Author Topic: How do i power this Sub?  (Read 2088 times)

Offline Golf VR6

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How do i power this Sub?
« on: 24 January 2008, 03:32 »
Guys, i need your help in choosing a mono amp to power this sub:

http://caraudiosecurity.com/shop/product/products_id/6990.html

12" Alpine SWX-1243D
Power Specifications

    * 3000 Watt Peak Power
    * 1000 Watt RMS Power
    * Impedance: 4+4 Ohm
    * Sensitivity 86dB/W (1m)
    * Frequency response: 20-500Hz
    * Mounting depth: 221 mm
    * Cut-out diameter: 277 mm

Please school me on this as i have no clue whatsoever on ICE systems.  I'm aware the amp RMS power should match the subs at least but what about all this Ohm malarky?  I'm finding it difficult to find an amp with 1000RMS at 4Ohms.  What are the best amp makes, but i preferably do not want to spend more than £200 and will most likely buy a used one as my funds are running extremely low.

Offline Chris 'N' Jen

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Re: How do i power this Sub?
« Reply #1 on: 24 January 2008, 10:06 »
as its duel voice coil sub so you dont need a 4ohm amp. if you wire it like this;
http://www.rockfordfosgate.com/rftech/woofer_wizard.asp?submitted=true&woofer_qty=1&woofer_imp=4
you can use a 2ohm amp. I presume you only have one of these subs?

for this sort of power you should be looking at at least 1200 - 1500 watt RMS amp @2ohm. Also for the current draw you may need an extra battery and dont forget, you need butch cable (0 guage) to supply that massive current.

With amps you get what you pay for. I have an Orion amp in my car. Id never heard of them before but i must say it perfroms very well and it also runs very cool which is an aded bonus

you coud have one of these

http://www.caraudiodirect.co.uk/orion-hccad5000-p-6172.html

1600watt @ 2ohms mono.

Some may say thats a bit too much but idealy you get a more powerfull amp and run it gently instead of making an amp run flat out. anything above about 80% of the amps gain has a chance of sending a clipped signal which will burn you coils.

You may also want to do "the big 3"

Upgrade the power cable from alt to battery to 0 guage
upgrade the earth from the battery to the body to 0 guage
upgrade the earth from the block to the chasis to 0 guage

Hope that helps. any more questions give me a shout.   :smiley: :smiley:
« Last Edit: 24 January 2008, 12:04 by Chris 'N' Jen »

Offline Golf VR6

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Re: How do i power this Sub?
« Reply #2 on: 25 January 2008, 04:30 »
That is some quality info right there, thanks dude.  I'm not sure if i want to have another battery installed, is one battery enough when used with a powercap?  I actually have loads of questions, but i think we'll take it one step at a time, i'll be in contact with you when money is freed up and i can start purchasing more ICE  :smiley:

Offline Chris 'N' Jen

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Re: How do i power this Sub?
« Reply #3 on: 25 January 2008, 08:55 »
Dont get a power cap. Their only use is for a doorstop or similar. Once they are discharged it just puts extra load on the system charging them back up.

You could go for a beefier battery under the bonnet. that will help. to be honest i have an 800watt rms and a 400watt rms amp both running from stock battery and i get very little dimming of headlights etc so maybe get your clobber in first and see how it goes.

Also a volt meter is handy too. If you put the terminals on the +ve and -ve of the amp it will give you the through current. it should read about 14.4 with engine running and no load. if it drops below about 12 on heavy bass you should consider extra power.

happy to help mate. give me a shout if you need owt else

 :smiley: :smiley:
« Last Edit: 25 January 2008, 09:06 by Chris 'N' Jen »

Offline blacfist

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Re: How do i power this Sub?
« Reply #4 on: 02 February 2008, 05:35 »
hi there,
the advice given thus far is all correct, but i c ur point on the money thing. fortunately, these days due to massive amounts of competition in the the manufacturing industry, its quite easy to find very high quality equipment for very small amounts of money.

to an extent u still get what u pay for, but you sound like someone who is after a decent (not competition winning) system without having to take out a 2nd mortgage to pay for it (& some guys really do take out 2nd mortgages by the way!!).

in reality, the so called 'facts and figures' given on most subs dont actually mean anything or very little. power depends on many things but mainly the type of enclosure the sub is placed in and the purity of input from the amplifier. in other words, you could have a sub that says '1000 watts rms' on the packaging box, run it with a amp that says '500 watts rms' on its box and you could quite easily destroy the sub! when an underpowered amp is push to its limits, the output voltage 'clips' or massively distorts leading to a damage to the speakers or sub. the link below is for an amp that i have personally been using for quite a while now. it doesnt have anything like the power that is claimed, id say its about a little under half the power they claim, but its VERY well built, has lots of useful features and delivers huge amount of 'clean' power to your sub:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/4000w-Subwoofer-Amplifier-Monoblock-Sub-Bass-Amp-Car_W0QQitemZ290202836316QQihZ019QQcategoryZ18797QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

its a nobody make, but the components inside come from the same factories as those found in much, much more expensive units. if you bridge both coils of your sub (4ohm+4ohm) the amp will see a resistance of about 2ohms, this amp claims to deliver about 900watt rms at the ohmage (so about 450ish in real terms) which is more than enuff to give you serious chest pains! power consumption is always an issue with big stereo systems, so id recommend a 90amp alternator and as previously suggested a bigger battery, the biggest you can afford and the biggest you fit under your bonnet on the battery tray!

the other thing to remember is that by placing the sub into a ported box, you can increase its efficiency (or its relative loudness at a given volume level) by about 6db (4times as loud) at its tuned frequency and 3bd (twice as loud) across the frequency range that it plays. you'll need a slightly bigger box but it means that you wont need quite as much power to deafen yourself and innocent passers by!!

the basic rule of thumb with ICE, bass in particular is that if you want something, you have to give something. BIG BIG bass means big boxes, which means a heavier car slower car, more fuel consumption and  electrical power requirements which means more expense and more things to wrong. of course not to mention the fact that you'll have no boot for your shopping etc!

ive tried to keep things simple (ish) but the subject is kinda large and would take much more words to explain fully. any other questions, please ask. oh, one other thing which you may have already noticed: ICE builders all have their own theories and opinions of how to achieve and what is the best system, no1 is really right or wrong, just different ways of approaching and handling the issue!!

hope that helps, a bit

Offline Heyho

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Re: How do i power this Sub?
« Reply #5 on: 02 February 2008, 14:30 »
If only power figures from "theloudest" were to be believed.  Far better to look out for something second hand with reputable power figures.  RRP of £499, and it's up for £149 - they must be losing a few quid on those! :wink:

A few generalisations there - and also, it takes an increase of 10db for a perceived doubling of loudness levels - 3db is doubling the power of the sound wave, and would not be heard as twice the volume.


Offline Golf VR6

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Re: How do i power this Sub?
« Reply #6 on: 07 February 2008, 17:38 »
Hey guys, sorry i've been away from my PC for awhile, some more great info in here, i will be following all the advices with a sound ear, yes i'm after a decent sound setup but not rediculous amounts of money, the 4000w amp is certainly cheap for the power its quoting, but not to sound like a snob, i've got a thing about unbranded electrical goods, therefore i'm thinking of getting this Audiobahn:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=220142545744&ssPageName=MERC_VI_RCRX_Pr4_PcY_BIN_Stores_IT&refitem=220142544877&itemcount=4&refwidgetloc=active_view_item&usedrule1=CrossSell_LogicX&refwidgettype=cross_promot_widget

And these Diamond Audio components in the front:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=220142544877&ssPageName=ADME:B:BOCOR:UK:1

What do you guys think of that sub and these component speakers?  These are the most important pieces of kit i have to get for now, and to get right is a must.

The costs are unfortunately spiralling out of control, i'm a music freak but hopefully the results can justify the expense.

Offline Chris 'N' Jen

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Re: How do i power this Sub?
« Reply #7 on: 08 February 2008, 09:11 »
i think the general consensis is that audiobahn spend more time and money on the looks of their amps than the internals, though i personally have never had one. Also, audiobahn have a tenancy not to deliver the power they claim, having said that, going by the ratings that amp should have no bother powering that sub. One last thing to consider, its always best to get a class D amp for subs as they are more efficiant, audiobahn i think are mostly class a/b. (im open to being shot down on the last statement as im not 100% sure) If you do get that amp make sure you wire the sub to show a 2Ohm load or you wont get the results. Seems like you got the right idea about power ratings, the more you scour the market the more idea youll get about what you should be going for.

As for the components, iv only ever heard good things about those, though never heard any myself. Dont forget you would be best amping the components. to run one set of those you should be looking at at least a 2 channel 400watt RMS @ 4Ohm. Obvioustly if you want 2 sets of comps you need a 4channel amp at 800 watt RMS @ 4ohm.

4000 watts is going to cost a lot, so if it seems too good to be true it probably is.

Hope that helps

 :smiley:


Offline Golf VR6

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Re: How do i power this Sub?
« Reply #8 on: 12 February 2008, 23:40 »
Ok, i've already bought the Diamond Audio Hex S600s and have dropped interest in the Audiobahn Amp but now looking at this Alpine PDX:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=130196628137&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=003

The total price for it is roughly £250 from the US, it's 1000W RMS but i can't find its max power rating, do you think this AMP is strong enough to run the sub?  It's a compact design which is quite a bonus.

Offline Chris 'N' Jen

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Re: How do i power this Sub?
« Reply #9 on: 13 February 2008, 08:50 »
Alpine have always been a great brand. I think the older stuff is slightly more hardcore than the newer stuff (cant back that statement up with anything, think i remember reading something about it) It meets the power rating so you should be ok, just be aware that you cant just wack the gains straight up.

You dont need peek ratings, RMS is the only ones you need. If it were me, id go for that one against the others you've listed, as long as your happy with buying from US. Seems like quite a good price too.

Are you going to amp up the front end?

 :smiley: