Author Topic: --Bike Carbs - Fuel weeing back out of Jets?  (Read 3909 times)

Offline fishnchipsx2

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--Bike Carbs - Fuel weeing back out of Jets?
« on: 10 June 2009, 22:50 »
Hi,
Been having problems fitting bike carbs to a mate's 1.3 over the last few days.    They are off a GSXR 600, haven't been re-jetted yet - we're trying to get them to at least run first.

We've got to the point where we can start em up and the engine runs.  However, each carb is weeing fuel out of a jet just below each trumpet - the outers considerably worse than the inners. 

What is it that causes this?  We suspected the floats were sticking, so we checked, and cleaned up the valves.  This seems to have helped a little, but it still hasn't solved the problem.

Any ideas?
Cheers,
Calum.

Offline danny_p

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Re: --Bike Carbs - Fuel weeing back out of Jets?
« Reply #1 on: 10 June 2009, 23:36 »
fuel pressure to high,  float angels wrong,  it'll be one or both of them
all the VW's have gone bar 1.

Offline fishnchipsx2

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Re: --Bike Carbs - Fuel weeing back out of Jets?
« Reply #2 on: 11 June 2009, 00:25 »
We're using a sh!tty borrowed pressure regulator, even when we turn it down to 0.5psi it still pisses fuel.  Any idea what sort of angle the carbs should be at? 

Could you please look at this video and tell me whether you reckon they're sat too steeply or not flat enough?  (I think it should work) http://www.facebook.com/v/203331605116

I wouldn't have thought it would be too far out, you get steeper hills than that... or is there a way of adjusting the float angles internally?

Cheers,
Calum.

Offline fishnchipsx2

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Re: --Bike Carbs - Fuel weeing back out of Jets?
« Reply #3 on: 11 June 2009, 01:04 »
I forgot to say... we're running it off the standard mechanical fuel pump which runs off the cam.  This then goes into the pressure regulator, before going into the carbs.

There is a nozzle under each carb which did just have fuel falling out... so we guessed they're supposed to be fuel returns, so we've run hose from them back into the tank.  However, we've come to believe that we shouldn't be needing any returns, and that these 4 nozzles are possibly supposed to work as vacuums?  (Not that they are at the moment, with fuel coming out of them!)

Could it be anything to do with using the mechanical pump instead of an electric one..? Not really sure how this would affect it...

Offline fishnchipsx2

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Re: --Bike Carbs - Fuel weeing back out of Jets?
« Reply #4 on: 11 June 2009, 01:39 »
Sorry, one more thing I just remembered!  On the top of the carbs, between 1 and 2, and between 3 and 4, there are holes facing in pairs.  I have seen pictures of other bike carbs which have T-pieces in these: I have no idea where they would lead to though.  We didn't have any which fit anyway, so we just routed 1+2 together and 3+4 together: it only takes about 15mm of hose for each connection.  Not sure if this is correct or not.

Offline bomp

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Re: --Bike Carbs - Fuel weeing back out of Jets?
« Reply #5 on: 11 June 2009, 02:04 »
Someone on this link here  has 1.5mm jets in CBR600 carbs in a MK1 1275, so I guess your jets should need to be around that size. The angle of the carbs need to be exactly as that of the bike they were off, google should help.
Life is like a skid mark on a toilet bowl.  Sooner or later someone\\\'s going to pi$$ you off.

Offline fishnchipsx2

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Re: --Bike Carbs - Fuel weeing back out of Jets?
« Reply #6 on: 11 June 2009, 02:11 »
I'm not sure where he got the information from, but my mate reckons the jets only need to be drilled out an extra 0.1mm - I know that a 0.1mm increase in diameter is a much larger increase when it comes to volume of fuel flowing through it, but I wouldn't have thought that it would make so much difference as to cause fuel to spurt out where it shouldn't be..?

Basically, we're trying to just get it driveable at the mo, before he splashes cash on getting a proper ally manifold made up etc.

Offline molegti

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Re: --Bike Carbs - Fuel weeing back out of Jets?
« Reply #7 on: 11 June 2009, 07:15 »
Use the electric fuel pump off the bike.

Offline DOA

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Re: --Bike Carbs - Fuel weeing back out of Jets?
« Reply #8 on: 11 June 2009, 09:33 »
Helped trying to fit similar carbs to a polo 1275 lump before (more pain than its worth but....) and you really want a bike fuel pump from a similarly sized engine and to blank the mechanical one thats driven off the cam. This was the first thing that caused fuel to pee into the inlets! (You only need about 7psi fuel pressure) The next thing was getting the floats to seal properly and to get this we ended up having to shim the float needle as the floats werent easily adjustable without breaking the springs. Without showing you pics of what we did its a bit difficult to explain this though lol. The next thing that caused this was air leaks between the carbs and the inlet manifold. This caused LOTS of problems as it was a nightmare to seal the inlet due to my friend who's engine it was being VERY pikey and refusing to spend money on some decent hose lol. Never did figure out why this caused so many problems though although the way we had them to make them seal made them essentially pretty solidly mounted to the manifold, if we made the connecting hoses longer to give some flex they leaked.
 1.5mm is definately far too big for the mains from our experience although I cant remember exactly what they were running last time it was on the road. We ended up buying some jet drills to set the jetting for much cheepness, if you go too big and need to go back you can solder the jets up and re-drill them if needed. We didnt have too many problems with the angle of the carbs but that may just have been the angle that the polo engine was at was pretty similar to the angle of the bike they came off (we had no reference though so I wouldnt know lol).
The one thing I did get out of all of the experience with this guys car was never, ever, ever! to bother unless I had the budget to set the car up on a rolling road as getting all of the jets, mixture screw and idle screw to work together was a complete nightmare that, even with a proper exhaust gas analyser and a wideband lambda sensor and logger unit plugged into the exhaust we never got the things anywhere near what I would call well set up (the owner liked to kid himself though so who was I to argue lol, it was his VERY LARGE fuel bill after all lol). Learnt a lot from the experience but its definately not one to try on a budget, it just doesnt work lol.
If you do set it up on a rolling road (and find someone who will do it for you!), get a spare set of jets and some jet drills as that will save you a lot of time finding and buying new jets, you can alter the spares if the ones that are in there need it while the old ones are swapped out. Should save you a few pennys on setting up time.

Offline DOA

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Re: --Bike Carbs - Fuel weeing back out of Jets?
« Reply #9 on: 11 June 2009, 09:42 »
Oh and the hoses normally run back to the airbox, not entirely sure (been a long time since I played with them lol) but I think they either put some idle air supply into the throat or provide a pressure reference signal from the bikes airbox. We blanked them as we had vacuum takeoffs in the manifold for vac advance on the dizzy (gave very bouncy vac signals so probably did more harm than good lol). Maybe get a gauge on there and use these for the same job if they give a good signal. The problem is knowing how much vacuum to need lol.