GolfGTIforum.co.uk
Model specific boards => Golf mk7 => Topic started by: Exonian on 12 February 2016, 16:18
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I like to do one of these threads once in a while just to get everyone's blood pressure boiling over:
I've just run a CAP valuation on my R and it comes out at £25300 top book.
I've just run an Orangewheels quote on a GTD and it comes in at slightly less than the valuation on the R for a car with met paint and park pack.
So in theory I could pick up the phone and find a dealer with an 'in stock' GTD in a similar spec (silver with park pack) and do a potentially free swap.
Why? A GTD is the only configuration of Golf I've not owned and it'd do me as a project for a while.
I like the idea of a mapped/boxed GTD as it would suit the roads I drive on and also I like the idea of filling the tank every 500 miles not every 280.
The performance would be much the same for me. Give me high torque at low rpm's over high power at higher rpm's any day.
I prefer the GTD looks (just).
I really should post this on the R Forum but I don't think the A&E departments would cope with the influx...
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If it's what you want - go and do it and don't listen to me or anyone else that will post on here - lock the thread now :laugh:
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Hmm, know quite a few have gone from a GTD to an R, but I think you might be one of the first considering an R to a GTD ?
Whilst I do love my GTD, I've never owned an R, so don't know how I would feel "stepping down" so to speak. That 70-100 bhp extra (after a GTD map) and 4WD, is quite a heady combination.
Just FYI, unless I'm doing long trips, I never get to see 500 miles on a tank, most often 420-450 ish just before the refuelling light comes on. I'm getting around 45-46mpg knocking around the houses (in my non mapped GTD), and 55-60 ish on a good run taken at legal speed limits (more for a manual - mine Is DSG).
I agree that the GTD has a slightly better look (personal) with nice alloys and the GTI front with the fogs, but I would love Lapis with those Pretoria alloys.
Hmm, this should be a good thread.
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Or if you have the space buy a tank and fill it. I have nearly 4000 litres of diesel at the back of my garage.
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Fill the tank every 500 miles? Give me one of them!! :grin:
I've seen me hit barely 400 miles and I need to refill and that's me not hammering it.
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Fill the tank every 500 miles? Give me one of them!! :grin:
I've seen me hit barely 400 miles and I need to refill and that's me not hammering it.
I'm getting between 420-450 too and then the lights on........ Have a short daily commute, then the regular trips here and there.
Cars just ticked 20k so should be freeing up now
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I can do 500 miles from a tank easily enough in mine, but that really is about the limit without needing to employ eco driving tactics! I do about 75% motorway driving probably.
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I didn't initially like the look of the R but having seen that Black one of Booth's I think it looks superb. Maybe it's the Blue that has put me off.
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Knowing, a couple of days ago, that this thread would be forthcoming very soon, lol, I was trying to guess what the title would be and it was something along the lines of....."Ok, here....... :laugh:
I think you should get yourself in a GTD, I can't see this particular itch lessening any time soon. :smiley:
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I didn't initially like the look of the R but having seen that Black one of Booth's I think it looks superb. Maybe it's the Blue that has put me off.
Snap!
That blue is truly awful imo
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I didn't initially like the look of the R but having seen that Black one of Booth's I think it looks superb. Maybe it's the Blue that has put me off.
Have you seen how much work she puts into keeping it looking like that though. I have had a couple of black cars(both Volvo V70 R's) and they were a nightmare to keep clean. Even in summer just sitting outside the house they got dirty with dust.
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I didn't initially like the look of the R but having seen that Black one of Booth's I think it looks superb. Maybe it's the Blue that has put me off.
Why thank you Gorocco :smiley: Black does scrub up well.
I very nearly went for Lapiz but bottled it! I wasa bit worried that black wasn't going to work on the R given the Mk7 sharp lines and creases suit the lighter colours like reflex silver and limestone grey, but I think it suits the R and gives it presence that is lacking on some of the other colours.
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I didn't initially like the look of the R but having seen that Black one of Booth's I think it looks superb. Maybe it's the Blue that has put me off.
Have you seen how much work she puts into keeping it looking like that though. I have had a couple of black cars(both Volvo V70 R's) and they were a nightmare to keep clean. Even in summer just sitting outside the house they got dirty with dust.
Not as much effort as you might think. Washed it today after 2 weeks without, pretty grubby it was but 55 mins later looking good.
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I didn't initially like the look of the R but having seen that Black one of Booth's I think it looks superb. Maybe it's the Blue that has put me off.
Have you seen how much work she puts into keeping it looking like that though. I have had a couple of black cars(both Volvo V70 R's) and they were a nightmare to keep clean. Even in summer just sitting outside the house they got dirty with dust.
Not as much effort as you might think. Washed it today after 2 weeks without, pretty grubby it was but 55 mins later looking good.
Yeah I seen that. Nice
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I didn't initially like the look of the R but having seen that Black one of Booth's I think it looks superb. Maybe it's the Blue that has put me off.
Have you seen how much work she puts into keeping it looking like that though. I have had a couple of black cars(both Volvo V70 R's) and they were a nightmare to keep clean. Even in summer just sitting outside the house they got dirty with dust.
Not as much effort as you might think. Washed it today after 2 weeks without, pretty grubby it was but 55 mins later looking good.
the way you keep the car looking though puts most members to shame :smiley:
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I like to do one of these threads once in a while just to get everyone's blood pressure boiling over:
I've just run a CAP valuation on my R and it comes out at £25300 top book.
I've just run an Orangewheels quote on a GTD and it comes in at slightly less than the valuation on the R for a car with met paint and park pack.
So in theory I could pick up the phone and find a dealer with an 'in stock' GTD in a similar spec (silver with park pack) and do a potentially free swap.
