GolfGTIforum.co.uk
Model specific boards => Golf mk3 => Topic started by: Shady Pioneer on 18 September 2009, 11:05
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Hey all, before any of you start by saying just buy a GTi, it's not a financial option to do so, as my insurance will jump up £1400, whereas if I do a conversion, it only goes up £127, don't ask me how or why, it just does lol!
Anyway, I'm here to find out exactly what I'll need because at the moment, as far as I'm aware I need the engine, exhaust system and a brake upgrade. I have been told I may need the gearbox and wiring loom as well?
Any help would be great, thanking you :)
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you'd be best off buying a complete doner car then you'll have all the parts you'd need :undecided:
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Off topic but the reason for the insurance is the badge, GTI's have always had high insurance costs whatever happens your still insuring a GL at the end of the day.
As Shep said it might be easier to get a doner car and that would give you everthing you need.
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is it really worth the hassle? sticking a gti engine in it wont make it super fast, not by todays std anyway, and its not like the 1.8 is gut wrenchingly slow. maybe better off saving up and buying a faster car when you can afford to.
if i were going to go through the hassle of an engine swap i'd at least be looking for an engine that had bags of power to begin with and too my mind a gti be it 8v or 16v doesnt for the size of the car its powering.
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is it really worth the hassle? sticking a gti engine in it wont make it super fast, not by todays std anyway, and its not like the 1.8 is gut wrenchingly slow. maybe better off saving up and buying a faster car when you can afford to.
if i were going to go through the hassle of an engine swap i'd at least be looking for an engine that had bags of power to begin with and too my mind a gti be it 8v or 16v doesnt for the size of the car its powering.
His old engine is knackered, hence the reason for the change.
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I THINK you could use the same pedal box as they are both cable clutch i believe.
You would need an new exhaust, full system, including cat/decat, your choice
Engine, box, full engine loom to fusebox and ECU with all anciliries.
You would probably need the 8v/16v subframe? As i dont think they are the same. Does the GL have a subframe or is it like a 6n polo?
Driveshafts MIGHT be the same but i doubt it, as they hubs are different.
Other things to look at would be the capability of the fuel pump/ fuel lines.
You would need 8v clocks.
Not sure on the gear linkages?
8v radiator (would also depend on donor car having air con etc) And not sure if that would fit on your current slam panel?
All coolant hoses etc etc to match up the engine and radiator.
Then new engine mounts.
Would also then recomend whilst its out doing the belts, maybe the head gasket. lol.
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Infact? Are the fuse boxs even the compatiably? You might need more of the loom or a different fusebox?
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Thanks for the input Mikester, my car has air con so I'd need to find a doner with air con? The clocks in mine are exactly the same, same rev limit, same top speed and what not, the only thing is I don't have the mfa.
It's a lot to think about and do ain't it lol, ideally I'd love to whack a 1.8t in there but funds and space don't allow, the only thing I might do is replace te engine for another standard one and decide what to do at the end of my insurance, another thing that doesn't help is I just received 3 points :(
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Infact? Are the fuse boxs even the compatiably? You might need more of the loom or a different fusebox?
I think they are different.
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Thanks for the input Mikester, my car has air con so I'd need to find a doner with air con? The clocks in mine are exactly the same, same rev limit, same top speed and what not, the only thing is I don't have the mfa.
It's a lot to think about and do ain't it lol, ideally I'd love to whack a 1.8t in there but funds and space don't allow, the only thing I might do is replace te engine for another standard one and decide what to do at the end of my insurance, another thing that doesn't help is I just received 3 points :(
3pts for what.
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Another pointless Shady thread coz he will never do it! :laugh: :evil: :laugh:
You would be far better off just repairing your existing engine!
Do ya want my Gti interior again now? :rolleyes:
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Its not going to be the hardest conversion in the world.
But would be made harder if the driveshafts are not compatiable.
If i was going to convert your car to a bigger engine, but had a small budget, then i would stick a 16v in it.
As the engines cost the same, and its going to be exactly the same arse ache of a conversion.
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Mikester - he wants to keep his 4 stud hubs! So that creates problems!
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Mikester - he wants to keep his 4 stud hubs! So that creates problems!
Yeah. But i did say in my original list on page 1 that i am not sure on wether his driveshafts from the hubs will match an 8v gearbox.
But if they did he could look at G60 brakes.
I would drive an 8v gti on uprate GL brakes, at the end of the day the 8v isnt THAT fast.
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It's only 25BHP more than my current engine I know that much, so not a lot. LL has kept his 4 stud wheels on with his 1.8T, so it's easily doable. But if I stick a 16v in I'd have to look at a hydro clutch as well.
