Author Topic: Comparison  (Read 4012 times)

Offline Sootchucker

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Comparison
« on: 30 October 2015, 07:56 »
The GTD is now over two years old and normally around this time I'm itching to get into something new, but strangely not this time. I'm still loving the Golf and it does everything I could expect of a mid size hatch, with a decent turn of speed, good comfort, decent fuel economy, pretty good refinement and lots of toys and gadgets.

Well over the last few days, I've been away on business, and this time instead of the usual BMW's they get us, I got a brand new A class Mercedes. I thought it would be the ideal opportunity to compare the Golf against one of it's main rivals. To be fair, the A class wasn't a sporty model but still a well equipped lower powered model (a 180D AMG line with 109PS).

First impressions on getting in were that the ergonomics were a disaster. The electronic handbrake is a small switch down on the bottom of the dash, and doesn't auto release so you have to reach down to release every time. Also didn't like the single stalk combining indicators and wipers into one unit - very fiddly. Some of the centre console switches (like the heater rear window), were tiny and right at the bottom of the central dash and you really had to have a good look to see what you were pressing.

Didn't like the design of the dash either. Very flat on top and quite square, with end caps that didn't flow into the door cards and looked like the designer couldn't' be bothered. I also found the waist line on the doors very high, with the windows starting quite high up, and adding to the claustrophobic feeling of the interior that the tiny rear window give you. I've said this before as well, but I think the tablet stuck to the centre of the dash as the infotainment system looks weird and cheap.

It's not all bad though. I do think like BMW and Audi, the infotainment controller knob in the middle of the centre console is far more intuitive and safer to use than a touch screen, and the unit in the Merc worked very well.  The seats as well come in for some praise. Whilst they were not sport seats, they were leather units and have a nice seat squab height action where the front and rear of the squab can be adjusted independently of each other, and I quickly found myself in a nice comfortable driving position. The headrest as well were great as they actually tilt forwards (unlike the Golf's one), so I could have my head resting on it during long motorway journeys without having to have my head right back.

The engine, whilst not winning any prizes for acceleration, was pretty smooth and quiet however, and coupled with a sweet manual 6 speed box, drove quite well (although I still massively prefer the DSG box of my GTD). Economy was good to, over 600 miles on a single tank with a calculated MPG (on refilling) of 71.2mpg. Not too bad considering I wasn't hanging around and the engine had to be worked to get up to speed.

I had some passengers on day two and both of them bumped their heads on getting in the rear on the sweeping C-Pillar, and both complained of a lack of rear leg space, something I've never had with any passengers in the GTD. Overall though, whilst a competent car, the overall build quality was no better than VW and in places visibly worse, and I never really gelled with it. My test has always been if I look back at a car after parking it, I liked it. Well I never once looked back at the Merc, it was just a box on four wheels to me, and certainly didn't have the emotional attachment I have with the GTD (still looking at it in shop windows as I drive past and love seeing other GTD's, GTI's and R's on the road). Again part of that may be the GTD is MY car and bought with MY money and not a hire car.

Bear in mind with the above that this wasn't a sports model (I believe that would have been the 220D - 177hp), so maybe that was part of it, but I just didn't gel with the design at all, and still much prefer the Golf  on the outside and especially on the inside where I still think after 3 years, the MK7 interior is still one of the classiest in the business. Now if VW could just steal the I-drive controller from Audi, I think it would be pretty much perfect.

All the above subjectively my opinion though, as there are enough A class Merc's on the road to suggest they must be a decent car ?
« Last Edit: 30 October 2015, 08:01 by Sootchucker »
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Offline JBirchy

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Re: Comparison
« Reply #1 on: 30 October 2015, 11:54 »
Interesting comparison Sootchucker. Although I haven't driven an A-Class, my Wife has a very highly Specced BMW 116i M-Sport which has the BMW Professional Nav, Leather, Heated Seats/Steering Wheel/Reversing Camera, Xenons etc... and I quite often draw a similar comparison in that the quality of the interior is higher in the VW, but only marginally.

Some of the BMW plastics are a bit nasty but the ergonomics are to my mind, better than the VW. As you mention, the iDrive system nowadays is so intuitive and user friendly, plus the huge 10" screen is mounted higher on the dash meaning eyes are distracted from the road much less frequently than in the Golf.

I find the driving position in the BMW better too, in that I can get lower in the car, individually adjust the front/rear tilt of the seat, sit further away from the pedals meaning my legs are more horizontal (also making use of the extending thigh support), and at the same time the steering wheel reaches further out to my chest. Not only that, they have placed a small leather pad on the side of the central tunnel to rest the left leg on (useful in our ZF8 Auto equipped car) which is a nice touch. It's a much sportier driving position and each time I get back into the Golf, I constantly find myself reaching for the seat lowering lever to try and get it lower to no avail.

The BMW Pro Media is the best infotainment system I've used by a long way too, the integration with Spotify and the Bluetooth functionality works better than in the VW. The live traffic rerouting on the Nav is a wondrous thing and must have saved us hours of sitting in jams.

Having said all of the above, the Golf rides better (admittedly I have DCC on the GTI and the BMW is on standard passive dampers with Run-Flats so is a touch too firm for my liking, my Brother in Law has an M135i on Adaptive Dampers and Michelin Pilot Super Sports and its as good as, if not smoother than the Golf in Comfort mode), the steering in the VW is a lot nicer, the sound from even the standard speakers in the Golf puts the standard BMW speakers to shame.

Economy wise, the BMW averages a disappointing 37mpg from it's 1.6 four pot turbo (138bhp) and I'm seeing an easy 34-36mpg in every day driving in the Golf. Over the last 2000 miles, I've averaged 36.7mpg which I find tremendous.

Gearboxes... The ZF8 in the BMW is a lot smoother at low speed driving/manoeuvring than the DSG in my GTI. I find the DSG quite aggressive which is great when travelling over 30mph, but getting back on the throttle after slowing for a roundabout I find very jerky in the Golf, it requires quite a lot of thinking and careful reapplication of power. I'm not sure if the GTD gearbox is mapped differently?

I love my GTI, I really love it and I've bonded with it in a way I never have with a car since my Alfa Romeo 156 2.0JTS a few years ago, however I feel my next car will come with a blue and white roundel on the bonnet, providing it can also come with a straight 6 turbo motor under it!

Jon

 
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Offline fredgroves

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Re: Comparison
« Reply #2 on: 30 October 2015, 12:19 »
An interesting writeup on the Merc, thanks for taking the time.

I did think about one before choosing my GTD, but never actually got around to taking a real look at it.

Never owned a Merc, so don't really know what to expect other than hearing lots of people say that its not the marque that it used to be and certainly not in the smaller models.

The comment about the all round visibility is interesting. There has been a tendency to do this over the last few years. Its one of the things (as a major business mile muncher) I find annoying and quite frankly dangerous. My last car was appalling for it and the second I sat in a Mk7 in the dealers I could see the advantage of the Golf's design. This is a pure survival feature for me and absolutely essential. Its not a taste thing, it could save my life!

The rest, well, of course there are things that could be better about the Golf - I particularly don't like the placement of the infotainment system as low as it is and the touch screen makes it quite dangerous to use while moving.

No car is perfect, but on balance I've got less complaints about the Mk7 than any other car I've ever had... now if only VW would just try a little harder, it could easily be perfect.
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Offline Booth11

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Re: Comparison
« Reply #3 on: 30 October 2015, 14:28 »
Great comparison Sootchucker, good read.  :smiley:

I too fleetingly considered A45 AMG when I was getting cold feet in the long wait for the R, but just couldn't get past the looks.  Too bling front and rear, and very bland and pedestrian from the sides.  Never got as far as getting in one, but had a good look through the window of my dentist's one.  Nothing I saw made me want to look any further.  I did spec one up on the configurator but it came to £42k!!  For a hatch, no thanks.

Agree with what fredgroves says about visibility in many cars. Something you take for granted in a Golf, until you get into something else, and realise not all cars are equal in those terms. That's an important plus for me with the Golf.

The A3 loaner (bog standard 2ltr diesel) made me realise how close to perfect (IMO) the interior of the Golf is. I found the A3 front cabin very cramped, and several times hit my head on the top of the door getting in.  Never got the driving position right in space of 4 weeks, despite lots of adjustment, and the seat belt position was just awful, even at the lowest setting, constantly riding up and cutting into my neck.  The rear view mirror was minuscule and reduced visibility out of the rear window considerably compared to the Golf.  Lots of dead space in the centre console.  Aircon vents were probably better and more adjustable than the Golf, but too stylised for my liking.  The pop up media and wheel controller I could take or leave.  Golf touchscreen is hit and miss whilst on the move, so not the best, but that aside I think the Golf interior is just about spot on.

There are some cars you just don't gel with and some you do.
« Last Edit: 30 October 2015, 14:30 by Booth11 »
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Online Exonian

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Re: Comparison
« Reply #4 on: 30 October 2015, 16:45 »
The thing I find with a Golf is when I've used other cars, and I do tend to use quite a few vehicles as we run a big fleet at work and I'm good friends with a manager at a leasing company, is that getting back into a Golf is a bit like coming home.
A Golf just has a familiar homely feel with the driving position and pedals, gear knob etc all in a familiar place no matter what age of Golf you get into (maybe aside from a mk1 as they're closer to a modern Polo in size in many respects although they still feel familiar and quite roomy inside).

A Class Mercs seem to be a bit like BMW 1 Series in that they're generally leased from new and they are chosen purely for the badge. I have a pretty good bit of inside info from the trade on that score! And yes, both of those models are chosen by a large number of women who probably just feel safe with those brands and probably carry expensive handbags and have a certain image to portray. Fair enough I say, it's a big world and it'd be boring if we all liked the same things.

As for my friend who manages the lease depot and gets to choose from a vast range of cars to bring home at the weekend, from those electric BMW sports car thingies to F-Types and 3 Series etc etc.
Yes, he will always have a Golf over the weekend if they have one in. I think we on here all know why; a Golf just has that little something the others don't.

Anyway, a very good and informative read Mr N and Mr Birchy  :cool:
‘25 8.5R, ‘23 8R, ‘20 8CS, ‘19 135iX, ‘19 TCR, ‘17 Ed40, ‘17 GTD, ‘15 7R, ‘13 GTI PP, ‘11 GTI, ‘09 GTI, ‘98 Ibiza Cupra, ‘05 GTI, ‘06 Polo GTI, ‘04 GT TDI, ‘05 Fabia vRS, ‘02 GTI T, ‘03 Ibiza TDI 130, ‘01 Leon 180, ‘89 mk2 16v, ‘99 Ibiza TDI, ‘96 VR6, ‘98 Ibiza TDI, ‘92 VR6, ‘88 mk2 8v, ‘92 Polo G40, ‘91 mk2 8v, ‘89 mk2 8v, 205 GTI 1.9, ‘83 mk1 GTI, ‘80 Scirocco GTI, plus some others I’ve forgotten 

Offline Booth11

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Re: Comparison
« Reply #5 on: 30 October 2015, 21:33 »
The thing I find with a Golf is when I've used other cars, and I do tend to use quite a few vehicles as we run a big fleet at work and I'm good friends with a manager at a leasing company, is that getting back into a Golf is a bit like coming home.
A Golf just has a familiar homely feel with the driving position and pedals, gear knob etc all in a familiar place no matter what age of Golf you get into (maybe aside from a mk1 as they're closer to a modern Polo in size in many respects although they still feel familiar and quite roomy inside).

A Class Mercs seem to be a bit like BMW 1 Series in that they're generally leased from new and they are chosen purely for the badge. I have a pretty good bit of inside info from the trade on that score! And yes, both of those models are chosen by a large number of women who probably just feel safe with those brands and probably carry expensive handbags and have a certain image to portray. Fair enough I say, it's a big world and it'd be boring if we all liked the same things.

As for my friend who manages the lease depot and gets to choose from a vast range of cars to bring home at the weekend, from those electric BMW sports car thingies to F-Types and 3 Series etc etc.
Yes, he will always have a Golf over the weekend if they have one in. I think we on here all know why; a Golf just has that little something the others don't.

Anyway, a very good and informative read Mr N and Mr Birchy  :cool:

Mr Ex you have summed it all up perfectly.  Couldn't agree more about the Golf feeling like 'coming home' and having a little something that others don't.  That 's why they appeal so much to me.  Sometimes you fancy something a bit different but you know that in a matter of weeks you'll be longing for the familiarity, ease and ergonomic harmony of the Golf. Maybe that sounds a bit dull and boring to some, but I'm happy with it.

Also agree about your point that Mercs and BMW 1 Series being driven by a certain type of woman.  That's certainly the case round my way, almost every Merc has a stereotype woman at the wheel, and I don't mean that in a judgmental way, it's just a fact.
Black Beauty: MK7 R 5dr DSG, DBP, 19" Pretoria, DCC, Vienna leather, Keyless, Dynaudio, DNS Pro, Rear camera, HBA
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Re: Comparison
« Reply #6 on: 31 October 2015, 04:44 »
I'm not saying a Golf is preferable to an i8 or F Type btw  :grin:
I'd quite like to have both!
But the Golf would be the old reliable friend metaphorically speaking.
‘25 8.5R, ‘23 8R, ‘20 8CS, ‘19 135iX, ‘19 TCR, ‘17 Ed40, ‘17 GTD, ‘15 7R, ‘13 GTI PP, ‘11 GTI, ‘09 GTI, ‘98 Ibiza Cupra, ‘05 GTI, ‘06 Polo GTI, ‘04 GT TDI, ‘05 Fabia vRS, ‘02 GTI T, ‘03 Ibiza TDI 130, ‘01 Leon 180, ‘89 mk2 16v, ‘99 Ibiza TDI, ‘96 VR6, ‘98 Ibiza TDI, ‘92 VR6, ‘88 mk2 8v, ‘92 Polo G40, ‘91 mk2 8v, ‘89 mk2 8v, 205 GTI 1.9, ‘83 mk1 GTI, ‘80 Scirocco GTI, plus some others I’ve forgotten 

Offline Bungleaio

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Re: Comparison
« Reply #7 on: 31 October 2015, 10:35 »
I really don't like how mercedes have incorporated the centre screen, it looks like an aftermarket retrofit to me.
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Offline Booth11

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Re: Comparison
« Reply #8 on: 31 October 2015, 11:41 »
I'm not saying a Golf is preferable to an i8 or F Type btw  :grin:
I'd quite like to have both!
But the Golf would be the old reliable friend metaphorically speaking.


Well no I wouldn't turn my nose up at an R8, but if I can only have one car (and that is the case), a Golf R will do.
Black Beauty: MK7 R 5dr DSG, DBP, 19" Pretoria, DCC, Vienna leather, Keyless, Dynaudio, DNS Pro, Rear camera, HBA
2012 MK6 GTI DSG
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Re: Comparison
« Reply #9 on: 31 October 2015, 13:07 »
I'm not saying a Golf is preferable to an i8 or F Type btw  :grin:
I'd quite like to have both!
But the Golf would be the old reliable friend metaphorically speaking.


Well no I wouldn't turn my nose up at an R8, but if I can only have one car (and that is the case), a Golf R will do.

Exactament Madamoiselle.
‘25 8.5R, ‘23 8R, ‘20 8CS, ‘19 135iX, ‘19 TCR, ‘17 Ed40, ‘17 GTD, ‘15 7R, ‘13 GTI PP, ‘11 GTI, ‘09 GTI, ‘98 Ibiza Cupra, ‘05 GTI, ‘06 Polo GTI, ‘04 GT TDI, ‘05 Fabia vRS, ‘02 GTI T, ‘03 Ibiza TDI 130, ‘01 Leon 180, ‘89 mk2 16v, ‘99 Ibiza TDI, ‘96 VR6, ‘98 Ibiza TDI, ‘92 VR6, ‘88 mk2 8v, ‘92 Polo G40, ‘91 mk2 8v, ‘89 mk2 8v, 205 GTI 1.9, ‘83 mk1 GTI, ‘80 Scirocco GTI, plus some others I’ve forgotten