GolfGTIforum.co.uk
Model specific boards => Golf mk4 => Topic started by: dai-cymru on 10 December 2009, 19:20
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Put my home made tester on tonight, run some air through and could hear a substantial leak, turns out to be my Forge tip. under pressure the clamp and hose slide of the turbo :shocked: when the pressure comes off it slides back on, so i thought cool just a loose clip tried to tighten it but it was already supper tight, put a new clip on and when i tighten it it just slides off, so bollox to this im putting a standard one back on, if i can find one that is :undecided: what clips are others using as i havent heard anyone else having this problem?
(http://i233.photobucket.com/albums/ee76/dai-cymru/ATT00042.jpg)
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couldn't believe you at first when you rang me!! :shocked: :shocked: :shocked:
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couldn't believe you at first when you rang me!! :shocked: :shocked: :shocked:
couldnt believe it myself :wink:
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not good, I have only got a K03 TIP in the shed unfortunately :sad:
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not good, I have only got a K03 TIP in the shed unfortunately :sad:
how rude there are only AGU on ebay too :cry:
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not good, I have only got a K03 TIP in the shed unfortunately :sad:
how rude there are only AGU on ebay too :cry:
nothing in work you could 'borrow' :undecided: though thinking about it you need all those funny offshoots for the DV etc :sad:
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is there a reason why its slipping off? is there any oil bypassing the blades and getting onto the tip?
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is there a reason why its slipping off? is there any oil bypassing the blades and getting onto the tip?
no completly dry, the material the tip is made of seems a bit crap to me, it doesnt squash down like a normal silicone hose :undecided:
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I know when fitting my TIP i thought that there isnt really alot of lip on the turbo to securely clamp the hoses on, hence why the manufacture used a bolt on item. Makes you think is it worth going down the metal style enlarged TIP from awesome.
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i would of thought it would not matter as it is only sucking in air, there would no real pressure in the pipe. It would matter on the other side of the turbo as it is pushing air into the inlet manifold.
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i would of thought it would not matter as it is only sucking in air, there would no real pressure in the pipe. It would matter on the other side of the turbo as it is pushing air into the inlet manifold.
have you ever put your hand on the inlet side of a turbo?? trust me lots of pressure :wink:
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but what is stopping the pressure going out of the air box?
All the turbo is doing is sucking air :huh:
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but what is stopping the pressure going out of the air box?
All the turbo is doing is sucking air :huh:
the turbo is suckin in air it's a one way thing air is sucked in and forced through the intake pipe (no air is travelling back towards the air box)
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what you have to think, that if the TIP isnt connected then the air that is registered by the MAF will not be going into the system and therefore cause mis-fuelling problem. The speed that the turbo spins at will cause alot of intake pressure.
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so surly no pressure would build up to force the pipe to leak ( Like me having my front door open and trying to pressure the house, it wont work)......... Everytime i have had a pressure test they have done it from the intercooler and manifold.
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yea but surly sucking would make the pipe stick to the turbo not push it off.
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What tip do u want , standard or aftermarket. ?
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I know when fitting my TIP i thought that there isnt really alot of lip on the turbo to securely clamp the hoses on, hence why the manufacture used a bolt on item. Makes you think is it worth going down the metal style enlarged TIP from awesome.
how much is the metal one? does that bolt in like the original one?
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What tip do u want , standard or aftermarket. ?
I have the forge aftermarket already, want to put the standard one on
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what Dai is trying to say is the pipe is not secure. It's pulling in un-metered air so making his fuelling lean and throwing up the fault codes
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What tip do u want , standard or aftermarket. ?
ko3s or ko3 tip
I have the forge aftermarket already, want to put the standard one on
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he needs a K03s TIP
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what Dai is trying to say is the pipe is not secure. It's pulling in un-metered air so making his fuelling lean and throwing up the fault codes
LOL thanks... i will go back to sitting in the corner
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no worries, class dismissed :grin:
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DÃ i I got a ko3s tip u can have , think u live near me too ..，
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lol one more question, how much PSI was put putting through it to make is leak?
