Author Topic: GTI v GTD  (Read 11833 times)

Offline dubber36

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GTI v GTD
« on: 17 February 2014, 08:28 »
Volkswagen Drive magazine have a feature comparing the two cars in the March edition that dropped through my door this morning.

As with many "comparison" tests, they have pitted a manual GTI PP against a DSG GTD with 19" wheels.  :rolleyes:  Still a good read tho', and should be in the shops on Wednesday.
Red Mk6 gone replaced with a white Mk7 which has gone too. Green Mk2 here to stay.

Offline Exonian

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Re: GTI v GTD
« Reply #1 on: 17 February 2014, 15:13 »
Just sat and read this myself.

All stuff most of us have considered at some point.
Neil asked for readers experiences and it will be interesting to see what people think on here.

My personal view was the GTI was only purchased by me because of the VAQ diff with a thought on future modifications and how previous remapped cars have struggled with understeer and torque steer at times, not to mention wheel spin.
I'd have happily kept my much loved mk6 GTI otherwise as it was all paid for and a fabulous all rounder with the spec it had.

Everyone on here will have a different reason for their purchase and different financial reasons.
I'm old fashioned and pay for my car with hard cash as this also puts me in the position that I can modify my car without having to read the small print on the insurance (company car schemes for example), PCP, GAP, Lease or whatever. I'm probably very much in the minority.
So the GTI was the only one with the option of the VAQ diff.


My question now is whether the GTI is going to become a much slower seller as the GTD will very much be bought with the head, is just as good to drive and will have excellent resale value - now thrown into the mix the fact that the R is not that much more expensive than the GTI considering the difference in power, all wheel drive and various other aspects that a performance car driver will look at.
So, VW throw a lot of money at the development of the VAQ diff then release an R with 300PS to the baying public who generally look at monthly payments rather than purchase price at not a huge difference in £££££

So, if I were in the same position now as i was 12 months ago what would I do?
Cupra? Very possibly
R? Hmmmm, maybe
GTI? Less likely
GTD? with sound pack option its quite a credible alternative assuming I could be arsed to swap from my much loved mk6 GTI, most of the benefits of the mk7 GTI sans PP VAQ diff...
‘23 8R, ‘20 8CS, ‘19 135iX, ‘19 TCR, ‘17 Ed40, ‘17 GTD, ‘15 7R, ‘13 GTI PP, ‘11 GTI, ‘09 GTI, ‘98 Ibiza Cupra, ‘05 GTI, ‘06 Polo GTI, ‘04 GT TDI, ‘05 Fabia vRS, ‘02 GTI T, ‘03 Ibiza TDI 130, ‘01 Leon 180, ‘89 mk2 16v, ‘99 Ibiza TDI, ‘96 VR6, ‘98 Ibiza TDI, ‘92 VR6, ‘88 mk2 8v, ‘92 Polo G40, ‘91 mk2 8v, ‘89 mk2 8v, 205 GTI 1.9, ‘83 mk1 GTI, ‘80 Scirocco GTI, plus some others I’ve forgotten 

Offline Ap69

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Re: GTI v GTD
« Reply #2 on: 17 February 2014, 16:12 »
Just sat and read this myself.

All stuff most of us have considered at some point.
Neil asked for readers experiences and it will be interesting to see what people think on here.

My personal view was the GTI was only purchased by me because of the VAQ diff with a thought on future modifications and how previous remapped cars have struggled with understeer and torque steer at times, not to mention wheel spin.
I'd have happily kept my much loved mk6 GTI otherwise as it was all paid for and a fabulous all rounder with the spec it had.

Everyone on here will have a different reason for their purchase and different financial reasons.
I'm old fashioned and pay for my car with hard cash as this also puts me in the position that I can modify my car without having to read the small print on the insurance (company car schemes for example), PCP, GAP, Lease or whatever. I'm probably very much in the minority.
So the GTI was the only one with the option of the VAQ diff.


My question now is whether the GTI is going to become a much slower seller as the GTD will very much be bought with the head, is just as good to drive and will have excellent resale value - now thrown into the mix the fact that the R is not that much more expensive than the GTI considering the difference in power, all wheel drive and various other aspects that a performance car driver will look at.
So, VW throw a lot of money at the development of the VAQ diff then release an R with 300PS to the baying public who generally look at monthly payments rather than purchase price at not a huge difference in £££££

So, if I were in the same position now as i was 12 months ago what would I do?
Cupra? Very possibly
R? Hmmmm, maybe
GTI? Less likely
GTD? with sound pack option its quite a credible alternative assuming I could be arsed to swap from my much loved mk6 GTI, most of the benefits of the mk7 GTI sans PP VAQ diff...

An excellent view and well put, I think your right the Gti will almost become a specialist choice, of course we all know it won't sell as well as the Gtd, financial uncertainty will in most cases lead decisions by the head not heart.

I always wanted a Gti as it's the iconic car, and had a mk2 in 86, it's taken me in business best part of 25 years to establish a home where I no longer need aspire for more. Having had some humble cars in that time so now I can move some cash onto cars and 'enjoy' the fuel it uses over the diesel and not be worried by it. Having no kids is also helpful in that respect! Maybe the first I've had where the heart has ruled the head, feels strange as I'm in uncharted territory.

I'm wondering if it's the same decision or motivation as to why someone has a 335i verses the same car with the excellent 320d engine. 

I'm so pleased I had it over the Gtd nothing against then they are excellent cars truly are, but we all make decisions for different criteria as our lives are thankfully diverse.

Thanks
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Offline corgi

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Re: GTI v GTD
« Reply #3 on: 17 February 2014, 17:39 »
An excellent view and well put, I think your right the Gti will almost become a specialist choice

Don't kid yourself, the Golf is just a mainstream hatchback and the GTI is just a fancy version of that. I love hot hatches as all round everyday cars (I've had two Golfs a Mk2 16v and a Mk5 Ed 30, Pug 306 GTI6)... but they're (very good) mass produced hot hatches not specialist cars...

I'm wondering if it's the same decision or motivation as to why someone has a 335i verses the same car with the excellent 320d engine.

There is no comparison in terms of performance... the comparison here would be either 320i v 320d or 335i v 335d

I'm so pleased I had it over the Gtd nothing against then they are excellent cars truly are, but we all make decisions for different criteria as our lives are thankfully diverse.

Exactly, my GTD is a company car a (very nice) beater for the 911 Cab that now lives in the garage waiting for dry days in the summer (assuming they ever arrive)... therefore the GTI was never an option as the BIK tax was significantly more.
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Offline Ap69

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Re: GTI v GTD
« Reply #4 on: 17 February 2014, 18:49 »
An excellent view and well put, I think your right the Gti will almost become a specialist choice

Don't kid yourself, the Golf is just a mainstream hatchback and the GTI is just a fancy version of that. I love hot hatches as all round everyday cars (I've had two Golfs a Mk2 16v and a Mk5 Ed 30, Pug 306 GTI6)... but they're (very good) mass produced hot hatches not specialist cars...

I'm wondering if it's the same decision or motivation as to why someone has a 335i verses the same car with the excellent 320d engine.

There is no comparison in terms of performance... the comparison here would be either 320i v 320d or 335i v 335d

I'm so pleased I had it over the Gtd nothing against then they are excellent cars truly are, but we all make decisions for different criteria as our lives are thankfully diverse.

Exactly, my GTD is a company car a (very nice) beater for the 911 Cab that now lives in the garage waiting for dry days in the summer (assuming they ever arrive)... therefore the GTI was never an option as the BIK tax was significantly more.

I'm not kidding myself thanks, I didn't say a specialist car I said choice, ie certain car choice criteria will have to aline to pick a Gti.
So I was meaning the Gti is a narrow market that's all, be interesting to see if sales agree.  I would have thought most family men with a mortgage and kids probably won't go for a gti 3dr like me. And re the other comment made the R isn't significantly more.

I wasn't making a performance comparison that was never mentioned, the point is you can have a great car but some people will always go for something a bit different , as is their choice. It appears by looking around what's on the roads they are in the minority, most decide on something easier on the pocket, which you appear to agree with, with your Bik statement.

Btw my Bik was about £400 more per year for the Gti. 

It sounds like you have 2 lovely cars, enjoy.

Thanks
« Last Edit: 17 February 2014, 19:06 by Ap69 »
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Offline GiT1984

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Re: GTI v GTD
« Reply #5 on: 17 February 2014, 23:58 »
An excellent view and well put, I think your right the Gti will almost become a specialist choice

Don't kid yourself, the Golf is just a mainstream hatchback and the GTI is just a fancy version of that. I love hot hatches as all round everyday cars (I've had two Golfs a Mk2 16v and a Mk5 Ed 30, Pug 306 GTI6)... but they're (very good) mass produced hot hatches not specialist cars...

I'm wondering if it's the same decision or motivation as to why someone has a 335i verses the same car with the excellent 320d engine.

There is no comparison in terms of performance... the comparison here would be either 320i v 320d or 335i v 335d

I'm so pleased I had it over the Gtd nothing against then they are excellent cars truly are, but we all make decisions for different criteria as our lives are thankfully diverse.

Exactly, my GTD is a company car a (very nice) beater for the 911 Cab that now lives in the garage waiting for dry days in the summer (assuming they ever arrive)... therefore the GTI was never an option as the BIK tax was significantly more.

Interesting......

I'm getting out of a company Audi A3 Quattro TDi 170 S-Line (bought for the same reasons as most buy GTD's), taking the cash and buying my own GTi ...... which is the beater for my 981 Boxster S! I just got bored with the diesel drone, the oily refueling and the lack of any top end kick! Yes even in my commuter car - after 3 years I wanted more oomph ...... well that and an auto ...... :)

I will look forward to comparing it to my brothers GTD ..... 
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Offline Ap69

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Re: GTI v GTD
« Reply #6 on: 18 February 2014, 05:47 »
 
Nice motor the audi used to always fancy the quat combined with a Tdi.

Four wheel drive would be handy in this Gti in the wet, traction control takes away the power 1st & 2nd, until it finds enough.
 
When does your Gti arrive?

I think It's hard to makes comparisons the Gtd isnt a Gti with a Diesel engine, it looks different sounds different performs different, not as economical etc etc  each to their own on that choice, apples with apples et al.
« Last Edit: 18 February 2014, 06:03 by Ap69 »
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Offline GiT1984

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Re: GTI v GTD
« Reply #7 on: 18 February 2014, 09:48 »

Nice motor the audi used to always fancy the quat combined with a Tdi.

Four wheel drive would be handy in this Gti in the wet, traction control takes away the power 1st & 2nd, until it finds enough.
 
When does your Gti arrive?

I think It's hard to makes comparisons the Gtd isnt a Gti with a Diesel engine, it looks different sounds different performs different, not as economical etc etc  each to their own on that choice, apples with apples et al.

The Quattro is a much better car than the standard TDi - not least beacuse you can deploy full power in the lower gears, everywhere. It's been especially good in the streaming wet conditions we've been having recently! Accelerating out of T-junctions hard is fun (hold the revs at 2,500rpm and sidestep the clutch for a tiny bit of wheelspin and a dramatic launch where the rear of the car squats and it just lunges forward), but it's also nice and progressive on wet roundabouts - you just select a lower gear, turn in and pour on the power just before the apex, feeling a nice transition as the power goes to the rear and it pushes the tail round!

The above is one of the reasons I had to have the Performance Pack on the GTi,  as I think proper mechanical slippy diffs in front wheel drive cars transform the traction off the line and the ability to get the power down so much sooner when hauling out of a corner - slippery or otherwise! If it's not good enough in this regard - I'll just chop it in for an "R" ....

My GTi arrives next Friday, though and I'm all excited, having paid for it and insured it already! :cool:

To me the GTD/GTi comparison boils down to one thing - money. If you need the economy, you have no choice. However if you value the dynamics more highly (and are prepared to pay for them) - the GTi wins, as it did for me.
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Offline corgi

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Re: GTI v GTD
« Reply #8 on: 18 February 2014, 09:49 »

Btw my Bik was about £400 more per year for the Gti. 

It sounds like you have 2 lovely cars, enjoy.


I think its closer to £200 for the GTD...

Thanks, I do have a couple of good cars... and enjoy them I will... Thanks.

 :grin:

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Offline Ap69

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Re: GTI v GTD
« Reply #9 on: 18 February 2014, 12:14 »

Btw my Bik was about £400 more per year for the Gti. 

It sounds like you have 2 lovely cars, enjoy.


I think its closer to £200 for the GTD...


May well be for you depends on self contribution I was happy with my £400 ish difference.

I did work the fuel out but a while ago now so can't find the scrap of paper, have a feeling it was somewhere around £350 on 12k miles based on national av pump prices and honest johns users submitted data on mpg for Gtd and my exp of the Gti.

Thanks
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