Why? A GTD is the only configuration of Golf I've not owned and it'd do me as a project for a while.
I like the idea of a mapped/boxed GTD as it would suit the roads I drive on and also I like the idea of filling the tank every 500 miles not every 280.
The performance would be much the same for me. Give me high torque at low rpm's over high power at higher rpm's any day.
I prefer the GTD looks (just).
I really should post this on the R Forum but I don't think the A&E departments would cope with the influx...
Good post!
I have recently jumped out of the R (although still own it for another few weeks) into a Jag XE for the same reasons. Got a DTUK box on it and it's a great mile muncher, similar to a GTD. On a Sunday morning I miss my mapped R, but the rest of the week, it's a better all rounder for Norfolk roads
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I changed my 64 reg GTD in white with santiagos, 3 months ago for a Lapiz 3door manual Golf R with cadiz wheels. Best move ever there is really no comparison in performance and sound between the two.
I was getting about 350-400 out of a tank with my GTD and now getting about 300 out of my R but I do tend to drive my R harder than the GTD purely because I cannot help myself, just love the sound of the exhaust with the flaps open!.Never regret the move from diesel to petrol and enjoy the drive a lot more so will never see me going back to oil burners again, but the GTD is still a good warm hatch.
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Is this why you never posted it on the R forum Andy? :grin:
(https://cdn-webimages.wimages.net/051782995be0e6676006d57f7240697e768324-wm.jpg)
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I like to do one of these threads once in a while just to get everyone's blood pressure boiling over:
I've just run a CAP valuation on my R and it comes out at £25300 top book.
I've just run an Orangewheels quote on a GTD and it comes in at slightly less than the valuation on the R for a car with met paint and park pack.
So in theory I could pick up the phone and find a dealer with an 'in stock' GTD in a similar spec (silver with park pack) and do a potentially free swap.
Why? A GTD is the only configuration of Golf I've not owned and it'd do me as a project for a while.
I like the idea of a mapped/boxed GTD as it would suit the roads I drive on and also I like the idea of filling the tank every 500 miles not every 280.
The performance would be much the same for me. Give me high torque at low rpm's over high power at higher rpm's any day.
I prefer the GTD looks (just).
I really should post this on the R Forum but I don't think the A&E departments would cope with the influx...
You need your head checked pal
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I like to do one of these threads once in a while just to get everyone's blood pressure boiling over:
I've just run a CAP valuation on my R and it comes out at £25300 top book.
I've just run an Orangewheels quote on a GTD and it comes in at slightly less than the valuation on the R for a car with met paint and park pack.
So in theory I could pick up the phone and find a dealer with an 'in stock' GTD in a similar spec (silver with park pack) and do a potentially free swap.
Why? A GTD is the only configuration of Golf I've not owned and it'd do me as a project for a while.
I like the idea of a mapped/boxed GTD as it would suit the roads I drive on and also I like the idea of filling the tank every 500 miles not every 280.
The performance would be much the same for me. Give me high torque at low rpm's over high power at higher rpm's any day.
I prefer the GTD looks (just).
I really should post this on the R Forum but I don't think the A&E departments would cope with the influx...
You need your head checked pal
Nice and insightful view there lol
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I was getting about 460 miles a tank in the GTD in the Winter, and i'm getting about 340 miles to a tank in the R (although the R's tank is 9% bigger). Not bad at all, although my commute has gone from 12 miles each way to 20 miles each way, if I was only doing 12 miles in the R, which helps the mpg.
After 7 brand new VW TDIs in a row, I had made my mind up that I needed an R to escape the horrendous tramping (a change of tyres probably would've sorted it). The difference in performance is huge when you really wring the R's neck (even against a GTD with DTUK box on), but a bi-turbo MK8 GTD+/GTDR with 250ps and a tuning box to get it up to 310ps might tempt me back to the black pump in future.
Right now though, I could really see myself sticking with this R 3 or 4 years (having a 5 year warranty helps with the reassurance, mine has dipped into the warranty pot a few times already).
Although the R could be faster with a box, I wouldn't dare add it. Too many people have pushed a GTI or R too far and cooked a clutch or Turbo very prematurely, not a single person here (to my knowledge) has seen a modified GTD fail in the same way. VW's TDI tech does always seem to be generously over-engineered, but the TSIs don't seem to have much more to give without considerable risk.
I love my R, it is the best car i've owned, especially with a tyre change. I was initially underwhelmed with my GTD - hugely linear power delivery and refinement seemed to make it feel so much slower than it actually was, it took the DTUK box to liven it up a bit. You might only get to use that extra 116ps for 5% of your commute, but when you do it always puts a smile on your face.
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I've owned a mk7 GTI with a DTUK box and now own an S3 with DTUK box installed.... My Mrs owns a gtd that I use every now and again. It's ok but not a patch on either the gti or s3 (similar to R). She only gets 420 miles to a tank. I get 350 in s3 and got 370/380 in the gti.
If the gtd was a lot better on fuel I would totally understand the appeal of it but it's just not good enough in my opinion. She used to have the 170bhp a3 and that was a lot better on fuel, maybe as much as 10mpg. Although I would be intrigued to have a go in a mapped gtd. All the remaps I have had done over the years have always seen an improvement in economy as well as the obvious performance increase.
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I've owned a mk7 GTI with a DTUK box and now own an S3 with DTUK box installed.... My Mrs owns a gtd that I use every now and again. It's ok but not a patch on either the gti or s3 (similar to R). She only gets 420 miles to a tank. I get 350 in s3 and got 370/380 in the gti.
If the gtd was a lot better on fuel I would totally understand the appeal of it but it's just not good enough in my opinion. She used to have the 170bhp a3 and that was a lot better on fuel, maybe as much as 10mpg. Although I would be intrigued to have a go in a mapped gtd. All the remaps I have had done over the years have always seen an improvement in economy as well as the obvious performance increase.
I found no difference at all with actual mpg with a DTUK box on, or a TDITuning box on, indicated mpg did go up appreciably, a product of the box making the car use more fuel than it thinks it is using. I'm sure that's where pretty much all the increased mpg claims come from. They don't have to consider the effects of their work on emissions, but combustion of fuel is basic chemistry:-
More fuel and air in = more CO2, N2 and water out (ideally). Add increased temperatures and pressures that diesel engines operate at and some of that N2 and O2 in the air becomes NOx in appreciable quantities. Up the temperature, make the engine run lean (an excess of air to that needed to burn the fuel) and you get a more efficient burn with fewer particulates, but you get more NOx too. It's a balancing act for the engine manufacturers between particulates and NOx for emission standards compliance.
The Box developers and remappers have no such considerations to make. My DTUK box halved my DPF regens, almost certainly a product of running the car leaner than VW had set it up, making fewer particulates (and making the car a little more efficient, we're talking a few % here at most, countered by the fact that when you put your foot down you will be using more, so overall my economy stayed the same for more performance - not a bad thing!). But if the particulates are down, the NOx is probably through the roof.
The car manufacturers are getting around hotter/leaner burns to up economy and power by having the "Clearblue" tanks on their cars now - Audi are doing it on the 190ps variants of the GTD engine. A tiny bit of Urea injected into the exhaust reduces the NOx of a lean burn back to N2, CO2 and water.
I don't think it will be long before we see DPFs on higher compression petrol engines running on RON97-99. Petrol engines are becoming more like diesel engines to raise the economy - running at higher temperatures and pressures, as far as they can push the fuel without pinking. The state my R's pipes get in is proof that petrol engines kick out particulates too (smaller, less visible in the air, but more dispersible and dangerous as a result). With no control measures to capture the soot, i'd expect that the exhaust output of an R is a fair bit dirtier than a GTD in terms of CO2 and particulates, but still a fair bit lower on the NOx.
GTD or GTI/R from an environmental point of view depends on whether you think that CO2, Particulates or NOx is the biggest threat to health. The mpg differences between the 3 aren't as big as you'd expect, and the lowest fuel prices for 6 years helps swallowing that difference. I'm spending amount on fuel on my R as I was on the GTD 2 years ago.
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Well, where do I start?
Or if you have the space buy a tank and fill it. I have nearly 4000 litres of diesel at the back of my garage.
That reply doesn't give the impression that you may possibly not be quite your average Joe at all.
A 4000 litre tank would be bigger than my entire garden.
A postage stamp is nearly bigger than my garden come to think of it. I'm not big on gardening by the way.Knowing, a couple of days ago, that this thread would be forthcoming very soon, lol, I was trying to guess what the title would be and it was something along the lines of....."Ok, here....... :laugh:
I think you should get yourself in a GTD, I can't see this particular itch lessening any time soon. :smiley:
It's not really an itch, but I do have some weird thoughts in the middle of the night when there's not much to do in my little padded cell.
Good post!
I have recently jumped out of the R (although still own it for another few weeks) into a Jag XE for the same reasons. Got a DTUK box on it and it's a great mile muncher, similar to a GTD. On a Sunday morning I miss my mapped R, but the rest of the week, it's a better all rounder for Norfolk roads
Thanks!
BTW, Andrew @ DTUK used your testimonial and pic on Instagram today!Is this why you never posted it on the R forum Andy? :grin:
I think you're along the right lines Steve!You need your head checked pal
That's what I love about the Scots! :grin:
(you're not wrong btw)I was getting about 460 miles a tank in the GTD in the Winter, and i'm getting about 340 miles to a tank in the R (although the R's tank is 9% bigger). Not bad at all, although my commute has gone from 12 miles each way to 20 miles each way, if I was only doing 12 miles in the R, which helps the mpg.
After 7 brand new VW TDIs in a row, I had made my mind up that I needed an R to escape the horrendous tramping (a change of tyres probably would've sorted it). The difference in performance is huge when you really wring the R's neck (even against a GTD with DTUK box on), but a bi-turbo MK8 GTD+/GTDR with 250ps and a tuning box to get it up to 310ps might tempt me back to the black pump in future.
Right now though, I could really see myself sticking with this R 3 or 4 years (having a 5 year warranty helps with the reassurance, mine has dipped into the warranty pot a few times already).
Although the R could be faster with a box, I wouldn't dare add it. Too many people have pushed a GTI or R too far and cooked a clutch or Turbo very prematurely, not a single person here (to my knowledge) has seen a modified GTD fail in the same way. VW's TDI tech does always seem to be generously over-engineered, but the TSIs don't seem to have much more to give without considerable risk.
I love my R, it is the best car i've owned, especially with a tyre change. I was initially underwhelmed with my GTD - hugely linear power delivery and refinement seemed to make it feel so much slower than it actually was, it took the DTUK box to liven it up a bit. You might only get to use that extra 116ps for 5% of your commute, but when you do it always puts a smile on your face.
I get to use the extra 116PS about 0.00% of my commute.
Probably about 1% of my entire annual driving.
I'm getting old, I can't be arsed to rev the engine hard anymore - I like zippy and fun without doing the big speeds.
The trouble with tuning boxes on the R is that the peak figures on the graphs look to be quite high in the range where as with a Diesel the power and torque is slap bang where you're going to use it.
The downside of a tuned Diesel is that it feels really powerful at first, like you're driving a big torquey V8 then all of a sudden you run out of revs!!! Is there a happy medium? Maybe I need a V8 in my life.
