GolfGTIforum.co.uk
Model specific boards => Golf mk7 => Topic started by: Exonian on 07 January 2015, 05:25
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So there I was having a chat to a sales guy about nothing in particular after I'd popped in to order a touch up stick as I have one tiny mark that's bugging me (as they do).
I was just telling him I'd had a couple of drives in white GTDs recently and was impressed (as we were stood by a white one at the time).
"We've got a late 2014 pre reg over there that needs clearing from stock, we've just dropped it £5k"
At that point my eyes opened quite widely and it went to take a look.
White paint plus basic nav being the only options.
Now, I bought my GTI in a spec I wanted, and added the service pack expecting to keep it at least 3 years until the Edition 40 hit the road.
The R doesn't really appeal to me (but I'd have leased one at the cheapo deal prices if I'd been in the poison to) as I seldom use more than 4000 revs anyway as I generally have passengers on board.
So that GTD lacks a few toys I'd want but financially speaking it's already dropped most of its first year depreciation and has five doors too (I got a 3 door for vanity reasons as I preferred the styling but it has been a minor pain in the botty).
He's offered me a fair price on the GTI to boot.
Help!
Yes, the GTI is nippy and revvy but I love the GTD torque kick on a manual car too (you seem to feel it less in a DSG), and there's always the option of a Trevor at a later date...
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You need a Trevor, transforms the car! Missing mine a lot (my dad now has it), but my logic was that i'll appreciate the R more having an extra 116ps vs an extra 60ps and significantly less torque. my mpg is definitely worse without the Trevor (was getting an indicated 47mpg on my commute with an actual 43mpg, now it's like indicated 41mpg/actual 40mpg and more regens to boot.
Did you get a look at the tyres? I do hope they weren't Bridgestones, I really should have got shot of those on day one, they ruin the car's potential. I bet my car couldn't crack 0-62 in 8.5s with those on.
I'm buying the R purely to scratch an itch after 7 new TDIs in a row, and my GTD feels so sterile in its standard form vs my old Scirocco 170TDI, with the addition of Bridgestone tramping frustrations.
If these new fuel prices are going to be around for a while (and with US fracking online as well as the global will to punish Russia's economy right now, I can't see us going back over $70 a barrel for years), I think that the petrol option will be appealing to more people.
Without a Trevor i'd say don't do it, with a Trevor it's a real possibility to think about - i'd rather have a Trevored GTD than a standard GTI, but right now i'd rather have the R than either of them.
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I was just thinking this week how awesome the gearbox is in the GTD, the combination really is a pleasure to drive (and when I say drive I don't mean sitting in traffic!)
The torque is brilliant, and the engine revs much freer than previous diesels I've driven. It's just a great overall package.
As Monkeyhanger says, Trevor is probably a must have one day. I still haven't taken the leap, as the GTD is definitely fast enough for me, but I will one day as it does sound incredible to drive. First service in a couple of months so might add it after that..
Comparing to the GTI is definitely trickier, and your situation an intriguing one! I chose the GTD based on overall costs, but didn't feel like I was compromising as I love the diesel style of driving. I don't remember all the figures, but based on the improved depreciation, fuel and tax, I was saving £100 a month or so over the GTI.
In your situation although you will pocket savings on running costs (unless you were only doing very short journeys!) I don't know if you will be making savings on ownership, based on how your cars are financed, and if you are losing out in the overall early trade in.
So it (probably) comes down to, what you fancy! If you fancy the GTD, I would say go for it. It's an awesome car, and probably slightly more of a wolf in sheeps clothing than the GTI - which may explain why a 1.2 Colt kept trying to race me last night :rolleyes:
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Are you currently sitting with two pencils up your nose and a pair of underpants on your head repeatedly saying wibble?? :grin:
I can't see the sense in this to be honest. Would you be having to pay additional pennies to swap?
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stick with the GTI :)
stay away from the R, it will corrupt you, i drove mine for the first time in two weeks and forgot how good it was :grin:
ask yourself this do you want to be a person who looks around at the fuel station for the derv gloves :)
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stick with the GTI :)
stay away from the R, it will corrupt you, i drove mine for the first time in two weeks and forgot how good it was :grin:
ask yourself this do you want to be a person who looks around at the fuel station for the derv gloves :)
+ 1 - :grin:
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I can't say I have ever got diesel anywhere other than inside the fuel tank :huh:
(http://i.imgur.com/qpE96E0.jpg)
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Andy, you've got that itch again. Control it if you can, dear bean.
BTW what is a Trevor?
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Perhaps this song might convince you to stick with the GTI:
Ode to the GTi by Sir Cliff Richard
Words adapted by am1w
When I was young my father said
"Son I have something to say",
And what he told me I'll never forget
Until my dyin' day.
He said, "Son you are a GTi boy,
And that's the way to stay,
Son, you be a GTi boy until your dyin' day".
When I was sixteen I fell in love
With a girl as sweet as could be.
But I remembered just in time
What my daddy said to me.
He said, "Son you are a GTi boy,
And that's the way to stay.
Son, you be a GTi boy until your dyin' day."
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Sounds like you know the answer, keep the GTI.
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I'll probably be the only person on here to say that you don't need a Trevor to make the gtd a better driving car. It's great in standard form.
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Need more info really...
When you say they have 'dropped the price by 5k" is that 5k off full retail?
The GTD is late 2014 - how many miles?
When was your GTI registered?
Will you need to put money in to do this?
How much lower are the monthlies (if you are buying that way)
What options are you going to have to learn to live without if you take the GTD?
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Perhaps this song might convince you to stick with the GTI:
Ode to the GTi by Sir Cliff Richard
Words adapted by am1w
Cliff Richard? I should think that's a nail in the coffin for the GTI...
Get a GTD, GTD owners hate Cliff :D
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Andy, you've got that itch again. Control it if you can, dear bean.
BTW what is a Trevor?
It's a DTUK tuning box for the GTD, "Trevor" was the code name Andy from DTUK used when allowing me to trial the new box. It transformed the GTD, but very subtle about it - loads more torque and power, but done in a very tidy and linear way (unlike another box I tried), it was epic, and now my dad is reaping the benefits. :angry:
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Sorry Exonian but you must have lost the plot. :D
Don't change your GTI for a GTD it makes no logical sense at all. I can understand the people who changed to the R (even though they took a massive hit in the pocket) I can understand people who changed for a BMW M135I or Audi S3.
GTD owners were all complaining about their MPG and combined with diesel being more expensive per litre than petrol it's a bit of a false economy.
You're losing the limited slip diff, higher revving, better sounding, faster car for a little bit of better economy and paying for it.
Don't do it.
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Have to agree with the GTI owners on this (sorry GTD guys), only reason I could see to do this would be if you have all of a sudden switched to doing 30k+ miles a year ! I've just hit 16k in 6 months of ownership and get an indicated 52-53mpg long term (with a Trevor) so probably more like 50mpg (which I'm happy with considering the grunt !). If I were under 20k a year I would give my right arm for a GTI PP or R !
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Sorry Exonian but you must have lost the plot. :D
Don't change your GTI for a GTD it makes no logical sense at all. I can understand the people who changed to the R (even though they took a massive hit in the pocket) I can understand people who changed for a BMW M135I or Audi S3.
GTD owners were all complaining about their MPG and combined with diesel being more expensive per litre than petrol it's a bit of a false economy.
You're losing the limited slip diff, higher revving, better sounding, faster car for a little bit of better economy and paying for it.
Don't do it.
How can it be false economy when you get nearly 20 miles per gallon more from a gtd than you do from a gti. I don't remember gtd people complaining about mpg's other than it didn't get what was claimed from vw but neither does the gti oh and the gti isn't any faster in real terms over the gtd. I've only done 10k in my gtd since September 13 and the only issue I've got is the size of the boot :grin:
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How can it be false economy when you get nearly 20 miles per gallon more from a gtd than you do from a gti. I don't remember gtd people complaining about mpg's other than it didn't get what was claimed from vw but neither does the gti oh and the gti isn't any faster in real terms over the gtd. I've only done 10k in my gtd since September 13 and the only issue I've got is the size of the boot :grin:
Agreed, I'm very happy with my since new mpg of 48mpg (8000 miles of mixed driving and plenty of welly). I've probably saved around £400 on fuel on that mileage.
I still don't think it's crazy to move from a GTI to a GTD, needs and desires change. There's a few on here who have gone from high performance petrol's to GTD's quite happily.
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You should always consider depreciation in there too. For the whole package, the GTI was going to cost me more than £110 a month on average over 3 years than having a GTD, with only 11k miles PA.
Some would be happy to forego that extra money for marginally better performance, but in that case i'd rather have the R as the better residuals more than cover the extra fuelling costs over a GTI, and go some way into eating into the extra purchase cost - with a bigger performance gap between it and the GTI than the GTI has over the GTD.
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Exonian - where are you?
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Exonian - where are you?
Sitting back with popcorn? :)
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You wont be getting a radically different car, so other than the economy improvement there isn't much point.
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Perhaps this song might convince you to stick with the GTI:
Ode to the GTi by Sir Cliff Richard
Words adapted by am1w
When I was young my father said
"Son I have something to say",
And what he told me I'll never forget
Until my dyin' day.
He said, "Son you are a GTi boy,
And that's the way to stay,
Son, you be a GTi boy until your dyin' day".
When I was sixteen I fell in love
With a girl as sweet as could be.
But I remembered just in time
What my daddy said to me.
He said, "Son you are a GTi boy,
And that's the way to stay.
Son, you be a GTi boy until your dyin' day."
Those are the words I needed to hear! Thanks Asker!!! :grin: :grin: :grin:
Exonian - where are you?
Sorry! Had a hellish few days working silly long hours but I'm here and admiring all the responses right now!
Well what can I say; thanks for all the opinions, advice, words of wisdom and most of all the p!ss taking (without which it just wouldn't be worth getting out of bed in the morning!)
I've taken a couple of cold showers now to calm my eagerness and thankfully being frantically busy at work has diluted my thoughts over the last few days.
In answer to various things put to me and in no particular order:
I don't owe anything on the GTI as I had a few coppers tucked down the back of the sofa so decided I'd put some of 'our' house moving fund to better use and bought the GTI before my darling wife cleaned out everything when we moved house.
The GTD would need a few grand throwing at it as my car is only worth about £19k now according to CAP despite having a very low mileage thanks to said house move meaning I hardly went anywhere this year and my other old runabout has been used as a mobile skip so had been doing all the mileage (probably hence why I needed a new battery at the grand age of 12 months).
My GTI is about 15 months old now so hardly an old rattler but with the 'new' GTD being pretty cheap for what it is I'd kind of hoped it would depreciate less in the next 12-18 months than my GTI and I'd probably also use it a lot more as to be honest my GTI has been an expensive and very dusty ornament lately.
The only options on the GTD is the poverty but still overpriced nav but my GTI was hardly specced to the hilt as I just put on it cheaper options aside from the PP to minimise depreciation - so RVC and 'miracle parking' are the only options aside from poverty nav.
And to Andy Wigit: :grin: :grin: :grin: funnily enough as all of our work vehicles need the Diesel glove treatment and I still often use them for my petrol cars as the whole pump areas are often smeared with the yucky oily stuff. Ewwww! So I keep a load of Diesel gloves (borrowed from work) in my car as it is!
I'll whisper the next bit quietly Your R isn't quite standard and I wouldn't mind betting a standard one wouldn't set your world on fire! :laugh:
Anyway, keep the abuse coming everybody as I'm still thinking about it!
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as it needed a service the R was flashed back to stock at the beginning of December, it corrupts in the way it goes about its business, actually not as shabby stock as i remember :grin:
i thought you'd been looking for a pipe and slippers given you'd be trading in the driving loafers
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:grin: :grin: :grin:
I'm very much in pipe and slippers mode these days and have given in to old age!
mind you when my dear friend and colleague took me out in his hired GTD DSG a few weeks ago and overtook three cars in a row it rather woke me up to the fact that the GTD has the power and torque right where you need it and kind of reminded me of the wise words a racing driver said to me as I sat cowering in the passenger seat of a 360bhp Cupra going round Castle Combe: "You just can't use this performance on the road and you're far better off in a quick Diesel as a road car"
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Sorry Exonian but you must have lost the plot. :D
Don't change your GTI for a GTD it makes no logical sense at all. I can understand the people who changed to the R (even though they took a massive hit in the pocket) I can understand people who changed for a BMW M135I or Audi S3.
GTD owners were all complaining about their MPG and combined with diesel being more expensive per litre than petrol it's a bit of a false economy.
You're losing the limited slip diff, higher revving, better sounding, faster car for a little bit of better economy and paying for it.
Don't do it.
How can it be false economy when you get nearly 20 miles per gallon more from a gtd than you do from a gti. I don't remember gtd people complaining about mpg's other than it didn't get what was claimed from vw but neither does the gti oh and the gti isn't any faster in real terms over the gtd. I've only done 10k in my gtd since September 13 and the only issue I've got is the size of the boot :grin:
Because my average MPG is 35 and I drive with a lead foot and I have even managed 57MPG on a motorway run. (I have the pic to prove) Cracking 40MPG in the GTI is easily done without even trying on the motorway. Factor in that diesel is almost 10p more a litre and the difference isn't great. I know because I used to drive a diesel!
How is the GTI not faster than the GTD in real terms? They are both front wheel drive, the diesel is heavier and the GTI cracks it to 60 in 6.3 secs over the GTD doing it in 7.3 seconds due to being at a 50BHP disadvantage.
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How is the GTI not faster than the GTD in real terms? They are both front wheel drive, the diesel is heavier and the GTI cracks it to 60 in 6.3 secs over the GTD doing it in 7.3 seconds due to being at a 50BHP disadvantage.
Some of that 1s disadvantage is due to being unable to put that power and torque down from standstill, add Quattro to an A3 with the same TDI engine and you lose 0.7s off the 0-62 time. That's not to say the GTI wouldn't gain on it's 0-62 time with 4WD traction, but I doubt it would gain as much. The in gear differences are less noticeable, but still there. The GTD is as quick in gear as the MK6 GTI in the higher gears, but not quite as quick as the MK7 (the extra torque it got has probably given it more edge than the 10ps increase). There's only around 20kg in it weight wise, i'd hardly consider it relevant when a PP adds 14Kg, DSG adds 16Kg and 5 doors adds 34kg - a 5 door DSG PP GTI can weigh 44Kg more than a 3 door GTD manual.
Pulling away quickly from a static start is where you'll see the clear advantage of the GTI, in gear differences not so much, and the GTDs in gear grunt is easier to access - you'll have to push the GTI harder to beat the GTD.
If I already had a perfectly fine GTI, i'd personally be reluctant to swap prematurely for a GTD, the additional depreciation hit of chopping in early will bit into those mpg savings and petrol is so cheap now.
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How is the GTI not faster than the GTD in real terms? They are both front wheel drive, the diesel is heavier and the GTI cracks it to 60 in 6.3 secs over the GTD doing it in 7.3 seconds due to being at a 50BHP disadvantage.
Some of that 1s disadvantage is due to being unable to put that power and torque down from standstill, add Quattro to an A3 with the same TDI engine and you lose 0.7s off the 0-62 time. That's not to say the GTI wouldn't gain on it's 0-62 time with 4WD traction, but I doubt it would gain as much. The in gear differences are less noticeable, but still there. The GTD is as quick in gear as the MK6 GTI in the higher gears, but not quite as quick as the MK7 (the extra torque it got has probably given it more edge than the 10ps increase). There's only around 20kg in it weight wise, i'd hardly consider it relevant when a PP adds 14Kg, DSG adds 16Kg and 5 doors adds 34kg - a 5 door DSG PP GTI can weigh 44Kg more than a 3 door GTD manual.
Pulling away quickly from a static start is where you'll see the clear advantage of the GTI, in gear differences not so much, and the GTDs in gear grunt is easier to access - you'll have to push the GTI harder to beat the GTD.
If I already had a perfectly fine GTI, i'd personally be reluctant to swap prematurely for a GTD, the additional depreciation hit of chopping in early will bit into those mpg savings and petrol is so cheap now.
Where do you get all these stats from? You must have far too much time on your hands. :grin: :grin:
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CraigW: Yes, I have lots of time on my hands. More stats on the German VW site than our own. :whistle:
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If I already had a perfectly fine GTI, i'd personally be reluctant to swap prematurely for a GTD, the additional depreciation hit of chopping in early will bit into those mpg savings and petrol is so cheap now.
Ahh, there's reluctant and there's dismissing it as lunacy!
If the GTD was coming with a £5k discount then that's an awful lot of the first year depreciation gobbled up so therefore there are quite a few costs to be balanced up and fuel economy isn't one of the main ones. The fuel economy advantage for me would be gobbled up quickly as I do a lowish annual mileage and therefore the first service would wipe that out as my GTI is on a service plan.
There are other factors to consider such as general lower running costs, potentially better resale value, and insurance, additional tank range and the fact I quite like quick TDI's once they've been fettled with a little (the power spread is in the right rev band for road use without thrashing the car - I'm not a 0-60 sprinter).
So a lowish cost GTD kept for a shortish time is being factored into more long term plans...
It was just a thought, going from an unplanned conversation with a guy in a suit with not too much to do at the time...
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Ahh, there's reluctant and there's dismissing it as lunacy!
If the GTD was coming with a £5k discount then that's an awful lot of the first year depreciation gobbled up so therefore there are quite a few costs to be balanced up and fuel economy isn't one of the main ones. The fuel economy advantage for me would be gobbled up quickly as I do a lowish annual mileage and therefore the first service would wipe that out as my GTI is on a service plan.
There are other factors to consider such as general lower running costs, potentially better resale value, and insurance, additional tank range and the fact I quite like quick TDI's once they've been fettled with a little (the power spread is in the right rev band for road use without thrashing the car - I'm not a 0-60 sprinter).
So a lowish cost GTD kept for a shortish time is being factored into more long term plans...
It was just a thought, going from an unplanned conversation with a guy in a suit with not too much to do at the time...
Remember you can get a brand new one registered this year for £3500 discount from a broker. So in effect they are giving you a £1.5k discount and allowing you to skip the queue but no option on colour / model and extras.
I don't know by how much having the car registered last year and you being the second owner would eat into that £1.5k discount come time to move it on? Plus remember being second owner might affect your insurance if something was to happen to it in the first year.
Just some thoughts.
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Very good thoughts they are too P3.
The insurance issue wasn't something I'd considered for sure (I'd never be that sensible!)but on the flip side of a pre-reg's value is that the part ex offer was for top book where as with a broker that might not be so.
Extras aren't something that I'm overly bothered about as my time spent in the car isn't that high so I'd pick resale value over spec.
The car is well specced as standard.
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I hardly go over 2.5- 3k revs myself so i say to myself why do i need a GTI, i could get by with a tdi or GTD but i know spring is on the way and my window will be down a bit and i won't here than horrible noisey vibrating diesel engine and just now and again when it's safe i'll give it some beans up to 6.5k and remember why i bought a GTI. Diesels are for vans and company cars.
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I hardly go over 2.5- 3k revs myself so i say to myself why do i need a GTI, i could get by with a tdi or GTD but i know spring is on the way and my window will be down a bit and i won't here than horrible noisey vibrating diesel engine and just now and again when it's safe i'll give it some beans up to 6.5k and remember why i bought a GTI. Diesels are for vans and company cars.
That's more like it - a bit of "emotive"!!!
You're right, pass me an R32.
Mind you, there's always the option of the Sport and Sound pack and keeping the windows closed...
:grin:
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How is the GTI not faster than the GTD in real terms? They are both front wheel drive, the diesel is heavier and the GTI cracks it to 60 in 6.3 secs over the GTD doing it in 7.3 seconds due to being at a 50BHP disadvantage.
Some of that 1s disadvantage is due to being unable to put that power and torque down from standstill, add Quattro to an A3 with the same TDI engine and you lose 0.7s off the 0-62 time. That's not to say the GTI wouldn't gain on it's 0-62 time with 4WD traction, but I doubt it would gain as much. The in gear differences are less noticeable, but still there. The GTD is as quick in gear as the MK6 GTI in the higher gears, but not quite as quick as the MK7 (the extra torque it got has probably given it more edge than the 10ps increase). There's only around 20kg in it weight wise, i'd hardly consider it relevant when a PP adds 14Kg, DSG adds 16Kg and 5 doors adds 34kg - a 5 door DSG PP GTI can weigh 44Kg more than a 3 door GTD manual.
Pulling away quickly from a static start is where you'll see the clear advantage of the GTI, in gear differences not so much, and the GTDs in gear grunt is easier to access - you'll have to push the GTI harder to beat the GTD.
If I already had a perfectly fine GTI, i'd personally be reluctant to swap prematurely for a GTD, the additional depreciation hit of chopping in early will bit into those mpg savings and petrol is so cheap now.
I'd be interested to see the 20- 60 mph, 30 - 70, 30 - 80mph times etc between them and not just in 1 gear, ie the fastest way possible as in gear 1 gear just means its easier to drive. I doubt the GTD would win any as long as the GTI driver knows what gear to be in. I'm happy to be proven wrong tho, any videos anywhere ?
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I hardly go over 2.5- 3k revs myself so i say to myself why do i need a GTI, i could get by with a tdi or GTD but i know spring is on the way and my window will be down a bit and i won't here than horrible noisey vibrating diesel engine and just now and again when it's safe i'll give it some beans up to 6.5k and remember why i bought a GTI. Diesels are for vans and company cars.
That's more like it - a bit of "emotive"!!!
You're right, pass me an R32
Perfect as petrol hits £1 a litre aswell :smiley:
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That's more like it - a bit of "emotive"!!!
You're right, pass me an R32.
Mind you, there's always the option of the Sport and Sound pack and keeping the windows closed...
:grin:
Lol. I am actually frequently impressed with the tractor-less sounds of the GTD, and any tractory tones are completely taken away by the S&S pack. Windows down, sunroof open, pretty cool for a diesel :whistle:
I'd be interested to see the 20- 60 mph, 30 - 70, 30 - 80mph times etc between them and not just in 1 gear, ie the fastest way possible as in gear 1 gear just means its easier to drive. I doubt the GTD would win any as long as the GTI driver knows what gear to be in. I'm happy to be proven wrong tho, any videos anywhere ?
Here's the only one I've seen, they have some fun round the track around 4mins. Turning the English subtitles on is hilarious, apparently the GTI "sends me no fool, and when you change anything there is a binding site on the sea yet", which is a good quote for a future VW ad in my opinion.
Edit - I think the guy in that review surmises very well:
(http://i.imgur.com/hRqNNlB.jpg)
same spirit people, but Exonian, do you want more people to happen!?
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All things considered - tell them you will need 20k for your GTi and if that works for them you will pick the GTD up next week - that should get them thinking!
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I have to admit iv'e never driven a mk7 GTD but i was next to one but behind by the exhaust and it sounded quite nice, ( i presume sound pack) but only on tickover. I just can't imagine on full chat at 4k (yea 4k remember that Exonian) it will sound anything like nice. When i imagine a diesel engine sound at 4k, its like someone just stood on my grave.
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So Carl1 having never driven a gtd you're passing comment on them being tractors etc etc. Try driving one first and then tell us what you think.
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So Carl1 having never driven a gtd you're passing comment on them being tractors etc etc. Try driving one first and then tell us what you think.
Yes i am regarding the sound, it's not like i'm saying I don't like playing football on Mars i don't like the playing surface.
I'm not having a go at GTD owners either, but at the end of the day it's a diesel and they are not as refined as a petrol. I'm just trying to convince someone not to change a GTI to a GTD unless they did big miles. I considered one myself but i couldn't get one cheaper than i got my GTI PP and i may get one in the future but i wouldn't swop a 18 month old GTI for one, i'd wait until the next model.
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Some sound for you Carl1 :) sounds a lot better in person than this video, but gives you an idea.
http://youtu.be/9OqRKMyINnc
As for refinement, the diesel is whisper quiet when cruising. I may be wrong but I think the GTD has more sound proofing then the GTI to help with this, either way its very hushed.
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Some sound for you Carl1 :) sounds a lot better in person than this video, but gives you an idea.
http://youtu.be/9OqRKMyINnc
As for refinement, the diesel is whisper quiet when cruising. I may be wrong but I think the GTD has more sound proofing then the GTI to help with this, either way its very hushed.
Not sure if it's that, or just that a cruising diesel is quieter than a cruising petrol anyway - as it's sitting at lower revs doing what it's doing. If you look at the back of the brochure, they've got the GTD a few db lower than a GTI.
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Some sound for you Carl1 :) sounds a lot better in person than this video, but gives you an idea.
http://youtu.be/9OqRKMyINnc
As for refinement, the diesel is whisper quiet when cruising. I may be wrong but I think the GTD has more sound proofing then the GTI to help with this, either way its very hushed.
Yeah that sounds decent but i could stick a box on the other half's TDI and stick a camera on it at the back and you won't hear the engine and it would sound ok. Whats it like up front? i bet it's a different story and i don't want to hear a Vw speaker :smiley:
P.s im not saying the GTi sound great either :smiley:
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D0Rt6s1YaCk (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D0Rt6s1YaCk)Or their's this one :grin:
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If I already had a perfectly fine GTI, i'd personally be reluctant to swap prematurely for a GTD, the additional depreciation hit of chopping in early will bit into those mpg savings and petrol is so cheap now.
Ahh, there's reluctant and there's dismissing it as lunacy!
If the GTD was coming with a £5k discount then that's an awful lot of the first year depreciation gobbled up so therefore there are quite a few costs to be balanced up and fuel economy isn't one of the main ones. The fuel economy advantage for me would be gobbled up quickly as I do a lowish annual mileage and therefore the first service would wipe that out as my GTI is on a service plan.
There are other factors to consider such as general lower running costs, potentially better resale value, and insurance, additional tank range and the fact I quite like quick TDI's once they've been fettled with a little (the power spread is in the right rev band for road use without thrashing the car - I'm not a 0-60 sprinter).
So a lowish cost GTD kept for a shortish time is being factored into more long term plans...
It was just a thought, going from an unplanned conversation with a guy in a suit with not too much to do at the time...
There wont be much between the cars in terms of costs overall.
Sounds like you might be after a waft-mobile, maybe 530d?
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D0Rt6s1YaCk (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D0Rt6s1YaCk)Or their's this one :grin:
They don't sound amazing, but they are most definitely better than that.
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Sounds like you might be after a waft-mobile, maybe 530d?
Having spent a bit of time with a 335d x-drive I'd say that despite my utter respect for the thing it wasn't my cup of tea. It absolutely destroyed straight sections of road but corners... Not so good.
My other car is an old school GTI and it has to be said I do like a very agile front driver as despite me not being into high revving engines I so like to blast through the twisties a bit.
I can appreciate a good wafter but I'm
All about smallish, lightish and quickish.
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Monsieur Ex
It was only a few weeks back you were saying, having rediscovered driving the gti, that you'd forgotten just how good it was. Both gtd and gti great cars, but unless your regular mileage has suddenly increased, it seems a little fanciful to make the switch.
Why not just relax and enjoy your gti for a while, until you finally decide to get the R :tongue: :grin:
I don't think you're quite at the full pipe and slippers stage yet, maybe just approaching the top of that slope :kiss:
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I have to admit iv'e never driven a mk7 GTD but i was next to one but behind by the exhaust and it sounded quite nice, ( i presume sound pack) but only on tickover. I just can't imagine on full chat at 4k (yea 4k remember that Exonian) it will sound anything like nice. When i imagine a diesel engine sound at 4k, its like someone just stood on my grave.
You most definitely will have heard a sound-pack one if you preferred it to your GTI at idle.
You're completely backwards in your perception of sound vs revs - at a tickover (on a normal GTD) you will hear the characteristic diesel rattle (albeit quieter than some marques - the BMW 2.0td unit has more of an idle rattle), at 4k revs you won't, it'll sound pretty much like the GTI - a 4cyl 16v 2ltr turboed car (diesel or petrol) from the same manufacturer is going to sound pretty much the same at 4k revs unless the exhaust is significantly different between the 2. Once you get past around 1600rpm, the diesel "clatter" is gone from the engine note.
In Normal mode (without Soundaktor), the R under high load sounded pretty much like my GTD under high load (the turbo whine was a little different) when I was on my 2nd test drive of the R.
I'd suggest you stop imagining something upon which to base an opinion and find out before passing comment. :tongue:
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Monsieur Ex
It was only a few weeks back you were saying, having rediscovered driving the gti, that you'd forgotten just how good it was. Both gtd and gti great cars, but unless your regular mileage has suddenly increased, it seems a little fanciful to make the switch.
Why not just relax and enjoy your gti for a while, until you finally decide to get the R :tongue: :grin:
I don't think you're quite at the full pipe and slippers stage yet, maybe just approaching the top of that slope :kiss:
Ahh, madamoiselle B, such soothing words to ease away my (car) woes.
What's this talk of an R though? Surely that's just the modern day equivalent of a Cavalier 1.6L now that they cost tuppence to hire for couple years?
I must make a confession with my rekindled love of GTIness in mind: I've only used the darn thing a few times to do 2.5 miles in traffic since the beginning of December.
Hand me an extension lead and the order form for an electric UP!
Eeee up lad/lass!
Now for a nice cup o' Yorkshire tea whilst I puff on me pipe...
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I have to admit iv'e never driven a mk7 GTD but i was next to one but behind by the exhaust and it sounded quite nice, ( i presume sound pack) but only on tickover. I just can't imagine on full chat at 4k (yea 4k remember that Exonian) it will sound anything like nice. When i imagine a diesel engine sound at 4k, its like someone just stood on my grave.
You most definitely will have heard a sound-pack one if you preferred it to your GTI at idle.
You're completely backwards in your perception of sound vs revs - at a tickover (on a normal GTD) you will hear the characteristic diesel rattle (albeit quieter than some marques - the BMW 2.0td unit has more of an idle rattle), at 4k revs you won't, it'll sound pretty much like the GTI - a 4cyl 16v 2ltr turboed car (diesel or petrol) from the same manufacturer is going to sound pretty much the same at 4k revs unless the exhaust is significantly different between the 2. Once you get past around 1600rpm, the diesel "clatter" is gone from the engine note.
In Normal mode (without Soundaktor), the R under high load sounded pretty much like my GTD under high load (the turbo whine was a little different) when I was on my 2nd test drive of the R.
I'd suggest you stop imagining something upon which to base an opinion and find out before passing comment. :tongue:
So are you saying at GTD sounds as good as a GTI from 1600rpm upwards, ( not that the GTI sounds great) windows down and i wouldn't know i was driving a diesel. Wow they have improved since the mk6. I have seen a few drive past me when iv'e been walking and i must say iv'e always known they are a GTD before iv'e noticed they haven't got the exhausts either side. I will try and test drive one with the windows down and rev it and not cruise as my 16 year old diesel van sounds ok once i'm upto speed and cruising, if i get time mind you and i would like for my totaly wild imagination of what a diesel engine sounds like at 4k to be proven wrong, i seriously would , no joke.
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From 1600rpm and up there is not a lot of difference with the soundaktors off (in normal mode on both - very similar displacement, same general engine architecture (valve and cylinder configuration), direct cylinder injection (which used to be a purely diesel thing) and the use of a timing chain (rather than a belt) on the TSI gives it a little bit of a clatter at low engine speeds. If you hadn't noticed, petrols are getting more diesel-like in the technology employed on them.
As diesels go, the 2.0TDI unit sounds pretty sweet (far less rattly at or close to idle than a 2.0 BMW unit), whereas the 2.0TSI unit doesn't sound remarkably good (hard to make an inline 4cyl engine sound good next to a 6 or 8 cylinder engine) - a good reason for the soundaktor fitment on both. Once you get away from the idle clatter, they sound very similar and at cruising speed the GTD will be quieter than the GTI, only doing 2200rpm to maintain 80mph in 6th.
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I know my what your saying and im not surprised GTD's are quieter at cruising and both my previous ed30/35 sounded a bit diesel on tickover but my MK7 doesn't in the slightest, but i'm on about fast acceleration with the windows down a fair bit, i can't help but think the GTD would sound a bit harsh up front, a lot more harsh then a petrol.
I hadn't driven a petrol for a couple of years before my current car, you just get used to diesels they're everywhere without even realizing it and you become immune to them. Then i bought my car and was like wow it's just so smooth, almost like a V8 in comparison to diesels. I'd forgotten what half decent revy petrols were like and maybe you will feel the same when you get your R or maybe i will not feel the same once i drive a GTD :cool:
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Still, if I didn't have a GTI to dispose of, there's always deals like these around:
http://www.centralukvehicleleasing.co.uk/vehicle/choose_your_lease/57649/volkswagen/golf/20_tdi_gtd_5dr.html
:shocked:
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They all look good on 5000 mpa in pov spec.
I don't know what that outfits excess mileage charges are.
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6p + VAT I think.
Poverty spec on a gtd ain't exactly stingy though.
Throw the options onto one you've bought with your own cash and watch the pennies roll down the drain.
You can put the options list onto a lease car too and equally flush the lot down the toilet.
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Every rep and his dog has a Deisel golf :wink: keep the GTI and enjoy the smoother refinement.
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*whispers* I think you should just wait for the RS3 ;)
No on a serious note. It's not worth changing to a GTD. It's changing just for the sake of it. I'm sure it's a great car but so is the GTI. If you want to get out the car so badly then I'd just wait for some more used examples to come on the market and choose sonething a bit different.
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I hope the original poster doesn't mind me posting on this thread for similar advice. :huh:
I currently own a good spec 3dr Manual GTi with few toys, I bought this car before I got married and now me and the wife are expecting our first child in July.
Work wise I am not doing a big commute but may soon be travelling further, approx. 90 miles per day.
Would moving to a 5dr DSG GTD be a good move?
I was also considering the BMW 335d Saloon xdrive Msport Auto.
Is the boot of a Golf MK7 big enough for child requirements?
Cheers :)
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Is the boot of a Golf MK7 big enough for child requirements?
I would say yes, on the basis that when I was a nipper, the five of us and the family collie dog used to travel the country in a Mini 1000...
In all seriousness, it should be, assuming you buy an appropriately size pram, travel cot and the like...
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Would moving to a 5dr DSG GTD be a good move?
I was also considering the BMW 335d Saloon xdrive Msport Auto.
Is the boot of a Golf MK7 big enough for child requirements?
Cheers :)
Golf boot should be ok. Depends on how much baby stuff you wish to carry. Some parents even carry the kitchen sink!
The BMW 335d xDrive M Sport Auto is an amazing car and in a different league to the VW Golf GTD. Drive one and you will be smitten. And if you want RWD, try the BMW 330d sDrive M Sport Auto. Also pretty phenomenal. You'll have no space issues with either one of these and they are extremely fuel efficient.
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*whispers* I think you should just wait for the RS3 ;)
No on a serious note. It's not worth changing to a GTD. It's changing just for the sake of it. I'm sure it's a great car but so is the GTI. If you want to get out the car so badly then I'd just wait for some more used examples to come on the market and choose sonething a bit different.
:grin:
I'll whisper back *buggered if I could afford one anyway!*
It's not that I hate the GTI, conversely I love it!
It was more that particular deal in post 1 that opened my eyes to a potentially good deal with a similarly performing car and a slightly different experience over the short term.
Plus I must confess I didn't expect the thread to drag on for page after page and I'll admit that, as is so often the case with me, I posted up the thread being a bit tongue in cheek as it had been dull as hell on here for a few weeks.
The deal from post 1 just ain't going to happen.
And to 2014GTI: yes the boot is big enough in the Golf if you (as above, sound advice) buy sensibly. And remember the parcel shelf comes out and you can easily store a pram on its side freeing up more space for bags.
The 335d is pretty awesome though! Just remember it's no GTI
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Andy, you should get a BMW or a Golf 7R.
The 335d has clocked 0-60mph in 4.5s
My 330d has clocked 0-60mph in 5.2s.
The M135i has clocked 0-60mph 4.5s.
The Golf R DSG has clocked 0-60mph 4.5s (Top Gear).
These are seriously fast cars.
What's not to like? And besides, a car is never fast enough.
Come-on dear chap. Go for one of the above.
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And besides, a car is never fast enough.
I hear that - I'll probably be lusting after a Cayman once i've had my R a while, but the total costs of owning and running the R will probably be as much as i'd currently like to be spending without it eating into the holiday budget etc. It's a big money jump to anything that'll comprehensively spank the R, you get a lot of car for your money.
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They are some great cars AM1W but due to the massive lead time on the R (which is now up to 6-8 months) then I wouldn't consider any of them.
I would wait to see what the Motor Show's offer this year, starting with Detroit. 2015 is going to be a phenomenal year for cars.
Just to mention a few new 2015 models;
Audi RS3
Ford Focus RS
Golf R400
Honda Civic Type R
Mini Cooper S
In my opinion these cars look to be quite exciting and the new Focus RS is rumoured to be very competively priced. I'm considering changing marque this year for a bit of change.
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Monsieur Savage:
The facelift M135i will be out soon. It takes just 4 weeks from order to delivery to get one of these! Probably the last of RWD hatchbacks. A collector's car in the making?
Regarding making the R even faster, I'll most probably REVO it through my dealership. It will be a very economical way to get 0-60mph in 3.7s! Now that is fast enough for me.
Regarding Ford, Honda and Mini, they are a no-no for me. Audi, maybe, but I hate the grille with a vengeance. So it will probably be back to BMW for me as a last hurrah! Looks like the BMW M2 is on the cards.
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And besides, a car is never fast enough.
I hear that - I'll probably be lusting after a Cayman once i've had my R a while, but the total costs of owning and running the R will probably be as much as i'd currently like to be spending without it eating into the holiday budget etc. It's a big money jump to anything that'll comprehensively spank the R, you get a lot of car for your money.
The Cayman is a great car, a brilliant drive but is too impractical for me.
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Monsieur Savage:
The facelift M135i will be out soon. It takes just 4 weeks from order to delivery to get one of these! Probably the last of RWD hatchbacks. A collector's car in the making?
Regarding making the R even faster, I'll most probably REVO it through my dealership. It will be a very economical way to get 0-60mph in 3.7s! Now that is fast enough for me.
Regarding Ford, Honda and Mini, they are a no-no for me. Audi, maybe, but I hate the grille with a vengeance. So it will probably be back to BMW for me as a last hurrah! Looks like the BMW M2 is on the cards.
In July 2016 the M135i (320 bhp) may be replaced by an M140i (350 bhp)
http://www.autoevolution.com/news/exclusive-2015-bmw-1-series-lci-will-get-new-range-of-engines-87506.html
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Monsieur Savage:
The facelift M135i will be out soon. It takes just 4 weeks from order to delivery to get one of these! Probably the last of RWD hatchbacks. A collector's car in the making?
Regarding making the R even faster, I'll most probably REVO it through my dealership. It will be a very economical way to get 0-60mph in 3.7s! Now that is fast enough for me.
Regarding Ford, Honda and Mini, they are a no-no for me. Audi, maybe, but I hate the grille with a vengeance. So it will probably be back to BMW for me as a last hurrah! Looks like the BMW M2 is on the cards.
July 2016 may the M135i (320 bhp) replaced by an M140i (350 bhp)
http://www.autoevolution.com/news/exclusive-2015-bmw-1-series-lci-will-get-new-range-of-engines-87506.html
But only if it comes with xDrive (highly unlikely :cry:), and it still might not be as quick as a REVO Golf R.
http://www.revotechnik.com/product-details/software/volkswagen/golf-vii/181/stage-1/#.VLQjHkvyHIV
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AM1W;
I agree. The BMW M135I is a brilliant car. I've had a few journeys in my friends, the only thing that puts me off is how back end happy they are on a slightly wet road which is of course down to the RWD. A great machine for throwing around the corners sideways though! :laugh:
The main thing that appeals to me about the new Audi RS3 (which i'm seriously considering as my next motor) is that it has that magnificent 2.5l 5 Cylinder turbocharged engine which is not only highly tuneable but also sounds fantastic due to the brilliant 1-2-4-5-3 firing sequence :cool: Which in my opinion is the only thing the current 2L 4 Cylinders lack, that ability to have a nice deep growl.
So atleast 367 alleged BHP, 343LBFT Torque, 4.3 Seconds 0-62MPH combined with Quattro AWD with a top speed of 174MPH when you ask the guys at Audi nicely to remove the limiter. Not to mention again that it sounds great and the sky is pretty much the limit when it comes to tuning these things. It's the full package.
What's not to like? :laugh:
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Monsieur Savage:
When will the horsepower wars ever end?
I might just have to put a stop to it and get an Up! :smiley:
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I used to get all the baby junk in much smaller cars than a mk7...it was a long time ago and I guess it depends how much baby junk you have... If you avoid the range rover sized off road buggy, it might fit.... Or you could always buy a transit.
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AM1W;
I agree. The BMW M135I is a brilliant car. I've had a few journeys in my friends, the only thing that puts me off is how back end happy they are on a slightly wet road which is of course down to the RWD. A great machine for throwing around the corners sideways though! :laugh:
The main thing that appeals to me about the new Audi RS3 (which i'm seriously considering as my next motor) is that it has that magnificent 2.5l 5 Cylinder turbocharged engine which is not only highly tuneable but also sounds fantastic due to the brilliant 1-2-4-5-3 firing sequence :cool: Which in my opinion is the only thing the current 2L 4 Cylinders lack, that ability to have a nice deep growl.
So atleast 367 alleged BHP, 343LBFT Torque, 4.3 Seconds 0-62MPH combined with Quattro AWD with a top speed of 174MPH when you ask the guys at Audi nicely to remove the limiter. Not to mention again that it sounds great and the sky is pretty much the limit when it comes to tuning these things. It's the full package.
What's not to like? :laugh:
It really is a great sound, there's a depth to it that the Inline 4 cannot make.
Have you heard it with a decat? :cool:
L6 also nice.
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Andy, you should get a BMW or a Golf 7R.
The 335d has clocked 0-60mph in 4.5s
My 330d has clocked 0-60mph in 5.2s.
The M135i has clocked 0-60mph 4.5s.
The Golf R DSG has clocked 0-60mph 4.5s (Top Gear).
These are seriously fast cars.
What's not to like? And besides, a car is never fast enough.
Come-on dear chap. Go for one of the above.
The one thing I never look at are 0-60 times as the only thing they reflect is how high the engine can rev!
Give me 50-70 times in top gear, that's what sets the men out from the boys in the performance stakes for a road car.
I like a car that can accelerate up a steep hill in top gear, that's a true measure of useable performance to me, 0-60 is just for forum talk and Santa Pod RWYB junkies.
On West Country hills you need low end torque not BHP!
Unless you're into Jap cars that have motorbike style power deliveries and like going everywhere in second gear...
So to the Golf R - that's a definite possibility at some point when one comes up at the right price to change. But alas it would always be a car I admired for its technical prowess rather than actually loved.
The 135i is something you could love. But It's not for me. Having driven one it will always be remembered as one of those few cars that actually made me laugh as I drove it but it lacks that ingredient X for me. A one trick Pony, it'll never win the Ballon D'Or in the car stakes but it's got bags of character. If I could afford to run one and another decent car then I'd buy one in a flash.
The 3 series BMW's are just far too big for me. I've had a very memorable run out in a 335d X-drive and will always take my hat off to one when I see it. Phenomenal performance and reasonable economy but it's a motorway bruiser or better still an Autobahn one, it won't take bends and roundabouts like a GTI despite the extra traction out of the corners.
Which leaves us with a Golf GTI.
Or a GTD.
Two cars that have ingredient X and tend to over-perform when viewed as a whole package.
At least they suit my needs best, being fairly discreet but well respected and cost sensible sums to run, both easily tuneable if the mood suits and... need I say more!
I'm happy to be in the minority!
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Stick with the GTI lol, you could argue it drives in a Diesel-ish manner with a small turbo picking up early delivering a torquey response but the top end lacking a little (Still has more to give than the GTD) compared to the petrol models with a larger turbo.
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On West Country hills you need low end torque not BHP!
Thats where the GTI is great, the torque in the MK7 GTI (350NM) is nearly the same as the GTD (380NM) but it comes in earlier in the GTI (1,500-4,600 rpm) than the GTD (1,750-3,250 rpm)
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On West Country hills you need low end torque not BHP!
Thats where the GTI is great, the torque in the MK7 GTI (350NM) is nearly the same as the GTD (380NM) but it comes in earlier in the GTI (1,500-4,600 rpm) than the GTD (1,750-3,250 rpm)
Indeed, the power is available over a wider band.
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I think vw have the torque band slightly wrong on the gtd as it still pulls past the 3250rpm they suggest.
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I think vw have the torque band slightly wrong on the gtd as it still pulls past the 3250rpm they suggest.
I think Max power is around 3500? But the torque does seem to drop from 3250 pretty sharply on dynos. Has anyone played with best rpm to change gear? I wonder where the dsg changes in sport?
Compared to the GTI, I'm not sure if the GTI has a wider torque band as remember we only rev to 4000 (can't remember where the red line is)! What does the GTI rev to?
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My GTD pulls strongly to about 3800rpm (it tails off a little bit from 3500, not massively), and has completely run out of puff at 4500 - red line is 5000rpm. Getting the best out of it keeps the revs above 2500 when you've changed up.
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I think vw have the torque band slightly wrong on the gtd as it still pulls past the 3250rpm they suggest.
I think Max power is around 3500? But the torque does seem to drop from 3250 pretty sharply on dynos. Has anyone played with best rpm to change gear? I wonder where the dsg changes in sport?
Compared to the GTI, I'm not sure if the GTI has a wider torque band as remember we only rev to 4000 (can't remember where the red line is)! What does the GTI rev to?
The GTI happily revs to 7200 RPM up to the hard red line before changing up in the DSG and the torque kicks in very low in the revs and holds strong.
Poached;
Yes I have and a milltek is the first upgrade I'd invest in on an Audi RS3 as it sounds superb. :)
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I think i need some sense talking into me too.. I'm getting itchy feet for a Touareg R Line! There is a nearly new one available at a decent price to me atm and i'm very very tempted!! :drool: :undecided:
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I think i need some sense talking into me too.. I'm getting itchy feet for a Touareg R Line! There is a nearly new one available at a decent price to me atm and i'm very very tempted!! :drool: :undecided:
You could be on a slippery slope there Jim. The Touareg is on the borderline of owning a people carrier. Nothing says more than "I've giving up on life" then seeing a man driving a people carrier :laugh: :whistle:
Stick with the Golf R
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I think i need some sense talking into me too.. I'm getting itchy feet for a Touareg R Line! There is a nearly new one available at a decent price to me atm and i'm very very tempted!! :drool: :undecided:
Awesome! The Toerag (sorry, it's the best autocorrect would allow me) is a mean bit of kit with a f*ck off big Diesel engine in it and R Line looks smart.
Let me know what garage it is if you buy it as I'll chop my GTI in against your R :grin: :grin: :grin:
Mind you, I was looking at S1's (ex-demo) last night... :whistle:
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I think i need some sense talking into me too.. I'm getting itchy feet for a Touareg R Line! There is a nearly new one available at a decent price to me atm and i'm very very tempted!! :drool: :undecided:
Awesome! The Toerag (sorry, it's the best autocorrect would allow me) is a mean bit of kit with a f*ck off big Diesel engine in it and R Line looks smart.
Let me know what garage it is if you buy it as I'll chop my GTI in against your R :grin: :grin: :grin:
Mind you, I was looking at S1's (ex-demo) last night... :whistle:
My Mrs has got an A1 1.4 CoD S-line black edition DSG. Really lovely cars, quite fun but a little bit to much torque steer for my liking. I'm certainly going to be looking at swapping this for the S1 when the current A1 deal is up in a couple of years. She will never know its really for me! :laugh:
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I think i need some sense talking into me too.. I'm getting itchy feet for a Touareg R Line! There is a nearly new one available at a decent price to me atm and i'm very very tempted!! :drool: :undecided:
Oh please, please Mr Moderator don't get a Toerag. How about a BMW X3/X5 instead. Some great deals available.
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I think i need some sense talking into me too.. I'm getting itchy feet for a Touareg R Line! There is a nearly new one available at a decent price to me atm and i'm very very tempted!! :drool: :undecided:
Oh please, please Mr Moderator don't get a Toerag. How about a BMW X3/X5 instead. Some great deals available.
But not an X5 similar to the one that came through from South Shields to pick up our old washing machine last week after I put it on Freecycle - when it rolled up I thought Katie Price must be on the bones of her arse needing my 13 year old Bosch Maxx.....it was bright glittery hot pink, custom paint job I assume? And it was a lad driving it.
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I think i need some sense talking into me too.. I'm getting itchy feet for a Touareg R Line! There is a nearly new one available at a decent price to me atm and i'm very very tempted!! :drool: :undecided:
Oh please, please Mr Moderator don't get a Toerag. How about a BMW X3/X5 instead. Some great deals available.
But not an X5 similar to the one that came through from South Shields to pick up our old washing machine last week after I put it on Freecycle - when it rolled up I thought Katie Price must be on the bones of her arse needing my 13 year old Bosch Maxx.....it was bright glittery hot pink, custom paint job I assume? And it was a lad driving it.
:grin: :grin:
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Jokes aside Mr Moderator. An Audi SQ5 is a pretty good car as is the BMW X3. But have pity on us and yourself and don't get a Toerag. Pretty please?
Or, how about an R Hearse?
Prams will fit in these cars nicely and your lady can even have twins!
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got to admit the A1 and S1 left me a bit cold, someone said they thought a more door S1 would suit me as a daily but when i priced one up i may as well have a Golf R, i think they also made a mistake on the S1 in not making a dsg version, its a glorified Polo so never going to be up there in the handling stakes, love my Polo but drivers car it is not, all be it the manual is a peach
keep the GTI its a great car
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I've read a few reviews saying the S1 suffers a bit of torque steer which surprised me.
Mind you a bit of driving fun usually comes at the expense of an ultimately polished performer.
The S1 is a bit pricey but looking at some ex-demos with sensible spec some aren't too bad. And to me the manual is a blessing, I just drive too many different vehicles during the week to get used to DSG properly in a car I seldom use.
No, my GTI will most likely stay with me for a good while yet.
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Jokes aside Mr Moderator. An Audi SQ5 is a pretty good car as is the BMW X3. But have pity on us and yourself and don't get a Toerag. Pretty please?
Or, how about an R Hearse?
Prams will fit in these cars nicely and your lady can even have twins!
The SQ5 is a nice car tbh but one in the same price range will be too old and have too many miles on for my liking, i'd love the R estate but it's anyones guess when it will make an apperance?? :sad: i've been a fan of the Touareg since they started doing the R line package and they're pretty well specced as standard really.
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The Touareg is a cracking tow car. You could buy a caravan too. Lovely.
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The Touareg is a cracking tow car. You could buy a caravan too. Lovely.
Caravan club here i come!! :grin:
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So which do you think I should go for next providing I don't stick with the GTi for the time being (can I cope with a baby & 3dr?)
Golf GTD DSG 5dr with options & discount = approx. £29k
BMW Saloon 335D X-Drive M-Sport Auto with options and discount = approx. £35k
Mmmmm :rolleyes:
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So which do you think I should go for next providing I don't stick with the GTi for the time being (can I cope with a baby & 3dr?)
Golf GTD DSG 5dr with options & discount = approx. £29k
BMW Saloon 335D X-Drive M-Sport Auto with options and discount = approx. £35k
Mmmmm :rolleyes:
The 335D every day of the week - cracking car! :smiley:
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So which do you think I should go for next providing I don't stick with the GTi for the time being (can I cope with a baby & 3dr?)
Golf GTD DSG 5dr with options & discount = approx. £29k
BMW Saloon 335D X-Drive M-Sport Auto with options and discount = approx. £35k
Mmmmm :rolleyes:
The 335D every day of the week - cracking car! :smiley:
I am swinging this way..... :smiley:
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So which do you think I should go for next providing I don't stick with the GTi for the time being (can I cope with a baby & 3dr?)
Golf GTD DSG 5dr with options & discount = approx. £29k
BMW Saloon 335D X-Drive M-Sport Auto with options and discount = approx. £35k
Mmmmm :rolleyes:
The 335D every day of the week - cracking car! :smiley:
Agreed.... but expect it to corner like a 19th century sailboat :laugh:
Only joking of course..... but the handling would be a compromise in comparison to a hot hatch
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got to admit the A1 and S1 left me a bit cold, someone said they thought a more door S1 would suit me as a daily but when i priced one up i may as well have a Golf R, i think they also made a mistake on the S1 in not making a dsg version, its a glorified Polo so never going to be up there in the handling stakes, love my Polo but drivers car it is not, all be it the manual is a peach
keep the GTI its a great car
I didn't realise that the S1 is only manual. My Mrs loves auto's now she's been spoilt with the DSG in her A1. The S1 would be a no for me then on that basis.
However, I'm sure they will eventually bring out a DSG version?
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got to admit the A1 and S1 left me a bit cold, someone said they thought a more door S1 would suit me as a daily but when i priced one up i may as well have a Golf R, i think they also made a mistake on the S1 in not making a dsg version, its a glorified Polo so never going to be up there in the handling stakes, love my Polo but drivers car it is not, all be it the manual is a peach
keep the GTI its a great car
I didn't realise that the S1 is only manual. My Mrs loves auto's now she's been spoilt with the DSG in her A1. The S1 would be a no for me then on that basis.
However, I'm sure they will eventually bring out a DSG version?
Polo GTI, the new 1.8 variant (not the hugely unreliable twin-charge 1.4) - available with 7 speed DSG, a little down on power vs the S1 though - available with generous discounts via a broker.
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So which do you think I should go for next providing I don't stick with the GTi for the time being (can I cope with a baby & 3dr?)
Golf GTD DSG 5dr with options & discount = approx. £29k
BMW Saloon 335D X-Drive M-Sport Auto with options and discount = approx. £35k
Mmmmm :rolleyes:
If they ever get around to making it - GTDR? 4WD, 240PS (or 260PS) depending on where you read, likely to be no more expensive than the regular R, better specced than the Beemer as standard (fewer options needed), better residuals likely too. If I was getting a 335D X-drive i'd buy nearly new as the residuals aren't quite up there with Hot Golfs.
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Agreed.... but expect it to corner like a 19th century sailboat :laugh:
Only joking of course..... but the handling would be a compromise in comparison to a hot hatch
Mmm, the 3-Series in RWD and 4WD form is a fine handling car, a nicely balanced chassis, plenty of grip, reasonable steering feel... handling better than the Golf? That's a subjective opinion... handling always is... so from your perspective the Golf GTD/GTI might handle better than a 3-Series M-Sport but having driven both, regularly, I'm not sure I would agree in general driving.
Road-holding, on the other hand, is objective and measurable, in terms of grip etc. I doubt that there's much in it.
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Polo GTI, the new 1.8 variant (not the hugely unreliable twin-charge 1.4) - available with 7 speed DSG, a little down on power vs the S1 though - available with generous discounts via a broker.
I've been toying with selling the Blue GT for one of these as some good deals around, when specced up there was about £500 between the two
Going to get a demo for a day to see what i think, i want to wait ideally for the new platform as i think the chassis dynamics will make more fun
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Don't lynch me for suggesting BMW, but there are some cracking savings just hit HUKD, including a £10100 saving on the RRP of a 335D X-drive M Sport 4 door Auto (amongst other 3 and 5 series).
http://www.hotukdeals.com/deals/bmw-530d-se-auto-save-10-246-31150-15-drive-deal-2119028#comments
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Don't lynch me for suggesting BMW, but there are some cracking savings just hit HUKD, including a £10100 saving on the RRP of a 335D X-drive M Sport 4 door Auto (amongst other 3 and 5 series).
http://www.hotukdeals.com/deals/bmw-530d-se-auto-save-10-246-31150-15-drive-deal-2119028#comments
10 grand off?! Really?! That's insane :shocked:
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Don't lynch me for suggesting BMW, but there are some cracking savings just hit HUKD, including a £10100 saving on the RRP of a 335D X-drive M Sport 4 door Auto (amongst other 3 and 5 series).
http://www.hotukdeals.com/deals/bmw-530d-se-auto-save-10-246-31150-15-drive-deal-2119028#comments
10 grand off?! Really?! That's insane :shocked:
Its true, I have just spec'd one up with the toys I would want.... Discount coming out to £11,123.94.
I am seriously temped... my GTi is currently on PCP (VW) with about £20,000 remaining to settle.
I could either pay it off or part exchange it via BMW... mmm choices!
It is very premature of me to even consider changing it as I was only considering and thinking about changing once the baby has arrived.... eeeek. My GTi is barely a year old! :rolleyes: :shocked:
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The 5 series, as comfy as it would be is way too big for my needs, the 3 series screams "rep mobile", although rapid, not sure if they'd feel as dynamic as a Golf R if you started chucking it around. I bet one ordered now would arrive a month before my R though, but I'd be screwed on the GTD, doubt they'd give me more than WBAC money for it (£16k come April/May?).
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Agree about the 3 series Monkeyhanger, I considered it this year but there are so many of them and the hipster in me swayed to the seemingly rarer GTD. A friend had a 335d and it felt quite cramped inside also, but I didn't have my Golf at the time to compare directly.
With discussions mentioning the M235i and obviously the R, have people seen the Chris Harris video on the two? I just saw it in a youtube catch up. The R does fantastically.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TtOZNp6GOxI
All this car talk has made me look at cars, but I'll settle for a Trevor-ed GTD shortly!
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If that 335 had been a touring i would have been tempted as a daily for that money
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For the fourth year running the BMW 3 Series has been ranked as the most reliable company car. The second most reliable company car is the Golf and the third is the Audi A4. A company car can either be used by reps or directors and there is nothing wrong in being a rep. However, most reps have poverty optioned BMW 3 Series.
Top 10 most reliable company cars:
1 BMW 3 series
2 Volkswagen Golf
3 Audi A4
4 Honda Civic
5 Honda Accord
6 Mercedes-Benz C-Class
7 Audi A3
8= BMW 1 Series
8= Ford Focus
10 BMW 5 Series
Top 10 most reliable manufacturers:
1 BMW
2 Audi
3 Honda
4 Volkswagen
5 Toyota
6 Ford
7 Skoda
8 Mercedes-Benz
9 Nissan
10 Volvo
http://www.parkers.co.uk/company-cars/news-and-advice/latest-news/2012/november/the-uks-most-reliable-company-car-is/
It really annoys me hugely when people denigrate a fabulous car like the BMW 3 Series or the BMW 5 Series. IMO they are talking out of a body part which ejects human refuse and which sees very little sunshine.
I am not a rep and I am the proud owner of a BMW 3 Series. In fact, we have two highly optioned ones in our family. My BMW is amazing with fabulous ride and handling and has been bank vault solid and totally reliable, something that cannot always be said for a Golf. The Golf and all its variants, lets call a spade a spade or even a shovel, is a buzz box in comparison to a BMW 3 Series.
So lads and lasses, please try and temper your BMW bashing and accept the fact that these are fantastic cars which well deserve all the plaudits that are heaped on them.
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I am not a rep and I am the proud owner of a BMW 3 Series. In fact, we have two highly optioned ones in our family. My BMW is amazing with fabulous ride and handling and has been bank vault solid and totally reliable, something that cannot always be said for a Golf. The Golf and all its variants, lets call a spade a spade or even a shovel, is a buzz box in comparison to a BMW 3 Series.
This begs the question why are you changing you BMW for a Golf then?
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I am not a rep and I am the proud owner of a BMW 3 Series. In fact, we have two highly optioned ones in our family. My BMW is amazing with fabulous ride and handling and has been bank vault solid and totally reliable, something that cannot always be said for a Golf. The Golf and all its variants, lets call a spade a spade or even a shovel, is a buzz box in comparison to a BMW 3 Series.
This begs the question why are you changing you BMW for a Golf then?
As you've begged, I will answer. :wink:
I wish to downsize my personal transport. I don't anymore require all the space that the BMW 3 Series provides. Besides, we have just taken delivery of our new BMW 330d M Sport. So we will have one bigger car and one smaller car, one petrol and one Diesel, one RWD and one 4WD. This I feel covers all bases and is eminently more sensible for our requirements.
I hope this answers your enquiry.
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I think the real reason is that all of the posters on the BMW forums are as dull as shi!t* and wear shiny suits because it makes them feel important - so therefore you missed us all on here terribly, so had to sell your soul to get back into the Golf club...
Just a thought mind... :laugh: :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin:
* Excluding Martin who's still one of us at heart and anything but dull
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I don't feel like i'm a BMW basher (except the 1 series, but that is purely about the looks). The 3 series is seen by many as the rep-mobile of choice (myself included). From new, there aren't that many bought privately, it is bigger than I need it to be, they're generally far less generously equipped than a high end Golf (optional equipment has a huge depreciative hit on a new car), and the residuals of BMWs themselves are not what they used to be.
That makes them an expensive car to run. As much as I like VWs, if they went ugly (like BMW did for a spell, and continue to do for the 1 series), or started to depreciate heavily I either wouldn't be buying a new one, or wouldn't be buying one full stop.
Perhaps it is the rep-mobile image that makes it less desirable to me as a privately owned new car?
Mechanically they're up there (I have far more respect for BMW engineering than lower end Merc engineering) with the best - except where they refuse to acknowledge common faults (my mate was a swirl flap victim 4 months out of warranty).
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Andy/Exonian:
The BMW forum is excellent and the guys on it are terrific. No, I did not miss this or any other VW forum, if truth be told. I miss nice people, not forums. But I missed you and Martin/MAW73. I restarted posting as I will be getting another Golf. I hope this is ok!
monkeyhanger:
Well, according to Parkers the Golf is also ranked as a popular company car and hence could also be classed as a repmobile, but lower down in the pecking order.
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You're not wrong Asker, there seem to be low spec MK7's and GTD's everywhere that clearly aren't owned by real people, it's very rare to even get eye contact from the average GTD driver particularly from a certain demograph as they're just not interested in the car the way us forum dwellers are.
(and yes, I was very much joking about BMW forums as I know a lot of BM owners are a pretty good bunch)
So yep, Golf and 3 series are just boring rep mobiles, you've now made my mind up for me - I want a Scirocco
I bet Scirocco drivers don't thumb their noses at other Scirocco owners, they just admire each other's arch gaps and fat rumps and feel harmonious like Bini drivers do.
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Yeah (especially the trusty GTD no doubt), but I bet that the % new Golfs that are privately owned rather than company cars are a lot higher than the 3 series. The 3 series screams comfortable motorway cruiser to me, rather than an everyday all rounder that the Golf is. If I was after a motorway cruiser i'm sure i'd find a 330d/335d more fitting. Horses for courses, but the 1 series is closer to delivering what i'm looking for form a car, but I can't forgive its looks. There's no denying that those HUKD prices are great for those BMW 3/5s if you're in the market for one.
After a staid 15 year history with TDIs, i'm hoping to find a bit of a hooligan in the R that can still be sensible when I want it to be - perhaps i'm just scratching an itch.
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So yep, Golf and 3 series are just boring rep mobiles, you've now made my mind up for me - I want a Scirocco
I bet Scirocco drivers don't thumb their noses at other Scirocco owners, they just admire each other's arch gaps and fat rumps and feel harmonious like Bini drivers do.
The Scirocco is a great car, my 170TDI was far more fun than my GTD is, the car itself (regardless of what's under the bonnet) was a joy to look at when it was new out and the cloners hadn't got in on the act.
I would definitely consider a MK4 Scirocco - it needs the MQB treatment and an updated interior.
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Yeah (especially the trusty GTD no doubt), but I bet that the % new Golfs that are privately owned rather than company cars are a lot higher than the 3 series. The 3 series screams comfortable motorway cruiser to me, rather than an everyday all rounder that the Golf is. If I was after a motorway cruiser i'm sure i'd find a 330d/335d more fitting. Horses for courses, but the 1 series is closer to delivering what i'm looking for form a car, but I can't forgive its looks. There's no denying that those HUKD prices are great for those BMW 3/5s if you're in the market for one.
After a staid 15 year history with TDIs, i'm hoping to find a bit of a hooligan in the R that can still be sensible when I want it to be - perhaps i'm just scratching an itch.
Definitely not directly comparable cars, the 3 goes up against the Passat in reality and the 1 goes up against the Golf.
The 3 would get the nod ahead of the Passat from most buyers as it's a pretty ubiquitous car in that segment and the Golf would get the nod over the 1 series from Mr Average for the same reason. Horses for courses and when it comes to company cars it depends possibly on other factors such as current best lease deal and how much tax they have to pay out of their salary vs. other image factors or general interest in cars if any at all.
I can see the R being a short term itch relief for you. I'd put money (and I'm far from a gambler) that it won't become a long term love affair for you.
So yep, Golf and 3 series are just boring rep mobiles, you've now made my mind up for me - I want a Scirocco
I bet Scirocco drivers don't thumb their noses at other Scirocco owners, they just admire each other's arch gaps and fat rumps and feel harmonious like Bini drivers do.
The Scirocco is a great car, my 170TDI was far more fun than my GTD is, the car itself (regardless of what's under the bonnet) was a joy to look at when it was new out and the cloners hadn't got in on the act.
I would definitely consider a MK4 Scirocco - it needs the MQB treatment and an updated interior.
You've scratched your Scirocco itch where as I never have!
Having now spent over 12 months with an MQB car I'm not convinced on the benefits as an end user aside from the improved electronics in the graphic display and door lighting.
The handling IS improved but then again the mk5 chassis was pretty darned good and just improved with age as each revision came in but lost any rawness.
In contrast the panels are now thinner and you can see where money has been saved in hidden areas.
Aside from the huge domed instrument binnacle I've always loved the Scirocco interior.
The extra dials in the facelift one I drove looked a bit naff in a way but suit the car in the way that a Mini can get away with quirky things.
I just think the Scirocco is a bit overpriced for its old tech.
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The 7R will probably be the last car I will have in the UK. In 2-3 years, I will most probably be living most of the time in my home in Athens, Greece where the weather is better and the cost of living much lower.
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Greece where the weather is better and the cost of living much lower.
I don't think anyone could argue with you on those 2 points, VW prices reasonable out there?
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Exonian: I'd agree with you on the Scirocco's pricepoint. It has gone from being a bargain to being ridiculously expensive for what it was.
I really didn't like the impending MK6 when announced - 20% dearer than the outgoing MK5 price, very little extra to justify the huge price hike, and the looks? I really do think the MK6 looked like it had undergone a Japanese makeover (all soft edges, huge light clusters and smiley face on the exterior). The Scirocco had much better standard equipment, looked mean and was a smidge cheaper than the MK6. It was a genuine head turner in the early days, so many people wanting a look at it. A bit rougher around the edges than the MK7 Golf is now (on the handling/refinement front).
Now VW load the Scirocco up with 19" wheels, DCC and Leather to justify the higher price-point - but some (me included) wouldn't thank you for the standardisation of leather (especially as its not free!)
The thirst of the R might rankle me on a daily basis, having been a derv miser for 15 years, but i'm finally in a position to finance the car myself, saving 1/3 of what VWFS would want on PCP - that'll buy a fair bit of premium petrol. I loved the transformation that the DTUK box brought to my GTD, and the R is going to provide that + interest. With the R I really think i've peaked in car ownership, it's not far off the upper end i'm willing to spend on car wonership, and the next step up is probably going to be another £10k. With that in mind I could see myself with the R for a good few years (Scirocco MK4 not withstanding).
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scirocco most over rated car i have owned, build quality not brilliant, 6 years later they just look plain old and mid life botox has not helped, kept it longer than anything else and loved what i did to it but out the box i thought the wifes Mk5 pirelli was a better car
mk6 GTI was such a better car the Ed35 modded came in less than the retail of the R and was a way superior machine in comparison
mk7 chassis just blows it out the water
scirocco still sells for those who want a coupe
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Greece where the weather is better and the cost of living much lower.
I don't think anyone could argue with you on those 2 points, VW prices reasonable out there?
No idea about VW prices in Greece. However, no point having a nice car in Athens. They get wrecked. So it will be an Up! for me there or something similar which is small and easy to park.
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AM1W;
I agree. The BMW M135I is a brilliant car. I've had a few journeys in my friends, the only thing that puts me off is how back end happy they are on a slightly wet road which is of course down to the RWD. A great machine for throwing around the corners sideways though! :laugh:
The main thing that appeals to me about the new Audi RS3 (which i'm seriously considering as my next motor) is that it has that magnificent 2.5l 5 Cylinder turbocharged engine which is not only highly tuneable but also sounds fantastic due to the brilliant 1-2-4-5-3 firing sequence :cool: Which in my opinion is the only thing the current 2L 4 Cylinders lack, that ability to have a nice deep growl.
So atleast 367 alleged BHP, 343LBFT Torque, 4.3 Seconds 0-62MPH combined with Quattro AWD with a top speed of 174MPH when you ask the guys at Audi nicely to remove the limiter. Not to mention again that it sounds great and the sky is pretty much the limit when it comes to tuning these things. It's the full package.
What's not to like? :laugh:
It really is a great sound, there's a depth to it that the Inline 4 cannot make.
Have you heard it with a decat? :cool:
L6 also nice.
Here's the exhaust sound from mine yesterday morning at 6am when I leave for work. This is with the m p exhaust fitted. I got the wife to film it as she commented its pretty loud in the mornings. So I was interested to see what it sounded like. Fortunately I have understanding neighbours. Excuse my son making an appearance at the end of the video.
http://vid868.photobucket.com/albums/ab242/WITHCOMBEM/VID-20150122-WA0000_zps5mkrufab.mp4
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Nice wallpaper Martin.
Josh is growing away!
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Nice wallpaper Martin.
Josh is growing away!
Thanks mate.... I chose the wallpaper but got a decorator into to fit it (I'd rather slam my knob in a car door than attempt to hang wallpaper!)
Yes Joshua is getting bigger and more cheekier by the day!
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:grin: :grin: :grin:
I guess decorating isn't your thing then?!!!