195/65/15 tyres on a stock 8valver?

[itavaltalainen]

195 65 15 are not standard size for mk3 golfs that's what i meant (with car i was referring to this particular car - not cars in general, thought that was pretty clear).

and yes 195 65 15 are a lot bigger than 195 50 15....

195 65 15 have circumference of 1.993m
195 50 15 = 1.809

more than 10% larger.... so your speedo will show less than you're actually doing, so strictly speaking illegal.

dunno why you'd fit them when they are even more expensive than correct ones and they are illegal?

[tweed]

Sorry explain why they are illegal and give me a link of the law its braking!

and the fact you said 195/65/15 is not covered  EC paperwork for cars and not covered by insurance but they are standard size for many cars makes me wonder what the hell your on about?

As said by op they are cheaper than 205/50/15 thats the whole reason of this thread.

So changing a cars standard wheel circumference is illegal??
Under what law?

If thats true then why and how do so many people change their wheels?
Ever gone to a car show? Ever seen rs4's with 20" rotiforms etc?

Bullsh!t is making your wheel circumference illegal! 

Show me the law on that.

By the way I am becoming a police officer so I would never give illegal advice.

[itavaltalainen]

When I said something about EC paperwork I meant the EC paperwork for a Mk3 Golf, not any other car. 225 45 17 is the standard size on my new Golf - does that mean it's automatically a standard size for any other car - NO.

I must admit I misread the original dimension he mentioned.... I thought it was 195 50 15 he had and wanted to go to 195 65 15. From 205 50 15 to 196 65 15 is ok as the change is only 7mm in circumference.  I have posted how the circumference changes for my initial assumption. Why that is illegal? Because it changes the speed that is displayed in the car significantly enough (in particular if you fit larger wheels which will make your speedo read less then what you're doing). Also there is also the tyre's load index, i.e. if it cannot support the max axle weight.

You can fit any other wheels and tyres, given it does not touch body parts when in operation, but obviously only to the point where the speedo is still showing at least the speed you are doing (nor a lot more), load limits etc are adhered to. If you fit tyres where this is the case you'd need the speedo modified, provided nothing touches and all these things.

This is why in many European countries you need to carry documentation that the wheels and tyres on the car have been approved for use on that particular car model (unless factory fitted obviously) or even need to have it appended to your cars registration part 1 (the european, much more extensive counterpart of a V5) by a testing organisation (e.g. TÜV in West Germany, DEKRA in East Germany, Austrian local state government of the state you live in, Katsastus in Finland, just to name the ones I know for certain).

I would be very surprised if you could just put any tyres on any car and that would still be 100% legal in the UK as the EC type approval would cover the operation of a car in the UK as well (unless it's an old UK model or very specific e.g. some Caterhams etc). There may be regulations here that allow you to change within the limits of the EC type approval without needing to carry any paperwork or telling your insurance.

I can't give you a specific link to a law... a quick search and I found this on a UK tyre fitters website...
"UK law requires that your vehicle is fitted with the correct type and size of tyre for the vehicle type you are driving and for the purpose it is being used."

[Wayne]

Sorry explain why they are illegal and give me a link of the law its braking!

and the fact you said 195/65/15 is not covered  EC paperwork for cars and not covered by insurance but they are standard size for many cars makes me wonder what the hell your on about?

As said by op they are cheaper than 205/50/15 thats the whole reason of this thread.

So changing a cars standard wheel circumference is illegal??
Under what law?

It is not law as such but any car will have been homologated from new as part of this process tyres sizes will have been listed, fitting tyres outside of these sizes whilst it maybe ok could lead to insurance issues if you were to crash and they deem the car unsafe.

Another failing I have seen is fitting a lower speed rating again not recommended,

[tweed]

I know theres no law in that and I know fitting a 195/65/15 is not unsafe!

As I said its a standard size tyre for many cars so can not be unsafe.

Insurers are funny with wheels and tyres when the tyre is to small and stretched.

But fitting a larger wall tyre to protect you from claiming on insurance for new wheel is a win win for insurers.

Ring them and ask about it 

[Wayne]

As I said its a standard size tyre for many cars so can not be unsafe.

Yes but it was not standard on a mk3

But fitting a larger wall tyre to protect you from claiming on insurance for new wheel is a win win for insurers.

Maybe, maybe not all down to the insurer at the end of the day.

[tweed]

So why is it safe for one car but not a mk3 golf gti?

Granted performance wont be as good but that doesn't make it unsafe does it? Plus your less likely to get a puncher with a 195/65 than a 195/50. So safer right?

How can a tyre be unsafe for a mk3 gti but safe on a family wagon?


Now forget the performance of the mk3 gti because we are only meant to do a maximum 70mph and if your caught rally driving on b roads you'll get done for dangerous driving and 3 points on your licence. 
So then if we are a binding by the law then a 195/65/15 tyre is perfectly safe enough for the public highway.

Lets not forget that op is talking about winter tyres and winter tyres are more square edge than a normal round edge tyre so they are not great big balloons. Maybe you all should go look at a set before you give bad advise saying that its illegal to fit said tyrez to a mk3 golf and that it is unsafe.


Maybe if he asked about stretching tyres on a 9" rim you guys would support him and advise what tyres he should get for a good stretch 

[itavaltalainen]

"How can a tyre be unsafe for a mk3 gti but safe on a family wagon?"

Cos the  family wagon was designed to be used with it and it matches the car, speed rating, load index and the circumference, i.e. how far the tyre/car will travel for each revolution of the wheel.

205 55 16 is a default size tyre for many new cars, does that mean you can fit it to a Reliant Robin - NO!
It may be the standard size for a e.g. VW Caddy van but it's not for another car 

Otherwise every Jag XKR would have them on because they're cheaper.

At the end of the day it also does NOT matter whether you think it's safe or not. If you have an accident and the police and/or insurance find out you fitted tyres that were not intended for that car (i.e. a not homologated size or similar enough) then they may find them not fit for purpose and you can guess what that means.

If I fitted 185 60 14 on my mk7 golf estate (they wouldn't even fit over brakes but just for sake of argument) and 225 45 17 on my mk3 estate it'd still not be right just cos they are the standard size for another car.

Why is 195 65 xx safer than 195 50 xx ? It is not automatically - FULL STOP.

[Foreveryoungaus16v]

I wish people would stop arguing with the wheel specialist. 

[tweed]

So just to clear this up.

A bad winter is coming our way. The op wants to fit a winter tyre of 195/65/15 but is being advised not to because its not safe. And something about police. Dont know what they can do, anyway. Its also gonna be insurance void because said tyre is a modification. And not covered for cars. Its also illegal to fit said tyre to standard wheel on mk3 golf.

With that said im gobsmacked that there are aftermarket wheel manufacturers and tyre manufacturers.

Im also shocked that there is not a law in place for tyre garages to fit tyres to wheels that are outside the manufacturers standard size.


And as I said about speed rating of tyres we are only by law aloud to do a maximum of 70mph
You only need to get the same load index and thats not hard since most cars are around 1200kg

Ill do us both a favour and email a insurance company asking if I can fit said tyre to a mk3 gti and ask if im covered legally and see if its a modification and if my premium goes up. Might take couple of days for a reply.