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General => The garage => Topic started by: simon20vt on 24 August 2011, 13:48
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Nick, after being away from the VAG for a while, I'm thinking of investing in an Audi S3 225.
a) How much would you expect to get from a remap as a standard untouched factory car?
b) How much would you get from smaller mods such as CAI, uprated TIP, decat?
c) What modifications would you recommend to get best results out of the S3 without upgrading the turbo and internals?
d) I saw in one of your other posts about a custom job you did on a KO4 turbo and you saw results of about 300bhp - how much £££?
e) How good is the 4wd system as advantage over a KO4 fwd cheaper Seat Leon Cupra R that also has 225bhp?
Secondly, if i dont go down the route of an S3, i will be looking at a 530d m sport E39 bmw, be keeping my saxo and putting it on track..
What power could you get out of a map on the 530d BMW engine, have you done one of these before?
Sorry about all the questions :) but i am unsure of which route to go down at the moment, and I am exploring all options.
Thanks very much for your help,
Si
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Hello
Below is a graph from a S3 K04 and an R-Tech remap.
Graph 1 is stock with just remap
Graph 2 is with 3" turbo in take pipe. :smiley:
(http://www.badger-5.com/bin/dane-s3/DynoIT%20-%20D4NEU-std-tip-3inch-tip.jpg)
Haldex is fun... but Much much less power being layed down at the wheels, but then with the LCR in thwe wet its a nightmare to get the mapped power down with out spinning up.
300bhp was from a Hybrid turbo but the issues are getting a good hybrid unit. They are hybrid due to being made of many bits laying around, some hydrid turbo builders dont get the exhuast flow right, so the make huge boost but dont flow at the top end, or they have surge point low down which can be fatal to an engine.. (the one we mapped have flow issues at the top end and would not make the quoted 330bhp.
Search R-Tech K04 hybrid on you tube http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D2o7R8tkoVY&feature=related
To help make your mind up.... Happy reading!!! http://www.seatcupra.net/forums/showthread.php?t=298188 ( it took part in this thread via another user name..lol)
IMHO stay away from hybrid ko4 turbos it will cost you £1000s in the long run.
The 530d will push another 35bhp 50lbft with ease..
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So, in short which would be quicker and have larger power at the wheels after taking into account transmission loss, the 4wd S3 mapped with a tip, decat, full exhaust... or the fwd LCR with same mods? would either of these be as fast, or marginally quicker than a KO4-001 golf?
and, if you were to put launch control on both of them, what sort of 0-60 times could you expect from each?
would it be better to have the 4wd haldex compared to the fwd only?
What modifications would you recommend to get best results out of the S3 without upgrading the turbo and internals?
and what is the KO4 lag like compared to a KO3s, and how long does it pull for, before boost tails off rpm wise?
What would you do if in my position - ignore the fact the LCR can't put power down in the wet, if your choice was a 530d, S3 4wd, or LCR fwd, and why?
Cheers :wink: :smiley:
soooo many questions :laugh: LOL! sorry!
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A guy had a sorted k03s fwd a3, he took it to the ring with some s3's mapped etc on the straights he would pass them. So a lcr running same bhp as a s3, itll eat it on the straights once it's got it's power down, but tbh i'd rather have grip. They arn't exactly slow anyway lol. I'd get one with sorted suspension already as this cost over 2k, and it needs it! And I'd also get an uprated haldex controller, which I think sends more power to the rear and gets rid of the haldex kicking back in when your about to go sideways, happened to me and it's not very safe lol! I had a a3 quattro, so same apart from the power difference and a bit lighter.
So basically lcr will be quicker in straight lines and in the dry, bit of moisture and on bends a sorted s3 is good. ess three said his one was as good round corners as his porche!
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Why does the max torque drop from 259lbft @ 4240rpm down to 253lbft @ 3989rpm with the 3" turbo intake pipe?
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Why does the max torque drop from 259lbft @ 4240rpm down to 253lbft @ 3989rpm with the 3" turbo intake pipe?
Turbo inlet speeds, the oem and forge pipes can speed the slower air flow due to how the tip reduces towards the compressor housing, creating a vortex of some kind. Well thats my take on it from seeing the results from a Unique one off SFS ko4 tip we are testing for SFS during last week and the next 2 weeks coming.
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Why does the max torque drop from 259lbft @ 4240rpm down to 253lbft @ 3989rpm with the 3" turbo intake pipe?
Turbo inlet speeds, the oem and forge pipes can speed the slower air flow due to how the tip reduces towards the compressor housing, creating a vortex of some kind. Well thats my take on it from seeing the results from a Unique one off SFS ko4 tip we are testing for SFS during last week and the next 2 weeks coming.
Cleared that one up, thanks buddy :) to be honest i dont think the difference is to much to be bothered about
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something not right about them graphs, why is the info chopped off on the far right????
dont agree with the figures either, seems all wrong to me
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something not right about them graphs, why is the info chopped off on the far right????
dont agree with the figures either, seems all wrong to me
What info is chopped off? :huh:
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Think he must be reading it on a phone lol
That SFS hose you are testing is a monstor!
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something not right about them graphs, why is the info chopped off on the far right????
dont agree with the figures either, seems all wrong to me
It seems you looking at it on an iPhone as I can only see half the graph, Scrub that I can only see half with my PC aswell.
this graph is not my graph it's an independant tuner who can actually write an me7.5 maps and fully understands the ecu.
The spec1 result is the exact same as I got on my dyno, which read the same as the jkm dd, (as Adam knows).
Can you explain to everyone why you don't agree?
If you click on the source of the graph you will find all the logs that go with the run, boost, lambda and air flow, then using mathematics ( not maf /.8) but air in lbs you will see they are correct.
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Are you saying Badger bill writes your maps then?
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The full graph link
http://www.seatcupra.net/forums/showthread.php?t=289160
I ran a Bora with an AMK S3 engine yesterday, we started to custom map it but soon ran in to hardware issues, The car is also running the exact same map with the badger5 tip. I will post the graph up in 2 mins
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Are you saying Badger bill writes your maps then?
No.. The S3 in question was mapped here on my rolling road with a spec1 map which I wrote, then went to badger5 to have the tip fitted and tested. I was saying that Bill understands the ecus and mapping which means during the rolling road session he can crunch the number from the logs and make a mental picture of whats going on, check the link and you will see what I mean.
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From a AMK in a Bora with the Badger5 tip and same mapping as Dane's S3. Not got a full run yet as the car is in for a full custom remap and after 5 mins hardware issues started to crop up which caused the throttle cut at the end of the run.
(http://i258.photobucket.com/albums/hh252/Rtechremaps/AMK-S3-SP1-B5TIP.jpg)
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the AMK in bora, is that standard engine on oem management but with just a TIP and your custom map ?
did you run temp probe in the air intake when on the rollers ?
im a bit funny about all rolling road results now as they are too easy to fix, (im not saying you have or do this btw :smiley:).. i like to see a 3rd party temp gauge showing date,time, humidity and temp etc that matches up with any dyno results, date, time, humidity etc... :smiley:
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the AMK in bora, is that standard engine on oem management but with just a TIP and your custom map ?
did you run temp probe in the air intake when on the rollers ?
im a bit funny about all rolling road results now as they are too easy to fix, (im not saying you have or do this btw :smiley:).. i like to see a 3rd party temp gauge showing date,time, humidity and temp etc that matches up with any dyno results, date, time, humidity etc... :smiley:
Hello,
The Bora is mine :smiley:
It's running on OEM management and has a whole raft of mods i.e. FMIC, Pipewerx 3" down pipe, and a Badger5 TIP. It will be getting custom mapped but as Nick said we are experiencing hardware issues at the moment with it.
Stay tuned.
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dude i have AMK in my MK3
i had more torque than you before i had mine custom mapped (which is still a work in prtogress and will be completed end of this month)
i have a custom 3" downpipe made by trackslag, full Jetex exhaust system, No CAT, N249 delete, 007, Front mount intercooler, K&N reocated out of the bay, brand new MAF etc 40k on the engine bla bla
standard i got the 210bhp but i was well up on torque - more than what yours is now in fact (it was 230ibft)
im now upto around the 250hp mark and over 280ibft, gonna keep the torque capped at this as it is very brutal in my mk3 (alot lighter than your Bora)
what hardware issues you having ?
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I know I've read your thread.
As Nick has posted that the remap was only put on as a base map and those figures will change given that the car isn't running right, so also a work in progress.
Mine has 3" down pipe with 100cpsi sports cat, milltek cat-back, badger 5 tip, jetex cone filter, n249 delete, fmic, etc etc all the usual mods you do before mapping a 1.8T. Engine has 26K on the clock.
I'm having PCV issues.
My Bora is 4motion so I'm sure whatever the final result is it will be able to put it down to the road.
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dude i have AMK in my MK3
i had more torque than you before i had mine custom mapped (which is still a work in prtogress and will be completed end of this month)
i have a custom 3" downpipe made by trackslag, full Jetex exhaust system, No CAT, N249 delete, 007, Front mount intercooler, K&N reocated out of the bay, brand new MAF etc 40k on the engine bla bla
standard i got the 210bhp but i was well up on torque - more than what yours is now in fact (it was 230ibft)
im now upto around the 250hp mark and over 280ibft, gonna keep the torque capped at this as it is very brutal in my mk3 (alot lighter than your Bora)
what hardware issues you having ?
I dont need to fudge numbers on a dyno... JKM rolling road days and other forum rr events have backed it up for me over the years, BS dyno numbers will always come back and bite the tuner in the backside.
The torque is low as its only a spec1 map peaking to 16psi, its not had no custom map tweaks yet as the PCV is causing issuse.
Who custom mapped your car and and are they me7.5 specialists?
What TIP are you running? Forge? as the only tips I have seen to flow well are the 3" ones?
What are your blocks 60 & 115 & 114 vs N75dc% reading (a good sign how will the actuator is running) What condition did your tuner say the actuator was is going from the load logs? Is the peak load request being match and is the n75% running 78-88% top end or is it 95%?
What is your MAF reading vs and the fuel dump over 4000rpm? (As this can easy kill the power by getting the lambda wrong, ie running stock protection maps on a stage2 with decats) If you look at the logs you will see the fuel is perfect for best best performance
Post up your logs and I will tell you whats going on with your car why is not making 250bhp more?
If you want you can pop down for a free dyno run and a logging session and I will give you a full report on how your car is acting and why you cannot get over 250bhp. I am 100% sure to shed some light on the matter so you can go sort the issues go back to your tuner and get more power, but with just the stock forge tip the limit I see is around 250bhp peak.
Lots of factors which only a good logging session will find out... a remap will only work upto the hardware limits of the car and no more.
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Firstly i can get the power down - just :laugh: nest up is LSD
dont want a 4WD (well Haldex) taking away all my power
ill post up all the results once the final mapping session is completed. at the momnet i also have the base map (which is putting out more than the base map on the bora :wink:)
We did think the N75 valve could need replacing. he didnt mention any issues with the actuator but TBH iv not got any logs to show you or anyone
My torque was 230 before they even touched anything... i put that down to the mods iv done..
The tip is big, no name on mine. but its bigger than the silicone one that is on my mates S3? which we thought was strange
ill get all the logs and graphs up once its completed. its going back in a couple of weeks. car is mental to drive, i love it
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We did think the N75 valve could need replacing. he didnt mention any issues with the actuator but TBH iv not got any logs to show you or anyone
A naff N75 or weak actuator give the reading of high N75 duty cycle. I tend to see k04-023 turbos with 85K+ all have weak actuators and many struggle to make 240bhp peak power....
I hope you get it sorted and running the best it can, it will be the cherry on top of your mk3 project.. :wink:
When the Bora AMK is finished I will run it on all 3 rolling roads and post all graphs........ The DD rolling road is the easy one to fudge in many ways..
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Firstly i can get the power down - just :laugh: nest up is LSD
I fail to see how a nest can help your grip situation.
:wink:
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:grin: :grin: i phone :laugh:
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:grin: :grin: i phone :laugh:
That wont help either - thanks for the HU :wink:
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Firstly i can get the power down - just :laugh: nest up is LSD
I fail to see how a nest can help your grip situation.
:wink:
Dunno but I am going to try it next time at santa pod...lol
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Firstly i can get the power down - just :laugh: nest up is LSD
dont want a 4WD (well Haldex) taking away all my power
ill post up all the results once the final mapping session is completed. at the momnet i also have the base map (which is putting out more than the base map on the bora :wink:)
We did think the N75 valve could need replacing. he didnt mention any issues with the actuator but TBH iv not got any logs to show you or anyone
My torque was 230 before they even touched anything... i put that down to the mods iv done..
The tip is big, no name on mine. but its bigger than the silicone one that is on my mates S3? which we thought was strange
ill get all the logs and graphs up once its completed. its going back in a couple of weeks. car is mental to drive, i love it
Base stage1 or 2 map? what boost you running? This one is 16psi 172% load across the whole band.
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Firstly i can get the power down - just :laugh: nest up is LSD
dont want a 4WD (well Haldex) taking away all my power
ill post up all the results once the final mapping session is completed. at the momnet i also have the base map (which is putting out more than the base map on the bora :wink:)
We did think the N75 valve could need replacing. he didnt mention any issues with the actuator but TBH iv not got any logs to show you or anyone
My torque was 230 before they even touched anything... i put that down to the mods iv done..
The tip is big, no name on mine. but its bigger than the silicone one that is on my mates S3? which we thought was strange
ill get all the logs and graphs up once its completed. its going back in a couple of weeks. car is mental to drive, i love it
Why are you determined to turn this in to a pissing contest?
As long as my car is performing to the best of it's abilities, which I know Nick will make sure of, then that's all I ask for.
Whether your's makes more torque, or your knob is bigger than mine, doesn't put me up nor down. :smiley:
Good luck with the rest of your project.
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Firstly i can get the power down - just :laugh: nest up is LSD
dont want a 4WD (well Haldex) taking away all my power
ill post up all the results once the final mapping session is completed. at the momnet i also have the base map (which is putting out more than the base map on the bora :wink:)
We did think the N75 valve could need replacing. he didnt mention any issues with the actuator but TBH iv not got any logs to show you or anyone
My torque was 230 before they even touched anything... i put that down to the mods iv done..
The tip is big, no name on mine. but its bigger than the silicone one that is on my mates S3? which we thought was strange
ill get all the logs and graphs up once its completed. its going back in a couple of weeks. car is mental to drive, i love it
Base stage1 or 2 map? what boost you running? This one is 16psi 172% load across the whole band.
before mapping it was doing over 230lbft of torque. thats just standard boost etc
it is at around 20psi now and as i say its over 280lbft with circa 250 HP
the guys only had a couple of hours on it as we had an absolute nighmare getting my car on the rollers, which took most the day hence why i need to go back to complete the map.
They didnt make many adjustments but the engine in mine is a good one which leads me back to ask why in some of your previous replies about my car you seem to think im having issues with the power ? i just want to clarify im not and that im over the moon with the car and how the power comes in, it is superb. very very smooth and the power is brutal all the way through the rev range. TBH id be happy with it left as it is but they want to go to town on this making the map perfect for my car :cool: i cant give enough praise for their work and how they treat my pride and joy
@ yohan, nobody is having no pissing contest, i dont even know you, your car was mentioned by R Tech, and as its same engine code as mine i have a interest and thats all so please dont take anything that ssaid the wrong way.. its a open forum for discussions to take place.
i have same view as you and want the best ability from my engine :wink: :smiley:
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something not right about them graphs, why is the info chopped off on the far right????
dont agree with the figures either, seems all wrong to me
This is the post which perked us up.
We wanted to find out why its all wrong?
And going by other posts it seems you hit a wall at around 250bhp with a custom map, when you stated "I had more torque than you before i had mine custom mapped (which is still a work in prtogress and will be completed end of this month)"
I am trying to help find out why as we have many many 100s of logs which could help you, but now your saying its only your tuners base map then if the car if hitting the base load then things might be 100% with your car and maybe when your tuner edits the map for more top end load you will see 270bhp...albeit the factor of inlet ait flow as a hardware restriction.
The confusion.com lol.com :grin:
Nick
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ahh i see, the car in question had nothing to do with yohan tho, i was just wonerin why the graphs were cut off, plus the barometric pressure is low, and this will help give high reading ?? although im no expert so bare with me :embarassed:
we didnt hit a brick wall, we just plain ran out of time as it was after6pm by this point. will see what happens on the 23rd :smiley:
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ahh i see, the car in question had nothing to do with yohan tho, i was just wonerin why the graphs were cut off, plus the barometric pressure is low, and this will help give high reading ?? although im no expert so bare with me :embarassed:
we didnt hit a brick wall, we just plain ran out of time as it was after6pm by this point. will see what happens on the 23rd :smiley:
Makes sense now... :grin:
Did you look at the links and see the full graph, boost & lambda logs?
The MAF logs = bolt on g/s gains of from an intil best 196.14g/s to 215.28g/s = gained 19.14g/s of airflow (which are about spot on to the Bora AMK logs)
I think the graphs might work this way:
(http://i258.photobucket.com/albums/hh252/Rtechremaps/DynoIT20-20D4NEU-std-tip-3inch-tip.jpg)
and fuel and boost (which you can see how getting closer to 12.4:1 with a leaner burn can also make more power
(http://i258.photobucket.com/albums/hh252/Rtechremaps/d4neu-s3-std-tip-3inch-tip.jpg)
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5psi± less boost at 3,000rpm with the 3" TIP?
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5psi± less boost at 3,000rpm with the 3" TIP?
Yes I had put this down to the vortex effect of the narrow part of the smaller tip / oem tip which helps speed the air flow down low. The badger5 tip has a large alloy neck which slows the air at low intake speeds, but gives huge gains peak. You need to remember the map above is only a stage1 map we did for Danes s3 over on Audi-sport.net . We had another s3 in with the same spec and we custom mapped it for the tip, which allowed us to compensate for the air speed losses, with a 1.4bar peak a little later in the rpm range we got 283lbft albeit 400rpm later up the rev range. SFS have made a prototype 3" tip which by design should give the best of both worlds
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Hope it goes well today Nick :)
It would be good if you got a chance to compare the SFS tip against the Badger5 one, assuming there are no more issues that pop up.
I'm about to send you a PM about some stuff.
Cheers,
John
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Am I being stupid? I can't see any option to PM people...
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Am I being stupid? I can't see any option to PM people...
Your a newbie dude!!! You need 10posts.
Go in the new members section and say hello and tell everyone about the bora and the hybrid vrs :-) that should help you bump your post count.
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Ahhhh.
I just sent you one from my friends account.
I have 10 posts now though, woohoo.
*edit* Just sent you one from my account now so you can reply to that instead of my mate lol
*double edit* I now have a welcome thread :grin: http://www.golfgtiforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=205567.0 (http://www.golfgtiforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=205567.0)
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Yo Nick,
Did that oil change do the trick?
Glad it's staying with you for another week :)
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Yo Nick,
Did that oil change do the trick?
Glad it's staying with you for another week :)
It's running much better now, Ben went home in the car tonight to put some miles on it to get the long term fuel trim readings, then we will read the spark plugs..... Then I have moved a few jobs around which mean I have all day Monday on the dyno with your car. I read your print out you left me in the car, if seems you want the same torque as Danes? But I am already there with 2psi less than Danes, how about sitting at 280lbft with the same sort of curve?
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Yo Nick,
Did that oil change do the trick?
Glad it's staying with you for another week :)
It's running much better now, Ben went home in the car tonight to put some miles on it to get the long term fuel trim readings, then we will read the spark plugs..... Then I have moved a few jobs around which mean I have all day Monday on the dyno with your car. I read your print out you left me in the car, if seems you want the same torque as Danes? But I am already there with 2psi less than Danes, how about sitting at 280lbft with the same sort of curve?
Hi Nick,
That's great news :)
With regard to the torque curve, I want it to come in as early as possible and hold it as high as it can for as long as it can, similar to the red curve below. I suspect this is similar to how your K04 is mapped on your Golf?
(http://www.badger-5.com/bin/dane-s3/DynoIT%20-%20D4NEU-3inch-tip-comparisons.jpg)
280lbft sounds bloody awesome, almost as much as my Fabia but without the need for nasty diesel :grin:
Does that mean it's going to be around 280bhp also?
Did you add that valve in to the PCV system to stop it happening again?
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£20 of Super unleaded added and now strapped down ready to roll..... :grin: Ear muffs ready..
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Awesome, can't wait for the results!
Feel free to give me a call during the day.
Sorry for the low tank of fuel, by the time I got down to Hinckley it was just after 11 and I couldn't for the life of me find a Shell garage anywhere :grin: Just add in whatever you need and stick it on the bill :smiley:
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How did you get on Nick?
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How did you get on Nick?
Boom
(http://www.whitea4.com/audi/gt28rs/01%20Blown%20K04.JPG)
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How did you get on Nick?
Boom
(http://www.whitea4.com/audi/gt28rs/01%20Blown%20K04.JPG)
LOL
Your're a cruel cruel man :cry:
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That I am :)
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Although if that happened, then it would mean this.
(http://www.whitea4.com/audi/gt28rs/05%20Turbo%203%20Inch%20Inlet.JPG)
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Update restuls from dyno yesterday 290lbft 275bhp 223gs with 24psi peak now tuned down to 23psi 280lbft. But with lots of timing pull at the top end, for some reason I can only run 9deg advance at the top end, where it should easy run 16deg at 20psi at the top end.
I have to get it wired up to the Detcans later today to listen if the knock is phantom or actual knock.
It can make the power but I am not happy with the logs, it all might be linked to the miss/judder under load.
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Update restuls from dyno yesterday 290lbft 275bhp 223gs with 24psi peak now tuned down to 23psi 280lbft. But with lots of timing pull at the top end, for some reason I can only run 9deg advance at the top end, where it should easy run 16deg at 20psi at the top end.
I have to get it wired up to the Detcans later today to listen if the knock is phantom or actual knock.
It can make the power but I am not happy with the logs, it all might be linked to the miss/judder under load.
Hmm that's a strange one as you say :huh:
Do you want to keep it another week Nick? It sounds like it has the potential to be quite quick?
How does it drive and did you put that valve back in the PCV system?
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Maybe the combination of brand new poly bushes everywhere and the SMF are causing phantom knock?
Fingers crossed.
Would water injection help or just hide the problem?
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Maybe the combination of brand new poly bushes everywhere and the SMF are causing phantom knock?
Fingers crossed.
Would water injection help or just hide the problem?
WMI would mask the fault not the way forward imo( but once done its the way to got) If I we cannot get the timing up we will have to dial some the boost out as the substained EGTs will be too high as all the effort would be on the turbo to make the power. Even with the stock map on with the BP super unleaded I am seeing pull of 6kw?
Already wrote the linear DBW settings and the raised the 4x idle upto 900rpm once at opt engine temp as requested, plus found a map related to load based on idle rpm with the clutch pressed in, which when finished should make the solid fly wheel set up 100% times better when pulling off.
Nick
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Maybe the combination of brand new poly bushes everywhere and the SMF are causing phantom knock?
Fingers crossed.
Would water injection help or just hide the problem?
WMI would mask the fault not the way forward imo( but once done its the way to got) If I we cannot get the timing up we will have to dial some the boost out as the substained EGTs will be too high as all the effort would be on the turbo to make the power. Even with the stock map on with the BP super unleaded I am seeing pull of 6kw?
Already wrote the linear DBW settings and the raised the 4x idle upto 900rpm once at opt engine temp as requested, plus found a map related to load based on idle rpm with the clutch pressed in, which when finished should make the solid fly wheel set up 100% times better when pulling off.
Nick
Thanks Nick, really appreciate all the work you and the guys are putting in to this :)
900rpm should make the idle much nicer and look forward to the Linear DBW.
The catch can wont have filled up again ruining another set of plugs? Like you say if it's pulling on BP Ultimate then something can't be right. I can only afford to run V-Power daily though :(
Any luck with a replacement slipring/steering angle sensor?
Would you like to keep it another week? I don't mind, just so I know so I can change the hotel booking.
John
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Not had chance to do any of the extras yet.. stacked up to the eye balls..lol
Catch can is being vented to atmos at the moment, I will re-read the spark plugs and get the decats on the head and take it from there, I am trying to find a way of testing the VVT while is running under load.
It will be 100% when I have finished... :wink:
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Not had chance to do any of the extras yet.. stacked up to the eye balls..lol
Catch can is being vented to atmos at the moment, I will re-read the spark plugs and get the decats on the head and take it from there, I am trying to find a way of testing the VVT while is running under load.
It will be 100% when I have finished... :wink:
No problem Nick, I know how busy you guys are!
Good idea venting the can, rules it out completely.
Is the sh!tty I/C piping holding up ok?
As for 100%, can't wait! It will take as long as it takes :)
This is the reason I took the time to drive from Aberdeen down to you guys :wink:
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Rob smoke tested it the other day and was spot on, (just a weep around the lower TIP where is meets the comp housing)
What fuel pump are you using? I will check flow rate and rail pressure if I dont get any where, its running 11.9:1 at the top end.
Nick
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Rob smoke tested it the other day and was spot on, (just a weep around the lower TIP where is meets the comp housing)
What fuel pump are you using? I will check flow rate and rail pressure if I dont get any where, its running 11.9:1 at the top end.
Nick
Well this was something I also thought about.
It's the standard 2.8 V6 fuel pump.
Should it have a S3 or LCR pump?
edit - No idea when the filter was last done Nick.... car has done a sh!t load of miles.
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Leave it with me I will got right back to basics and get my head around it. :-)
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Leave it with me I will got right back to basics and get my head around it. :-)
Cheers Nick, catch you later :)
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I've been thinking more about this timing issue.
http://ngksparkplugs.com/tech_support/spark_plugs/p4.asp?mode=nml (http://ngksparkplugs.com/tech_support/spark_plugs/p4.asp?mode=nml)
"Ignition Timing
Advancing ignition timing by 10° will cause the spark plug tip temperature to increase by approximately 70° to 100°C.
A colder heat range spark plug may be necessary if the ignition timing has been advanced to near the knock level. Higher cylinder temperatures near the knock level will bring the spark plug firing end temperature closer to the pre-ignition range."
Would a colder set of plugs help?
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One range colder and a plug gap of 0.7mm is usually needed when remapping for every 50HP. As a guide
NGK BKR7EIX or Denso IK22 are a good choice
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One range colder and a plug gap of 0.7mm is usually needed when remapping for every 50HP. As a guide
NGK BKR7EIX or Denso IK22 are a good choice
Hmm could be on to something going by this thread.
http://www.audi-sport.net/vb/new-a3-s3-sportback-8p-chassis/78192-spark-plug-temperatures-want-them-cooler.html (http://www.audi-sport.net/vb/new-a3-s3-sportback-8p-chassis/78192-spark-plug-temperatures-want-them-cooler.html)
Quote from that link -
"I appreciate the Bosch OEM plug is cheaper, and had to cope with the running in period of the engine, but it only ever ran with stage 1 Revo and the filter/intake. I was forced to remove these plugs at 9k as they were causing stuttering over 5,500rpm. Changing them fixed the issue which has never returned."
Or on another thread -
"Avoid irridium plugs on chipped cars, the pointy electrodes can cause hot spots and pinking under load.
Try stock NGK platinums, or for big bost go one stage cooler, ie 7s not 6's."
The last post in this link is relevent also.
http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?3923456-Why-is-colder-better-on-spark-plugs (http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?3923456-Why-is-colder-better-on-spark-plugs)
"These logs were taken back when I had EIP software, and I've seen pretty similar occurrences posted here from people running the original Revo tune. Only difference is the plugs (stock vs NGK bk7eix or whatever they are)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v169/blazini/CorrectionFactors.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v169/blazini/CFchart9-4-07.jpg)
Correction factor logs only show where the ECU had to pull timing to prevent detonation. If colder plugs meant less timing pulled........well, it may or may not add up to 10hp, but you get the idea. "
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Although it's a different engine and I had the the colder plugs already (Denso IK22), reducing plug gap had a big affect. I had some misfires and some coil problems. High boost pressures can cause the spark to have a hard time jumping the gap. Reducing plug gap also prevents coil pack failures.
Taken from vortex FAQ.
>Stock spark plugs NGK PFR6Q stock gap .032"
--Common replacements
Autolite 3923
Autolite 3922 (one heat range colder)
Denso Iridium IK20
Denso Iridium IK22 (one heat range colder)
Bosch F7LTCR
NGK BKR7E (Race plug, one range colder)
*avoid BKR7E-11 as the factory gap is too large, .042*
For every additional 50HP over stock, a general rule is:
--1 heat range colder
--gap shrinks by .004
So, a chipped 1.8T would make good use ofa plug one range colder gapped to .028
Reference: From NGK's FAQ: Spark Plug Gap
"Another consideration that should be taken into account is the extent of any modifications that you may have made to the engine. As an example, when you raise compression or add forced induction (a turbo system, nitrous or supercharger kit) you must reduce the gap (about .004" for every 50 hp you add). However, when you add a high power ignition system (such as those offered by MSD, Crane, Nology) you can open the gap from .002-.005"."
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Morning Nick,
At the moment I've got a hotel booked for Friday (tomorrow) night. I'm going on holiday next Wednesday so shall I just shift the booking and pick the car up one week on Monday all going well (the 26th)?
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Morning Nick,
At the moment I've got a hotel booked for Friday (tomorrow) night. I'm going on holiday next Wednesday so shall I just shift the booking and pick the car up one week on Monday all going well (the 26th)?
Hello M8
Not all the detcans wired up to the engine yeaterday when I found a free slot, when to connect the device to the battery........ which we could not find..lol In the boot. I had to put a spare battery on charge and put it in the footwell. I will be driving it to work this morning to do a cold log. I dont think its the plugs as in not under peak cyliner pressures, but I will but mine in there of testing later.
Apart from that we are running 219-222g/s at the top of the rev range, its sooooo smooth and linear and the extra idle speed and torque request and made the clutch pick up loads better. I just want to be 100% sure that no issues have been caused when the engine ended up side down, just the CF pull worries me at the moment, I will know in an hour or so if its phantom voltage pick up from engine harmonics, or is it an early flame front. I think the 26th wil lbe fine to collect the car as it will give us chnage to do all the other work with the sterring.
Nick
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Morning Nick,
At the moment I've got a hotel booked for Friday (tomorrow) night. I'm going on holiday next Wednesday so shall I just shift the booking and pick the car up one week on Monday all going well (the 26th)?
Hello M8
Not all the detcans wired up to the engine yeaterday when I found a free slot, when to connect the device to the battery........ which we could not find..lol In the boot. I had to put a spare battery on charge and put it in the footwell. I will be driving it to work this morning to do a cold log. I dont think its the plugs as in not under peak cyliner pressures, but I will but mine in there of testing later.
Apart from that we are running 219-222g/s at the top of the rev range, its sooooo smooth and linear and the extra idle speed and torque request and made the clutch pick up loads better. I just want to be 100% sure that no issues have been caused when the engine ended up side down, just the CF pull worries me at the moment, I will know in an hour or so if its phantom voltage pick up from engine harmonics, or is it an early flame front. I think the 26th wil lbe fine to collect the car as it will give us chnage to do all the other work with the sterring.
Nick
Ooops, forgot to tell you the battery was there :grin:
That flow seems bloody impressive for the top of the rev range, roughly 275bhp? Sounds like I'm not going to recognise it when I get it back :evil:
No problem Nick, like I said I'd rather you held on to it as long as need be to make sure it is running 100% spot on.
I'll change my booking today and pop down on the 26th (assuming all is going well).
Any RR graphs?
Cheers,
John
*edit* Does it pop and bang and make cool noises now lol?