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lol one more question, how much PSI was put putting through it to make is leak?
10PSI - 5 short of the remapped value :nerd:
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pretty much standard then :shocked:
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lol one more question, how much PSI was put putting through it to make is leak?
10PSI - 5 short of the remapped value :nerd:
yep what he said
DÃ i I got a ko3s tip u can have , think u live near me too ..，
where abouts are you?
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Rhondda ..，where r u ??
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Rhondda ..，where r u ??
pontypridd LLantrsant side :smiley:
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Rhondda ..，where r u ??
pontypridd side ... But I'm down Cardiff few times a week
pontypridd LLantrsant side :smiley:
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that isn't a boost leak dude, and if it was unmetered air getting in you'd have a fuel trim fault code for lean running
that looks like a meaty air line, what pressure were you putting in and where was it blocked off?
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I may be well off here but if there is positive pressure in the Turbo Inlet Pipe how would it suck in air from a normal pressure atmosphere?
Does the pressure of say 15psi not relate to the the manifold side of the compressor wheel? As such would the pipe not be okay in actual driving?
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that isn't a boost leak dude, and if it was unmetered air getting in you'd have a fuel trim fault code for lean running
that looks like a meaty air line, what pressure were you putting in and where was it blocked off?
10 psi thats a regulator the airline is going into it, and I do have fuel trim codes, blocked off at throtte valve inlet (hose from the i/c) :smiley:
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that isn't a boost leak dude, and if it was unmetered air getting in you'd have a fuel trim fault code for lean running
that looks like a meaty air line, what pressure were you putting in and where was it blocked off?
10 psi thats a regulator the airline is going into it, and I do have fuel trim codes, blocked off at throtte valve inlet (hose from the i/c) :smiley:
mate i pm u with my number if u want the tip ...
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This any good to you ? :
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/2000-MK4-GOLF-1-8T-TURBO-BOOST-PIPEWORK-A3_W0QQitemZ200399263015QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM?hash=item2ea8ba1527
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we always have a couple of spares kicking around if you get stuck.. you bringing it to the charity day next month if you've still got it?
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What about if you went for a clamp like this mate. You can get a lot more clamping on it and a bigger aria to clamp
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/MIKALOR-BOOST-HOSE-CLAMP-CLIP-RS-TURBO-COSWORTH-74-79MM_W0QQitemZ120492261488QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM?hash=item1c0de60070
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By the look of it you didn't block of the hockey puck either
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By the look of it you didn't block of the hockey puck either
whats the hockey puck? why do i need to block it off, there was so much air coming out the TIP I need to sort that out first before retesting?
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Still not sure about pressurising that side of the boost pipework... :undecided: I'm sure you should be pressure testing the system after the turbo.
I know you said you found a leak there, but that side is only ever under vacuum or atmospheric pressure; Pressurising it will blow the pipe off. If you are concerned fit a fatter clamp, but not sure that's the problem here.... ? Try that or go back to standard TIP and see if your problem goes away.
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so if he's doing the test wrong is anyone going to enlighten him on how he should be doing it? :undecided:
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it's not wrong, and bloody handy for finding vac leaks on 1.8t's in that position but you can't expect the tip to stay in place under high pressure on that side of the turbo if the clip won't tighten up. It might show an unmetered air ingress but it's under constant vacuum so there's no way it will be popping off under pressure when driving. Ivor mk4's TIP was practically hanging off and still making full boost.
If it's a leak JUST in the charged system you're looking for then top turbo hose -> hard pipe is best. For info the smoke testers we've been looking at are regulated to 5psi.
