GolfGTIforum.co.uk
Model specific boards => Golf mk7 => Topic started by: Sootchucker on 02 January 2018, 09:31
-
Over the Christmas holidays, we went into the local dealership just "browsing" for potential replacements for the GTD which will be changed towards the end of this year (just because we were in town and I was bored :grin:)
I had already known that the next car would 100% be petrol after having 4 diesel VW's on the trot. I also wanted a change from a Golf as I've had 3 out of the last 4 cars as a Golf (and the 4th was a Scirocco).
Don't really need anything that sporty to be fair, so wasn't looking at performance models and I really like the new VW Tiguan, so had a look at that, but the trim I would have wanted (SEL or R-Line Spec), isn't available with the 1.4 TSI 150ps engine, (only the entry level models get this), so to get a petrol in these trim levels (and DSG) your are forced to have the 2.0l TSI 180ps variant (which according to what I've read can get a bit thirsty ?)
I then looked at the new T-Roc. To be honest I was quite surprised at how good it looked in the flesh (the model they had was the SEL in white with the Sport pack - so red calipers and optional alloys). It looked really good in the flesh but when I sat inside, for the first time since I can remember, I was really disappointed with the interior. Not the design which looks quite good, but the materials. The whole dash (including the upper surfaces) and the whole door cards are in nasty hard plastic. There are no soft touch materials anywhere and it looks cheap. It's really surprising then when the new VW Polo they had next to it, like the Golf has all the soft touch plastics on the dash etc. I think VW have really dropped the ball on this, and TBH, think it might affect sales, as the sales guy (who I've known for years) said a number of people who came in to look at the T-Roc left, disappointed with the interior.
I then sat in the MK7.5 GTI they had next to the T-Roc, and despite me having had (have) 2 MK7 GTD's, I have to be honest and say from a satisfied feeling point of view and the general levels of equipment, it still is a very hard act to beat, and even 5 years on from launch, the MK7 Golf still feels very fresh and of the moment (the latest changes have certainly updated the feel of the cabin - and I love the exterior lights).
So I think the next car is shortlisted as either an R-Line Tiguan (preferred choice), just so long as the promised new 1.5l 150ps TSI ACT engine materializes (along with DSG) as my salesman promised (slated for spring this year), or it will most probably be yet another MK7 Golf (a GTI). Price wise when the pano sunroof and a few other nice extras are added to the GTI top get to a similar spec as the Tiguan models, it's not a million miles away from the list price of the Tiguan (maybe 2.5k).
Choices are good, but it's just a shame about the T-Roc as I really wanted to like that and externally it did look good, but such a disappointment.
-
I read some reviews on the T-Roc over Christmas (having seen TV adverts etc) and all of them say the interior is cheap and nasty.
The main thing that keeps me away from a VW T-anything is that having come from ever larger repmobiles the last thing I want to go back to is something that I can't fit into ever smaller car park spaces.
Additionally these "SUV style" vehicles such as the T-Roc are effectively just an exterior bulked up version of the original donor car which don't give you anything other than an oversized exterior and extra weight which sucks performance and (more importantly) fuel economy.
With the drive for cleaner, greener cars, I don't understand this surge in much needlessly less efficient designs at all.
I understand what a Toyota Land Cruiser or a Landrover Disco is all about. I don't understand what the wannabees is all about.
Anyway, back to the "what do I buy now" question.... I keep pondering it. I ponder it last year when I replaced my GTD...with another GTD.
The Golf Mk7.x is a tough act to follow.
-
Does it have to be a VW? You said it yourself you’ve had 4 in a row and fancy a change but you’re 2 choices are another Golf... or a Tiguan - which is heavily based on a Golf :smiley:
My Dad has a new Tiguan on the way. I tagged along with him when he was buying and I too was a bit surprised at the interior space versus the exterior bulk. It didn’t feel that much bigger inside than the Golf to me. I also felt that the dashboard materials weren’t up to the Golf’s standard. That said I do think they’re a very good looking car especially in R Line trim. A huge improvement on the old model imo, which never looked right to me.
-
The reason most SUV's have been Diesels is the fact they're heavy and un-aerodynamic so a high torque and low revving Diesel engine is much better suited. They're not the sort of cars you can punt along country lanes bouncing off the red line as the centre of gravity is too high and if you're bouncing off the red line then you're also injecting an awful lot of fuel which kills economy dead.
I'd personally think a 1.5 TSI is far too small an engine for an SUV and won't be that economical unless you drive like a nun. And if you're going to drive like a nun then a Diesel will still give you much better economy and have better torque characteristics if using a DSG box.
Why does nearly everyone think an SUV is the answer these days? On the one hand there's all this fuss about CO2 emissions and various other nasties coming out of the exhaust pipes which is kind of ironic when an SUV contains more raw materials, weighs loads and has crap aerodynamics meaning they're horrendously uneconomical next to their hatchback donor unless you're just steady state cruising on flat roads.
I'd think a Polo GTI or if you don't need the space an UP GTI would be the answer.
A decently torquey engine that will be good on fuel as it will be completely under stressed in the lightweight (compared to an SUV) body shell and still have a bit of character with the ability to put a smile on your face when in the mood.
Plus you don't have to stand on a ladder to wash the roof :whistle:
-
Why does nearly everyone think an SUV is the answer these days?
Comfort!
We had an Audi Q2 as a loan car for a week. We both loved it. Primarily because of the ride comfort and ride height. I had to drive over the mountain roads to reach a job I was doing. It was a much more comfortable drive with the Q2 Sline than my new GTI with the adjustable suspension set to comfort. It's the first genuinely comfortable Sline spec car I have driven! Both cars had 18 inch alloys. Though the Q2s tyres had a slightly higher side walls. The Q2 suspension just seemed to soaked up the bumps at faster speeds than were comfortable in the GTI. Even about town the Q2 handled speed bumps, sleeping policemen, potholes, manhole covers, road repairs much better. There was a part of the road which had sunk, going into the local town. This created a natural speed bump in the road. Even though it was inside the 40mph zone I would still slow down for it. With higher suspension in the Q2 there was no need to slow down. It just breezed over it.
Our elderly relatives found it much easier to get in and out of the higher seats. They didn't have to lower themselves into them as they do with normal cars. Or pull themselves up out of them.
Also, at night time, the higher seating level meant that other car lights were often less dazzling.
It is disappointing to hear what people are saying about the interior of the Troc. I did quite like the style of it in the adverts. Though I think the Q2 has the edge on style and the interior is very similar to the quality of A3. When my wife was driving the Q3 she, it got a lot of complements. We are keeping the A3 for a few more years and a lot could change in that time. However, a mini SUV, compact SUV, crossover, whatever you want to call it - is probably going to be our next purchase. Hopefully, the more economical 1.5 petrol engine and new 7 speed DSG will be standard by then.
-
I was interested in the T-Roc and contemplated waiting for it when the lease on my Octy was due to finish. However after seeing the reviews of the cheap nasty interior plastics i'm now glad I didn't hold on. This seems a strange error of judgment from VW. Although i'm sure it will still sell by the bucketful if it's sensibly priced. It's a good looking car and will appeal to the fashion conscious, but with those horrible hard plastics it just isn't for me.
I did also contemplate a Tiguan SEL or R Line, but they're expensive cars now compared to a Golf, and I doubt it benefit from the extra outlay. Running costs would also be a fair bit more, even tyres alone given the huge wheels that come as standard on the R Line.
I've ended up in a GTD for the next couple of years. It gives me time to see what will happen to diesel residuals without having to worry about them. It also allows me to see if electric or hybrid development advances much before I make the leap.
If you're thinking about about Tiguan with the 1.5TSi, you'll certainly notice the drop in performance coming from a performance Golf. I'd advise trying the same engine in the Skoda Karoq to see if it's worth waiting for. In fact if there's a Skoda Karoq in Sportline trim available in a couple of years time, that may well be the ideal replacement for the GTD. Similar virtues to a Tiguan R Line, only (hopefully) without the hefty price tag.
-
You don't get the same standard kit in a Skoda as you do with a VW so once you've ticked a couple of extras boxes the cheap Skoda isn't that cheap any more.
-
Why does nearly everyone think an SUV is the answer these days?
Comfort!
Without a doubt. The vast majority of people couldn't give two hoots about emissions and handling dynamics.
Since having my Amarok, I hate our Golf with a passion. Not just because it's a 1.6 diesel Match, I don't even like getting in it to move it on the drive to clean it. Once you have become accustomed to the high up driving position, the space, comfort and practicalities of a SUV type vehicle, going back takes some doing.
-
Surely if you want comfort and ease of access then anything but a performance whatever is where you want to be?
Something like a non-sport Mondeo or equivalent would give you big barge comfort both in terms of weight and body roll and non low profile tyres.
All this trend for huge cars is getting laughable. Near one of my sites there is a new shopping complex. They've jammed the parking spaces so tight that even my Golf barely fits into them. All of the SUV's park in the disabled spaces because they can't actually fit into the "normal" spaces.
-
Yeah, part of the reason is that my brother last November purchased a Nissan Quasqui. Whilst it's a nice enough car (although woefully underpowered with a 1.2 115ps engine), it was a bit of a revelation how comfortable it was and I loved the high driving position - not just for getting in an out, but visibility. That's why I went looking at the T-Roc in the first place.
The reason I stay (currently) with the VAG brand is the DSG gearbox. With a dodgy knee my wife can't drive a manual anymore for anything over 10 minutes, so about 7 years ago, we swapped both our cars to DSG versions (mainly for her) but I loved it.
I've since tried a Merc with the Auto box and hated it, and the performance Focus's (petrol) don't come with any auto options at all. To be fair I've heard the BMW autos are supposed to be the best in the business, but I just can't seem to bring myself to climb into a BMW (as a personally owned car). Plus, with options they get very expensive, very quickly.
I really do like the Audi A3 Saloon (really classy) in S-Line trim, but after a horrendous experience with 3 Audi dealerships (up their own ars*s) I swore I'd never step foot inside one of their dealerships again - however these days, I suppose we always have orange wheels, drive the deal etc. which not only give you great competitive prices, but means you don't have to deal with the Audi dealership w*nkers.
-
Why does nearly everyone think an SUV is the answer these days?
Comfort!
Without a doubt. The vast majority of people couldn't give two hoots about emissions and handling dynamics.
Since having my Amarok, I hate our Golf with a passion. Not just because it's a 1.6 diesel Match, I don't even like getting in it to move it on the drive to clean it. Once you have become accustomed to the high up driving position, the space, comfort and practicalities of a SUV type vehicle, going back takes some doing.
As someone also with an Amarok and a (performance) Golf on the drive, have to say the Amarok hasn’t had such a profound effect on me. Whilst it’s great to have both at my disposal, horses for courses and all that, if I could only have one, it would, without shadow of a doubt be the Golf.
-
The T-Roc is Polo based is it not? Therefore the savings will have to come from somewhere as there's a lot more metal involved in its manufacture. Hence the interior has been hit by the accountants.
I'm also going to take a wild guess (I don't read motoring publications anymore so am way out of the loop) that the T-Roc is built somewhere with a lower labour cost and production costs than the halo VW models. The old Scirocco factory maybe? The T-Roc is pretty much the niche model that takes over from the out of fashion coupe and has stolen both its name and wheel arch gaps.
Doesn't the high driving position get negated if everyone drives one? I used to occasionally blast around in commercial vehicles in work and can definitely vouch for the high up position of a lorry but I was always glad to get back to the driving dynamics of a hot hatch afterwards.
It does seem a bit odd that on this forum, named after VW's iconic hot hatch, there's a lot of hankering after "comfy" SUV's.
I'll take a guess here and say the GTI moniker is mostly bought nowadays by those that like the heritage of the GTI badge rather than actually enjoy using the performance and the R's are bought by those that still have a bit of fire in their belly.
A shame really as the R isn't as much fun to drive as a GTI and yet GTI (and GTD) drivers would prefer to be sat on a large mattress on wheels.
-
It does seem a bit odd that on this forum, named after VW's iconic hot hatch, there's a lot of hankering after "comfy" SUV's.
I'll take a guess here and say the GTI moniker is mostly bought nowadays by those that like the heritage of the GTI badge....
Or could it be, just a guess, that the average age of forum users on here is quite high?
-
Well ahem....cough....that certainly applies to me :smiley:
-
When I just clicked on this thread again the little ad at the top of the page was for Stannah Stairlifts! :laugh:
I'm no spring chicken but I certainly don't hanker after something that you need a Stannah for to clean the roof.
Mind you looking at the prices of VW's these days I suppose your average owner can afford to pay someone else to clean their car roof.
I just don't think I'm VW owner material anymore, I have nothing in common with 99% of the R Forum owners and it looks like GTI enthusiasts have matured into SUV lovers.
I'm the opposite of an Audi owner, I still remember the first time I saw an A1 and wondered why anyone would pay £2k more for exactly the same dashboard as an Ibiza.
I don't like any of the Skoda range.
SEAT offer some interesting things in Cupra guise but I'm probably too old for that image now...
Only another ten years until I get my free bus pass.
(which will no doubt have stopped by then having followed my works pension down the pan)
F**k it, I'm off to drive my manual GTI in some rose tinted specs to remind myself why I'm even on here...
-
Exonian... I think I know what you mean. I'm no spring chicken either!
I guess the age thing is simply that whilst the young desire performance cars, those with the ability to buy them are somewhat older.
I'd doubt if a Porsche forum would have an average age of user under 60.
Oh and whoever it was that asked, the T-Roc is built on the old Scirocco production line in Portugal.
-
F**k it, I'm off to drive my manual GTI in some rose tinted specs to remind myself why I'm even on here...
I think we are both of a similar age then, I'm enjoying my manual whilst my knees are still up to the job :rolleyes: :laugh:
Horses for courses though plus there are many on here who are in need of a change having had so many Golfs. I'm on my first and have never bought the same make let alone model of car in a row provided you ignore my second Capri which I bought to restore (but never got round to doing). Could be tempted though this time but being very near to retirement by then I may have more of a downsized budget to play with....
-
You don't get the same standard kit in a Skoda as you do with a VW so once you've ticked a couple of extras boxes the cheap Skoda isn't that cheap any more.
I agree to an extent, although that surely ought to be judged on the basis of the equipment that you actually want, rather than simply comparing standard car vs standard car.
For example an Octavia vRS 245 has alcantara and 19 inch alloys as standard, whereas the Golf GTi PP has neither despite being £2k more expensive at list price.
Pre FL Mk7 GTi's and GTD's had KESSY as standard at one point. That was something i'd rather not have at all rather than have it given to me for free. I simply didn't want it.
-
Just been out for a "spirited" drive at lunchtime (had to get somewhere and back quite quickly), and it reminded me of how good dynamically a Golf really is. Sure mine is only the devils juice GTD, but she can still put a smile on your face despite "only" having just over 180ps (mine was actually dyno'd last year at 187bhp standard), so can only imagine how good a GTI or R must be.
TBH, over the holidays, our good friends from south wales came up and spent 3 days with us, and the GTD was used to ferry us all about for that 3 days, and it took all 4 of us (all grown adults - some like me grown more than others) in great comfort and the the car had ample performance. Maybe this thread has been a bit of a wake up call for me. I'm not ready for the scrap heap yet so maybe an SUV isn't for me (yet).
If it wasn't for the supreme uncertainly over the future of diesel taxation, pump prices and resale value, I'd even consider keeping the GTD for a few years more (buying it outright at the end of the PCP), as it's a great all rounder with an average 45mpg to boot, but that uncertainty is pretty big at present. Maybe plan 2 is a GTI - best of both worlds ?
As an aside, are we becoming the dumping ground for VW's diesel engines ? It seems that we in the UK have a much greater choice from the marque of diesel variants rather than the petrol equivalents, or is this just VW UK not really in touch with what's happening in the UK with regards to Diesel's fall from grace ?
-
When I just clicked on this thread again the little ad at the top of the page was for Stannah Stairlifts! :laugh:
I'm no spring chicken but I certainly don't hanker after something that you need a Stannah for to clean the roof.
I just don't think I'm VW owner material anymore, I have nothing in common with 99% of the R Forum owners and it looks like GTI enthusiasts have matured into SUV lovers.
I'm the opposite of an Audi owner...
... My ad was for insulated wellies :embarrassed:
... Even though the Audi Q2 was a loan car, I gave it a wash before it went back. I could reach the middle of the roof at a stretch an I'm not tall. I would think the Troc is a similar size. I tried the roof of the Tiguan at the dealers - not a mission of me washihng that. Would have needed a milk crate or similar.
... I can see why people like SUVs. However, I doubt if I would buy one for myself to drive. I love driving my GTI. Though I can see our other car being change for an SUV for the best of both worlds.
... I personally prefer VW to Audi, but my wife prefers Audi.
-
The T-Roc is Polo based is it not?
As far as I can see from google, the Troc is using the MQB platform the same as the Golf.
There is supposed to be an SUV coming soon based on the Polo, called the T-Cross.
-
The new Polo is also MQB based now. Only shortened and it doesn't get the independent rear suspension of the higher powered Golf's as far as I know.
That said the T Roc is VW's version of the Q2, and is very similar in terms of dimensions.
-
The new Polo is also MQB based now. Only shortened and it doesn't get the independent rear suspension of the higher powered Golf's as far as I know.
That said the T Roc is VW's version of the Q2, and is very similar in terms of dimensions.
This is what Parkers review says - "The VW T-Roc uses the same oily bits and chassis as many other cars within the VW Group, including the VW Golf, Audi Q2 and A3."
I read somewhere that the Polo will be using a smaller MQB A0 chassis.
-
When I just clicked on this thread again the little ad at the top of the page was for Stannah Stairlifts! :laugh:
I'm no spring chicken but I certainly don't hanker after something that you need a Stannah for to clean the roof.
I just don't think I'm VW owner material anymore, I have nothing in common with 99% of the R Forum owners and it looks like GTI enthusiasts have matured into SUV lovers.
I'm the opposite of an Audi owner...
... My ad was for insulated wellies :embarrassed:
... Even though the Audi Q2 was a loan car, I gave it a wash before it went back. I could reach the middle of the roof at a stretch an I'm not tall. I would think the Troc is a similar size. I tried the roof of the Tiguan at the dealers - not a mission of me washihng that. Would have needed a milk crate or similar.
... I can see why people like SUVs. However, I doubt if I would buy one for myself to drive. I love driving my GTI. Though I can see our other car being change for an SUV for the best of both worlds.
... I personally prefer VW to Audi, but my wife prefers Audi.
My ad was for todger enlargement :embarrassed:.......I've no idea why :undecided:
-
You don't get the same standard kit in a Skoda as you do with a VW so once you've ticked a couple of extras boxes the cheap Skoda isn't that cheap any more.
I agree to an extent, although that surely ought to be judged on the basis of the equipment that you actually want, rather than simply comparing standard car vs standard car.
For example an Octavia vRS 245 has alcantara and 19 inch alloys as standard, whereas the Golf GTi PP has neither despite being £2k more expensive at list price.
Pre FL Mk7 GTi's and GTD's had KESSY as standard at one point. That was something i'd rather not have at all rather than have it given to me for free. I simply didn't want it.
Standard equipment on the VW is better than on the Skoda so that's your starting point. You can't compare a golf GTi to Skoda Octavia vrs and then say you get 19s and alcantara. You get as standard more on the golf so the 2k argument is non existent.
-
I spec'ed a Octavia VRS instead of my GTD actually.
Its kinda swings and roundabouts.... sure you can choose to not have bits that the GTD comes with, but other things you can't spec at all. The real kicker though was that you couldn't get as much discount on the Skoda, the residuals were a fair bit worse and Skoda PCP finance was a higher percentage rate.
All in all, it made absolutely no financial sense to pursue it further for me and it was only a financial consideration in the first place....I didn't honestly want to drive one in the first place as besides the badge it was bigger than I wanted (in the same way as the SEAT was smaller than I wanted) Others may discover its the car of their dreams.
-
You don't get the same standard kit in a Skoda as you do with a VW so once you've ticked a couple of extras boxes the cheap Skoda isn't that cheap any more.
I agree to an extent, although that surely ought to be judged on the basis of the equipment that you actually want, rather than simply comparing standard car vs standard car.
For example an Octavia vRS 245 has alcantara and 19 inch alloys as standard, whereas the Golf GTi PP has neither despite being £2k more expensive at list price.
Pre FL Mk7 GTi's and GTD's had KESSY as standard at one point. That was something i'd rather not have at all rather than have it given to me for free. I simply didn't want it.
Standard equipment on the VW is better than on the Skoda so that's your starting point. You can't compare a golf GTi to Skoda Octavia vrs and then say you get 19s and alcantara. You get as standard more on the golf so the 2k argument is non existent.
With respect your starting point is your budget and the car that offers most of what you want, and least of what you don't want. Otherwise you're paying extra for no reason. If you just don't want the Skoda badge then there's probably not a lot I can say to convince you.
I understand the logic with PCP or cash purchases (as seems to be the norm on here), but there's more than one way to skin a cat. My Octy was leased for far less than I could get a GTD for, the only things I added would have cost just as much if not more to add to a GTD. Sure I missed out on front parking sensors and an electronic handbrake, but I did get half leather and lane assist instead.
I'm intrigued to know what additional equipment a GTi PP has that you don't get on a VRS 245. As far as I can tell it's front assist, active info display and an electronic handbrake, but by all means correct me if i've missed something.
-
I'm not a badge snob in any way and I take your stupid comment about being convinced by you as total stupidity. I like the standard equipment I have on my gti pp and if you could get exactly the same but in the Octavia then I would as I love the size of the boot. Don't assume things about people you don't even know.
-
:laugh:
mcmaddy, for so many of your posts on here I have an image in my head of someone furiously banging on their keyboard in a state of constant anger and irritation. Mad as hell with the world with zero tolerance for the perceived idiocy all around him lol.
This is only in jest, so don't go taking it the wrong way :cool:
-
I'm not a badge snob in any way and I take your stupid comment about being convinced by you as total stupidity. I like the standard equipment I have on my gti pp and if you could get exactly the same but in the Octavia then I would as I love the size of the boot. Don't assume things about people you don't even know.
Well when I used the word 'you' i didn't mean 'you' personally, I meant people in general. But after reading back my post again I can now see how I gave you that impression and apologise. :smiley: It was Fred that mentioned the badge, so I thought it was a fair issue to mention it as it had already been raised. I can't say I always like the tone of some of the stuff posted on here, but i've somehow always tried my best to be as polite as possible. But no doubt some may think I deserved it.
I was merely making the point that the extra equipment you get on a VW over an Skoda isn't free, one has to pay for it with the higher price for what can often be a smaller car. Fine if you want all the extra kit and are willing to pay for it, or give up the extra space. But we all want different things and that's why VAG offer a choice.
-
Over the Christmas holidays, we went into the local dealership just "browsing" for potential replacements for the GTD which will be changed towards the end of this year (just because we were in town and I was bored :grin:)
I had already known that the next car would 100% be petrol after having 4 diesel VW's on the trot. I also wanted a change from a Golf as I've had 3 out of the last 4 cars as a Golf (and the 4th was a Scirocco).............
The thing with the current crop of Golfs for me is value for money.
When my wife's Audi A1 came up to be changed almost a couple of years ago now, she couldn't have cared less what she was driving but gave me a few must have stipulations.
Keyless, Heated seats and I think cruise.
I looked at all sorts of car. Kia, Audi, Ford, Seat, Skoda, Suzuki.
I drew up a spreadsheet of standard options, added options, fuel economy, likely insurance costs and cost of overall finance.
I really couldn't get anywhere near the value for money on the GTI and I wasn't even using man maths.
I would happily have got her a Kia or Suzuki if it met her needs.
I think that is a problem once you have had the GTI/GTD/R, you will initially struggle when going elsewhere especially if you like decent standard equipment.
-
Well, only VAG offer Automatic Cruise Control on a manual box... it was one of my main things that brought me back to another Golf...
-
:laugh:
mcmaddy, for so many of your posts on here I have an image in my head of someone furiously banging on their keyboard in a state of constant anger and irritation. Mad as hell with the world with zero tolerance for the perceived idiocy all around him lol.
This is only in jest, so don't go taking it the wrong way :cool:
It's probably the job I've got and who I deal with on a daily basis :whistle:
-
I'm not a badge snob in any way and I take your stupid comment about being convinced by you as total stupidity. I like the standard equipment I have on my gti pp and if you could get exactly the same but in the Octavia then I would as I love the size of the boot. Don't assume things about people you don't even know.
Well when I used the word 'you' i didn't mean 'you' personally, I meant people in general. But after reading back my post again I can now see how I gave you that impression and apologise. :smiley: It was Fred that mentioned the badge, so I thought it was a fair issue to mention it as it had already been raised. I can't say I always like the tone of some of the stuff posted on here, but i've somehow always tried my best to be as polite as possible. But no doubt some may think I deserved it.
I was merely making the point that the extra equipment you get on a VW over an Skoda isn't free, one has to pay for it with the higher price for what can often be a smaller car. Fine if you want all the extra kit and are willing to pay for it, or give up the extra space. But we all want different things and that's why VAG offer a choice.
My apologies Guzzle, case of writing without thinking 👍
-
And just to clarify, the badge was the minor niggle but certainly part of it... the size, the actual total cost of ownership and the treatment from the dealer was the main problem!
I'd already not been so put off that I was prepared to give Skoda and SEAT a look - because ultimately they are VAG just the same as Audi and VW.
If anything, paying over the odds for an Audi badge was more of an issue, when quite frankly, it wouldn't mean a jot to me.
-
I'm not a badge snob in any way and I take your stupid comment about being convinced by you as total stupidity. I like the standard equipment I have on my gti pp and if you could get exactly the same but in the Octavia then I would as I love the size of the boot. Don't assume things about people you don't even know.
Well when I used the word 'you' i didn't mean 'you' personally, I meant people in general. But after reading back my post again I can now see how I gave you that impression and apologise. :smiley: It was Fred that mentioned the badge, so I thought it was a fair issue to mention it as it had already been raised. I can't say I always like the tone of some of the stuff posted on here, but i've somehow always tried my best to be as polite as possible. But no doubt some may think I deserved it.
I was merely making the point that the extra equipment you get on a VW over an Skoda isn't free, one has to pay for it with the higher price for what can often be a smaller car. Fine if you want all the extra kit and are willing to pay for it, or give up the extra space. But we all want different things and that's why VAG offer a choice.
My apologies Guzzle, case of writing without thinking 👍
No worries, apology accepted and no hard feelings. 👍
Apologies also to Sootchucker for going so far off topic for so long. I mentioned the Karoq Sportline as my hope is that it will tick a lot of boxes for me wnen i move on from my own GTD after the disappointment of the T Roc interior, and the high price of the Tiguan. However I accept what suits me might not suit other people.
-
For the first time in a good few cars owned I actually think I'll keep the GTi I've got. I only wish I'd bought one when I got the gtd in 2013. Might have saved me some cash :grin:
-
And just to clarify, the badge was the minor niggle but certainly part of it... the size, the actual total cost of ownership and the treatment from the dealer was the main problem!
I'd already not been so put off that I was prepared to give Skoda and SEAT a look - because ultimately they are VAG just the same as Audi and VW.
If anything, paying over the odds for an Audi badge was more of an issue, when quite frankly, it wouldn't mean a jot to me.
I see what you are saying, and I actually agree mostly. I looked at all four as well, and drew similar conclusions. In the case of SEAT or Skoda vs VW the dilemma was whether the extra kit on the VW compensated for the extra cost. However in the case of the A3 I couldn't reconcile the more expensive car having less standard equipment. Nicer car certainly, but both the Octy and Golf were nice enough yet substantially less expensive after the Audi was specced up equally.
However I chose not to go PCP or cash as I didn't want to concern myself with interest rates or residuals. I wanted fixed price motoring at the lowest cost for most boxes ticked, so ended up leasing.
-
I'm also going to take a wild guess that the T-Roc is built somewhere with a lower labour cost and production costs than the halo VW models. The old Scirocco factory maybe? The T-Roc is pretty much the niche model that takes over from the out of fashion coupe and has stolen both its name and wheel arch gaps.
I just realised that the T-Roc name comes from the discontinued Scirocco. Doh! :embarrassed: I still think they could have picked a better name than 'Troc'. My wife thinks so too.
-
So we call it a T-rocco or a T-rocky?
Trok sounds like it belongs in Harry Potter or something.
-
So we call it a T-rocco or a T-rocky?
Trok sounds like it belongs in Harry Potter or something.
I just did a google search - rocco is an adult film star. :huh:
Rocky is a chocolate bar, cartoon character and Sylvester Stallone. Apparently he was also an adult film star. :huh:
So I think we can rule those out. Now I have to delete my browsing history. :angry: :embarrassed: :grin:
-
If I'm right the T-Roc interior is very similar to the new Polo, hate to put the frighteners on folks waiting for the Mark 8 Golf but maybe thats the current thinking and as it will already be at some sort of pre production stage I fear that a similar style interior and exterior btw (which is nice)is on the cards.
Maybe the Mk7 and 7.5 will be the last incarnation of a subtle/staid interior.
-
I actually don't mind the interior in the new Polo. The main problem with the T Roc interior is it seems to be made out of recycled Tupperware.
-
The T-roc is an enigma - VW have put a lot of emphasis on building cars with "added value" in the form of perceived quality, particularly in what the journalists refer to as the "touch points" within the cabin. To then produce a car which has attracted so many negative comments about the quality of the interior appears to be something of an own goal. In my previous life I had some experience of what is referred to as "supply chain finance" and one of my specialisms was the Automotive sector. Without knowing the finer details, I wonder if VW are sourcing interior fittings from lower down the supply food chain, and whether this might be indicative of a change of policy which will extend to other models.
And if this thread confirms anything, it's that the British car-buying public aspire towards bigger, more comfortable cars. Which explains why it's so difficult to find anywhere to park these days which doesn't carry the threat of somebody opening their door into the side of my normal-sized Golf!
-
delete please, wrong thread!
-
And if this thread confirms anything, it's that the British car-buying public aspire towards bigger, more comfortable cars.
Aspire maybe but the top ten best selling cars in the UK for 2017 contain only one SUV- the Nissan Quashkai. The rest are Focus or Fiesta sized cars with the Merc C being the rep mobile of choice now.
-
And if this thread confirms anything, it's that the British car-buying public aspire towards bigger, more comfortable cars.
Aspire maybe but the top ten best selling cars in the UK for 2017 contain only one SUV- the Nissan Quashkai. The rest are Focus or Fiesta sized cars with the Merc C being the rep mobile of choice now.
Any UK-centric "Top 10 Best Selling Cars" list will be heavily weighted by the fleet market, to the extent of being a mere reflection of BIK values. My point is that the average UK buyer (and they can be very average indeed) is easily swayed by fashion, and smallish lower-end SUV's such as the Cashcow are sold as accessories to an active, aspirational lifestyle, often advertised in the company of other stereotypical lifestyle accessories such as mountain bikes, kayaks etc. They offer a higher than usual driving position to enable the lucky owner to look down upon the proletariat, and comfy seats. So the buyer feels comfortable, and is able to feel protected due to the perceived solidity of the car thanks to chunky styling with large lumpy plastic bumpers at each end and the high driving position.
They also have high-profile tyres and chunky wheels. Ideal for parking with two wheels on the pavement, which is the closest that most pseudo lifestyle SUV's will ever get to driving offroad.
-
And if this thread confirms anything, it's that the British car-buying public aspire towards bigger, more comfortable cars.
Aspire maybe but the top ten best selling cars in the UK for 2017 contain only one SUV- the Nissan Quashkai. The rest are Focus or Fiesta sized cars with the Merc C being the rep mobile of choice now.
Any UK-centric "Top 10 Best Selling Cars" list will be heavily weighted by the fleet market, to the extent of being a mere reflection of BIK values. My point is that the average UK buyer (and they can be very average indeed) is easily swayed by fashion, and smallish lower-end SUV's such as the Cashcow are sold as accessories to an active, aspirational lifestyle, often advertised in the company of other stereotypical lifestyle accessories such as mountain bikes, kayaks etc. They offer a higher than usual driving position to enable the lucky owner to look down upon the proletariat, and comfy seats. So the buyer feels comfortable, and is able to feel protected due to the perceived solidity of the car thanks to chunky styling with large lumpy plastic bumpers at each end and the high driving position.
They also have high-profile tyres and chunky wheels. Ideal for parking with two wheels on the pavement, which is the closest that most pseudo lifestyle SUV's will ever get to driving offroad.
Well said.
-
And if this thread confirms anything, it's that the British car-buying public aspire towards bigger, more comfortable cars. Which explains why it's so difficult to find anywhere to park these days which doesn't carry the threat of somebody opening their door into the side of my normal-sized Golf!
Worth noting though that our normal sized Golf's aren't so normal sized anymore. Mine barely fits in my normal sized garage. These days if you want a normal sized Golf it's called a Polo. The parking problem isn't simply because of bigger and more comfortable cars, it's also a consequence of more cars on the road, combined with parking space dimensions that haven't increased in decades, people taking up two spaces when they could fit in one, and others making car journeys they don't really need to make by car.
My point is that the average UK buyer (and they can be very average indeed) is easily swayed by fashion, and smallish lower-end SUV's such as the Cashcow are sold as accessories to an active, aspirational lifestyle, often advertised in the company of other stereotypical lifestyle accessories such as mountain bikes, kayaks etc. They offer a higher than usual driving position to enable the lucky owner to look down upon the proletariat, and comfy seats. So the buyer feels comfortable, and is able to feel protected due to the perceived solidity of the car thanks to chunky styling with large lumpy plastic bumpers at each end and the high driving position.
They also have high-profile tyres and chunky wheels. Ideal for parking with two wheels on the pavement, which is the closest that most pseudo lifestyle SUV's will ever get to driving offroad.
Why let these things bother you? Are they doing you that much harm? At the end of the day they're just another vehicle on the road. They pay their road tax, they buy their fuel and insurance and have just as much right to be there as the rest of us. Thoughtless driving and parking on kerbs is an issue, but that's not exclusive to SUV drivers.
-
Any UK-centric "Top 10 Best Selling Cars" list will be heavily weighted by the fleet market,
Really?
Ok, 2.54 million new vehicles registered in the UK, the Auto Express top ten accounts for 590,502 of them.... that's roughly 20% of the UK vehicle market.
As for Fleet numbers, looks like 44.68% Private 51.46% Fleet and 3.86% business registrations in 2017.
I can't see that being skewed too much and besides in the top ten there are only a couple that might possibly be the big fleet vehicles (ie astras for BT engineers or cop cars etc).
BTW what did surprise me when looking at these numbers, fleet car registrations were UP in 2017, when HMRC have basically declared war on BIK.... very curious, all I can assume is that some people didn't do their homework!
-
Fred the amount of queries and phone calls I get at work from our company car drivers saying something's wrong with payslip is unbelievable. 9 times out of ten they are clueless about the whys and wherefores regarding anything other than the monthly amount they have deducted.
-
They also have high-profile tyres and chunky wheels. Ideal for parking with two wheels on the pavement, which is the closest that most pseudo lifestyle SUV's will ever get to driving offroad.
Haha, I parked mine on top of a 3 foot high pile of snow that resembled Table Mountain, formed from clearing the supermarket carpark the other week...just because I could.
