Winter Tyres - Stuff you need to know for a novice?

[Phil 117]

So I have been doing some research today in regards to Winter Tyres, and have found many useful things, I still don't know what I'd need to do and get out and buy some. E.g, will they fit my car?

After watching this video (http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/car-news/66692/winter-tyres-4x4-grip-test-video) seeing a Ford Kuga with 2WD with Winter Tyres go so much further, I think I'm going to get some. I live on a Hill, and when it snowed before, I couldn't get up it. Touch wood, I've not had a prang yet, but as I'm now buying my own car and spending a decent amount of money on it, I want make sure I'm safe.

So, for those people who run winter tyres currently, do you mind answering some of these questions for a novice like myself?

1) Is it just tyres, or alloy's and tyres? When ever I see pictures or video's, usually the winter tyres are on different alloys. Is it just that it makes it easier to change?

2) 1 leads me onto cost. Looking around, Winter Tyres seem to be about £500 (ish) for a set of 4. If you then have to purchase alloys, it then taking this close to £1000. And then what is the cost of fitting?

3) Storage. Do I have to pay to have summer tyres stored in the winter and winter tyres stored in the summer. I have a garage I can put them in, but aren't they meant to be kept at the right temperature etc?

4) If i need alloys, what size? I see things like "7.5 Jx17" and "offeset 49". I have no idea what these mean. Is it so they clear the brake calipers?

5) How long do you run them for? As they are not just snow tyres, they are winter tyres, they are much better in the cold. So are these the sort of things you put on from November all the way through to February?

6) Life. How long will they last for. As these tyres are expensive, will they last 2-3 years, or expect them to last longer than that?

7) Will the speedo be calibrated correctly if a different set of alloys are going on the car?

8 ) Used ones on eBay. I am still on the hesitant side of these tyres due to cost. I have seem some on eBay much cheaper, as they are used. Usually they're for sale as someone has bought a different car they don't fit on. Is it worth a gamble paying for cheap ones, or just invest in some new ones?

9) And finally, where do you get them from? Do places do alloy & tyre pack, or you have to buy them separate?


Thank you very much in advance. I literally have not a clue. I can barely add oil or washer fluid. When it comes to technical stuff, I hate to say I know absolutely nothing. So an idiot proof guide would be much appreciated!

[dubber36]

Right here's my take on it.

1) I have two sets of wheels so that I can change them over myself. I will get 3 winters out of my tyres, so at and average of £10 a corner to swap a tyre, over 3 years that's £240, or the price of a decent set of second hand OEM wheels.

2) If you buy second hand wheels, the cost of tyre changing is recouped. You can only wear out one set of tyres at a time, so winter tyres don't actually cost any extra to buy/run. If anything you will save money as summer tyres will wear faster in winter.

3) I keep mine stacked in the garage wrapped in bubble wrap. As long as they are not left in direct sunlight and lay on their sides, they'll be fine. Some tyre dealers do offer storage, but I prefer to have my things where I can see them.

4) 7.5 J is the width of the wheel (7.5 inches) and 17 is the diameter, again in inches. The offset or ET, is the distance from the center line of the wheel to the hub mounting face. The smaller the number, the further the wheel sticks out.

5) Mine went on last week and I'll keep them on until the daytime temperatures are consistently above 7-8 degrees, so probably late February.

6) All depends on your driving style and mileage, but as I said earlier, I expect to get 3 winters or around 20,000 miles from mine.

7) As long as you keep the overall diameter of the tyre the same, the speedo will be fine. 205-55-16, 225-45-17, 225-40-18, 235-35-19 are all, give or take a few mm, the same overall diameter.

8 ) I've bought used tyres in the past, and whilst they are initially cheaper, they will need replacing sooner.

9) Mytyres do wheel and tyre packages which will come ready for you to bolt to the car, or like me, you can buy used wheels and sort your own tyres. Hindsight is a wonderful thing and all that, but it's much better and cheaper to do all this in the summer.

[corgi]

1) Is it just tyres, or alloy's and tyres? When ever I see pictures or video's, usually the winter tyres are on different alloys. Is it just that it makes it easier to change?

It is easier if you have a set of wheels for each... makes it easier swapping them over. But you could just buy a set of tyres the correct size and have them swapped over every few months... I'd go with the wheels and tyres option...

2) 1 leads me onto cost. Looking around, Winter Tyres seem to be about £500 (ish) for a set of 4. If you then have to purchase alloys, it then taking this close to £1000. And then what is the cost of fitting?

sounds about right... you don't have to have alloys, you could get some steel wheels for the winter. Think fo the cost savings of not using your "summer" tyres for half the year. In the end there is an initial investment. When you sell the car you can sell the winter wheels/tyres to offset the loss... How much value do you put on the extra safety..?

3) Storage. Do I have to pay to have summer tyres stored in the winter and winter tyres stored in the summer. I have a garage I can put them in, but aren't they meant to be kept at the right temperature etc?

Storing them in the garage should be fine, what you need to is keep them out of direct sunlight and the worst of the freezing weather

4) If i need alloys, what size? I see things like "7.5 Jx17" and "offeset 49". I have no idea what these mean. Is it so they clear the brake calipers?

I would go as close to the size your running normally as possible. It appears you can go down to 17" on the GTI PP, and possibly 16" with the correct offest on GTI and GTD... You're correct the offest is required to clear the brake calipers and/or suspension components

http://www.worldoneperformance.com/blog/2009/07/22/how-do-wheel-offsets-work/ explains offset... Someone will be along shortly to tell you what a reasonable offset for the Golf is or you could search this forum, I'm surer it has been discussed... But if you take a wheel off somewhere on them is likely to be stamped ET and then + and a number, this is the offset...

5) How long do you run them for? As they are not just snow tyres, they are winter tyres, they are much better in the cold. So are these the sort of things you put on from November all the way through to February?

While the ambient temperature around or below +7C. Summer tyres become much less effective below this temperature..

6) Life. How long will they last for. As these tyres are expensive, will they last 2-3 years, or expect them to last longer than that?

It depends on how many miles you do, how you drive etc. In their normal operating conditions (see above) about the same as normal summer tyres (or a little less as winter tyres are generally a softer compound)

7) Will the speedo be calibrated correctly if a different set of alloys are going on the car?

Yes, if you go for wheels/tyres of the same size and profile. If you go for a smaller wheel diameter you will need a higher profile. This site can help you calculate the required sizes: http://www.etyres.co.uk/tyre-size-calculator... You don't need to get them exact e.g. changing from 235/40 R18 to 235/45 R17 shows a rolling circumference difference of -0.3%

If you do change the size of the wheel (if you change the wheels at all to a non-OEM design or manufacture) then you should inform your insurance company. Many are not interested but some will make a small charge... You wouldn't want them not to pay out because you were running a "modified" car...

8 ) Used ones on eBay. I am still on the hesitant side of these tyres due to cost. I have seem some on eBay much cheaper, as they are used. Usually they're for sale as someone has bought a different car they don't fit on. Is it worth a gamble paying for cheap ones, or just invest in some new ones?

Personally, I wouldn't buy used wheels or tyres...

9) And finally, where do you get them from? Do places do alloy & tyre pack, or you have to buy them separate?

Have a look at some of the threads on here, there are plenty of threads where posters have said where they bought appropriate packages from...

[Buck]

Agree with the above.

I bought a second hand set of genuine R32 18s and then bought a new set of Vredestein tyres.
On my 3rd year with them and they are an excellent combo.

[Phil 117]

Thank you both for giving such detail with those.

As you said, it's just the cost of the alloy's really as your saving life in your summer tyres. You just see the big upfront cost.

Does it matter if there 17 or 18 inch alloys? I presume so long as you get a bigger profile on the 17's, it should be fine.

[dubber36]

I'd go for 17's as the taller tyre sidewall will be a little more forgiving, plus they will be cheaper.

[Phil 117]

I'd go for 17's as the taller tyre sidewall will be a little more forgiving, plus they will be cheaper.

Dubber, what are you thoughts on 16's? Will it just make the car look rubbish?

I'm thinking of these. Can get the alloys & some Nokian WR D3 (seem to be a good set of tyres). I can get them fitted for under £700 which doesn't sound too bad.

Tyres: http://www.tyreleader.co.uk/car-tyres/nokian/wrd3/205-55-r16-91h-400196

Alloys: http://www.tyreleader.co.uk/alloy-wheels/dezent/td/6.5x16-5x112-et46-57.1-87430?car=24500

[dubber36]

I think 16" alloys would look rubbish. It's a vanity thing, but it wouldn't be obvious to the casual observer that you had winter tyres fitted, so the car would look wrong with really small alloys. Especially aftermarket ones.

16" steels however would give the car a purposeful, rugged winter look and would be even cheaper.

http://www.mytyres.co.uk/cgi-bin/skw.pl

(EDIT) for some reason that link is all in German, but I'm sure you'll find you way around the mytyres web site.

[Phil 117]

Hmm...

So I thought I'd ring round my local dealers, and VW are doing 16" Asben Alloys with Pirelli Winter Control Tyres. They don't look the best tyres, and 16" AND £1015 fitted.

One of my local dealers has however offed me this, which I think is quite. Just wanted to see if this a good price?

They have a set of 17" Singapore's' which are optional on the GT, and 18" ones are standard on the GTD look exactly the same. He said they've got a spare set as they upgraded the alloys for a demo so had these spare.

With Continental Winter Contact TS830P tyres, they would fit them for £700.00

That doesn't seem to bad, it's just the continental's are the 2012 model, and have now been replaced with TS850's.

Do you think I should go ahead with that?

[dubber36]

I'd bite his had off at that price, considering that the wheels alone retail at around £500 each 

Look after them, and you'll be able to get a reasonable amount of money back for them by selling them on when you change the car.