I respect my R but I don't love it. I love driving it though! It just feels like an extraordinary powerful but very normal Golf - which in itself is a massive testament to the engineering that tames the power (and indeed the power itself).
Maybe I just need a different hobby instead of playing around with cars? Knitting?
Most likely I'll end up keeping the R a few years and mapping it nearer the end of the warranty, possibly adding some retrofits along the way as a bit of a project.
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I get to use the extra 116PS about 0.00% of my commute.
Probably about 1% of my entire annual driving.
I'm getting old, I can't be arsed to rev the engine hard anymore - I like zippy and fun without doing the big speeds.
The trouble with tuning boxes on the R is that the peak figures on the graphs look to be quite high in the range where as with a Diesel the power and torque is slap bang where you're going to use it.
The downside of a tuned Diesel is that it feels really powerful at first, like you're driving a big torquey V8 then all of a sudden you run out of revs!!! Is there a happy medium? Maybe I need a V8 in my life.
Maybe I just need a different hobby instead of playing around with cars? Knitting?
I know exactly what you mean about diesel power delivery - for a few weeks after I got the R, it felt alien to wring it's neck to get the most out of it, rather than just being able to put your foot down in the gear you're already in to get that burst you need to get from 60-80 reasonably quickly, or just dropping from 6th to 4th to get from 50 to 80mph very quickly. I usually get 3 or 4 opportunities on my commute to fly off a roundabout or sliproad from 20 to 80, and I enjoy every single one of them. I do change gear far more often in the R than Iever did in the GTD.
Other hobbies? I'm a big Lego fan, which can be pricey in it's own right, but the huge sets that give a sense of achievement and look impressive as a display piece are usually worth more than you paid for them a year or 2 after they retired, when used (they're worth silly money unopened). Right now i'm halfway through one of these:-
(http://cdn1-www.comingsoon.net/assets/uploads/2015/11/gb-lego-header.jpg)
Just over 4600 pieces. I usually go for Star Wars UCS sets like this 5195 piece, 3' x 2' beast:-
(https://img.bricklink.com/SL/10179-1.jpg)
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When I first got my GTD it struggled to get over 400 miles per tank, but as I put more miles on it it started to get slightly better up to about 450 per tank on a good run.
I'm actually quite surprised how good my R is on fuel, my average tank range is about 320-330, but last week we had a few long journeys and I think i got 370 miles :grin:
In saying that if you fancy changing then just do it mate, life's to short :wink:
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I know exactly what you mean about diesel power delivery - for a few weeks after I got the R, it felt alien to wring it's neck to get the most out of it, rather than just being able to put your foot down in the gear you're already in to get that burst you need to get from 60-80 reasonably quickly, or just dropping from 6th to 4th to get from 50 to 80mph very quickly. I usually get 3 or 4 opportunities on my commute to fly off a roundabout or sliproad from 20 to 80, and I enjoy every single one of them. I do change gear far more often in the R than Iever did in the GTD.
Other hobbies? I'm a big Lego fan, which can be pricey in it's own right, but the huge sets that give a sense of achievement and look impressive as a display piece are usually worth more than you paid for them a year or 2 after they retired, when used (they're worth silly money unopened). Right now i'm halfway through one of these:-
I remember you saying about your Lego collection before - a good investment and worth more than gold (as you well know).
Before I moved house my wife spent literally weeks (she doesn't have a proper job so has lots of time on her hands) sat on the floor sifting through the kids old Lego sets as we had a whole load of first edition Harry Potter sets. We used to buy them when Boots did 3for2 promotions before Xmas then sell the surplus sets.
Obviously at the time we had absolutely no idea the Harry Potter sets were first edition, they were just kids toys we bought as Xmas gifts; but they sold for very strong money on eBay once SWMBO had finished her marathon session of sifting through boxes and boxes of sets, getting all the parts and assembling them for photos and checking they were 100% complete. Mind you if you put the hours in as labour rates she's was probably only on about 10p an hour! The boys did ok out of it though, they put the money into premium bonds.
We sold dozens of sets and the ones we didn't sell because they were incomplete we put into a massive job lot that sold for over £100. As it included a lot of the original boxes I think the box I ended up posting it all in was about 4ft high and a couple foot across. The people that bought our house saw it when they came to view as it was awaiting the courier to collect it, they asked what it was and were absolutely gutted when we told them it was full of Lego as they had a five or six year old son.
I kept a load of Star Wars figures as little keepsakes.
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When I first got my GTD it struggled to get over 400 miles per tank, but as I put more miles on it it started to get slightly better up to about 450 per tank on a good run.
I'm actually quite surprised how good my R is on fuel, my average tank range is about 320-330, but last week we had a few long journeys and I think i got 370 miles :grin:
In saying that if you fancy changing then just do it mate, life's to short :wink:
My R is doing mostly town work but when I do take it out on the open road it's so hilly where I live it still won't get 30mpg on a trip this time of year. I'm going to take it on a few longer journeys this coming week to see how it fares. Not that the fuel mileage is very important to me as I cover a low mileage.
I think I just need a few challenges with the R to get it how I want it, maybe a nav retrofit and another set of wheels. Not that I need a nav, it's just the challenge of cracking the fitment and getting it for less than the factory charge. And not that I need more wheels as I already have three sets... :whistle:
And more mid-range torque - that's what I really need.
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I get to use the extra 116PS about 0.00% of my commute.
Probably about 1% of my entire annual driving.
I'm getting old, I can't be arsed to rev the engine hard anymore - I like zippy and fun without doing the big speeds.
The trouble with tuning boxes on the R is that the peak figures on the graphs look to be quite high in the range where as with a Diesel the power and torque is slap bang where you're going to use it.
The downside of a tuned Diesel is that it feels really powerful at first, like you're driving a big torquey V8 then all of a sudden you run out of revs!!! Is there a happy medium? Maybe I need a V8 in my life.
Maybe I just need a different hobby instead of playing around with cars? Knitting?
I know exactly what you mean about diesel power delivery - for a few weeks after I got the R, it felt alien to wring it's neck to get the most out of it, rather than just being able to put your foot down in the gear you're already in to get that burst you need to get from 60-80 reasonably quickly, or just dropping from 6th to 4th to get from 50 to 80mph very quickly. I usually get 3 or 4 opportunities on my commute to fly off a roundabout or sliproad from 20 to 80, and I enjoy every single one of them. I do change gear far more often in the R than Iever did in the GTD.
Other hobbies? I'm a big Lego fan, which can be pricey in it's own right, but the huge sets that give a sense of achievement and look impressive as a display piece are usually worth more than you paid for them a year or 2 after they retired, when used (they're worth silly money unopened). Right now i'm halfway through one of these:-
(http://cdn1-www.comingsoon.net/assets/uploads/2015/11/gb-lego-header.jpg)
Just over 4600 pieces. I usually go for Star Wars UCS sets like this 5195 piece, 3' x 2' beast:-
(https://img.bricklink.com/SL/10179-1.jpg)
I have an old lego set with a couple of metal vw bettles in it hadn't seen it for years and forgot they done a few metal cars to go with the sets years ago :grin:
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Well, where do I start?
Or if you have the space buy a tank and fill it. I have nearly 4000 litres of diesel at the back of my garage.
That reply doesn't give the impression that you may possibly not be quite your average Joe at all.
A 4000 litre tank would be bigger than my entire garden.
A postage stamp is nearly bigger than my garden come to think of it. I'm not big on gardening by the way
It's an 8,000 litre thank actually but it is just under half full. You would be surprised how small the thank is compared to what you would think it would be.
I got the tank, full of diesel(not red in case anyone was thinking) in exchange for floor and wall tiles that cost me nothing because I got them almost free from my brother who is a tile importer.
It is all boxed in so you would never know it was even there.
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Well, where do I start?
Or if you have the space buy a tank and fill it. I have nearly 4000 litres of diesel at the back of my garage.
That reply doesn't give the impression that you may possibly not be quite your average Joe at all.
A 4000 litre tank would be bigger than my entire garden.
A postage stamp is nearly bigger than my garden come to think of it. I'm not big on gardening by the way
It's an 8,000 litre thank actually but it is just under half full. You would be surprised how small the thank is compared to what you would think it would be.
I got the tank, full of diesel(not red in case anyone was thinking) in exchange for floor and wall tiles that cost me nothing because I got them almost free from my brother who is a tile importer.
It is all boxed in so you would never know it was even there.
A curious story! Unfortunately I'm not in a position to do deals like that but it must be pretty handy. I think 8000 litres would last me a good few years. It sure must beat hanging round draughty forecourts.
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Well, where do I start?
I get to use the extra 116PS about 0.00% of my commute.
Probably about 1% of my entire annual driving.
I'm getting old, I can't be arsed to rev the engine hard anymore - I like zippy and fun without doing the big speeds.
The trouble with tuning boxes on the R is that the peak figures on the graphs look to be quite high in the range where as with a Diesel the power and torque is slap bang where you're going to use it.
The downside of a tuned Diesel is that it feels really powerful at first, like you're driving a big torquey V8 then all of a sudden you run out of revs!!! Is there a happy medium? Maybe I need a V8 in my life.
I respect my R but I don't love it. I love driving it though! It just feels like an extraordinary powerful but very normal Golf - which in itself is a massive testament to the engineering that tames the power (and indeed the power itself).
Maybe I just need a different hobby instead of playing around with cars? Knitting?
Most likely I'll end up keeping the R a few years and mapping it nearer the end of the warranty, possibly adding some retrofits along the way as a bit of a project.
You're not getting old, but maybe a bit lazy? Come on! you can still really enjoy the R, and love it. Please don't go to the dark side. Think about the pollution. Most of the driving I do, a GTD would be more than adequate, but then so would a base model Golf.
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I just don't get chance to wring the neck of the car Ant.
I'm used to low revving luggers and get just as much enjoyment from a huge slug of torque at 2000rpm to blast out of bends with than I ever did with having to hit 6000rpm plus.
The GTI is a good compromise as it hits peak power and torque at low revs where the R needs to be worked a lot more. Ultimately "more rewarding" I'll grant you in a heartbeat, but quick point to point times living in the West Country and being mindful of traffic and speed limits then low speed torque suits me far better.
I'm good with lazy. I'm a time honoured insomniac so spend most of my life feeling jet lagged at best. My insides seem to be disintegrating too so energy levels tend to be quite low.
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I just don't get chance to wring the neck of the car Ant.
I'm used to low revving luggers and get just as much enjoyment from a huge slug of torque at 2000rpm to blast out of bends with than I ever did with having to hit 6000rpm plus.
The GTI is a good compromise as it hits peak power and torque at low revs where the R needs to be worked a lot more. Ultimately "more rewarding" I'll grant you in a heartbeat, but quick point to point times living in the West Country and being mindful of traffic and speed limits then low speed torque suits me far better.
I'm good with lazy. I'm a time honoured insomniac so spend most of my life feeling jet lagged at best. My insides seem to be disintegrating too so energy levels tend to be quite low.
You've just described me almost exactly!
Do you have the other half of my amulet by any chance ? :laugh:
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I just don't get chance to wring the neck of the car Ant.
I'm used to low revving luggers and get just as much enjoyment from a huge slug of torque at 2000rpm to blast out of bends with than I ever did with having to hit 6000rpm plus.
The GTI is a good compromise as it hits peak power and torque at low revs where the R needs to be worked a lot more. Ultimately "more rewarding" I'll grant you in a heartbeat, but quick point to point times living in the West Country and being mindful of traffic and speed limits then low speed torque suits me far better.
I'm good with lazy. I'm a time honoured insomniac so spend most of my life feeling jet lagged at best. My insides seem to be disintegrating too so energy levels tend to be quite low.
I'm the same, I hate getting up in the morning, feel tired and stressed all day, but for me this makes it even more important knowing I will be looking forward to driving something that can put a smile on my face.
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I sort of get where you are coming from Ex as my Scirocco had shed loads of low down oomph compared to the Pirelli with the K04 and you could easily get caught napping, it is a bit similar in the R but not to the same extent as the 35/Pirelli
The irony with the Scirocco was i always felt short changed when it ran out of puff after 5K so never gave the sense of engagement when you rung its neck. This was what annoyed my on the 7 GTI I had on loan was it was so good I felt i was being robbed of tome end
My sensible head with the M2 coming was to have a GTD but I just can't let the R go and have come to the conclusion my Polo isn't exactly great on fuel around town
What you need to do is get up early on a Sunday, shove the DSG into manual and have a proper drive over some nice roads, I did on Saturday and had a huge grin
Next it will be pipe and slippers for Christmas
Maybe we need a Southerly R meet where we can all have a good hoon to get there
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I'm well ready for pipe and slippers.
Mind you I was just heading home from a trip to Cornwall the other evening when a slight slip of my accelerator saw me accidentally (honest your honour) fly off the line at a set of traffic lights, a couple of miles from my house, putting a rather overly eager young pretender back a couple of car lengths. I'll put it down to being in great need of a pee.
Anyway, I got home and by the time I'd unpacked my bags from the boot there was a text message from a friend saying "tut, tut, at your age Andrew, car sounded good though!"
Yep, I'd been spotted by a colleague heading home late in the evening - there's no privacy in this world!
As for the getting up early on a Sunday thing, I don't need to do that as I work shifts so tend to take the car for an occasional blast to clear out the pipes a bit. Even at 4AM on unrestricted roads I tend to keep it very sensible though hence why I often think I'd be better off with something where the power band is much lower in the rev range.
My Revo'd mk6 had all the power I'd ever need but was a little too eager to blow dump valves and spin wheels. I used to use a Bluefinned mk6 too that was much more civilised than the Revo car but sometimes just a little too civilised maybe? The mk7 GTI with tuning box was somewhere in between the two of those but again the power wasn't quite in the right place to make the most of it every day. Somewhere out there is the perfect blend.
The 7R has the grip but just needs more low end torque to really make it perfect for me.
Maybe I'm an RS3 type of guy at heart but I'd not pay north £40k for a small hatchback no matter how nice it sounds.
I just wish they'd do a 1.0 or 1.2 TSI UP! GT - charismatic 3 cylinder turbo, wheel at each corner and no weight...
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As an ex GTD driver who currently has an R I think you'd be mad to go the other way. The GTD is a decent car and it is very good on the motorway, but for my day-to-day driving it proved to be rather frustrating. It lacks refinement and although it handles well it just never felt like a fun car to drive quickly, largely because of the diesel powertrain. If anything it encourages you to drive more sedately and with economy in mind.
For a while I tried to convince myself that these were good things, but in the end the lure of 300hp in a Golf was too much to resist. The R is a great car that is compromised by poor economy, whereas the GTD is a good car that in reality doesn't really excel in any area.
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Thanks for that Andrew, an excellent reply and interesting thoughts.
The only real answer I have to that is if I did get a GTD at any point the first thing i'd want to do to that Diesel power train would be to unleash another 40 or 50 lb ft of torque.
Yes, the R would be far quicker still when in full fat mode but the GTD would then have an element of fun that could be exploited at sensible speeds.
The standard R is just a bit too polished for it to be much fun unless you're really "on it".
If you're really "on it" you're doing illegal speeds within seconds.
I'm just a lover of low end torque so I can just rapidly waft!
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Bloody Hell Mr Ex! Your recent posts have got me nearly sobbing in despair! I'm pretty sure you are the same age as me, we are old but not that old. Forget your pipe and slippers, forget GTD, plenty of time for both of those later....much later. Go and thrash your R, and I don't mean Fawlty Towers style. :laugh:
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Get a box on it and it will have more torque than a GTD 👌
My jag is fine for the work commutes but god it's boring!!!
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reading this is a bit like watching supervet, so sad
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reading this is a bit like watching supervet, so sad
It's breaking my heart.
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Get a box on it and it will have more torque than a GTD 👌
My jag is fine for the work commutes but god it's boring!!!
The box doesn't really do much until higher up the rev range, plus the one I had on the GTI wore down the battery.
reading this is a bit like watching supervet, so sad
It's breaking my heart.
Well, there's too much traffic going in the other direction trading 'up' to R's so it's good to look at the alternatives in life; faster isn't always better for the daily grind when you want something sharp and nippy in the cut and thrust rather than something that needs a bit of winding up before it goes ballistic.
When I look back at the twenty odd cars I've owned in the past it's not the quickest ones that I remember most fondly - just the more charismatic ones, and being Volkswagens mostly the charisma sometimes needs to be assisted via the aftermarket as VW's have a justified reputation for being a tad dull at times.
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Is this a serious thread? Having owned a GTD, GTI & R why would anyone in their right mind want a GTD over an R if they're the same price?
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reading this is a bit like watching supervet, so sad
It's breaking my heart.
Well, there's too much traffic going in the other direction trading 'up' to R's so it's good to look at the alternatives in life; faster isn't always better for the daily grind when you want something sharp and nippy in the cut and thrust rather than something that needs a bit of winding up before it goes ballistic.
When I look back at the twenty odd cars I've owned in the past it's not the quickest ones that I remember most fondly - just the more charismatic ones, and being Volkswagens mostly the charisma sometimes needs to be assisted via the aftermarket as VW's have a justified reputation for being a tad dull at times.
I do appreciate it's not all about speed. I personally do find the R sharp and rapid for the cut and thrust. I probably spend about 70% of my driving life in those conditions and the car doesn't disappoint on that score, not for me anyway. To me it offers the best of all worlds, and perhaps some of it comes down more to personal driving style?
But I understand what you mean about the charismatic being more memorable, albeit with the aid of a few aftermarket tweaks. Maybe the R is just too accomplished out of the box and doesn't really lend itself to customisation in the way that other VW's do, or have in the past. So perhaps a VW with a slightly different character to the R is in order. GTD already on your radar, but maybe the Clubsport is the car you are looking for? A more bubbly personality and (hopefully) with plenty of potential to put your own mark on it, and turn it into a more charismatic prospect?
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I don't get much choice (company car and both GTI and R are too polluting for company policy) but over the years I quite like the low down grunt of a TDI... especially a powerful TDI engine in a small(ish) car.
If it was my own money though I'm not sure I'd have one though, unless I was doing some serious mileage and wanting to save some money.
My friend's GTI PP is a lovely thing.
R's start to push things into the "fun toy" arena though - both through running costs and reduced practicality.
I'm really not sure what I would buy with my own £35k, it does depend on whether you want a practical mode of transport, a fun toy or a p3n1s extension...
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Is this a serious thread? Having owned a GTD, GTI & R why would anyone in their right mind want a GTD over an R if they're the same price?
Well, as you ask, not exactly a serious thread as I don't tend to post serious threads or take much seriously in general when it comes to internet forums but it was a 'food for thought' idea highlighting the fact that all out BHP isn't everything in a road car. 300 bhp at 6000 rpm or 400 lb ft at 2000 rpm and I'd probably take that latter, thank you, please.
One man's meat and all that.
I'd half hoped that there would be a lone voice or two that came out with a left field slant on the subject but alas not.
reading this is a bit like watching supervet, so sad
It's breaking my heart.
Well, there's too much traffic going in the other direction trading 'up' to R's so it's good to look at the alternatives in life; faster isn't always better for the daily grind when you want something sharp and nippy in the cut and thrust rather than something that needs a bit of winding up before it goes ballistic.
When I look back at the twenty odd cars I've owned in the past it's not the quickest ones that I remember most fondly - just the more charismatic ones, and being Volkswagens mostly the charisma sometimes needs to be assisted via the aftermarket as VW's have a justified reputation for being a tad dull at times.
I do appreciate it's not all about speed. I personally do find the R sharp and rapid for the cut and thrust. I probably spend about 70% of my driving life in those conditions and the car doesn't disappoint on that score, not for me anyway. To me it offers the best of all worlds, and perhaps some of it comes down more to personal driving style?
But I understand what you mean about the charismatic being more memorable, albeit with the aid of a few aftermarket tweaks. Maybe the R is just too accomplished out of the box and doesn't really lend itself to customisation in the way that other VW's do, or have in the past. So perhaps a VW with a slightly different character to the R is in order. GTD already on your radar, but maybe the Clubsport is the car you are looking for? A more bubbly personality and (hopefully) with plenty of potential to put your own mark on it, and turn it into a more charismatic prospect?
Yes Ms B, as I've said many a time, the R is just a little too polished to be charismatic but not that easy to mod owing to TD1's, suspect turbo components and worse still - locked ECU's.
Guess which one bothers me most?
The ClubSport was my intended 'next car' choice when I bought the mk7 GTI as it's release would coincide with my first mk7 being 3 years old but as soon as I saw it I just knew that it was unlikely to happen. Then there's the not so slight issue of putting the power down.
Unless something happens to the R that makes me want to move it on I can see it being a keeper, there are a few little things I'd like to do to it in time.
I don't get much choice (company car and both GTI and R are too polluting for company policy) but over the years I quite like the low down grunt of a TDI... especially a powerful TDI engine in a small(ish) car.
If it was my own money though I'm not sure I'd have one though, unless I was doing some serious mileage and wanting to save some money.
My friend's GTI PP is a lovely thing.
R's start to push things into the "fun toy" arena though - both through running costs and reduced practicality.
I'm really not sure what I would buy with my own £35k, it does depend on whether you want a practical mode of transport, a fun toy or a p3n1s extension...
£35k??? Eek! I'd not spend that on a Golf! Once you're north of £30k I think there's a lot more out there.
Cars are just getting stupidly expensive.
The GTI PP is a good place to put your money right now with current incentives and the best blend of the Golf range in real terms - high 30's MPG on 95RON and the power delivery is almost Diesel like in some respects with the plus side of petrol smoothness and willingness to rev. I loved my GTI but it was a 3 door so I couldn't get in and out of it very easily once it was in the garage and more importantly I was concerned about modifying it.
I wouldn't put the R in fun toy category either, it's too polished for that but it's as capable performer as most fun toys to be honest.
Mind you, with a remap and some tasty wheels it would be as good as most things out there.
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Well, as you ask, not exactly a serious thread as I don't tend to post serious threads or take much seriously in general when it comes to internet forums but it was a 'food for thought' idea highlighting the fact that all out BHP isn't everything in a road car. 300 bhp at 6000 rpm or 400 lb ft at 2000 rpm and I'd probably take that latter, thank you, please.
One man's meat and all that.
I'd half hoped that there would be a lone voice or two that came out with a left field slant on the subject but alas not.
No, I get what you are saying, absolutely. If it was as simple as that choice, I'd go with the grunt too as in real world legal use of power, its definitely the better option IMHO.
However of course oil burners come with their own special set of "features", from poor fuel economy from cold to needing to be careful about the DPF regen. Its not suitable for every owner and thats for sure.
Having said that, I'm busy tweaking the spec for the replacement for my GTD.... another GTD!
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You do have a very valid reason to go from GTD to GTD fredgroves, but it's a testament to the car that you're likely to get another.
So, what are you likely to do different with GTD #2?
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Probably choose:
Manual (because of BIC)
5 door (because of company policy)
Colour.... jury is still out but not LSG!
DCC - have it now, love it
NavPro - have it now and MIB2 is finally much better... feel a bit gutted it didn't work as advertised the first time tho. Probably chuck appconnect with it for giggles.
Lane Assist - have HBA but Lane Assist gives me a better package with dynamic lighting
DynAudio - because its cheap with the NavPro now and I've always thought standard audio lacking
S&S - well, maybe... I like the idea :) Again had they been able to tell me back then what it did, I'd have spec'ed it then.
My current GTD has been the best car I've had. Full stop. Maybe thats more to do with the stuff I've had before, but I can't think of anything better I can afford/have. Its not an endless list of options when you start to drill into car choices with a handful of caveats.
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Probably choose:
Manual (because of BIC)
5 door (because of company policy)
Colour.... jury is still out but not LSG!
DCC - have it now, love it
NavPro - have it now and MIB2 is finally much better... feel a bit gutted it didn't work as advertised the first time tho. Probably chuck appconnect with it for giggles.
Lane Assist - have HBA but Lane Assist gives me a better package with dynamic lighting
DynAudio - because its cheap with the NavPro now and I've always thought standard audio lacking
S&S - well, maybe... I like the idea :) Again had they been able to tell me back then what it did, I'd have spec'ed it then.
My current GTD has been the best car I've had. Full stop. Maybe thats more to do with the stuff I've had before, but I can't think of anything better I can afford/have. Its not an endless list of options when you start to drill into car choices with a handful of caveats.
When will the order go in? If it's not for a while then you might end up with a facelifted version. Whether the facelift improves it or detracts is anyone's guess at the moment though - assuming the FL applies to all models and not just the rather anonymous looking standard Golfs.
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Probably not able to order for 6 months... but I am trying to get them to order it ASAP as the 5 month wait is a killer :-/
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I just wish they'd do a 1.0 or 1.2 TSI UP! GT - charismatic 3 cylinder turbo, wheel at each corner and no weight...
You and your wishes....
1.0T up! is arriving in the summer:
"It delivers truly dynamic performance with a top speed of 185 km/h, and takes just 10 seconds to accelerate to 100 km/h. This up! even strives to match the driving performance of the first Golf GTI. Its dynamism is paired with high efficiency: 4.4 l/100 km (equating to 102 g/km CO2*/*forecast value) mean that the up! 1.0 TSI can cover up to 800 km on a single tank of fuel."
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Photo?
:grin:
Nice one jv
:afro:
Just add remap and whoooooosh!
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Up! GTI was a serious missed opportunity and would make ideal daily hack
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I hope they've uprated the suspension.... and brakes!
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It's not a GTI unfortunately. These are your trim level options:
take up!
move up!
high up!
piss up!
cross up!
e-up!
Can also get a well sick yo BeatsAudio setup. Dynaudio just ain't cool with the up! target market.
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You missed the Eh-UP!
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With VW these days, more like a f**k Up!
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Few photos of the up! facelift here — http://www.autobild.de/artikel/vw-up-facelift-genf-2016-vorstellung-und-sitzprobe-8638331.html
I've been planning on buying one for a while now as a family run around so will likely wait for this one to arrive. The 1.0T sounds like an interesting engine for it.
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Few photos of the up! facelift here — http://www.autobild.de/artikel/vw-up-facelift-genf-2016-vorstellung-und-sitzprobe-8638331.html
I've been planning on buying one for a while now as a family run around so will likely wait for this one to arrive. The 1.0T sounds like an interesting engine for it.
It's crying out for a 150ps engine (1.4TSI?), a proper successor to the Lupo GTI, which was a hoot to drive. I wish i'dbought myself one years ago, rather than paying almost the same price for a Polo 1.9TDI.
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The 1.0T should remap pretty well!
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Is this a serious thread? Having owned a GTD, GTI & R why would anyone in their right mind want a GTD over an R if they're the same price?
Well, as you ask, not exactly a serious thread as I don't tend to post serious threads or take much seriously in general when it comes to internet forums but it was a 'food for thought' idea highlighting the fact that all out BHP isn't everything in a road car. 300 bhp at 6000 rpm or 400 lb ft at 2000 rpm and I'd probably take that latter, thank you, please.
One man's meat and all that.
I'd half hoped that there would be a lone voice or two that came out with a left field slant on the subject but alas not.
I understand your angle completely. The R is an amazing car and I love mine, but for me, filling up every 4 days, inability to use the power and the harder ride on poor country roads means it's not the right car for me during the week, but an oil burner is not the right car for the weekend. I want to keep both the Jag and R, but I'm not sure the wife is going to be happy at the amount of money I'm spending monthly on cars lol
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Exonian, I'm not sure quite how down or to the left you are, but if you are ever happen to be in South Wales you would be welcome to drive my car and see how you find the GTD/DTUK/S&S/good tyres combo!
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Thanks ffrank, a kind offer and indeed yours would be pretty much my ideal spec too.
The clue to my whereabouts is my username, hence the vague description (my usual poor attempt at humour) in my location row in my bio. It'd be a bit dull to list the area twice.
Lack of imagination when choosing my username I'm afraid!
I'm very down and reasonably very left too - sunny Devon