Author Topic: HID kits  (Read 13027 times)

Offline The Doc

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Re: HID kits
« Reply #10 on: 13 October 2011, 07:44 »
Was on MOT course new rules from jan if you have HID lights must have headlight wash or will fail MOT bit harse in my opinion.

I don't think it's harsh.

Infact I think anyone caught with HIDs should have their car crushed.

+1


Offline jmsheahan

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Re: HID kits
« Reply #11 on: 13 October 2011, 09:11 »
Was on MOT course new rules from jan if you have HID lights must have headlight wash or will fail MOT bit harse in my opinion.

I don't think it's harsh.

Infact I think anyone caught with HIDs should have their car crushed.

+1



Agreed.

There's quite an interesting article on them in this months Retro Cars (4 pages), fitting guide etc. I couldn't help but think it was a tad pointless though - they state they are a grey area and the new laws could come into force. More hassle than it's worth!

I don't understand what's wrong with uprated normal bulbs and a loom that can take the extra current. HID's look pap anyway and if you are stupid enough to think blinding other drivers is ok then you really shouldn't be on the road. Ban aftermarket kits I say.

Offline Agreeable Slick

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Re: HID kits
« Reply #12 on: 13 October 2011, 11:08 »
Are you saying then that in a normal light unit they have to have headlight washers? Or is this in any unit -  I.E. including proper projector units? As I know a lot of cars circa 5 years old have projector units but have got shoite light dispersion on to the road.

Offline Rhyso

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Re: HID kits
« Reply #13 on: 13 October 2011, 11:26 »
Are you saying then that in a normal light unit they have to have headlight washers? Or is this in any unit -  I.E. including proper projector units? As I know a lot of cars circa 5 years old have projector units but have got shoite light dispersion on to the road.

^^^

I'd also like clarification if that i were to retro-fit OEM xenons to my car would I need the washers and auto-levelling system that goes with it  :undecided:

Offline SoundillusioN

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Re: HID kits
« Reply #14 on: 13 October 2011, 12:08 »
Are you saying then that in a normal light unit they have to have headlight washers? Or is this in any unit -  I.E. including proper projector units? As I know a lot of cars circa 5 years old have projector units but have got shoite light dispersion on to the road.

^^^

I'd also like clarification if that i were to retro-fit OEM xenons to my car would I need the washers and auto-levelling system that goes with it  :undecided:

My 2009 Mazda 6 has projectors with normal bulbs, the light output is not amazing and in another recent thread on this matter I stated that my MK1s lights with uprated looms to standard bulbs and lenses are much better.

If I wanted to fit Mazda's OEM HIDs from a higher end model I would have to fit the levellers and washers that goes with it if I were to keep it legal.

Read This From GOV Department For Transport:

Aftermarket HID (Xenon) headlamps

Fact sheet: Aftermarket HID headlamps


In the Department's view it is not legal to sell or use after market HID lighting kits, for converting conventional Halogen headlamps to HID Xenon. If a customer wants to convert his vehicle to Xenon HID he must purchase completely new Xenon HID headlamps. The reason for this is that the existing lens and reflector are designed around a Halogen filament bulb, working to very precise tolerances. If one places a HID "burner" (bulb) in the headlamp, the beam pattern will not be correct, there will be glare in some places and not enough light in other places within the beam pattern.

The following is the legal rationale:

The Road Vehicle Lighting Regulations 1989 regulate the situation in the UK.
Under these Regulations, HID/Gas Discharge/Xenon headlamps are not mentioned and therefore they are not permitted according to the strict letter of the law.

However new vehicles have HID headlamps. This is because they comply to European type approval Regulations. The UK cannot refuse to register a vehicle with a European type approval. These are to ECE Regulation 98 (for the HID headlamps which are tested on a rig in a laboratory) and ECE Regulation 48 (Lighting Installation on the vehicle).

For the after market, a used vehicle cannot obtain type approval because it is only applicable for new vehicles. However we feel that saying "HID is banned in the after market" would not be reasonable. Instead we should make analogies with new vehicles. It would be reasonable to require HID in the after market to meet the same safety standards as on new vehicles. The same level of safety should apply.

Therefore a HID headlamp unit sold in the after market should:

1. be type approved to ECE Regulation 98 as a component.

2. when fitted to the vehicle should enable ECE Regulation 48 to be complied with (although no government inspection will take place).

3. Comply with RVLR as far as "use" is concerned.

In practice this means:

1. The headlamp unit (outer lens, reflector, bulb) shall be type approved to ECE 98 and be "e-marked" to demonstrate this. That can only be done by the headlamp supplier - Hella, Valeo etc. who must test the headlamp in an independent laboratory.

2. Once fitted to the vehicle it must have headlamp cleaning and self-levelling (which can be for the headlamp or can be in the vehicle suspension - some expensive estate cars have "self-levelling suspension" and that is adequate). Also the dipped beam must stay on with the main beam.

3. The headlamp must be maintained in good working order, kept clean, and aligned/adjusted correctly like any other headlamp.

Under the Road Traffic Act 1988 it is an offence to supply, fit or use vehicle parts which are not legal.

In summary it is not permitted to convert an existing halogen headlamp unit for use with HID bulbs. The entire headlamp unit must be replaced with one designed and approved for use with HID bulbs and it must be installed in accordance with the rules stated above.

If you require any further information regarding the regulations covered by this fact sheet, please contact the DfT at the address below:

Transport Technology and Standards 6
Department for Transport
Zone 2/04
Great Minster House
76 Marsham Street
London
SW1P 4DR


Taken from http://www2.dft.gov.uk/pgr/roadsafety/drs/hidheadlamps.html

Also note that this has been the case from 2006 and is due to change again including the new, more strict rules for MOT.

Hopefully the last time I post anything on the matter, maybe we need a legal section full of stickies!  :grin:

Offline Agreeable Slick

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Re: HID kits
« Reply #15 on: 13 October 2011, 12:44 »
Humm... looks like that's just sh!t on my early xmas pressie to the motor next month then.

You would have thought that with projectors they would make an exception. :sad:

Offline Diamond Hell

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Re: HID kits
« Reply #16 on: 13 October 2011, 12:45 »
2. Once fitted to the vehicle it must have headlamp cleaning and self-levelling (which can be for the headlamp or can be in the vehicle suspension - some expensive estate cars have "self-levelling suspension" and that is adequate). Also the dipped beam must stay on with the main beam.

Over-ridden by EU legislation IIRC.  You only need E-marked units for the HID kit.

But unless these are available for your car then you can't fit them.

Infact I think anyone caught with HIDs that don't conform to the law should have their car crushed.

Totally.
Just because you're offended doesn't make you right.

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Offline SoundillusioN

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Re: HID kits
« Reply #17 on: 13 October 2011, 13:05 »
Humm... looks like that's just sh!t on my early xmas pressie to the motor next month then.

You would have thought that with projectors they would make an exception. :sad:

Sorry.  :sad: Projectors are only a third of the requirement.

2. Once fitted to the vehicle it must have headlamp cleaning and self-levelling (which can be for the headlamp or can be in the vehicle suspension - some expensive estate cars have "self-levelling suspension" and that is adequate). Also the dipped beam must stay on with the main beam.

Over-ridden by EU legislation IIRC.  You only need E-marked units for the HID kit.

But unless these are available for your car then you can't fit them.


Yeah I'm sure that doesn't cover everything, especially anything recent but I get tired of hearing stuff about new laws. As far as I'm aware it has NEVER been legal to fit HIDs to a vehicle that was never designed to have them and this document proves that the major facts about the matter have been quite clear for some time.
« Last Edit: 14 October 2011, 02:03 by SoundillusioN »

Offline Agreeable Slick

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Re: HID kits
« Reply #18 on: 13 October 2011, 15:38 »
Hold on then, so if there was an option to have them in the model range, and provided I get the right units then I can fit them? I'm now confused.

IIRC - the passat W8 B5.5's had Xenons(HID's).... :undecided:

Offline Rhyso

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Re: HID kits
« Reply #19 on: 13 October 2011, 15:40 »
Hold on then, so if there was an option to have them in the model range, and provided I get the right units then I can fit them? I'm now confused.

IIRC - the passat W8 B5.5's had Xenons(HID's).... :undecided:

AFAIK you would still require the washers and leveling system to go with the OEM xenons  :sad:

That = £££££££££££££££££££££'s  :sad: