Author Topic: Winter Wheel / Tyre Combination - Thoughts?  (Read 8069 times)

Offline AGB

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Winter Wheel / Tyre Combination - Thoughts?
« on: 05 December 2022, 10:10 »
Hello Folks

Wondering if I may tap into your wisdom and experience.

I'm looking at putting winter appropriate tyres and wheels on to the TCR - currently running OE spec Pirelli P-Zero 19s and looking to go to 18s but debating tyre choices.

I was looking at Michelin PS4 but it seems that their Cross Climate is potentially a better tyre.

I was wondering if anyone can comment or do you have recommendations from other manufacturers? I see the AutoExpress review puts Hankook in first place which I have no direct experience of - always thought they were budget and not so great.

Currently also looking at wheel options and am lost in choice. Probably something from OZ Racing, BBS or VWR. I'm looking for a robust wheel with a simple spoke pattern that won't be too intricate to clean but if it's motorsport designed, assumption is that hitting kerbs on track will be factored into the design. Sometimes potholes spring up like weeds where I live and when they're full of water, it's an inevitability that I'm going to hit one at some point.

Thanks in advance for your opinions.  :cool:


Alex
MK7 Clubsport S, 981 Cayman GT4, MK7.5 GTI TCR

Offline SRGTD

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Re: Winter Wheel / Tyre Combination - Thoughts?
« Reply #1 on: 05 December 2022, 11:18 »
I’ve no personal experience of winter tyres but if looking for a good all season tyre rather than an out and out winter tyre, then Michelin Cross Climate is probably a good choice. I’d not fit PS4 if you’re looking for something that’s more suited to winter road conditions - I’ve always considered the PS4 to be a summer tyre (I have them on my Polo GTI+).

Might be worth having a read of the Tyre Review winter tyre test;

https://www.tyrereviews.com/Article/2022-Tyre-Reviews-Winter-Tyre-Test.htm

As for alloys, I’d definitely steer clear of anything diamond cut. Forum member @Ceefeesh has just fitted a set of 18” Borbet Y spoke in matt titanium with Michelin Crosx Climate+ tyres to their mk8 GTI. They fit the criteria of a simple spoke design that would be easy to clean and Borbet are a well known reputable brand (they make OEM alloys for some car manufacturers including VW).

There are some pictures of the wheels fitted on the car on page 3 of the discussion topic at the link below;

https://www.golfgtiforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=289008.20

18” BBS SR alloys in Himalaya Grey might be another option - reply #328 in the discussion thread at the link below;

https://www.golfgtiforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=288000.msg2655034#msg2655034
2020 Polo GTI Plus; Pure White, DSG (because they all are)
Gone but not forgotten;
2016 Polo GTI; Blue Silk
2011 mk6 Golf GTD; Carbon Grey
2007 mk5 Golf GT (2.0 170bhp TDI version); Deep Black Pearl
2002  mk4 Golf GTI (the 150 bhp diesel version); Deep Black Pearl

Offline bogwoppit

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Re: Winter Wheel / Tyre Combination - Thoughts?
« Reply #2 on: 05 December 2022, 11:45 »
Assuming that the only difference between the GTI TCR brakes and the GTI PP/R brakes is that the TCR has drilled disks?

If so, certain 17" wheels will fit.

On our PP during the cold months, we run the VW Dijon wheels (17"x7J, ET49) with 225/45 Michelin CrossClimate+ tyres, but we tend to get mild winters here (Lincs). If we lived up North, then I would run proper winter tyres.

For pics of this wheel on a Golf:

https://www.motorauthority.com/news/1089904_2015-volkswagen-golf-r-preview-drive-on-ice

Note that VW also make a narrower Dijon wheel (17"x6J, ET48) as a specific winter wheel set. I have no idea if these ones will clear the bigger brakes.
« Last Edit: 05 December 2022, 20:26 by bogwoppit »
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Offline golfDB

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Re: Winter Wheel / Tyre Combination - Thoughts?
« Reply #3 on: 05 December 2022, 14:45 »
Hi, I run a GTD on 19s in the summer and Cross Climate 2s in the winter on 18s.  As soon as the temperature drops you can notice a difference with the cross climates.   Below are two youtube videos that you may find interesting.   The first is an Audi A3 on cross climates, the second is a Golf R on Michelin Alpin  Winter tyres. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YO0zyQh2l3M

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eGCukBY2haA



Regards,

Dave,



Offline Exonian

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Re: Winter Wheel / Tyre Combination - Thoughts?
« Reply #4 on: 05 December 2022, 16:03 »
Is this a planned necessity purchase Alex or just an attempt to keep the sh!tshow economy afloat by buying stuff?

If you see a fair bit of snow that you actually go out and drive in rather than take a day off work, or you plan on taking the family to Ukraine on a cheap road trip then proper winters will be essential.
Essential for those specific couple of days in the year.

Generally winters in Southern England are fairly tame and the odd day of snow merely involves the whole South East to run around the house panicking then immediately phoning work to say they won’t be in. Schools close because the H&S snowflakes are scared someone will graze a knee in the playground and half the teachers will use the handy excuse of being “unable to make it in” anyway. So most people stay home, build a snowman and watch Netflix. The small fraction of people left will attempt to drive their Corsa/3 series/Tesla on Chinese summer tyres and immediately get stuck halfway up a hill blocking the road.
With the best winter tyres in the world fitted there’s still no getting past roads rendered impassible by nobs on summer tyres stuck sideways across the highway.

Therefore my scientific deduction is Cross Climates are the best investment for Southern-ish England.

Winter tyres won’t handle so well aquaplaning at 60mph in 10°c torrential rain which is a more likely scenario in the southern half of the country between October and April.
Cross Climates should handle it all and cope with getting to the corner shop for a pot noodle on the day you actually have snow and phone in work.

Wheels? I’d go for BBS SR’s as they look robust and suit Golf’s in an OEM style.
Motorsport wheels are aimed at light weight not pothole absorption.

I took delivery of my Clubsport in December and immediately fitted TCR replica wheels for the precise reason that I’d not be gutted if a pothole took one out. In fact they’ve been on the car nearly two years now and are (I think) still ok after hitting numerous potholes that were invisible thanks to being full of water. I hit a beauty last week on an unfamiliar road that damn near gave me whiplash such was the impact (at low speed too) during a rainstorm. I’ll find out whether there was actual wheel damage later this week when it’s going in for a service. Not that it’s of any relevance here.
You might well be able to buy wheels as individuals which helps if one gets bent/cracked by a pothole. My old Pretorias were treated like royalty, never went near a pothole and covered extremely low mileage but still ended up with kinks. I’ll stick to cheapies from now on in personally.

So my vote is BBS SR in 8x18” ET45(ish) on Cross Climates.


My actual choice will be keeping my summer tyres on as it mostly just rains where I live, and using cheapo wheels as I’m a) broke b ) boring and c) cold, lazy and disinterested in mods nowadays



‘23 8R, ‘20 8CS, ‘19 135iX, ‘19 TCR, ‘17 Ed40, ‘17 GTD, ‘15 7R, ‘13 GTI PP, ‘11 GTI, ‘09 GTI, ‘98 Ibiza Cupra, ‘05 GTI, ‘06 Polo GTI, ‘04 GT TDI, ‘05 Fabia vRS, ‘02 GTI T, ‘03 Ibiza TDI 130, ‘01 Leon 180, ‘89 mk2 16v, ‘99 Ibiza TDI, ‘96 VR6, ‘98 Ibiza TDI, ‘92 VR6, ‘88 mk2 8v, ‘92 Polo G40, ‘91 mk2 8v, ‘89 mk2 8v, 205 GTI 1.9, ‘83 mk1 GTI, ‘80 Scirocco GTI, plus some others I’ve forgotten 

Offline bogwoppit

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Re: Winter Wheel / Tyre Combination - Thoughts?
« Reply #5 on: 05 December 2022, 17:29 »
If you are anywhere near Durham, then these wheels/tyres could be worth a look:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/185284044188

BMW 128ti - current

Mk 7.5 GTI PP, indium grey, manual - gone

Offline Bluto

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Re: Winter Wheel / Tyre Combination - Thoughts?
« Reply #6 on: 05 December 2022, 19:25 »
I have Continental TS 870 PS winter tyres and have run a set of winters tyres (and wheels) in the UK since about 2014.  Over which time I've had Continental TS 830P and then 860 on 17" wheels. Now the latest iteration 870 PS on 18" wheels.

Granted I've seen the wheel swop date due to the magical 7°C getting later and later.  Used to be late October, but in the last few years it's been very late November.  I usually make the decision to swop when my early morning commute is consistently below 7°C for about a week or so.

Driving about 30k miles a year my daily commute in the winter months sees me leaving home about 7 am and leaving work at 5.30 pm.  During which the UK temperatures on my commute would generally be 4 to 5°C (or a few degrees less in the mornings) as I went up and down the Midlands, much of it cross country on B-roads.

Granted if you decide to drive like a loon round corners you can feel the tyres squirm (technical term :nerd:) compared to summers, but then that's to be expected.  But I don't and I'd rather have the overall grip reassurance in cold and wet or frosty/icy conditions. In wet weather conditions I've not had any issue with them in terms of braking.  In my opinion I also find they're better when the road is greasy compared to summers.  I would echo GolfDB's comment but in a winter tyre usage, when the temperature drops you can tell the difference.

My Continental 860s were due for renewal this year after 4 winters' use.  I did think about whether to go with all-season tyres this time around, as I know they've come on a long way in terms of performance.  I watched a few videos and reviews.  However in my case I decided to stick with winters.  That may change in the future if the UK continues to get milder winters and I don't drive when it's generally still pitch black for my morning commute.

I think you have to make the decision based on researching the tyres, but also what's right for your driving. When you drive in the day, what types of roads you drive, the distances you drive and where you are in the UK.

The Michelin CrossClimate 2 does look to do really well in testing and reviews.  I've not driven on all-season tyres so can't comment on them.  But I think that whichever you pick, all-season tyres or winters, point is they'll perform better than an equivalent summer tyre if the mercury remains under the 7°C.

Winter wheel wise I have the 18" BBS SR Himalaya Grey.  All the reasons you've stated, a simple design and easy to clean, importantly they're not diamond cut which can take offence at gritted roads  :grin:.  I wanted something durable and not easy to crumple in the face of nasty unexpected pothole.
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Offline willni

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Re: Winter Wheel / Tyre Combination - Thoughts?
« Reply #7 on: 05 December 2022, 22:16 »
I run Brescias w/ Michelin Pilot Sport 4S' in Summer and Belvederes w/ Goodyear Ultra Grip+ in winters. For reference my PS4S' are noticeably awful at the current 4-8 degree temperatures at 3mm depth and I don't have confidence in them for attacking any corners with any great gusto.

You will be disappointed with how the car looks on 18s regardless so you might as well just get a set of standard vw alloys and save some money in my opinion.

For Winter tyres you need conditions that are consistently below 7 degrees. Summer tyres are similar in they they perform best in heat  (12+ degrees imo), then All-season really do 0-12 degrees best but can be used all year.

As mentioned above the Michelin Climate 2s are actually extremely good for winter, and are able to sort of keep up with fully dedicated winter tyres in the latest tyre reviews and will be my choice once my winters wear out, I would do it sooner but they're on 6mm, so I can get another winter.
Mk7.5 GTI - Performance Pack, DSG, Sunroof, Dynaudio, Pro Nav, Vienna Leather, Climate Windscreen & last of the 3 doors....Many Sets of Alloys...

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Offline AGB

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Re: Winter Wheel / Tyre Combination - Thoughts?
« Reply #8 on: 05 December 2022, 23:11 »
I’ve no personal experience of winter tyres but if looking for a good all season tyre rather than an out and out winter tyre, then Michelin Cross Climate is probably a good choice. I’d not fit PS4 if you’re looking for something that’s more suited to winter road conditions - I’ve always considered the PS4 to be a summer tyre (I have them on my Polo GTI+).

Might be worth having a read of the Tyre Review winter tyre test;

https://www.tyrereviews.com/Article/2022-Tyre-Reviews-Winter-Tyre-Test.htm

As for alloys, I’d definitely steer clear of anything diamond cut. Forum member @Ceefeesh has just fitted a set of 18” Borbet Y spoke in matt titanium with Michelin Crosx Climate+ tyres to their mk8 GTI. They fit the criteria of a simple spoke design that would be easy to clean and Borbet are a well known reputable brand (they make OEM alloys for some car manufacturers including VW).

There are some pictures of the wheels fitted on the car on page 3 of the discussion topic at the link below;

https://www.golfgtiforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=289008.20

18” BBS SR alloys in Himalaya Grey might be another option - reply #328 in the discussion thread at the link below;

https://www.golfgtiforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=288000.msg2655034#msg2655034

Cheers, great advice. I should have been less vague - I meant wheels to use in winter versus specific winter tyre compounds. Not cold enough where I am in the South East for that!
MK7 Clubsport S, 981 Cayman GT4, MK7.5 GTI TCR

Offline AGB

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Re: Winter Wheel / Tyre Combination - Thoughts?
« Reply #9 on: 05 December 2022, 23:13 »
Assuming that the only difference between the GTI TCR brakes and the GTI PP/R brakes is that the TCR has drilled disks?

If so, certain 17" wheels will fit.

On our PP during the cold months, we run the VW Dijon wheels (17"x7J, ET49) with 225/45 Michelin CrossClimate+ tyres, but we tend to get mild winters here (Lincs). If we lived up North, then I would run proper winter tyres.

For pics of this wheel on a Golf:

https://www.motorauthority.com/news/1089904_2015-volkswagen-golf-r-preview-drive-on-ice

Note that VW also make a narrower Dijon wheel (17"x6J, ET48) as a specific winter wheel set. I have no idea if these ones will clear the bigger brakes.

I will add the option to my list. Not sure the 17's will look right. I'm used to liquorice thin tyre walls, I think I'd take a while to adapt to the sight of it! I'm SE and I meant winter tyres as in a better compound not pure winter compounds. My fault for not being clearer. Thanks for the reply, really helpful. You've given me food for thought with that shot of the Golf R on ice...
MK7 Clubsport S, 981 Cayman GT4, MK7.5 GTI TCR