Has anyone considered the new Volvo XC40? I quite fancy a Volvo of some kind to replace the Golf.
-
And if this thread confirms anything, it's that the British car-buying public aspire towards bigger, more comfortable cars. Which explains why it's so difficult to find anywhere to park these days which doesn't carry the threat of somebody opening their door into the side of my normal-sized Golf!
Worth noting though that our normal sized Golf's aren't so normal sized anymore. Mine barely fits in my normal sized garage. These days if you want a normal sized Golf it's called a Polo. The parking problem isn't simply because of bigger and more comfortable cars, it's also a consequence of more cars on the road, combined with parking space dimensions that haven't increased in decades, people taking up two spaces when they could fit in one, and others making car journeys they don't really need to make by car.
My point is that the average UK buyer (and they can be very average indeed) is easily swayed by fashion, and smallish lower-end SUV's such as the Cashcow are sold as accessories to an active, aspirational lifestyle, often advertised in the company of other stereotypical lifestyle accessories such as mountain bikes, kayaks etc. They offer a higher than usual driving position to enable the lucky owner to look down upon the proletariat, and comfy seats. So the buyer feels comfortable, and is able to feel protected due to the perceived solidity of the car thanks to chunky styling with large lumpy plastic bumpers at each end and the high driving position.
They also have high-profile tyres and chunky wheels. Ideal for parking with two wheels on the pavement, which is the closest that most pseudo lifestyle SUV's will ever get to driving offroad.
Why let these things bother you? Are they doing you that much harm? At the end of the day they're just another vehicle on the road. They pay their road tax, they buy their fuel and insurance and have just as much right to be there as the rest of us. Thoughtless driving and parking on kerbs is an issue, but that's not exclusive to SUV drivers.
I can't think of many cars which have been updated regularly throughout their lifespan which haven't mutated into larger versions of their previous selves. Mazda made a praiseworthy job of updating the MX-5 and producing a newer model which actually weighed less than its predecessor, but in the world of VW the Golf has swollen considerably, as has the Polo, which is now larger than the original Golf, and I expect the Mark 2 Up! to be bigger, heavier, and better furnished than the existing model. It just seems to be a fact of life in the automotive industry's never-ending struggle to satisfy ever more prescriptive legislation while still pandering to the whims of the buying public.
And we still have parking spaces designed to accommodate Ford Anglias. Which are now occupied by the obese grandchildren of their intended occupants, which all seem to be driven by inconsiderates with no concern for their fellow drivers. I'm convinced that all pseudo SUV's come with "An overblown sense of entitlement" as a standard fitting.
-
Well there's a lot of them around now, and I suspect there's going to be even more, so it looks like your life is only going to get harder. :sad:
The current Golf is actually lighter than the Mk6 it replaced, it's one way manufacturers are now trying to deal with emissions targets by reducing weight. However it takes up more room in the car park than it has ever done.
-
The Mk7 Golf hatch is bigger than a Ford Sierra and roughly the same size as a Ford Mondeo Mk1...
Which gives you an idea.
-
Fred the amount of queries and phone calls I get at work from our company car drivers saying something's wrong with payslip is unbelievable. 9 times out of ten they are clueless about the whys and wherefores regarding anything other than the monthly amount they have deducted.
I find that really strange when its about something that hits you in your pocket.
Got any jobs going at your place then? To be paid so much that you just don't care about deductions, I'll have a piece of that!
-
The Mk7 Golf hatch is bigger than a Ford Sierra and roughly the same size as a Ford Mondeo Mk1...
Which gives you an idea.
Today's average driver is probably also bigger by a similar percentage to Mondeo man....
-
The Mk7 Golf hatch is bigger than a Ford Sierra and roughly the same size as a Ford Mondeo Mk1...
Which gives you an idea.
Today's average driver is probably also bigger by a similar percentage to Mondeo man....
:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
-
Fred the amount of queries and phone calls I get at work from our company car drivers saying something's wrong with payslip is unbelievable. 9 times out of ten they are clueless about the whys and wherefores regarding anything other than the monthly amount they have deducted.
I find that really strange when its about something that hits you in your pocket.
Got any jobs going at your place then? To be paid so much that you just don't care about deductions, I'll have a piece of that!
I think they care it's they just don't know that's the problem. They apply for a vehicle and seem to think the quote they are given is the only amount they need to pay totally forgetting about the tax element.
-
The Mk7 Golf hatch is bigger than a Ford Sierra and roughly the same size as a Ford Mondeo Mk1...
Which gives you an idea.
Just to give you an idea of how big the Golf has grown over the years (source Wikipedia)
| Mark | Length | Width | Height |
| MK1 | 3705mm | 1610mm | 1395mm |
| MK2 | 3985mm | 1700mm | 1415mm |
| MK3 | 4074mm | 1694mm | 1991mm |
| MK4 | 4148mm | 1735mm | 1440mm |
| MK5 | 4216mm | 1759mm | 1469mm |
| MK6 | 4213mm | 1779mm | 1469mm |
| MK7 | 4255mm | 1799mm | 1452mm |
-
Those Mk3's were quite tall weren't they? :grin:
H 1,422mm