Author Topic: Regal DSG software - group buy interest gauging.  (Read 7729 times)

Offline illyun

  • I live here
  • *****
  • Posts: 2,271
Mk1 GTI Campaign, Mk5 GTI Edition 30, Mk6 GTI (Coming Soon...)

Offline illyun

  • I live here
  • *****
  • Posts: 2,271
Re: Regal DSG software - group buy interest gauging.
« Reply #21 on: 14 February 2009, 22:42 »
Thread cleaned up.. let's try and keep this relevant shall we?

....I would have thought that forum members' opinions about Regal are highly relevant.


Illyun I assume you mean your post about your CEL not the intercooler thread.. well that was binned because it was actually you, in your second post, who lit the blue touch paper and instigated the whole situation.

Anyway enough of that, let's remain on topic as PMs are the place to discuss that sort of thing.

err no.. that was TT I seem to recall  :rolleyes:  Anyway, let's end this as its not relevant.  I'm sure the Regal software is ok, but its just not for me.
Mk1 GTI Campaign, Mk5 GTI Edition 30, Mk6 GTI (Coming Soon...)

Offline Teutonic_Tamer

  • Forum addict
  • *
  • Posts: 4,562
  • GreasedMonkey - HoofHearted - GTI now mod'ed, ASK!
Re: Regal DSG software - group buy interest gauging.
« Reply #22 on: 16 February 2009, 22:21 »
Rev limits to 7,100 revs would be very beneficial to a DSG ED30. The K04 turbo is capable of making more power above the 6k limit you are talking about. Manuals continue making power over the 6k limit, but the DSG prepares for changing gear and inhibits power development over 6k in readiness for an upchange and disengagement of the clutchpack. Raising the change level means that you free up an extra 1k of revs for the power to be fully utilised.

....Would you expect any extra stresses on the clutches by freeing up revs for more power?

Good question. :afro:

So, Yes.  If the gear change point is, say, 1000rpm higher, then then the corresponding 'engaging' of the clutch will also be higher too.  This usually means a higher level of torque - so yes, the clutches will be stressed slightly more.  However, if the revised DSG software also somehow modifies both an actual increase in speed which the clutch clamps, along with a greater clamping pressure, then these potential increases in stresses could actually be eliminated.  Some live datalogging of clutch engagement would be very useful to confirm this very valid concern.
Sean - Independent Automotive Engineering Technician (ret'd)
-----
'06/7 Golf Mk5 GTI 5dr (BWA) DSG, colour coded,

I feel like a homo


Offline Teutonic_Tamer

  • Forum addict
  • *
  • Posts: 4,562
  • GreasedMonkey - HoofHearted - GTI now mod'ed, ASK!
Re: Regal DSG software - group buy interest gauging.
« Reply #23 on: 16 February 2009, 22:23 »
Ah right well I see how the stock FP could run into trouble fuelling for the higher rev's. But as for a HPFP, I'm not planning on modding to that sort of level. Breathing mods is as far as I think I'll go. Would be interesting to see the A/F ratio's at those high RPM's though on the stock pump.

But still, I'm very interested in the way the DSG remap would improve the kick-down system.

What don't you like about the DSG kick-down?  I personally think it is one of the best kick-downs around.  Best start a new thread though!  :wink:
Sean - Independent Automotive Engineering Technician (ret'd)
-----
'06/7 Golf Mk5 GTI 5dr (BWA) DSG, colour coded,

I feel like a homo


Offline Teutonic_Tamer

  • Forum addict
  • *
  • Posts: 4,562
  • GreasedMonkey - HoofHearted - GTI now mod'ed, ASK!
Re: Regal DSG software - group buy interest gauging.
« Reply #24 on: 16 February 2009, 22:25 »
But still, I'm very interested in the way the DSG remap would improve the kick-down system.

....I have to say that I've never quite understood why there is a kick-down system on the DSG - Throttle plus paddleshift is instant and superfast....And reliable!

Paddle shift down is NOT as quick, nor instant like true kick-down.  Paddle shift can only work sequentially, whereas kick-down can completely skip cogs.

Anyway, OT for this thread,  :wink: apart from actually clarifying what the Regal software does to the existing DSG kick-down.
Sean - Independent Automotive Engineering Technician (ret'd)
-----
'06/7 Golf Mk5 GTI 5dr (BWA) DSG, colour coded,

I feel like a homo


Offline RedRobin

  • Forum addict
  • *
  • Posts: 4,227
  • BIALI Motorsport - Chief Horn Blower!
Re: Regal DSG software - group buy interest gauging.
« Reply #25 on: 16 February 2009, 22:31 »
^^^^
Then I best test kick-down out for myself and see what I think.
:cool: FACEFOOK: https://www.facebook.com/robin.procter.50?ref=tn_tnmn



Throbbin' Red VeeDub GTI Mk5 - DSG, Custom Milltek TBE, Forge Twintake, KW-V3 + Eibach ARBs, AP Racing BigBrake kit, Quaife ATB diff, Revo2

Offline illyun

  • I live here
  • *****
  • Posts: 2,271
Re: Regal DSG software - group buy interest gauging.
« Reply #26 on: 17 February 2009, 02:44 »
I'm going to wait until I see if anyone blows their transmission  :grin: :grin: :grin:
Mk1 GTI Campaign, Mk5 GTI Edition 30, Mk6 GTI (Coming Soon...)

Offline RedRobin

  • Forum addict
  • *
  • Posts: 4,227
  • BIALI Motorsport - Chief Horn Blower!
Re: Regal DSG software - group buy interest gauging.
« Reply #27 on: 17 February 2009, 06:32 »
....

Been out very early this morning (5:30am) and tried kick-down. I got wheelspin and lit up the TC which was very quickly brought under control with the help of the Quaife, WALK, suspension, and without any juddering, but I must say I prefer the smoother driving style of better anticipation and using the paddles to make fast acceleration without the drama of kick-down.

In the past I've sometimes double clicked the paddles to drop 2 gears, probably not as fast etc as kick-down but I feel I've now learnt to be more constantly in the optimum gear (from driver training) and don't need to do this anymore. Only in emergency perhaps.

Presumably this new Regal DSG software doesn't have any effect on such actions - Or does it?
:cool: FACEFOOK: https://www.facebook.com/robin.procter.50?ref=tn_tnmn



Throbbin' Red VeeDub GTI Mk5 - DSG, Custom Milltek TBE, Forge Twintake, KW-V3 + Eibach ARBs, AP Racing BigBrake kit, Quaife ATB diff, Revo2

Offline pazz

  • Not said much yet
  • **
  • Posts: 98
Re: Regal DSG software - group buy interest gauging.
« Reply #28 on: 17 February 2009, 13:35 »
RedRobin, hadnt you used kick-down before? Or was that sarcasm I'm missing?

without the drama of kick-down.

I could'nt of summed it up any better though to be honest as to why the stock system is flawed, it is exactly that - the drama of kick-down.

The stock Kick-down system in my oppinion is somewhat unpredictable. 80% of the time it's over-sensitive or aggressive for the intended acceleration. I throttle half-way down and all of sudden I find myself rev'ing the tits off it and off into the distance when all wanted was a little low-end torque in a high gear.

I will start a topic on this later tonight (currently at work).

Offline Teutonic_Tamer

  • Forum addict
  • *
  • Posts: 4,562
  • GreasedMonkey - HoofHearted - GTI now mod'ed, ASK!
Re: Regal DSG software - group buy interest gauging.
« Reply #29 on: 17 February 2009, 14:48 »
....

Been out very early this morning (5:30am) and tried kick-down. I got wheelspin and lit up the TC which was very quickly brought under control with the help of the Quaife, WALK, suspension, and without any juddering, but I must say I prefer the smoother driving style of better anticipation and using the paddles to make fast acceleration without the drama of kick-down.

Then you need to ditch those Goodyears, and get some decent grippy french rubber!  :tongue:  :grin:  :evil:

Seriously, though, I generally get very little wheelspin with my PS2s.  But then I do tend to turn off the TC and let my right foot control the wheelspin.  Can I ask what gear you were originally in, and what gear did it kick down to?  And what kind of speed were you doing just before the kickdown.

Perhaps you could actually try it again with the TC turned off.  :smiley:  Oh, and at a slightly warmer time of day, to give your tyres a fair chance of getting warm!  :tongue:  :wink:

In the past I've sometimes double clicked the paddles to drop 2 gears, probably not as fast etc as kick-down but I feel I've now learnt to be more constantly in the optimum gear (from driver training) and don't need to do this anymore. Only in emergency perhaps.

You have sort of hit the nail on the head.  Under ideal driving situations, then you are correct in that you should be paddling down, before you actually need to accelerate - and this should normally not be a problem for any delay in say going from 6th to 5th, 5th to 4th, and 4th to 3rd - etc.  And if it is only one cog you need to drop, then the paddles are a perfect answer, and probably better than the kickdown.

But on the flipside, there are a few valid reasons why kickdown is preffered (rightly or wrongly) to using the paddles.  The first, and most obvious is simply someone who has come from a conventional auto, and has never actually had any kind of 'tiptronic' function (be that paddles, or the floor mounted shift lever).  If my grey matter recalls correctly, didn't you come from an auto beemer, and never used the GTI paddles for the first 30k miles?

Another reason to use the kickdown - maybe you are trundling along at 40mph in a long queue of traffic, with a pesky caravan up front, and you have sort of given up trying to get by - so just leave the DSG 6th gear (be that in manual or auto mode).  And suddenly, just like someone parting the sea, a gap appears, you really haven't got time to be paddling down 3 or 4 cogs, so nailing the loud pedal instantly gives you the lowest possible gear for max acceleration.  So this instance of using kickdown would be way quicker than paddling down.  :nerd:

So, all I am trying to say, is that both paddle shifting down, and using the kickdown each have their own advantages and disadvantages - and just one particular method isn't always 100% the correct one to use at all times.  :smiley:


Presumably this new Regal DSG software doesn't have any effect on such actions - Or does it?

But I really can't understand what particular 'issue' with the kickdown you don't like - or would like Regal to 'solve'!  :huh:
« Last Edit: 17 February 2009, 14:49 by Teutonic_Tamer »
Sean - Independent Automotive Engineering Technician (ret'd)
-----
'06/7 Golf Mk5 GTI 5dr (BWA) DSG, colour coded,

I feel like a homo