AutoCar Mk7 GTI with P Pack review places it No3.

[Bill_the_Bear]

Here are my points;

1. Not surprising after last week's Autoexpress test (ST first, Golf second, R265 third)

2. Where did the extra 50Kg come from?

3. VW Driver got 6.3 for the MK6 2dr manual

6.5 for the MK6 DSG 5dr

6.0 for the MK5 2rd manual!

Car and Driver 5.6s MK7 GTI 220 (non PP) 0-60

Are not 0-60 times *highly* dependant on the conditions of the test?  Some factors that might impact are (off the top of my head):

Air temperature
Engine and tyres warmed up or not
Altitude
Flatness of the test route
Fuel octane number
Type of tyres
0-60 or 0-62

Also if they were doing it properly I think they should run the test down both directions of the course then take an average in order to discount wind speed and flatness of the track.  Its rare to see the tests treated as scientific so variation in results is to be expected.

EDIT:
Didn't mention weather as I assume its a given they're not performing these tests in the wet or on ice!

[matchboy]

I always find the 0-60 time is basically a 'pub boast' tool (and I am guilty of doing that I admit) - the amount of times you actually pull away and nail it to achieve that time is minimal - unless you come across some chav in a "suped" up Peugeot 106/Corsa who you want to put back in their place.  The real test should be the 30-70 and 70-100 bracket, as that pulling power is what differentiates the cars.  Even so, I have a real issue with these reviews banging on about how the car performs around a track - zero interest to me, I'm never going to go round a track in mine!!

[Gryzor]

Even so, I have a real issue with these reviews banging on about how the car performs around a track - zero interest to me, I'm never going to go round a track in mine!!

My point exactly, and nor do I drive like I think I'm on one either, so these reviews mean absolutely nothing.  Well, apart from confirming that it's "not exciting enough", because that's my main decider right there!

[Running Man]

Probably the definitive review of the Mk7 GTI with P Pack.
After Steve Sutcliffe's glorious feelings, I was a bit surprised by this lower than expected rating.
The Focus ST3 (awful button fest interior) is the better handler in both wet and dry.

Obviously ford coughed up this week, next time they mention the cars the GTI will be the best.

Spot on 

[Poached]

Chris Harris is top of my list in terms of reviews. His review of the GTI was very positive and also very fair in my opinion. He didn't take it anywhere near a track and noted this, which I think is spot on. I took my Mk6 on track and within a few laps I realised the suspension and brakes needed a fair amount of tweaking before it would be suitable.

Instead he treated it as a quick, practical hatch that served up thrills when you fancied but remained faithful when needed. And I think that's spot on. The RS265 has had the podium for a while and that's fine. The new VXR seems to be a fantastic step up over the old car and the ST seems to be decent enough. I think looks wise the GTI is now firmly behind the others (although I'm not as keen on the ST), but the GTI somehow still looks very stylish and very GTI-ish on the road. I just wish they had kept the Monza Shadows.

But where I think they have improved the GTI is in terms of excitement. The Mk6 I found (being honest) a tad dull to drive and so I turned to a remap to liven it up. The remap was spot on and I'm sure pretty much anyone who remapped their GTI would agree it was how the car should have been built.

But if the handling of the new GTI is as good as the reviews suggest, I'm not sure a remap will be quite the necessity it previously has been on GTI's. Which in my books would be very good indeed.

Still to test drive the Mk7. But having sat in one my initial disappointment is the steering wheel. It's too big and not thick enough.

Penguin brings up some good points. Both GTI's I've had are much better with an aftermarket map. The stock maps are quite linear.

The cars really benefit from it, it's probably the same across the VAG range and these reviews obviously don't account for this.

At the end of the day it's just a review, buy whatever floats your boat.

[DevonK]

If this review was the only one raising these issues I'd dismiss it as an outlier, but the "uninvolving" comments reflect a theme common to several reviews lately. It's starting to look like other options may better meet the needs of someone for whom engaging, smile-on-your-face driving is the main priority.

As to Chris Harris's review - contrast it to his review of say either the new Fiesta ST or the GT86 - he displays nowhere near the same level of enthusiasm for the GTI. In the other two reviews he's all gleeful fun; with the GTI he delivers a serious lecture on the ACC and hardly mentions the handling at all.

[Bill_the_Bear]

If this review was the only one raising these issues I'd dismiss it as an outlier, but the "uninvolving" comments reflect a theme common to several reviews lately. It's starting to look like other options may better meet the needs of someone for whom engaging, smile-on-your-face driving is the main priority.

As to Chris Harris's review - contrast it to his review of say either the new Fiesta ST or the GT86 - he displays nowhere near the same level of enthusiasm for the GTI. In the other two reviews he's all gleeful fun; with the GTI he delivers a serious lecture on the ACC and hardly mentions the handling at all.

Have you had a test drive of the GTI though?  Trust me you really can't believe this crap about boring or uninvolving or anything.  The reviewers seem to want a car that if you drop concentration on while flinging it around a track you'll spin out.  That is a stupid way to assess a car.

You also have to remember that the GTI is being reviewed not just against the competition but against itself and its legacy.  So even if it beats the competition it can still produce less enthusiasm if its not a massive leap forward over previous generations too.  I think this is why the Fiesta ST and the GT86 seem more fun, their performance was far from guaranteed before the review!

Also remember that even if the GTI can be beaten in performance by a Focus ST (which I think is far from a proven thing) then that isn't the main reason for buying anyway.  Take into account the looks and the practicality.  Many people may prefer the Focus or the BMW or the R265 or whatever, but I would not make judgements based on these reviews.  Listen to the owners and take a test drive.

EDIT:
Oh and remember that a month ago Mat Watson said the GTI was absolutely the best hot hatch money could buy.  So there isn't really a common theme at all, the reviews are all pretty much random in their results.

[monkeyhanger]

If this review was the only one raising these issues I'd dismiss it as an outlier, but the "uninvolving" comments reflect a theme common to several reviews lately. It's starting to look like other options may better meet the needs of someone for whom engaging, smile-on-your-face driving is the main priority.

As to Chris Harris's review - contrast it to his review of say either the new Fiesta ST or the GT86 - he displays nowhere near the same level of enthusiasm for the GTI. In the other two reviews he's all gleeful fun; with the GTI he delivers a serious lecture on the ACC and hardly mentions the handling at all.

Have you had a test drive of the GTI though?  Trust me you really can't believe this crap about boring or uninvolving or anything.  The reviewers seem to want a car that if you drop concentration on while flinging it around a track you'll spin out.  That is a stupid way to assess a car.

You also have to remember that the GTI is being reviewed not just against the competition but against itself and its legacy.  So even if it beats the competition it can still produce less enthusiasm if its not a massive leap forward over previous generations too.  I think this is why the Fiesta ST and the GT86 seem more fun, their performance was far from guaranteed before the review!

Also remember that even if the GTI can be beaten in performance by a Focus ST (which I think is far from a proven thing) then that isn't the main reason for buying anyway.  Take into account the looks and the practicality.  Many people may prefer the Focus or the BMW or the R265 or whatever, but I would not make judgements based on these reviews.  Listen to the owners and take a test drive.

EDIT:
Oh and remember that a month ago Mat Watson said the GTI was absolutely the best hot hatch money could buy.  So there isn't really a common theme at all, the reviews are all pretty much random in their results.

It's quite easy for them to be flinging around a car that isn't theirs, for fun and burn though £600 worth of tyres in a sitting, in the pursuit of fun. Not real world driving for 99% of us, but they'll hang a dour review on a car that won't kill you the first mistake you make in it. The "Evo" influence always makes it's way into hot hatch reviews (and a lot of normal car reviews too).

[drisser]

personally the reason I ordered the GTi was that in addition to all the good traits of quality engineering, residuals, cool understated looks, great seats, economy, low tax, low weight, sensible if not cheap price...

I honestly thought it was one of the best sounding, fastest, best handling front drive cars I have driven. PERIOD.  I have not interest in spending £25k on a megane that is worth 12k in 2 years jsut so I can corner on a track 4% faster.

While I am no road tester, but I have owned or drive a good number of decent handling, fast coupes and hot hatches and i was left under no uncertain thoughts that it is the best car in the real world that does everything well, a mantle held by my current BMW 330 ci Coupe as far as I am concerned and it would have taken something special to get me out of that (Find me a megane or focus with 100k miles on the clock that feels as tight and new as my 10 year old BMW)

The sum of all those arguments made me splash out, I wouldnt have done on any other of those cars in the test except maybe the 135 but its pig ugly and a used 135 coupe gives 95% performance for 50% price.

[PenguinGTI]

Drisser, have to agree with you.

I don't want to fault the reviewers, as I think some of them do a great job and certainly keep me entertained (even if they don't always provide useful consumer information), but... I do recognise that the reviews influence my purchase very lightly, if at all.

The GTI may be as dull-as-dishwater compared to the light-footedness and liveliness of an RS265, and it might not slap you in the back like the VXR, but at the end of the day it's a Golf and it's a GTI and I like the boxy look and I like the tartan seats. I like the materials inside and I like the fact that it feels well put together (even if sometimes it isn't).

Am I being a fanboy, perhaps. I think the problem comes from people wanting a track car they can take their mother-in-law out in. The GTI is not that type of car. It's a Golf, but it can also go pretty quickly.