I'm going to look into it a bit more and make a firm decision then. :evil:
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He still wont have a Gti though!
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you wouldnt need a hydro clutch.
You can just stick the 16v abf on an 8v gearbox.
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Thanks for the input Mikester, my car has air con so I'd need to find a doner with air con? The clocks in mine are exactly the same, same rev limit, same top speed and what not, the only thing is I don't have the mfa.
It's a lot to think about and do ain't it lol, ideally I'd love to whack a 1.8t in there but funds and space don't allow, the only thing I might do is replace te engine for another standard one and decide what to do at the end of my insurance, another thing that doesn't help is I just received 3 points :(
3pts for what.
:lipsrsealed: :lipsrsealed: --- for being too dam cool :cool: *removes lips from arse*
who would you get to do the conversion?
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http://www.audivwparts.co.uk/www.audivwparts.co.uk/info.php?p=12&pno=0&pid=1990066&cat=&ack=9&search=&referrer=/default.php?
This place has a few engines at the moment, VR ABF AGG etc plus are friendly and helpful.
If you aint done the swap by next April my car will be failing its MOT if the tester has his specs on
and the ADY unit in it is "HOT" if it can be described that way :grin: :grin: :grin:
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Cheers shep, I think all the sh!t is out of my arse now. :evil: :evil: :evil:
I would get my friend to do. In fact dubcheryl's boyfriend, he offered if I ever wanted it doing. He knows his stuff.
As for if and when, gotta a good ol' think about this now.
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Dont strain yourself! all that thinking! :wink: :grin:
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3 POINTS FOR WHAT!!??? :grin:
What you lot have to remember is the 1.8 & 2L 8v's are VERY similar, all the belts, tensioners are the same, and the engine mounts are the same, rad is the same too.
Pedal box AFAIK is the same and all.
Not that hard really, you could even use the same gearbox I think.
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3 POINTS FOR WHAT!!??? :grin:
What you lot have to remember is the 1.8 & 2L 8v's are VERY similar, all the belts, tensioners are the same, and the engine mounts are the same, rad is the same too.
Pedal box AFAIK is the same and all.
Not that hard really, you could even use the same gearbox I think.
Where are you getting that info from Matty? I'd like to know :)
I know the engine mounts are the same as one of mine went not long ago and got one from a scrap MK3 which was identical.
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3 POINTS FOR WHAT!!??? :grin:
What you lot have to remember is the 1.8 & 2L 8v's are VERY similar, all the belts, tensioners are the same, and the engine mounts are the same, rad is the same too.
Pedal box AFAIK is the same and all.
Not that hard really, you could even use the same gearbox I think.
Where are you getting that info from Matty? I'd like to know :)
I know the engine mounts are the same as one of mine went not long ago and got one from a scrap MK3 which was identical.
Work.
I did a cambelt on a 2L 8V the other week, exactly the same as my 1.8. What engine code is yours?
I'm almost positive you can use the same gearbox but I could be wrong. I think the driveshafts are the same, if you wish, I can phone up TPS (Volkswagen for traders basically) and get some 2L 8V and 1.8 part numbers and ask them if they match up.
Radiator is the same as I gave this GTi a service and was having a nose at what parts I could nick from a scrapped one.
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Yeah mate, if you could that would be swell :) Cheers. I guess not many people do this type of conversion do they lol!
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or you can use vagcat
http://www.vagcat.com/epc/ (http://www.vagcat.com/epc/)
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1.4ltr. AEX;
1.6ltr. AEE,AEK,AFT
1.8ltr. AAM,ADZ;
2.0ltr. AGG;
"J..":ADY;
Clutch is the same for all of those, which is a good sign, what is your engine code?
EDIT:
So are the driveshafts. :cool:
Means that most likely the geaarbox is the same, maybe it has different ratios? Maybe they're the same. I dunno, if they were different it would probably make yours faster accelerating.
I'm gonna phone a trade place and ask if the gearbox's are the same.
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On phone now asking about gearbox, and I'll ask about ECU while I'm there. :wink:
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Cheers man, my engine code is ADZ, I'd imagine that I'd need the ECU from an 8v, and as for the gearbox, I wouldn't know lol.
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ECU: No.
Gearbox: They are unsure.
:rolleyes:
Some 2L 8v have matching codes to your 1.8
Near the bell housing there is a code stamped, find it and find out about the donor engine's gearbox, if they match all is golden.
The ratios will be the same.
I personally reckon they'd fit, but really I guess there is only one way to make sure, and that's with codes.
