Author Topic: DSG woe update  (Read 23393 times)

Offline joesgti

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Re: DSG woe update
« Reply #80 on: 13 August 2008, 12:07 »
hurdy would you still have had these problems in a manual???  :huh:


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Offline Teutonic_Tamer

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Re: DSG woe update
« Reply #81 on: 13 August 2008, 12:07 »
My money is on the next R being a 2.0  :undecided: Audi have gone that way it stands to reason VW will. I dont even think the mk 6 will get a R model. Its a shame but its the age were in It could be bye-bye to the 3.2 burble  :huh:

Yup, the VR6 will be resigned to the history books.  Narrow angle V, W and H engines all suffer from cooling issues (which is why the R32 needs additional rads, and doesn't have front fogs, and the Veyron has sommat like sixteen rads  :shocked:), and also suffer from poor economy and emissions.
Sean - Independent Automotive Engineering Technician (ret'd)
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'06/7 Golf Mk5 GTI 5dr (BWA) DSG, colour coded,

I feel like a homo


Offline 08micsta

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Re: DSG woe update
« Reply #82 on: 13 August 2008, 12:08 »
FYI- You still owe us proper pics of the RS4 and not just close ups of its grills  :evil:

Mike

P.S- Re the viscosity thing... I was just trying to be intelligent. IF you are planning on coming to South Africa soon you may be interested in this company that does seminars etc:

http://www.oilwiselubrication.co.za/

Some very interesting things to learn.

Mike


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Offline Teutonic_Tamer

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Re: DSG woe update
« Reply #83 on: 13 August 2008, 12:13 »
Hmmmmmmmmmmm if TT doesn't know then thats a bad omen  :grin: :grin:  :rolleyes:

I'm about to exorcise the devil!  :evil:

Now why have I got three sixes on my screensaver!  :shocked:
Sean - Independent Automotive Engineering Technician (ret'd)
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'06/7 Golf Mk5 GTI 5dr (BWA) DSG, colour coded,

I feel like a homo


Offline Teutonic_Tamer

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Re: DSG woe update
« Reply #84 on: 13 August 2008, 12:18 »
hurdy would you still have had these problems in a manual???  :huh:

If you mean clutch slip, then yes.  However, uprated clutches for manual boxes are more freely available.
Sean - Independent Automotive Engineering Technician (ret'd)
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'06/7 Golf Mk5 GTI 5dr (BWA) DSG, colour coded,

I feel like a homo


Offline Teutonic_Tamer

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Re: DSG woe update
« Reply #85 on: 13 August 2008, 12:31 »
FYI- You still owe us proper pics of the RS4 and not just close ups of its grills  :evil:

I thought I did - arn't they here: http://www.golfgtiforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=56988

???

EDIT: looking through that thread again, I noticed how high the rear end looks.  It must have settled down by about 2 inches at the rear - or am I now on the cusp of the dreaded DRC failure?  :undecided:

P.S- Re the viscosity thing... I was just trying to be intelligent. IF you are planning on coming to South Africa soon

Are you offering?  Digs and free use of a GTI ???  :grin:  :grin:

Seriously, I'd love to go to South Africa, but SWMBO really aint keen on the idea.  She sees too much of the "bad stuff" on telly (mainly the violence and stuff about the townships), and I have a hard time convincing her that there are good parts of RSA too.  If I did come, it would include a trip to www.ThunderCity.com, for a flight in the EE Lightning - and I would sell my left kidney for that!


you may be interested in this company that does seminars etc:

http://www.oilwiselubrication.co.za/

Some very interesting things to learn.

Good link, thanks.

I particularly like:
Quote
"$240 billion or six to seven percent of the United States’ gross national product is lost due to downtime and repairs to manufacturing equipment damaged by poor lubrication"

 . . . and the fcuking Yanks try to tell the rest of the world that they make the best lubricants!  :rolleyes:
« Last Edit: 13 August 2008, 12:41 by Teutonic_Tamer »
Sean - Independent Automotive Engineering Technician (ret'd)
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'06/7 Golf Mk5 GTI 5dr (BWA) DSG, colour coded,

I feel like a homo


Offline 08micsta

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Re: DSG woe update
« Reply #86 on: 13 August 2008, 13:41 »
If you do ever come down we would probably offer a place to stay and of course you and my dad would get on extremely well. He is in the oil industry and that seminar business is his newest addition to his company.

I hate to break it to you but ThunderCity closed down about 2 years ago. We were of the last few to visit.

Tell SWMBO that South Africa is nothing like the news desicribes. Its still very classy and amazing.

Mike

**Sorry for major thread hijack**


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Offline Teutonic_Tamer

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Re: DSG woe update
« Reply #87 on: 13 August 2008, 14:12 »
If you do ever come down we would probably offer a place to stay and of course you and my dad would get on extremely well. He is in the oil industry and that seminar business is his newest addition to his company.

Cool, thanks!  :wink:  :smiley:

I hate to break it to you but ThunderCity closed down about 2 years ago. We were of the last few to visit.

Your'e joking!!!!!!!  Their web site is still live!  What happened to them?  :cry:  :cry:  :cry:  :cry:  :cry:  :cry:  :cry:  :cry:


Tell SWMBO that South Africa is nothing like the news desicribes. Its still very classy and amazing.

I keep on trying - one day I'll grind her down into submission!  :wink:  :grin:

**Sorry for major thread hijack**

No worries, situation normal on this forum!  :grin:  I don't mind, but Hurdy hasn't accepted yet!  :grin:  :laugh:  :grin:  :laugh:
Sean - Independent Automotive Engineering Technician (ret'd)
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'06/7 Golf Mk5 GTI 5dr (BWA) DSG, colour coded,

I feel like a homo


Offline 08micsta

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Re: DSG woe update
« Reply #88 on: 13 August 2008, 14:18 »
They closed down due to a loss in revenue I assume. They had to pay for the planes and those huge hangers. I blame it on their marketing. There is another company now but its odd that they use the same website?

My dad says at one stage they even battled to pay him for the lubricants etc that he was supplying them.

**Sorry Hurdy**


The Ultimate Club for Mini Fanatics

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Offline Teutonic_Tamer

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Re: DSG woe update
« Reply #89 on: 13 August 2008, 14:21 »
Righty, here goes.

Veyron gearbox - is a no-no, because apart from the obvious  :wink: it uses very different technology.  Our Golf gearboxes were designed by BorgWarner, whereas the Veyron uses a Ricardo developed box.  So unless you are extremely good with a hacksaw, hammer, and a pair of stilsons, I'd keep well away from the Bugatti parts department!  :grin:

Porsche - the PDK is alleged to be using the dry-plate single clutch version - so another non-starter.

Hurdy, just to refresh my grey matter, you were getting clutch slip from a standing start?  Were you also getting clutch slip throuought the rev range, and through all gears?  And how many miles has the car done (in total from new, and roughly how many for the remap etc)?

Picking up on a couple of points in previous posts, the oil pressure does not apply the clamping force for the clutch.  It is a good old fashioned coil spring which provides the clamping force, and will suffer from the inherent weaknesses of "spring steel" - heat being a particular problem (open front fog grille thread?  :wink:).  Basically, excess heat in spring steel will reduce its "spring ability", leading to reduced effectiveness, and therefore weakness of the spring.  Regarding the oil pressure, this basically controls lubrication (obviously  :rolleyes:), but also controls the release of the clutch - so if there is a need for an increase in oil pressure, then that would imply that they need to overcome stonger clutch clamping springs - so uprated springs would appear to be one answer.  :nerd:



OK, so onto the nitty-gritty (and being as Hurdy is still offline, I'll just have to go on what I can remember where Hurdys probs).

Hurdy, being as you are already experiencing quite severe clutch slip, then your clutch packs, along with the oil need to be replaced ASAP.  When clutches (wet or dry) slip, the friction lining can "burn".  In wet clutches, this will then contaminate the oil, and if the heat is great enough, the oil will actually start to break down, and turn to solid carbon (which is related to how the Yanks caused the problems in the 1.8 20vT, by using their shyte mineral oil in a "turbo"  :rolleyes:).  Not good.  Also, when mulitplate wet clutches (like motorbike and DSG ones  :wink:) are "abused" in any way, the friction plates have a tendancy to literally shed chunks of friction lining, which will end up floating around in the oil, before getting trapped in the filter (if it actually does make it that far).  Whilst I'm not intentionally implying that you "abuse" your clutch, Hurdy, your useage is very extreme, with all your 1/4 mile sprints, and even more launch control useage.  Unless you go down the strip as though you were "driving Miss Daisy"?  :tongue:  :grin:

So, with a new clutch and oil required - even the standard OEM clutch with fresh DSG oil and filter should be a big help, and will probably cure your problems.  Though for how long - who knows?  Being as the DSG box must be drained of oil and removed from the car to the workbench to change the clutch, it would surely be a good time to fit the Quaiffe.  OK, you need to open up the physical casings to gain access to the diff, but this major open surgery would be a one-time-only, fit and forget exercise, because the Quaiffe itself (just like the standard diff) is completely maintenance-free.  Fitting the Quaiffe at this time should have an effect on the clutch durability.  OK, just like with the standard diff, the clutch will be taking the same amount of torque, however, the Quaiffe will have a smoothing effect on the clutch, with less "grip-slip-grip-slip" reaction "stresses" from the roadwheels.  This should provide a more "linear" stress on the clutch, rather than the "peaks and troughs" stresses which will occur with a conventional open diff.

If/when any uprated clutch packs are developed, then just replacing the clutch pack would be less work, with no need to expose the internals of the gearbox.

Also, advice on maintenance.  The standard maintenance for the DSG box is an oil and filter change every 4 years or 40k miles.  Not (yet  :wink:) knowing how many miles you have done, but guessing by the much shortened life of your clutch, I would seriously recommend changing the DSG oil and filter every year or 10k miles.  Sadly, that seems to be the price you might have to pay for putting such extreme amounts of torque through the DSG box.

As a final avenue to explore for independent advice, have you ever tried a company called "inde-tech" - www.Inde-Tech.co.uk.  They really are masters of the Audi "multitronic" CVT gearbox, and might just know about, or have contacts for the DSG.

HTH
Sean - Independent Automotive Engineering Technician (ret'd)
-----
'06/7 Golf Mk5 GTI 5dr (BWA) DSG, colour coded,

I feel like a homo