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so the plot thickens again :undecided:
there isn't anything left to change I don't think :undecided:
EDIT - just had a text from Dave - the code he gets is that pressure drop from DV to throttle valve and he says's he notices that sometimes the DV has slid out of its position :undecided:
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Ivor mk4's TIP was practically hanging off and still making full boost.
if that's the case what's the point in buying the Forge one then? I'm aware the standard tip does tend to break where plastic meets metal but even still if the car can make full boost with it practically hanging off why bother :huh: bearing in mind with the Forge one you have to blank off an excess port too
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because the standard one gives up at about 160g/s
oh and it wasnt supposed to be hanging off :grin: i spotted it looking for his knocking suspension and got it back on properly with a bit of fiddling
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because the standard one gives up at about 160g/s
oh and it wasnt supposed to be hanging off :grin: i spotted it looking for his knocking suspension and got it back on properly with a bit of fiddling
is that under vacuum? :huh:
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that's metered air, so yeah induction into the turbo or vacuum
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cheers topher
these are his fault codes
17545 - Fuel Trim: Bank 1 (Add): System too Rich
P1137 - 35-00
17705 - Pressure Drop between Turbo and Throttle Valve (check D.V.!)
P1297 - 35-00
AFAIK he has replaced
Map sensor
MAF
Lambda sensors
obviously he's done a leak test and replaced a couple of pipes but still these codes appear :sad:
Thoughts? :undecided:
The fuel bank one isn't something stupid like a coil pack is it? :undecided:
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has anything been bypassed or is everything as it should be vacuum/intake manifold wise. 90% of the time that is a leak or broken check valve/jet pump somewhere around the PCV or a dodgy maf. Have you checked the voltage from the o2 sensor to make sure that isn't the problem?
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has anything been bypassed or is everything as it should be vacuum/intake manifold wise. 90% of the time that is a leak or broken check valve/jet pump somewhere around the PCV or a dodgy maf. Have you checked the voltage from the o2 sensor to make sure that isn't the problem?
nothings been bypassed; its all as it left the factory :smiley:
what sort of voltage should we be seeing? i assume you can do that with VAGCOM can you or the good old fashioned multi meter way?
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i can't remember the scale off the top of my head, and my head is still too fuzzy to go searching the bentley manual on a sunday :grin: But ideally both ways, make sure they tie up to eliminate possible wiring fault.
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cool; thanks Chris :smiley:
been texting Dave all this as he's in work so its giving him something to do :grin: :grin:
99% of the time it drives spot on and then bang it just seems to lose power :undecided:
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17705 can put you in limp mode, so solve that and it should run tickety-boo!
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17705 can put you in limp mode, so solve that and it should run tickety-boo!
lol that's like Mission:Impossible :grin: :grin: :grin:
another question - what sort of values should we see when logging the O2 sensors. At idle the bank 1 sensor is extremely erratic; is it like this until you start moving :undecided:
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see that just again screams leaky vac around the pcv to me, once you're on throttle the check valve closes and takes all those pipes out of the equation.
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see that just again screams leaky vac around the pcv to me, once you're on throttle the check valve closes and takes all those pipes out of the equation.
fancy having a go at finding it then :wink: :grin: :grin:
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if you can get it here we can have a look mate no problem at all :cool:
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if you can get it here we can have a look mate no problem at all :cool:
not in South Wales any time soon then :tongue:
No doubt Dave will see this and reply as to what he wants to do; his time is pretty limited at the moment between new baby and fitting stuff to my car work
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Errr.. might be actually. I'm sure I saw something in the diary over that way. Just get him to check every little pipe that sits under the inlet manifold. Could even be a pinhole but if there is any sign of wet/oil/muck/buildup around those pipes then something is leaking down there.
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Errr.. might be actually. I'm sure I saw something in the diary over that way. Just get him to check every little pipe that sits under the inlet manifold. Could even be a pinhole but if there is any sign of wet/oil/muck/buildup around those pipes then something is leaking down there.
hello chaps, already checked the small pipes down under the inlet manifold cant see anything obvious :sad: but could be a pin hole as you said :undecided:if you can get it here we can have a look mate no problem at all :cool:
not in South Wales any time soon then :tongue:
No doubt Dave will see this and reply as to what he wants to do; his time is pretty limited at the moment between new baby and fitting stuff to my car work
yep got to helicoil a sump, refit a v8 disco starter, fit the tip fit some shocks to somebodys tdi :wink: and thats not including my shifts and stuff ha ha
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Pancake pipe the small join one under the bumper? :undecided:
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Pancake pipe the small join one under the bumper? :undecided:
fixed that one
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right standard tip is back on (although i have an extra hole (ba-boom :wink:) on this tip that i had on the forge but not the original tip that came with the car)
It goes like stink :smiley: but need to clear the codes and run it for a few days to know if it's cured anything as it's an intermittant fault anyway and can take a few days to show up.
Forge TIP now for sale http://www.golfgtiforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=137715.0
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so if he's doing the test wrong is anyone going to enlighten him on how he should be doing it? :undecided:
By not blocking off the hockey puck your pushing boost into the crankcase,this isn't recommended as your putting pressure into parts of your engine that are never under boost.You'll find leaks at your dipstick,but this isn't and will never be a boost leak.
The only real way imo to test for a leak in your boost hoses is to fit a tester onto the charge pipe just after the turbo.
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Thats why most leak testers only use about 5psi.. perfectly safe and shows leaks in the pcv system that you'd probably never find otherwise
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Thats why most leak testers only use about 5psi.. perfectly safe and shows leaks in the pcv system that you'd probably never find otherwise
Just get rid of the whole lot.
My tip held 18psi without any worries,you did yourself proud fitting it :wink:
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so if he's doing the test wrong is anyone going to enlighten him on how he should be doing it? :undecided:
By not blocking off the hockey puck your pushing boost into the crankcase,this isn't recommended as your putting pressure into parts of your engine that are never under boost.You'll find leaks at your dipstick,but this isn't and will never be a boost leak.
The only real way imo to test for a leak in your boost hoses is to fit a tester onto the charge pipe just after the turbo.
which bit is the hockey puck?
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The PRV that looks like a hockey puck is attached to the tip next to the N75.
(http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y127/patb303/PCV/IMG_0248.jpg)
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The PRV that looks like a hockey puck is attached to the tip next to the N75.
(http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y127/patb303/PCV/IMG_0248.jpg)
:embarassed: :embarassed: :embarassed: so obvious :smiley: (except to me)
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think i got that in my garage , if u need it just let me know !
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think i got that in my garage , if u need it just let me know !
you have everything in your garage :smiley: dont need one mate thanks, just saying i should remove it when im testing for leaks
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Remove it and plug the hole with a piece of plastic and secure with jubilee clip
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Remove it and plug the hole with a piece of plastic and secure with jubilee clip
will do thanks :smiley:
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Remove it and plug the hole with a piece of plastic and secure with jubilee clip
will do thanks :smiley:
Just while your doing the boost leak test,put it back afterwards.
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I best remember my vagcom lead on Saturday then :wink:
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Errr.. might be actually. I'm sure I saw something in the diary over that way. Just get him to check every little pipe that sits under the inlet manifold. Could even be a pinhole but if there is any sign of wet/oil/muck/buildup around those pipes then something is leaking down there.
topher ! if u coming down this way and dont mine checking my boost leak out that will be great , i will most prob be popping up for a re-map after the new year but will rather get it sorted before i get it remap to make life easier for both of us ..
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Errr.. might be actually. I'm sure I saw something in the diary over that way. Just get him to check every little pipe that sits under the inlet manifold. Could even be a pinhole but if there is any sign of wet/oil/muck/buildup around those pipes then something is leaking down there.
topher ! if u coming down this way and dont mine checking my boost leak out that will be great , i will most prob be popping up for a re-map after the new year but will rather get it sorted before i get it remap to make life easier for both of us ..
did you swap the DV for the forge one mate?
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nah not yet ...... but i dont think it will be that tho , it might lose 1-2psi but not 10psi on it ......
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fair enough :smiley: boost leaks are a pain
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I checked the diary, there is a job written down for Newport.. but on boxing day! :grin:
i think somebody just wrote an address down in the back of the book for safe keeping, so no jobs in wales yet chaps sorry
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you dont want to go to Newport anyway full of thieving townies and ****** :lipsrsealed: :grin:
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I checked the diary, there is a job written down for Newport.. but on boxing day! :grin:
i think somebody just wrote an address down in the back of the book for safe keeping, so no jobs in wales yet chaps sorry
how rude :cry: :cry:
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I checked the diary, there is a job written down for Newport.. but on boxing day! :grin:
i think somebody just wrote an address down in the back of the book for safe keeping, so no jobs in wales yet chaps sorry
how rude :cry: :cry:
Where's your Christmas spirit Toph :cry: :cry:
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I spent my xmas spirit on insurance for the r32 so i can blat it around for a couple of weeks before it goes :lipsrsealed:
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I spent my xmas spirit on insurance for the r32 so i can blat it around for a couple of weeks before it goes :lipsrsealed:
blat it all the way down to south wales then :wink:
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I spent my xmas spirit on insurance for the r32 so i can blat it around for a couple of weeks before it goes :lipsrsealed:
you still got that? Thought that went months ago? :huh:
and do what Dave says :tongue:
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you dont want to go to Newport anyway full of thieving townies and ****** :lipsrsealed: :grin:
it aint that bad,
Many good nights in newport with many girls..lol The Coldra & Celtic Manor were my second homes for a few months back in 1999-2000 when I had my good looks and the ladys could not resist me... and the welsh lads wanted to kick me head in in the Zanzi bar.
Nick
Topher
We can get Ben to cover the xmas holidays, if not I will sack him..
Regards
Scrooge
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It is an easy night out :grin: :evil:
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I checked the diary, there is a job written down for Newport.. but on boxing day! :grin:
i think somebody just wrote an address down in the back of the book for safe keeping, so no jobs in wales yet chaps sorry
no worries , if u do come down this in the near future just let me know ... :smiley:
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Took Dai's car for a quick blast last night and the good news is those fault codes have gone :smiley:
Slight bad news is the 17963 - Charge Pressure Control - Upper boost limit exceeded has appeared for the first time since he replaced the MAP sensor :undecided:
Occasionally the car would bog down slightly and then pick up and pin you right back in the seat. Logged block 115 and its always nicely above the specified boost pressure but is there such a thing as having to much boost going through the system? :undecided:
For a Spec 1 map though it is absolutely rapid :shocked: :shocked: :shocked:
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ha ha, nope been testing it today, and the maximum pressure code has gone and good old pressure drop code is there :rolleyes:
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ha ha, nope been testing it today, and the maximum pressure code has gone and good old pressure drop code is there :rolleyes:
must be that ebay vagcom lead you bought :tongue:
Back to the drawing board again then :undecided:
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ha ha, nope been testing it today, and the maximum pressure code has gone and good old pressure drop code is there :rolleyes:
must be that ebay vagcom lead you bought :tongue:
Back to the drawing board again then :undecided:
jusy have to check the pcv system :sad:
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ha ha, nope been testing it today, and the maximum pressure code has gone and good old pressure drop code is there :rolleyes:
must be that ebay vagcom lead you bought :tongue:
Back to the drawing board again then :undecided:
jusy have to check the pcv system :sad:
free this afternoon if you need a hand - lets use the garage this time and stick a heater on :grin: :grin:
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got no chance with the boss today mate
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got no chance with the boss today mate
I'm on taxi duty anyway (again :rolleyes:)
Give us a shout if and when :afro:
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got no chance with the boss today mate
I'm on taxi duty anyway (again :rolleyes:)
Give us a shout if and when :afro:
ok ta :smiley: