Who has Dynaudio?

[Rolfe]

The basic system in my 11.5-y-o Peugeot was very good, and I'm not convinced the 310 is as good.  There seems to be a bit more sibilant in radio speech, and I'm not sure the music is as involving.  I did think that nearly 12 years later, the basic Golf system would be at least as good as the basic Peugeot system was then, but maybe not.

It's still not bad though, and I'm not necessarily complaining.  It's only a car audio.  I really didn't want that big TV screen in the middle of my console.

To continue the derail for a bit, I know my Linn amp has some complete BS attached to it.  Some years ago, I needed new speaker cables, and I remembered that the dealer had been going on about biwiring the speakers as a great thing to do.  So I thought, why not.  I ended up with a couple of chunks of inflexible sugarally, which I was told had to be plugged in in one direction only.  I thought there was an improvement but there was no way to do a listening comparison and I now know I fooled myself.

If was only when I moved house, and the stiff Linn cables simply wouldn't fit the geometry of the new room, that I realised quite how much BS it had been.  I had to buy new cables again, and to their credit I didn't get any guff about direction, or even the merits of biwiring, from the second dealer.  However, it was only when trying to figure out how to wire them that I realised there was nothing on the amp to differentiate treble and bass connections.  A little bit of discussion on another forum made it clear to me that the two sets of outputs on the amp are identical.  There is no feasible way that biwiring can possibly make any difference to the sound of my system.  And yet the instruction manual for the amp waxes lyrical about the great benefits to be gained from this "upgrade".

Mr. Tiefenbrun, I'm ashamed of you.

Rolfe.

[VWKev]

The basic system in my 11.5-y-o Peugeot was very good, and I'm not convinced the 310 is as good.  There seems to be a bit more sibilant in radio speech, and I'm not sure the music is as involving.  I did think that nearly 12 years later, the basic Golf system would be at least as good as the basic Peugeot system was then, but maybe not.

It's still not bad though, and I'm not necessarily complaining.  It's only a car audio.  I really didn't want that big TV screen in the middle of my console.

To continue the derail for a bit, I know my Linn amp has some complete BS attached to it.  Some years ago, I needed new speaker cables, and I remembered that the dealer had been going on about biwiring the speakers as a great thing to do.  So I thought, why not.  I ended up with a couple of chunks of inflexible sugarally, which I was told had to be plugged in in one direction only.  I thought there was an improvement but there was no way to do a listening comparison and I now know I fooled myself.

If was only when I moved house, and the stiff Linn cables simply wouldn't fit the geometry of the new room, that I realised quite how much BS it had been.  I had to buy new cables again, and to their credit I didn't get any guff about direction, or even the merits of biwiring, from the second dealer.  However, it was only when trying to figure out how to wire them that I realised there was nothing on the amp to differentiate treble and bass connections.  A little bit of discussion on another forum made it clear to me that the two sets of outputs on the amp are identical.  There is no feasible way that biwiring can possibly make any difference to the sound of my system.  And yet the instruction manual for the amp waxes lyrical about the great benefits to be gained from this "upgrade".

Mr. Tiefenbrun, I'm ashamed of you.

Rolfe.

Rolfe, depending on where you go to buy your AV kit, you really should demo a system in your own home so that you can decide if there are any benefits, every room is accoustically different and even what you hear in a dealers wont sound the same in your house.

Regarding bi-wiring, it is all down to personal preference, it may be making a difference, but you cant hear it, it may be that in your system you wont get any benefit from it. Like fine wine drinkers, they have particular ways of tasting, smelling etc to get the best from their experience. Me ? A bottle of wine at a fiver is good enough. Like sound, if you dont know what your listening for the bi-wire experience may be getting lost on you, where-as like the wine connoseur, you know what to listen for and will appreciate it more.

[Rolfe]

No, what I'm saying is that the way the Majik is wired up, it's impossible for the biwiring to make the speakers do anything differently.

Rolfe.

[BA Baracus]

No, what I'm saying is that the way the Majik is wired up, it's impossible for the biwiring to make the speakers do anything differently.

Rolfe.

Its going to be difficult enough for me to get a pass from the missus to buy a GTI (she says a car is a car to her), there is NO way I can start bringing "biwiring" for better sound quality into the negotation process!!! 

[AdrianM]

Regarding bi-wiring, it is all down to personal preference, it may be making a difference, but you cant hear it, it may be that in your system you wont get any benefit from it. Like fine wine drinkers, they have particular ways of tasting, smelling etc to get the best from their experience. Me ? A bottle of wine at a fiver is good enough. Like sound, if you dont know what your listening for the bi-wire experience may be getting lost on you, where-as like the wine connoseur, you know what to listen for and will appreciate it more.

As Rolfe says, Bi-wiring as utter rubbish. It's a useless tweak promoted by audiophools that have no idea about audio/electric science. This has been shown so many times in objective double blind tests that it's incredible that there are any gullible people left to believe in it. 

Even Bi-amping, which uses seperate amplifiers, is only really effective in certain specific applications, like those that use an external crossover.

[VWKev]

Regarding bi-wiring, it is all down to personal preference, it may be making a difference, but you cant hear it, it may be that in your system you wont get any benefit from it. Like fine wine drinkers, they have particular ways of tasting, smelling etc to get the best from their experience. Me ? A bottle of wine at a fiver is good enough. Like sound, if you dont know what your listening for the bi-wire experience may be getting lost on you, where-as like the wine connoseur, you know what to listen for and will appreciate it more.

As Rolfe says, Bi-wiring as utter rubbish. It's a useless tweak promoted by audiophools that have no idea about audio/electric science. This has been shown so many times in objective double blind tests that it's incredible that there are any gullible people left to believe in it. 

Even Bi-amping, which uses seperate amplifiers, is only really effective in certain specific applications, like those that use an external crossover.

Could you post up some results of those tests, I'd be interested to see them.

[Rolfe]

Never mind tests, it's axiomatic that if the two sets of outputs from the amp are delivering an identical signal, then it doesn't matter whether they're connected individually to the speaker treble and bass or not - the speaker will behave in exactly the same way.

Rolfe.

[AdrianM]

Regarding bi-wiring, it is all down to personal preference, it may be making a difference, but you cant hear it, it may be that in your system you wont get any benefit from it. Like fine wine drinkers, they have particular ways of tasting, smelling etc to get the best from their experience. Me ? A bottle of wine at a fiver is good enough. Like sound, if you dont know what your listening for the bi-wire experience may be getting lost on you, where-as like the wine connoseur, you know what to listen for and will appreciate it more.

As Rolfe says, Bi-wiring as utter rubbish. It's a useless tweak promoted by audiophools that have no idea about audio/electric science. This has been shown so many times in objective double blind tests that it's incredible that there are any gullible people left to believe in it. 

Even Bi-amping, which uses seperate amplifiers, is only really effective in certain specific applications, like those that use an external crossover.

Could you post up some results of those tests, I'd be interested to see them.

Here's a few to get you started;

http://www.provide.net/~djcarlst/abx_wire.htm
http://www.axiomaudio.com/tips_biwiring_and_biamping.html
http://www.avforums.com/forums/interconnects-speaker-cables-switches/46335-bi-wiring-cables-what-load-long.html
http://www.audioholics.com/education/cables/bi-wiring-from-amplifier-to-loudspeaker

[R32UK]

Never mind tests, it's axiomatic that if the two sets of outputs from the amp are delivering an identical signal, then it doesn't matter whether they're connected individually to the speaker treble and bass or not - the speaker will behave in exactly the same way.

Rolfe.

more power = more sound no?? 

[VWKev]

Regarding bi-wiring, it is all down to personal preference, it may be making a difference, but you cant hear it, it may be that in your system you wont get any benefit from it. Like fine wine drinkers, they have particular ways of tasting, smelling etc to get the best from their experience. Me ? A bottle of wine at a fiver is good enough. Like sound, if you dont know what your listening for the bi-wire experience may be getting lost on you, where-as like the wine connoseur, you know what to listen for and will appreciate it more.

As Rolfe says, Bi-wiring as utter rubbish. It's a useless tweak promoted by audiophools that have no idea about audio/electric science. This has been shown so many times in objective double blind tests that it's incredible that there are any gullible people left to believe in it. 

Even Bi-amping, which uses seperate amplifiers, is only really effective in certain specific applications, like those that use an external crossover.

Could you post up some results of those tests, I'd be interested to see them.

Here's a few to get you started;

http://www.provide.net/~djcarlst/abx_wire.htm
http://www.axiomaudio.com/tips_biwiring_and_biamping.html
http://www.avforums.com/forums/interconnects-speaker-cables-switches/46335-bi-wiring-cables-what-load-long.html
http://www.audioholics.com/education/cables/bi-wiring-from-amplifier-to-loudspeaker

Cool thanks, will have a read through them a little later.