Author Topic: Mk2 Golf - ICE already installed however would still like some advice  (Read 3455 times)

Offline drapergti

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Hi Everyone.

Recently joined and I have recently bought a mint Mk2 with the exception of having some ICE already installed (nothing mad) as follows

Pioneer Head Unit 4x 50w not too old
Two Pioneer GM-5300T Bridgeable two channel amps - One for the front (Tweeter and Door) and one for the rear
Front Tweeters (top of A pillar) TS S15
Front Door 13cm Speakers - TS E1396
Rear Speakers (in Stealth Shelf) TS A2503i (25cm 420w max) 3 way

And a knob between the electric window switches which adjusts the fader between the fron and the back (I guess between each amp) :angry:

The HU does not control the fader between the amps so I guess wired in a strange way, if I adjust the Head Unit fader full front then there is no sound at all and full rear on the HU means the knob / dial between the electric windows does the job.

I am not 100pct happy with this set up -

1. I think the rears over power the fronts
2. I hate the non-OEM dial between the windows


So I am basically looking for a way to use some of what I have, sell the rest and replace.

My aims are to

Keep the car looking 100pct factory (its only got 82k and has not been modded in any way)
Maybe add a discreet sub somewhere (where?)

I really like my music to sound balanced and "Pure" I tend to listen to rock and Dance music but rarely heavy bass R&B

As an example I used to have a Focus ST170 which as standard had a great sound system so being able to replicate that kind of system would be great.

I would be happy to get rid of the head unit as it does not change to green!

Any advice on a clean factory style install would be much appreciated.

Thanks - Stuart
 :smiley:

Offline S11EPS

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Without having the headunit model I can't be 100% sure, but it sounds to me like the headunit only has (or the installer has only used) 1 set of pre-out's (rear), the signals of which are being used for both amplifiers, hence the need for the aftermarket fader control. Not ideal.

First things first, can we have the head unit model number? This will tell us if the installer has made the system overly complicated or if you do only have one set of pre-outs.

Those three ways you have are a great way of going loud for little money (I had a couple of sets myself) but for proper car audio, where you expect the bulk or your sound to be coming from upfront, they wreck a decent set up.

Let's start by ascertaining where we are with your headunit, and go from there.

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Offline drapergti

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Hi There,

Thanks for the reply. The head unit is a DEH-P5600MP if that helps?

Offline S11EPS

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Ok, that helps.
This is your unit, right?



From the specs I've read that you have 2 sets of RCA pre-outs - one front and a non-fading or Subwoofer output.
So, I can kind of understand why it has been done as it has. Not to mind, to get you on the route to recovery....

Firstly, for a decent sounding, well-balanced system the pre out's your head unit has are fine. Unless you absolutely want to change it (I have no idea what the budget is?) there's no real need to change it.

What we’re looking for is a strong, clear, front-focussed sound that is backed up with a sub capable of delivering some lows as well as some punch. We achieve this by utilising the front pre-outs and an amplifier to drive a good set of components up front and the non-fading sub-out and a mono amp to drive a good 10 or 12” boxed sub.

You can add some head-unit powered rear-fill speakers, but there’s certainly no need for anything as huge as the pioneers you currently have.

So, what’s the total budget and we can start to look at some kit.

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Offline drapergti

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I guess a few hundred pounds plus anything that I can get for the parts I don't use. Keeping the existing HU is no problem. Can I use the existing two amps? One for the front and one for the sub, or do I need a mono amp for the sub?

Thanks for taking the time to help me out. Much appreciated.

Stuart

Offline S11EPS

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OK, I've just checked out the specs of your amps:
This is them, right?:



The specs are (RMS) 2 x 125watts or 1 x 380watts.
These are really good amps, and no replacement is required in my opinion.

I'd look to run one off of the front RCA pre-out to power your front components (see below).
I'd run the 2nd off of the non-fading pre-out powering a 10" sub in a box.

I personally would ditch the stealth shelf and replace it with a genuine item (your car sounds like a real minter, try and keep it as standard as poss) and get some drop in replacements in the standard rear location (parcel shelf supports). These will be head unit powered only, faded right down to offer some rear fill only.

You might find you don't even want rear fill - try having a listen with nothing connected first.

Your front speakers are currently your weakest link.
The 13cm door speakers have an rms rating of 35 watts and a sensitivity rating of 90db.
I'm not entirely sure how these are wired in terms of crossover, but it seems a little wierd to be running seperate tweeters alongside a 3-way speaker.

I would look to spend a chunk of money here - you're going to struggle to get a set of 5 1/4" components that will handle all of your 125wrms power for anything approaching sensible money, but £150 will get you a vast improvement over what you have now.

Have a look at products from Infinity, DLS, Rainbow or Hertz.

As for a subwoofer, you're looking to approximately match rms watts but play close attention to box volume. A great sub in a box twice as big as it should be won't sound as good as a budget sub in a weel sized box. I'd advise going to your nearest car stereo place and having a look at sub and box matched packages. From a shop you're going to be paying circa £150 for anything half decent.

Alternatively I have a 10" JL sub in a small JL box for £100...

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Offline drapergti

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Great info!

I will come back re the sub box, but wondered if you know the mounting depths permissable in the doors, and would it be ok to fit the tweeter in the dashboard factory position or is the top of the A pillar the best place?

The tweeter I currently have have a built in cross over I think.

I will be sure to keep you updated of my progress.

Thanks again!

Offline k4ith

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this is looking a good thread was gonna ask roughly the same but from scratch as i have nothing so need cable (sizes etc) amp or amps? speaker sizes as i am gonna have a go at doing this myself instead of paying for it to be done.
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Offline drapergti

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Right then, car has been in the garage for the majority of the winter...minor repairs etc...now time to focus again on this post.

I may have found a buyer for all the speakers I mentioned above and the shelf so time to spend a few pounds.

If my amp puts out 250w RMS am I looking for a set of components that are rated at this amount or below?

I was looking at something like these ? http://www.caraudiodirect.co.uk/diamond-audio-d353-p-7081.html?cadid=snrsesj8b1rm8j32cf5s1ddua2

What do you think? Guess I will need dynamat or similar also.

Would you house the tweeters in the A pillar, in the blanking plate for the wing mirror or in the original dash space. Would be interested in your experiences.

I would like a Audioscape style subwoofer boot install with similar in for the amps if possible, but have noticed the website is down.
« Last Edit: 15 February 2009, 20:29 by drapergti »

Offline tommk3cab

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My tweeters are in the mirror backs at the moment due to the ease of mounting them there, the ideal place in most cases is in the A pillars just above the highest point of the dash pointing the tweeters at each other, or in some cases at the opposing head restraints. This means the driver tweeter pointed at passenger headrest and visa versa.

as far as speaker choices go...

if you can find a way to get 6.5 inch speakers in ( you may or probably will need to modify the door card and standard mountings) then it would be worth it as you will get a much better midbass response from them. You will also gain more with 6.5s from and sound deadening which you choose to fit.

If not then the speakers you have chosen will be fine.