GolfGTIforum.co.uk
Model specific boards => Golf mk7 => Topic started by: lengster on 19 August 2013, 22:31
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Best deals on a new one if I get dismayed with pursueing used mk6s.Had a quick look on vw site but nearly 500 a month with only leather added worked out at over 15k in total,think buying a 6 outright for 12 or 13k is better for me and retain 5-6k in 3 years or whenever I choose to get rid.
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Got a quote the other day from a local dealer on a GTD....
List Price - Close to £30,000 (No discount)
Mileage - 25,000
Term - 36 months
Interest - 6.3%
Deposit - £1500
Monthly payments were around the £540 mark!
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Got a quote the other day from a local dealer on a GTD....
List Price - Close to £30,000 (No discount)
Mileage - 25,000
Term - 36 months
Interest - 6.3%
Deposit - £1500
Monthly payments were around the £540 mark!
Well I would be looking for discount to boost your “deposit”. What was your GFV figure, considering you have £4k options there (assuming 5 doors and manual gearbox).
Were you talking 25k miles per year or 25k miles over 3 years (8300 miles per annum)? 25k miles per year would certainly hammer your GFV right down. Based purely on their excess mileage rate of 6p per mile, your GFV would be around £11770 vs £14470 for an average 10k per annum driver, and assuming no GFV enhancement for your £4k optional equipment (£1000 enhancement in lieu of that equipment is about max you could hope for – leather, pronav and DSG add about £300 each).
If you could get a £3500 discount from a broker, you’d effectively be financing £25k minus GFV, bringing your monthly payments down by £107 a month to £433. That mileage is a killer though, the difference for 25k vs 10k miles per annum is close to £100 a month.
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The quote I got was 6.3% over 4 years at £370 per month on PCP with Performance Pack, Pan Roof and Chassis Control.
£3,500 deposit (trade in)
Got a bit of a discount, about £1300 I think.
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I would get some numbers back for a 48 month PCP (and take the 90k/5yr extended warranty at the same time); but the 25k mileage profile is going to lower the GFV and push up the monthly payments as detailed by monkeyhanger.
For example I took a GTI over 48 months (vs 36) with the 90k/5yr extended warranty on a 15,000 mile a year profile, and it lower my monthly PCP payments by around £50. There will be some higher maintenance costs as a result, but it still works out cheaper overall.
FYI - discounts of over 12% are available on line, but even via a local dealer I wouldn't settle for less than 8%.
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Just for reference, I'll be paying £400 a month over 3 years with £4,500 down based on 10k miles pa. 6.4%, with a GFV of £13,400 (I think).
The best way of going about it is to spec the car how you want it, know what you have to put down as a deposit and then what you want to pay each month. Then work the discount into this in order to get your monthly payments to what you want to pay.
If you're doing 25k miles a year your monthly payments are going to be high, as MH has stated this is the factor that bumps up the monthly amounts and reduces the GFV significantly.
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Got a quote the other day from a local dealer on a GTD....
List Price - Close to £30,000 (No discount)
Mileage - 25,000
Term - 36 months
Interest - 6.3%
Deposit - £1500
Monthly payments were around the £540 mark!
Well I would be looking for discount to boost your “deposit”. What was your GFV figure, considering you have £4k options there (assuming 5 doors and manual gearbox).
Were you talking 25k miles per year or 25k miles over 3 years (8300 miles per annum)? 25k miles per year would certainly hammer your GFV right down. Based purely on their excess mileage rate of 6p per mile, your GFV would be around £11770 vs £14470 for an average 10k per annum driver, and assuming no GFV enhancement for your £4k optional equipment (£1000 enhancement in lieu of that equipment is about max you could hope for – leather, pronav and DSG add about £300 each).
If you could get a £3500 discount from a broker, you’d effectively be financing £25k minus GFV, bringing your monthly payments down by £107 a month to £433. That mileage is a killer though, the difference for 25k vs 10k miles per annum is close to £100 a month.
Should of said it was a 3dr and DSG. Discovery Pro Nav, Keyless, Winter Pack, Park Assist, Carbon Grey.
25k miles per year so 75k over the 3 years. Not sure what the GFMV was didn't get into that detail as the monthly payments were too high for me! Would be willing to pay between £400 and £450 a month.
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There are 2 things hammering your GFV and upping your monthly payments– your mileage (a 3 year old 75k miles car is worth £2700 less than a 3 year old 30k miles car), and your options.
Options are pretty much dead money down the line. Looking at yours:-
DSG = £1415 spent, retains £300 on your GFV (checked on my dads).
Discovery pro = £1700ish spent, retains about £250 on your GFV
Winter pack, park assist, keyless and metallic paint will retain £200 at most on your GFV for a £1370 spend (metallic/pearl paint enhanced mine by £40 vs Tornado Red).
So for your options (I include DSG as an option), you will lose £3735, which contributes approx. £114 a month to your payments.
If you consider that you’re getting no discount (should be looking for £3500 off a well specced model through a broker), a £3500 discount would amount to a £107 saving on your monthly payments.
Current undiscounted quote = £570pm
Broker discounted quote (with options) = £463pm
Current undiscounted quote (but forget the options) = £556
If you’re being priced out of a £570pm car you have a few options – chase a broker discount, do fewer miles (maybe buy a reliable older car for racking up the heavy/business miles) or lose the options.
If you are doing 75k miles in 3 years you need to be aware of the limitations of the standard guarantee – it is only good for 60k miles, any more than that and you’re on your own/reliant on VW goodwill if something should happen. You could get the extended 5 year/90k miles warranty, but at your mileage you won’t even see 4 years out of it.
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I think if you are going to do that kind of high mileage you are mad to buy new on PCP, you would be better to just lease something without any ownership hassles.
Or.. Better to buy a cheap used diesel golf mk 5 tdi, hammer it and buy something else fun for the weekend ? You have to really love a certain car to want it new and to pay £500 per month for it.
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Whats to stop the OP saying he is doing 10K a year, which will bring the monthly payments down, put some of that difference away each month into an account. When he comes to change the car the xs mileage will only come into effect if he is handing the car back and walking away.
If he is trading it in or selling it privately the money he has put by would maybe cover the offset of having a higher mileage car than average and hence less of a deal.
Or is it just swings and roundabouts?
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Whats to stop the OP saying he is doing 10K a year, which will bring the monthly payments down, put some of that difference away each month into an account. When he comes to change the car the xs mileage will only come into effect if he is handing the car back and walking away.
If he is trading it in or selling it privately the money he has put by would maybe cover the offset of having a higher mileage car than average and hence less of a deal.
Or is it just swings and roundabouts?
If you quote low miles to get a cheaper price per month, you have to be putting money away for when you trade in, or you'll be in negative equity. No way a GTD or GTI in p/x in 3 years time is going to be worth £2700 more than accurate GFV, you will have to pay the piper at some point. If you're putting money by to make up the shortfall later then what's the point? You are paying more interest on that would-be payment deferred than you would accumulate in a savings account, you might as well pay it up front.
OPs spec is £26224 on DTD.
With deposit down, he'll be financing £24724, with a GFV of £11770 (25k miles PA declared) and paying £463pm. That car might end up having a p/x value of £1000 more than GFV. If you want this car then you're going to have to chase a broker deal to make i work in the budget you have planned for.
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Whats to stop the OP saying he is doing 10K a year, which will bring the monthly payments down, put some of that difference away each month into an account. When he comes to change the car the xs mileage will only come into effect if he is handing the car back and walking away.
If he is trading it in or selling it privately the money he has put by would maybe cover the offset of having a higher mileage car than average and hence less of a deal.
Or is it just swings and roundabouts?
If you quote low miles to get a cheaper price per month, you have to be putting money away for when you trade in, or you'll be in negative equity. No way a GTD or GTI in p/x in 3 years time is going to be worth £2700 more than accurate GFV, you will have to pay the piper at some point. If you're putting money by to make up the shortfall later then what's the point? You are paying more interest on that would-be payment deferred than you would accumulate in a savings account, you might as well pay it up front.
OPs spec is £26224 on DTD.
With deposit down, he'll be financing £24724, with a GFV of £11770 (25k miles PA declared) and paying £463pm. That car might end up having a p/x value of £1000 more than GFV. If you want this car then you're going to have to chase a broker deal to make i work in the budget you have planned for.
Sorry for stealing your post Lengster! Hopefully you'll get something out this to.
I made the mistake of not declaring enough miles on my last car but luckily the settlement figure matches the p/x value.
I would be happy paying £463 if i could guarantee that the dealer from DTD would settle the outstanding finance on my current car.
Forgot to say that I get a car allowance from work plus mileage. Currently paying £351 for my current car and worked out that i can save £140 a month on fuel, plus the reduced tax over the year.
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I made the mistake of not declaring enough miles on my last car but luckily the settlement figure matches the p/x value.
I would be happy paying £463 if i could guarantee that the dealer from DTD would settle the outstanding finance on my current car.
Forgot to say that I get a car allowance from work plus mileage. Currently paying £351 for my current car and worked out that i can save £140 a month on fuel, plus the reduced tax over the year.
How does the outstanding amount compare to the WBAC.com valuation of it (accurate valuation based on true condition)? Broker initiated VW dealership should pay WBAC.com value at minimum, especially if it is a VAG car less than 5 years old. If not you might have to get rid privately.
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I made the mistake of not declaring enough miles on my last car but luckily the settlement figure matches the p/x value.
I would be happy paying £463 if i could guarantee that the dealer from DTD would settle the outstanding finance on my current car.
Forgot to say that I get a car allowance from work plus mileage. Currently paying £351 for my current car and worked out that i can save £140 a month on fuel, plus the reduced tax over the year.
How does the outstanding amount compare to the WBAC.com valuation of it (accurate valuation based on true condition)? Broker initiated VW dealership should pay WBAC.com value at minimum, especially if it is a VAG car less than 5 years old. If not you might have to get rid privately.
Dealer said it would be worth roughly £9500 in 6 months time, WBAC.com value it at £8,600 today!
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I made the mistake of not declaring enough miles on my last car but luckily the settlement figure matches the p/x value.
I would be happy paying £463 if i could guarantee that the dealer from DTD would settle the outstanding finance on my current car.
Forgot to say that I get a car allowance from work plus mileage. Currently paying £351 for my current car and worked out that i can save £140 a month on fuel, plus the reduced tax over the year.
How does the outstanding amount compare to the WBAC.com valuation of it (accurate valuation based on true condition)? Broker initiated VW dealership should pay WBAC.com value at minimum, especially if it is a VAG car less than 5 years old. If not you might have to get rid privately.
Dealer said it would be worth roughly £9500 in 6 months time, WBAC.com value it at £8,600 today!
Why are you posting here and not calling them right this instance to fix that p/x in writing!
Go. Now.
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Dealer said it would be worth roughly £9500 in 6 months time, WBAC.com value it at £8,600 today!
Why are you posting here and not calling them right this instance to fix that p/x in writing!
Go. Now.
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On paper there's £1800 there at least - £9500 in 6 months vs £7700 in 6 months with WBAC.com.Is that the no discount dealer? Best see what a broker dealership would give you for yours. On that £9500 valuation, will you have any equity in it?
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I made a quick enquiry via a moneysupermarket link today,2 year pcp 15k pa 3 month deposit and it came in at £375,i could be interested at those levels.Im waiting on a follow up call and see were it goes when discussing the nitty gritty,anything I should be asking or to look out for?
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Dealer said it would be worth roughly £9500 in 6 months time, WBAC.com value it at £8,600 today!
Why are you posting here and not calling them right this instance to fix that p/x in writing!
Go. Now.
On paper there's £1800 there at least - £9500 in 6 months vs £7700 in 6 months with WBAC.com.Is that the no discount dealer? Best see what a broker dealership would give you for yours. On that £9500 valuation, will you have any equity in it?
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The £9,500 will pay off the finance. That's from the dealer offering no discount.
Thought about going with DTD but not sure just in case they give me a crap part ex and then if I back out I loose £500....
Thanks for the help!
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if you trade your car in early before the end of your pcp do you get hit for excess mileage?
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I made a quick enquiry via a moneysupermarket link today,2 year pcp 15k pa 3 month deposit and it came in at £375,i could be interested at those levels.Im waiting on a follow up call and see were it goes when discussing the nitty gritty,anything I should be asking or to look out for?
Taking out a pcp plan on a 2nd hand car didn't work for me. The dealer said I would be cheaper buying a new car rather than a 2nd hand car. That was with Audi.
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if you trade your car in early before the end of your pcp do you get hit for excess mileage?
It's not taken into account, you just get what they offer you and this will normally clear the outstanding finance. If you decide to hand it back at the end of the PCP plan they will charge you for excess mileage.
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that's good as I've done way more than expected. keeping the golf if and when it comes so mileage doesn't really come into it.
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if you trade your car in early before the end of your pcp do you get hit for excess mileage?
Mileage only comes into the equation if you are handing the car back and walking away.
You can trade the car in or sell it privately and mileage doesn't matter. Obviously though it will reflect on what its worth.
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that's good as I've done way more than expected. keeping the golf if and when it comes so mileage doesn't really come into it.
Exactly what I've done with my current car... :(
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cheers fellas had a bit of a panic moment haha
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I made a quick enquiry via a moneysupermarket link today,2 year pcp 15k pa 3 month deposit and it came in at £375,i could be interested at those levels.Im waiting on a follow up call and see were it goes when discussing the nitty gritty,anything I should be asking or to look out for?
Taking out a pcp plan on a 2nd hand car didn't work for me. The dealer said I would be cheaper buying a new car rather than a 2nd hand car. That was with Audi.
Yes, that is usually true. Apr is around 6% for new and 12-13% apr for used.
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Well it depends how you define "cheaper"
If its just monthly payment then yes like for like it will be less on a new car because they subsidise the finance. When I was looking at the golf / M135 they were both 6% APR but you are sill financing a much higher GFV at the end of the day.
In the end I bought a used 135 coupe and paid higher, but I also negotiated a lower rate - down from over 12% to under 10% APR.
There aint no free lunch at the end of the day and manufacturers sell new cars because of the lower monthly payment making it "affordable" to get into a new car. Ultimately if you PCP a car costing £30k new v a £20k car used (which i went for) you still pay less for the used one, a lot less. Plus with a new PCP you can normally put in max 30% deposit, with used I was able to put in 40%.
If i was going to be doing high miles, I would buy something 2-3 years old, lower than average mileage with a much lower GFV to buy it outright, then its easier to sell on. But I understand some people like to change the car every 2-3 years and buy new, but you ultimately pay a lot for that, especially if doing high miles.
I learnt a lesson though running a BMW 330ci for nearly 3 years, it cost £6500 used and I sold it last week for £4500. That really was cheap motoring and it never missed a beat, plus personally I like the feeling of having a car "bought and paid for".
When I bought the 135 (30 months old) I could have had a new one for less monthly payment because of the good deals on offer, but ultimately I wanted to pay it off so bought used, with a lower start point and a 24 month PCP with a much lower final payment that I know I can make in 2 years and have the car paid off.
Pays your money and makes your choice..
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I learnt a lesson though running a BMW 330ci for nearly 3 years, it cost £6500 used and I sold it last week for £4500. That really was cheap motoring and it never missed a beat, plus personally I like the feeling of having a car "bought and paid for".
I'm with this every time. Is there a particular reason why you must have a new car?
I get the reason why manufacturers offer PCP's as an "affordable" way of getting people into their new cars, but it's bloody expensive. Very rough figures here, but you could put down a £3000 deposit on a new GTI and drive round in it for 3 years paying out £400 a month. At the end of that time what are you left with? £1000 worth of equity? Or you could buy a really nice used car for £5000 and sell it in 3 years time for maybe £3000.
The equity loss in both cars is around the same, but the new car has cost you £14.4k in the process. That's getting on for £100 a week. Imagine going to get £100 out of the cashpoint every week. Now I appreciate that the older car may cost a bit more to maintain, but the savings you will be making will more than cover any repairs you may need.
Overpay as much as you can into your mortgage (if you have one) That's where your money will do most good, then once that is paid off, you won't have to even think about how you can manipulate figures to ride round in a new car. You'll just hand over your debit card and drive away.
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If i was going to be doing high miles, I would buy something 2-3 years old, lower than average mileage with a much lower GFV to buy it outright, then its easier to sell on. But I understand some people like to change the car every 2-3 years and buy new, but you ultimately pay a lot for that, especially if doing high miles.
Ic
Yes...and no.
I fully understand the logic, but some people want the peace of mind of a warranty if they are doing high miles. Would I want to buy a 3yr old car (even a low mile example) and then do 35,000 miles a year in it with no warranty? Not sure I would - but it's a personal thing, no right or wrong and the money saved on the purchase can be put aside for any unexpected repair bills.
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I understand drisser's logic. And from a monetary point of view it makes sense. But none of us are getting any younger so why drive around in a old sh!tter when you can have a brand new car for a few quid more?! To coin a well used phrase these days - YOLO! :laugh:
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I must admit I'm not a big fan of PCP deals. I would rather be in a position where at the end of the finance terms you own the car outright and you don't have a huge balloon payment hanging over your head. That's just my preference but I can appreciate the attractiveness of PCP
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I must admit I'm not a big fan of PCP deals. I would rather be in a position where at the end of the finance terms you own the car outright and you don't have a huge balloon payment hanging over your head. That's just my preference but I can appreciate the attractiveness of PCP
I agree with this - its much better to own your car than PCP it. But a HP for eg. may cost you an extra 50% on top of what you're all ready paying on a monthly basis :laugh:
Loving your new banner btw!
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I must admit I'm not a big fan of PCP deals. I would rather be in a position where at the end of the finance terms you own the car outright and you don't have a huge balloon payment hanging over your head. That's just my preference but I can appreciate the attractiveness of PCP
I agree with this - its much better to own your car than PCP it. But a HP for eg. may cost you an extra 50% on top of what you're all ready paying on a monthly basis :laugh:
Loving your new banner btw!
Cheers Mark. Can you tell I was bored this morning :grin: :grin:
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Cheers Mark. Can you tell I was bored this morning :grin: :grin:
:grin: :grin: Well the thing is you don't need to call VW or look at shipping details or check the tracker anymore, so what else are you going to do with your time!! :laugh:
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When you are looking to run a car, pick a budget and stick to it. For Stuart.Cameron’s case it looks like he’s really pushing on what he wants to pay. He can have his car either by chasing a huge discount (go and chase it, no one is going to chase you to give you £3500 off, least of all your local dealer), or cutting back on the options (maybe a bit of both), or get something cheaper.
The smart money for me is chasing that discount – more car for less money.
There are advantages and disadvantages for buying used or new. VW (and BMW/Audi) are good at creating high residuals which allow you to effectively finance the depreciation on an expensive car relatively cheaply, at a “reasonable” APR (Go see what the Germans are paying on their finance though – 1.9% APR). You have the peace of mind that all the car should cost you is fuel, tyres and servicing.
Buy a used car for less, lose less money on it and you’ll be quids in if nothing untoward happens to it, although out of warranty repairs seem to be getting more and more expensive as cars get ever more complex and running to tighter tolerances. Fuel economy is unlikely to be as good (fuel economy and power output get better with every incarnation of a model), equipment may not be as good, and it may have some wear on it (it is a good feeling to be in a car that is new) If you’re not paying cash then you’ll probably be paying more APR if you finance through a dealer. If I was buying a second hand car I’d be looking for a personal loan at 5-6% APR rather than car dealer used finance at anywhere between 10% and 20%.
There aren’t many people here buying a new GTI or GTD outright, most will be financing one way or the other. Are we not allowed to live before we pay our mortgage off? Got to have a decent life balance, and if having a new car is what makes you happy then, why not. It might not be a smart “investment”, but if you can afford to do what makes you happy then go for it
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Cheers Mark. Can you tell I was bored this morning :grin: :grin:
:grin: :grin: Well the thing is you don't need to call VW or look at shipping details or check the tracker anymore, so what else are you going to do with your time!! :laugh:
Very true. I'm perversly missing the excitement of the wait :grin:
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Cheers Mark. Can you tell I was bored this morning :grin: :grin:
:grin: :grin: Well the thing is you don't need to call VW or look at shipping details or check the tracker anymore, so what else are you going to do with your time!! :laugh:
Very true. I'm perversly missing the excitement of the wait :grin:
I can help you out there - let's do a swap!! :laugh:
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There aren’t many people here buying a new GTI or GTD outright, most will be financing one way or the other. Are we not allowed to live before we pay our mortgage off? Got to have a decent life balance, and if having a new car is what makes you happy then, why not. It might not be a smart “investment”, but if you can afford to do what makes you happy then go for it
I get that to a certain extent and sort of understand why people would do that. I guess I'm extremely old fashioned in my ways, and being self-employed, my income is extremely irregular, so regular monthly outgoings don't sit at all well with me.
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I understand drisser's logic. And from a monetary point of view it makes sense. But none of us are getting any younger so why drive around in a old sh!tter when you can have a brand new car for a few quid more?! To coin a well used phrase these days - YOLO! :laugh:
Are you saying my 330 Ci was an old sh!tter !? :lipsrsealed:
I do take your point, but I am paying only £230 a month for my 135 coupe over 24 months with a small final payment, and lets face it most "modern" cars very rarely break down in a big way, so i dont buy into this idea buying new is the only way to avoid big bills. My 330ci had nothing but 2 services and 1 tyre in 3 years and had 101k miles on the clock when she left me last week.
I do however buy into the philosophy "buy cheap and buy twice". But for me buying cheap means buying a new Peugeot or something. People who buy these cars new, on a PCP really are not clever.. To think my lovely 330ci cost me less to run over 3 years than someone buying a new Peug 308 for example.. I would buy quality used German cars every day over new cheaper brands.
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Are you saying my 330 Ci was an old sh!tter !? :lipsrsealed:
:grin: Not at all, in fact if anyone's got an old sh!tter at the moment its me!! :laugh:
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Buy a used car for less, lose less money on it and you’ll be quids in if nothing untoward happens to it, although out of warranty repairs seem to be getting more and more expensive as cars get ever more complex and running to tighter tolerances. Fuel economy is unlikely to be as good (fuel economy and power output get better with every incarnation of a model), equipment may not be as good, and it may have some wear on it (it is a good feeling to be in a car that is new) If you’re not paying cash then you’ll probably be paying more APR if you finance through a dealer. If I was buying a second hand car I’d be looking for a personal loan at 5-6% APR rather than car dealer used finance at anywhere between 10% and 20%.
Yes, good point. Would someone with better maths run the numbers on;
http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/volkswagen/golf-mk5-mk6/volkswagen-golf-gtd-2-0-tdi-170-ps-dsg--low-rate-finance-and-free-servicing/1605506 (http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/volkswagen/golf-mk5-mk6/volkswagen-golf-gtd-2-0-tdi-170-ps-dsg--low-rate-finance-and-free-servicing/1605506)
Let's say you manage to get this 2012 nearly new car (6000 miles) for £20,000. The good points;
1. New enough for a PCP, but rates higher for used cars?
2.New enough for you to extend the warranty to 5 years/100,000 miles
Bad points, not exactly what you were planning.
Would this be significantly cheaper to finance?
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I must admit I'm not a big fan of PCP deals. I would rather be in a position where at the end of the finance terms you own the car outright and you don't have a huge balloon payment hanging over your head. That's just my preference but I can appreciate the attractiveness of PCP
From my past experiences of buying a 2nd hand car on finance, I have always paid a car off and then immediately traded it in for something new so in effect have always had a monthly payment.
I don't really see the difference in paying a PCP every month for a new car and not actually owning it at the end of the term as I just trade it in and start again.
I would be paying the same monthly figure for a car a good few years older on normal car finance anyway so would rather have a brand new car at that kind of money.
It would be different if I paid my car off and then had a a couple of years of no payments but I'd be worried I'd get used to spending that money on something else and wouldn't be able to afford another car :laugh:
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I must admit I'm not a big fan of PCP deals. I would rather be in a position where at the end of the finance terms you own the car outright and you don't have a huge balloon payment hanging over your head. That's just my preference but I can appreciate the attractiveness of PCP
From my past experiences of buying a 2nd hand car on finance, I have always paid a car off and then immediately traded it in for something new so in effect have always had a monthly payment.
I don't really see the difference in paying a PCP every month for a new car and not actually owning it at the end of the term as I just trade it in and start again.
I would be paying the same monthly figure for a car a good few years older on normal car finance anyway so would rather have a brand new car at that kind of money.
It would be different if I paid my car off and then had a a couple of years of no payments but I'd be worried I'd get used to spending that money on something else and wouldn't be able to afford another car :laugh:
As I say I can see the advantages of PCP but it's not for me. I just like to know that at the end of the finance terms the car is mine outright. I'll probably keep the car for 4 years but paying off after 3 so in the fourth year any savings will go directly into the next car so I can keep progressing towards that Porsche :wink: :smiley: :smiley: