Electrics question ce1 88 mk2 golf gti

[rubjonny]

yeah agreed, it would be best to take it out the car, strip down then make a nice fresh ms loom, just wasn't sure if you wanted to go that route

if you want an ecu relay you'll have to add one above the CE1 fusebox, unless you can find a plug 'R' from a digifant MK2.  if you can get one of these you could pop an ecu relay in the factory spot, but tbh adding a relay above the fusebox is just fine. i use vag relay holders when i make abf/vr6 looms for this purpose.  the only other feed you need is the fuel pump trigger wire, danny does megasquirt provide an earth trigger for the pump relay?

you can use pin N to power the injectors if you can find a spade big enough, however this pin isnt fused. there will be a white/red wire which originally fed the WUR which you could use to feed the injectors and thats fused from the factory fuel pump fuse

[emery1990]

Nah it's ok rather you say something then me stressing myself out other something that sounds pretty simple! It starting to sound a bit more easier, as you said, I dont need to identify anything for a start, Ill get it out first, looks like my servo used to a submarine or something, rusty!

Ill get one of those relay holders then, do I just get any old relay or an actual ecu relay, then get a feed to it then just take a feed to my ms. That whats feeding my injectors, the red/white one.

What sort of mods are they ? maybe adding the ecu relay is one?

Will get it out probs tomorow hopefully weather permitting.

[danny_p]

fuel lpump relay connects to pin 37,  it connects pin to ground to trigger the relay.

i rember the problem i had with ms and a vw fusebox / loom now. it was when i put the ms inside a vw ecu box to make it plug and play.  the ISV was partly an issue . and the otherone problem i hit was golf syncro related and i'm pritty sure it was a syncro specific quirk as they have one or two of them that liek to bite occasinaly 

[rubjonny]

a std switching relay is fine, ce1 digi mk2 uses a vw 53 relay for the ecu which will be fine.  what i do is go to scrappy and chop out a load of relay holders for my looms, that way they clip neatly to the top of the fusebox. can be a mare to unclip just look at em carefully you'll see there is either 1 clip in the middle or 2 clips either side of the relay holder. dont get too rough or you'll snap the clips off and defeat the whole point of using the holder 

CE1 plug D is for the engine loom, these are the pins you want to be looking at:
D
2 - blk - ignition live feed (this is the one digifant uses to trigger the ecu relay)
7 - blk - ignition live feed (also a blk/yel to the coolant level relay, dont cut that one splice to the black wire)
13- red/yel-fuel pump relay earth trigger
23- blk - ignition coil live feed
26- red/blk- rev counter feed, may need a conversion box depending how you trigger your spark

in addition:
E/14 - red/wht - should be a spade on this one, this is a fuel pump live. could use this for lambda and/or fuel injectors
N - fuel pump feed - the spade connector on this one is massive so would need to find one big enough. plus it unfused so bear that in mind

[emery1990]

Glad I didnt just go cutting everything, I was going to just cut everything off at that white plug, but thought I'd ask first! Do I get some holders from any vw?

Right so, I cut number 2 and put that to my ecu relay Ill be getting then get ms to the ecu relay.

Dont understand what you mean about splicing the black one to the black one?

13- thats going to my fuel pump wire for ms

23 do I leave that put?

26 - Leave that put aswell, triggering spark from my dizzy.

Im not using an ISV, just going to have to rev it a bit, I'm use to that anyway from the kjet system!

e/14 that goes to my fuel injectors.

Everything else on that plug I can cut off, Ive got a few wires going to different plugs, ones a blue/yellow wire, shall I cut these too.

Servo etc is out.

Basically, is it all the wires from plug D that go into the engine bay, should be cut? And ones that go else where should be kept?

[danny_p]

the isv is easy to drive with ms  it's only really used during the warmup perios anyway,  you can make them idel nicely with the ignition map even with bumpy cams and itbs

[rubjonny]

sorry what i meant was on pin D/7 there are 2 wires coming out the same pin, the black wire plus a black/yellow one which runs to the coolant level sensor relay.  dont cut the black/yel wire as you need that relay, cut/splice to the black wire

you want vw/seat from up to late 90s for the relay holder you need, pretty much all of them will have at least 1 extra relay above the fusebox. chop it out then remove all the spade terminals from it, then add your own spades at the right points for the relay you choose to use. ideally get yourself a holder with a 53 relay in it, that way you wont even have to remove the old spades just splice into the existing wires.

you dont cut all the wires to the D plug, you need quite a few of em still as they're for dash temp, oil sensors, wipers etc.  look at my fusebox faq in the mk2 maintenance section, find the part that covers pre-90 MK2 Golf and it has the complete listing for the D plug. the pin numbers are written on the front, match the wires and positions carefully and only cut out what tyou dont need from the old engine managment (pretty mcuh the wires you cut  are the ones i have listed above)

if you unwrap the old engine loom completly it should become pretty obvious which wires you want to keep, and which ones can be removed, but if you get stuck or are unsure let us know and we'll try to help

[emery1990]

Brilliant, cheers Ill get cracking.

Oh I gets you about the d7 now!

Can I just buy the relay holder brand new ? Or Do I have to go around scrapyards searching. Id rather get a 53 relay, sounds easier. But If dont get a 53 pin, how do I know where to put my new spades if I dont get a 53 relay ?

So them wires I cut, shall I just get some new wire and take that to the places I need? TBH I only needs to get a live to my throttle switch now, should I get my injector live from somewhere else? I ask as Ive got a removable lamda- lc-1 and is that e/14 the only wire I can connect onto ?.Can I feed my injectors off of 23 ignition coil live ( As currently injectors areon e/14 but may have to move to allow e/14 to connect to 02 sensor)

[rubjonny]

can get relay holder from vag: 161 937 501 B - 3.94+VAT

just use the relay you choose as a guide for the pin locations, read the pin numbers off the relay and put your spades in the right spot. you need the spades with the retaining pegs though, the ones you get from halfords in different colours wont cut it.  either chop the wires out of scrappy and solder, or buy new ones from polevolt.co.uk and invest in a proper ratchet criming tool for non-insulated terminals

you could use new wire or the bits cut out of your old loom if in good nick. your call!  injector live you can either use E/14, pin N or could use the power output from the megasquirt ecu relay, same as factory CE1 digifant mk2. same answer for the lambda probe, though usually these get fuel pump live rather than ecu live.
I'd not run either direct from the coil live, as you dont want anything thats putting too much electrical load on the ign circuit, injectors i guess wont be too bad but lambda probe heater i suppose would be reasonably high current.

if it was me, I'd have lambda probe heater to E/14, and injectors from the ecu relay live. or just run both injectors and lambda to E/14

[emery1990]

OK cheers, this is helping loads! becoming much clearer now.

One last question then I can relax and then ILL do all what youve said.

Is there a few live feeds on the ecu relay ill be getting, as i wont one live for my ms  dont I, then another one for my injectors.

Danny, would I put the MS 02 sensor wire to the e/14, or would I connect the actual sensor to that then the ms 02 wire goes to the sensor aswell? If the first one, then Id need to make it a plug wouldnt I, as the 02 sensor will only be for mapping so then I can just unplug it.