fluttering sound

[Hurdy]

It does sound like you have a problem.

275whp is low for a K04 conversion on a standard GTI. A standard GTI has a slightly higher compression ratio than the ED30 does and so should mean that you would see a higher figure than an ED30 with the K04 fitted. Most ED30's with a simple remap will be making over 280whp.

Hmmmm - are you sure?  Manufacturers figures are quoted as power at the flywheel, and are extremely accurate.  VAG use a very accurate DIN testing standard!  So anybody who states that a standard GTI is making 200whp, or standard Ed30 are making 230whp are talking BS.  A standard GTI makes 200bhp at the flywheel, and the Ed30 is 230 flywheel.  Roadwheel horsepower will be noticeably less, and is NEVER used by manufacturers.

It is for this very reason why wheel driven, or hub driven dynos can never be deemed accurate, because there is no way they can know exactly what the specific transmission losses are!  Hub/wheel dynos are only good for making comparisons, and not for making factual claims.

I agree he has a problem though!

Yes, I'm sure TT, Ask Vtec abuser (Ben). The Awesome RR printouts show both BHP and WHP.

And how, exactly do Awesome measure that?  The ONLY way to measure the true and accurate engine output is on an engine dyno - and I doubt that (a) Awesome actually have an engine dyno, and (b) they would go to the lengths required to completely remove an engine from a car and bolt it too said engine dyno! 

The method Awesome, and all RR operators use, is a basic conversion formula.  Which like I said previously, is fine for making comparisons on the SAME car, for assessing remaps and the like.  However, no rolling road or hub dyno can ever give a true and genuine power/torque output from the flywheel. 

Agreed TT , but my first post was about whp. I only mentioned bhp in my second post to make the differentiation.

[NewGolf]

It does sound like you have a problem.

275whp is low for a K04 conversion on a standard GTI. A standard GTI has a slightly higher compression ratio than the ED30 does and so should mean that you would see a higher figure than an ED30 with the K04 fitted. Most ED30's with a simple remap will be making over 280whp.

Hmmmm - are you sure?  Manufacturers figures are quoted as power at the flywheel, and are extremely accurate.  VAG use a very accurate DIN testing standard!  So anybody who states that a standard GTI is making 200whp, or standard Ed30 are making 230whp are talking BS.  A standard GTI makes 200bhp at the flywheel, and the Ed30 is 230 flywheel.  Roadwheel horsepower will be noticeably less, and is NEVER used by manufacturers.

It is for this very reason why wheel driven, or hub driven dynos can never be deemed accurate, because there is no way they can know exactly what the specific transmission losses are!  Hub/wheel dynos are only good for making comparisons, and not for making factual claims.

I agree he has a problem though!

Hi TT,
Without trying to Open another can of worms here then, do such signatures that a few ED30 modded owners have posted, such as "306BHP/350NM at the hubs" etc ring true, or are they simply falling foul of the tuners hype?

[wps]

regarding the flutering sound i'm experiencing. i was told by a fren that it could be due a faulty sensort beside the HPFP. apparently there's a recall by VW. i'll call my dealer on monday with my vin number to see if my car is affected. any idea if that sensor could be the culprit. cheers

[candy turbo]

not a teccie by a long way but custom code has to be the plce to go for a custom remap, go to jbs in chesterfield im sure they will be able to sort you out 

[Teutonic_Tamer]

It does sound like you have a problem.

275whp is low for a K04 conversion on a standard GTI. A standard GTI has a slightly higher compression ratio than the ED30 does and so should mean that you would see a higher figure than an ED30 with the K04 fitted. Most ED30's with a simple remap will be making over 280whp.

Hmmmm - are you sure?  Manufacturers figures are quoted as power at the flywheel, and are extremely accurate.  VAG use a very accurate DIN testing standard!  So anybody who states that a standard GTI is making 200whp, or standard Ed30 are making 230whp are talking BS.  A standard GTI makes 200bhp at the flywheel, and the Ed30 is 230 flywheel.  Roadwheel horsepower will be noticeably less, and is NEVER used by manufacturers.

It is for this very reason why wheel driven, or hub driven dynos can never be deemed accurate, because there is no way they can know exactly what the specific transmission losses are!  Hub/wheel dynos are only good for making comparisons, and not for making factual claims.

I agree he has a problem though!

Yes, I'm sure TT, Ask Vtec abuser (Ben). The Awesome RR printouts show both BHP and WHP.

And how, exactly do Awesome measure that?  The ONLY way to measure the true and accurate engine output is on an engine dyno - and I doubt that (a) Awesome actually have an engine dyno, and (b) they would go to the lengths required to completely remove an engine from a car and bolt it too said engine dyno! 

The method Awesome, and all RR operators use, is a basic conversion formula.  Which like I said previously, is fine for making comparisons on the SAME car, for assessing remaps and the like.  However, no rolling road or hub dyno can ever give a true and genuine power/torque output from the flywheel. 

Agreed TT , but my first post was about whp. I only mentioned bhp in my second post to make the differentiation.

Eye, and I was just trying to clarify the well-known myth/confusion which arises between the two.

Incidentally, and related to my concern, some tw@t in the US is trying to sue Audi of America, claiming that the B7 RS4 does not make 420PS.  Looks like someone will be wasting an aweful lot of money in the US legal system, because the person in question has only used either a rolling road or hub dyno.  Audi will just laugh in his face when he fails to produce a TuV DIN standard engine dyno report! 

[Teutonic_Tamer]

It does sound like you have a problem.

275whp is low for a K04 conversion on a standard GTI. A standard GTI has a slightly higher compression ratio than the ED30 does and so should mean that you would see a higher figure than an ED30 with the K04 fitted. Most ED30's with a simple remap will be making over 280whp.

Hmmmm - are you sure?  Manufacturers figures are quoted as power at the flywheel, and are extremely accurate.  VAG use a very accurate DIN testing standard!  So anybody who states that a standard GTI is making 200whp, or standard Ed30 are making 230whp are talking BS.  A standard GTI makes 200bhp at the flywheel, and the Ed30 is 230 flywheel.  Roadwheel horsepower will be noticeably less, and is NEVER used by manufacturers.

It is for this very reason why wheel driven, or hub driven dynos can never be deemed accurate, because there is no way they can know exactly what the specific transmission losses are!  Hub/wheel dynos are only good for making comparisons, and not for making factual claims.

I agree he has a problem though!

Hi TT,
Without trying to Open another can of worms here then, do such signatures that a few ED30 modded owners have posted, such as "306BHP/350NM at the hubs" etc ring true, or are they simply falling foul of the tuners hype?

It's not really a can of worms as such, basically because rolling roads or hub dynos are the only real practical way for the average joe public to measure their cars performance.  It is just an "accepted practice" of the most convenient way to do such things.  But sadly, it should never really be used to compare, prove, or dispute the manufacturers engine dyno claims, as some people try to do.

And different tuners use differing methods of calculating transmission losses, which can give noticeably differing figures - so yes, it could be tuners trying to "hype" up their own products or services. 

I'm probably gonna loose a few friends by saying this, but RR or hub dyno readings are just another method of "willy waving"!   

[Teutonic_Tamer]

regarding the flutering sound i'm experiencing. i was told by a fren that it could be due a faulty sensort beside the HPFP. apparently there's a recall by VW. i'll call my dealer on monday with my vin number to see if my car is affected. any idea if that sensor could be the culprit. cheers

The VW "recall" (and not an official VOSA recall) is actually the high pressure sensor for the fuel rail, and is applicable to all Mk5 GTI engines (I think!, though not sure about the early AAX donkey).  Mine was replaced last week, due to being faulty - but it did not cause any adverse running, nor make any noise.  So I think, wps, this may be a bit of a red herring for your specific concern.

[Teutonic_Tamer]

not a teccie by a long way but custom code has to be the plce to go for a custom remap, go to jbs in chesterfield im sure they will be able to sort you out 

Sorry, but can not agree with Custom Code.  They simply "purchase" stock "tuned" maps from a 3rd party, bung them on their lappies, and plug in and go.  They do not use any RR developments for any of their "standard" maps.  Any Custom Code "dealers" or "resellers" who do carry out alterations to Custom Code maps then simply modify them beyond the original "Custom Code" spec, and so no traceability, and no scope for comparision between other "related" Custom Code maps - unlike say Superchips or REVO, which will know about every single tweak or alteration to their own maps.  Superchips themselves tweak their own maps and no one else is allowed to, whereas REVO agents are allowed to alter REVO maps, but these revised datamaps are then sent back to REVO, for them to keep/assess/tweak or whatever - thus providing traceability back to the actual "name" of the product you specifically purchased.

I have some serious concerns about the wording in the official Custom Code advertising too! 

[wps]

could the fluttering be from a faulty DV. i'm currently using a brand new version 'g' dv. anyone on ed30/s3 experience using a forge replacement DV. does the boost holder better. cheers

[Hurdy]

could the fluttering be from a faulty DV. i'm currently using a brand new version 'g' dv. anyone on ed30/s3 experience using a forge replacement DV. does the boost holder better. cheers

Forge claim that their DV is faster reacting and holds boost for longer over the rev range. For me it was simply a way of eliminating the possibliity of a blown DV as the Forge item is a piston type valve rather than a diaphragm one.