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Well cheers for that pal, so if I decide to do anything I just need to find an engine that
matches the same gearbox code? So I'd keep my ECU and then upgrade the brakes and exhaust system...interesting :p
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Actually, check your handbook if you have it, it will have the gearbox code in there, a 3 digit code. Then we can match it up. Are you going AGG code engine, easiest I think as it's most common IIRC.
Also, are we all confident the exhausts are different? I'm not too sure on that...
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I don't have the handbook im afraid, if I remember correctly, boneybradley told me my exhaust, at least he backbox, was the same size as an 8v one, where is he?
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Doing research it looks like the 16V manifold might fit the 1.8 but not the 8V, that sounds stupid to me. :huh:
EDIT:
Looking at these:
GTi 8V mani (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/MK3-GOLF-GTI-8V-EXHAUST-MANIFOLD_W0QQitemZ280392164957QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM?hash=item4148ace65d&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14)
1.8 mani (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/VW-MK3-Golf-1-8-ADZ-Exhaust-Manifold-051-253-033-C_W0QQitemZ200366193481QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM?hash=item2ea6c17b49&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14)
They look the same, so I'd bet they'd fit you know.
Alternatively, you could find a good donor car, I've seen one on here for £150 an 8V that was rusted to hell. Then you would have all you need, you could even sell your wheels and get the 5x100 versions or just use G60 discs and whatever else LL was saying you will need.
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If the shafts are the same I would use the 8v box. As for exhaust I'm not sure if the bore is the same?
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If the shafts are the same I would use the 8v box. As for exhaust I'm not sure if the bore is the same?
I suppose the bore could be different, but on my GL, a full exhaust from the downpipe was put on by Kwikfit by the previous owner and the receipt say's "2L 8v" or something, I can scan it if it will help in any way.
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Reference the brakes, why not fit a set of grooved discs and same fast road pads, it is only 25 bhp more and your not going to track days it at the end of the day, rear drums will be ok up to a point if well set up or run a mk2 disc set up.
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That is along lines I was thinking Wayne, no real need for bigger brake discs as the power output is minimal.
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That is along lines I was thinking Wayne, no real need for bigger brake discs as the power output is minimal.
It will be fine, the standard set up with good quality pads and grooved discs is all you really need.
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I only have an 8v but wouldn't give back my 288mm grooved and green stuff pads for drums! Lol
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I only have an 8v but wouldn't give back my 288mm grooved and green stuff pads for drums! Lol
Well set up drums are ok and at least you have no sticking caliper issues.
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TBH I find that without ABS, rear drums can be better anyway, they don't do much braking at all and the handbrake is ALWAYS better on drums, so Merc have drums in their discs.
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abs is for girls and old peolpe! :evil:
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TBH I find that without ABS, rear drums can be better anyway, they don't do much braking at all and the handbrake is ALWAYS better on drums, so Merc have drums in their discs.
Vauxhall do the same with the handbrake, much better idea.
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abs is for girls and old peolpe! :evil:
I wouldn't have ABS in mine if I did it :lipsrsealed:
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i converted my driver to gti-8 valve enjine etc but kept it four stud, conversion was pretty straight forward , i just upgraded the brakes on the front to seat ibiza gti stuff,
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What did you have to change then bud, gearbox and the like?
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So plans failed then? :grin:
Old topic, so shoot me.
BTW I've since found out you could just use your gearbox.
IMO, it's an engine out, swap the ECU engine in, happy days.
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So plans failed then? :grin:
Old topic, so shoot me.
BTW I've since found out you could just use your gearbox.
IMO, it's an engine out, swap the ECU engine in, happy days.
Best not lock it or I'll get another couple of threads made about me lol! The main reason I'm not bothering with the GTi engine is because even though it's a simple enough job (in theory) I need to keep my insurance down, and it's not that big of a gain to warrant doing it, so more money down the drain for an extra 25bhp, I'll stick with what I have for now. :)
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you do know they made a 2.0gl vento with 4 stud hub's,non gti suspension and woeful 256mm vented discs (with drums out back!)
gearbox fits fine but gives the car low gearing (fancy a motorway screamer (75mph at 5000rpm) :evil:)
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you do know they made a 2.0gl vento with 4 stud hub's,non gti suspension and woeful 256mm vented discs (with drums out back!)
gearbox fits fine but gives the car low gearing (fancy a motorway screamer (75mph at 5000rpm) :evil:)
Didn't know that but do now :wink: I'm usually sat at around 5,000rpm anyway doing 75mph so I'd be used to it lol!
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Meh. I honestly think you could do it for £100 if you kept looking and asking.
Engine and ECU.
Then I guess you might as well stick a cambelt on the thing.
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Meh. I honestly think you could do it for £100 if you kept looking and asking.
Engine and ECU.
Then I guess you might as well stick a cambelt on the thing.
Insurance as well you fool lol! I'm thinking for the future because I may keep the car for another year after this year with Adrian Flux, and if I chose to go elsewhere I'm sure a GTi engine in my car won't go down too well with most places. And then the resell of the car could be difficult as well, due to this very reason.
It's not worth it.
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Meh. I honestly think you could do it for £100 if you kept looking and asking.
Engine and ECU.
Then I guess you might as well stick a cambelt on the thing.
Insurance as well you fool lol! I'm thinking for the future because I may keep the car for another year after this year with Adrian Flux, and if I chose to go elsewhere I'm sure a GTi engine in my car won't go down too well with most places. And then the resell of the car could be difficult as well, due to this very reason.
It's not worth it.
Meh. I'd say it's deffo worth it. I'f mine kicks up a fuss & I still want the car I'll drop in an 8v.
Insurance wasn't much was it?
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No it wasn't but my money situation at the moment, and Xmas coming up doesn't make it a good decision.
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Puusy. :tongue:
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have matty and shady got some love hate thing going on, lol :D
your engine will be reet shady!!
bit of smoke never hurt anyone :D
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lol I've got a 16v? haha
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?
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Shady I tell thee exactly what you need!
1. Money
2. A Plan
3. The determination to stick to the Plan and not keep changing your mind every five minutes!
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Shady I tell thee exactly what you need!
1. Money
2. A Plan
3. The determination to stick to the Plan and not keep changing your mind every five minutes!
True words from len here.
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?
He could put my 16v engine and box in his car ;)
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Shady I tell thee exactly what you need!
1. Money
2. A Plan
3. The determination to stick to the Plan and not keep changing your mind every five minutes!
I know, I'm terrible, but hey ho, it's my car. :laugh: This was always just an idea anyway, I never said I was going to do it, I was just gathering info. As robz said though, my engine will continue to go and go, I might not even bother replacing it for now, see how long I can get away with it haha!
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lol
good sales effort :D
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good attitude shady!
be reet!
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Bora R32 bumpers?
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Bora R32 bumpers?
That's in the pipeline man :grin: NCB and money first. :evil:
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Bora R32 bumpers?
That's in the pipeline man :grin: NCB and money first. :evil:
Joining us on the dark side of fuel?
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ditch the aircon,saves weight and power,stick to the same engine,they are cheaper,get the head flowed,inlet etc flowed for more responce,get a lightweight crank pulley wheel,new belts etc.. and just give the engine a full service.Get the suspension bushes replaced,even if cannot afford poly's,replace with standard.you will be surprised how better the car will feel and drive.Also include new engine and box mount in that.Do the airbox mod,with a free flow-filter in.At the end of the day,it should feel quicker,firmer and more like how it should drive,also your insurance will hardly increase.A proper set-up car will poss drive and feel better than one thats had ££££££ spend but not set up.
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ditch the aircon,saves weight and power,stick to the same engine,they are cheaper,get the head flowed,inlet etc flowed for more responce,get a lightweight crank pulley wheel,new belts etc.. and just give the engine a full service.Get the suspension bushes replaced,even if cannot afford poly's,replace with standard.you will be surprised how better the car will feel and drive.Also include new engine and box mount in that.Do the airbox mod,with a free flow-filter in.At the end of the day,it should feel quicker,firmer and more like how it should drive,also your insurance will hardly increase.A proper set-up car will poss drive and feel better than one thats had ££££££ spend but not set up.
Cheers for the input chap. Gotta get money through before any of this and that's gonna be hard during Xmas lol! But still I'm looking at keeping this for now as it's cheap on insurance for what it is, and it's good enough to drive. Got a couple issues as everyone knows lol but still drives well. Gonna service it again in Jan' I think.
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Bora R32 bumpers?
That's in the pipeline man :grin: NCB and money first. :evil:
Why I said what I did! Pipe dreams are fine but sort what ya got first!
Now what was I gonna do with that 405 Mi16 thats been in the garage 5 years now! :embarassed:
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Bora R32 bumpers?
That's in the pipeline man :grin: NCB and money first. :evil:
Why I said what I did! Pipe dreams are fine but sort what ya got first!
Now what was I gonna do with that 405 Mi16 thats been in the garage 5 years now! :embarassed:
SCRAP IT
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Bora R32 bumpers?
That's in the pipeline man :grin: NCB and money first. :evil:
Why I said what I did! Pipe dreams are fine but sort what ya got first!
Now what was I gonna do with that 405 Mi16 thats been in the garage 5 years now! :embarassed:
SCRAP IT
+1
Sikaflex your blue lights, grill, front bumper and wheel's on it and weigh it in.
:lipsrsealed: