GolfGTIforum.co.uk
Model specific boards => Golf mk5 => Topic started by: Hairy Porter on 10 September 2009, 19:42
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Drove a Mk6 Gti today at the dealers (in for new seatbelt).
Just the same to drive as my Mk5, if a little quieter and more remote.
The steering is still no better.
The thing that has changed is the price, my DSG five door was £19,300 otr. It's now about £5,000 more to buy a same spec Mk6.
As both will be thought of as the same car when the light and nimble (please) Mk7 GTI is shown in two years it's just too much.
Mk7 for me (or a hybrid Honda Civic type R if Honda make it in a 5 door).
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Drove a Mk6 Gti today at the dealers (in for new seatbelt).
Just the same to drive as my Mk5, if a little quieter and more remote.
The steering is still no better.
The thing that has changed is the price, my DSG five door was £19,300 otr. It's now about £5,000 more to buy a same spec Mk6.
As both will be thought of as the same car when the light and nimble (please) Mk7 GTI is shown in two years it's just too much.
Mk7 for me (or a hybrid Honda Civic type R if Honda make it in a 5 door).
Which dealer let you use their demo?
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yeah the general consensus is that the Mk6 is more expensive yet cheaper to build, hmmm :huh:
I specced up a Mk6 so that it had the same bits as my car it was over £3k more!
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for all those who bought a Mk6 Gti, you should of saved your pennies, for what looks like the same money, look at what you could of had for the same spondoolies.....
http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/news/autoexpressnews/233923/ultimate_golfs_ready_to_turn_up_the_heat.html
Prices expected around 25k, not far off current mk6 Gti prices. :smiley:
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for all those who bought a Mk6 Gti, you should of saved your pennies, for what looks like the same money, look at what you could of had for the same spondoolies.....
http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/news/autoexpressnews/233923/ultimate_golfs_ready_to_turn_up_the_heat.html
Prices expected around 25k, not far off current mk6 Gti prices. :smiley:
Strewth - just done a little sex-wee! :embarassed:
"A bigger turbo, as well as tweaks to the ECU, will ensure the car has a power output of around 270bhp"
Look at the wheels - same as the Audi R8 V10 :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool:
(http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/images/front_picture_library_UK/dir_602/car_photo_301193_25.jpg)
(http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/images/front_picture_library_UK/dir_602/car_photo_301192_25.jpg)
And this one is for RedRobin - give him some starting queues :grin:
(http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/images/front_picture_library_UK/dir_602/car_photo_301191_25.jpg)
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for all those who bought a Mk6 Gti, you should of saved your pennies, for what looks like the same money, look at what you could of had for the same spondoolies.....
http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/news/autoexpressnews/233923/ultimate_golfs_ready_to_turn_up_the_heat.html
Prices expected around 25k, not far off current mk6 Gti prices. :smiley:
Am I missing something? The article is dated "09th February 2009". :undecided:
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Looks lovely. My only reservation is that as awesome as that 2.0T engine is, it has no soul. You need a 6-cyl engine to bring a car to life IMO
And you can just tweak your standard one up to that power anyway, why bother paying what will be 5k for the privalege? I would just buy an R32 :D
I think I am getting old :(
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for all those who bought a Mk6 Gti, you should of saved your pennies, for what looks like the same money, look at what you could of had for the same spondoolies.....
http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/news/autoexpressnews/233923/ultimate_golfs_ready_to_turn_up_the_heat.html
Prices expected around 25k, not far off current mk6 Gti prices. :smiley:
Am I missing something? The article is dated "09th February 2009". :undecided:
And its supposed to have been unveiled in May...hmmm.....
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Looks lovely. My only reservation is that as awesome as that 2.0T engine is, it has no soul. You need a 6-cyl engine to bring a car to life IMO
But the VR6 is really past its sell by date. It will really struggle to meet future emissions regs. And a conventional wide angle V6 isn't really suited to transverse installation in a relatively compact hatchback. Vauxhall used to put transverse V6s in Cavaliers and Vectras - and whilst they made a lovely noise, and gave good torque - they were an utter, utter barsteward to work on. I used to cry whenever a V6 Vectra needed a cambelt! :sick:
So a four pot, or inline five is about the best for a Golf.
And you can just tweak your standard one up to that power anyway, why bother paying what will be 5k for the privalege?
Oh no. If the R20T does materialise, then it won't just be a VW remap. They will beef up a whole load of internals - like they did with the current S3 engine - and that is good for 400-450 bhp! :shocked:
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^^^^
I'm loving your new sig, Sean!! Excellent! They can't say they weren't warned!
I don't like the shape of the Rocco's, period!
I like the look of the new "R20" except for the bling wheels and don't care what car they are off - Too bling on a Golf imo.
I'd love to see a Golf with a 5-cyl twin turbo 2.5 engine - It would sound very good.
:afro:
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I think that image of the R20T is a photoshop special from Auto Express (as usual) hence why it has R8 V10 wheels.
Although now we have seen the Rocco R20, we can guess what the Golf R will look like.
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That autoexpress (like many of their 'exclusive' articles) was a load of tosh back then.
The R20 Golf (or whatever its going to be called) will be revealed next week officially at the Frankfurt motor show. It starts 15th Sept.
http://carscoop.blogspot.com/2009/09/vw-golf-r-to-break-cover-in-frankfurt.html
(dated only 2 days ago) and there are many other articles online stating the same.
I hope the car looks as good as those photoshops and it had sure well better have 4motion. Its bad enough losing the V6..........gone is the true character of the R Golf model :cry: :cry:
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Ahh the rumours :laugh:
hopefully we will have something confirmed over the next couple of months. With models hitting the dealer in about 2 yrs... just in time for my new motor :grin:
But for me it HAS to be 4wd!!!
As for the price... it going to be a couple of grand more than the current GTi and with options it will be quite a few more :wink: As for waiting.... your always going to be waiting as there will always be something better and faster around the corner :wink:
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The following major introductions will be presented at the 2009 Frankfurt Motor show:
* Alfa Romeo MiTo Quadrifoglio Verde
* 2010 Aston Martin Rapide
* 2010 Audi A5 Sportback
* 2010 Audi RS3
* 2010 Audi R8 Spyder
* Audi e-tron concept [9]
* 2010 Bentley Mulsanne
* 2010 BMW X1
* 2010 BMW X6 ActiveHybrid
* 2010 BMW 7 Series ActiveHybrid
* 2010 BMW 3 Series Coupe and Convertible facelift
* 2010 BMW 5 Series
* 2011 BMW 6 Series facelift
* BMW Vision EfficientDynamics concept
* Bugatti Bordeaux
* Citroën C3
* Citroën DS3
* 2010 Ferrari 458 Italia
* Fiat Punto Evo
* 2011 Ford C-Max
* 2010 Honda CR-V
* 2010 Hyudai i10 Electric
* 2010 Hyundai i30
* 2010 Hyundai ix35
* Hyundai ix Metro Concept
* 2010 Jaguar XJ
* 2010 Kia cee'd facelift
* 2010 Kia Venga
* 2010 Kia Sorento
* Kia Forte LPI Hybrid
* Kia cee'd Hybrid
* Kia Sorento Hybrid
* Lexus LF-Ch full hybrid premium compact concept
* Lotus Elise Club Racer [10]
* 2011 Maserati GranCabrio
* Mazda MX-5 Superlight concept
* 2010 Mercedes-Benz SLS AMG
* Mini Coupe Concept [11]
* 2010 Opel Astra
* 2010 Peugeot RCZ
* 2010 Peugeot 5008
* 2010 Porsche 911 Sport Classic
* 2010 Porsche 911 Turbo
* 2010 Porsche 911 GT3 Cup
* 2010 Porsche 911 GT3 RS
* 2010 Porsche Panamera (European debut)
* Rolls-Royce Ghost
* 2010 Saab 9-5
* Toyota Auris HSD Full Hybrid Concept
* Toyota Prius Plug-In Hybrid Concept
* 2010 Toyota Land Cruiser
* 2010 Volkswagen California
* 2010 Volkswagen Caravelle
* 2010 Volkswagen Polo 3dr
* 2010 Volkswagen Transporter
* 2010 Volkswagen Polo BlueMotion
* 2010 Volkswagen Polo GTI
* 2010 Volkswagen Golf BlueMotion
* 2010 Volkswagen Passat BlueMotion
* 2010 Volkswagen R20 Golf
* 2011 Volvo C30
* 2011 Volvo C70
* 2010 Volvo XC60 R-Design
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Auto express image(s) when the GTi mk6 was about to be unveiled was spot on last time. Thats why i was quick to believe what i saw from that report. I cant wait to see what it turns out to be.
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If the R20T is 4WD then I'm going into Hadwins to order one (5 door DSG) on Wednesday.
I hope there is a nice choice of colours, not just white, black and grey.
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Deep Blue Pearl will be a choice for 100% (or equivalent name for the blue)
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Looks lovely. My only reservation is that as awesome as that 2.0T engine is, it has no soul. You need a 6-cyl engine to bring a car to life IMO
And you can just tweak your standard one up to that power anyway, why bother paying what will be 5k for the privalege? I would just buy an R32 :D
I think I am getting old :(
I'm not sure that you would be able to tweak a standard GTi to match the performance of the R20T. Look at the remap results of the Mk5 GTi and Ed30 as an example. Standard GTi remaps to around 250bhp and the Ed30 to around 300bhp. Both are essentially the same engine apart from the Ed30 having a bigger turbo.
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Doesn't the ED30 have stronger internals?
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Yes, I believe the R20 will use the engine from the Edition 30, not the engine from the MKVI GTI. Hence if the R20 Golf is 270 standard then a remap to 300 should be possible.
Perhaps TT, if you are about, you can explain the technical and mechanical differences between the 2.0 Engine variant of that used in the Edition 30/R20 between that of the MKVI GTI?
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I would expect that Vw will use the base engine of the Audi S3 for a starter,(slightly diff then the BYD ed30 unit)Its a prooven unit with added strenght to cope with the added output.
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Yes, I believe the R20 will use the engine from the Edition 30, not the engine from the MKVI GTI. Hence if the R20 Golf is 270 standard then a remap to 300 should be possible.
Nope - the Edition 30 engine is dead. :nerd: :smug: Long live the Edition 30! :laugh:
Perhaps TT, if you are about, you can explain the technical and mechanical differences between the 2.0 Engine variant of that used in the Edition 30/R20 between that of the MKVI GTI?
Wikpedia is your friend on this issue: :tongue:
Mk5 GTI & variants engines: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Volkswagen_Group_petrol_engines#2.0_TFSI_125-210kW
Mk6 GTI & variants engines: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Volkswagen_Group_petrol_engines#2.0_TSI.2FTFSI_132-155kW
Got it? :wink: :nerd:
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i dont think it rocket science.. it will just be the GTI engine plus K04 turbo :nerd:
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i dont think it rocket science.. it will just be the GTI engine plus K04 turbo :nerd:
Hmmmmm . . . not so sure. If it is gonna be 270 bhp standard, then they will have to uprate some internals, like they did with the current S3 engine.
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i dont think it rocket science.. it will just be the GTI engine plus K04 turbo :nerd:
Hmmmmm . . . not so sure. If it is gonna be 270 bhp standard, then they will have to uprate some internals, like they did with the current S3 engine.
I think the answer lays within the Rocco R :nerd:
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i dont think it rocket science.. it will just be the GTI engine plus K04 turbo :nerd:
Hmmmmm . . . not so sure. If it is gonna be 270 bhp standard, then they will have to uprate some internals, like they did with the current S3 engine.
I think the answer lays within the Rocco R :nerd:
Linky please! :wink: :smiley:
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i dont have one... :embarassed:
But I cant see it being any if not much quicker than the Rocco R.
Think the might save that for the Special Anni one
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for all those who bought a Mk6 Gti, you should of saved your pennies, for what looks like the same money, look at what you could of had for the same spondoolies.....
http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/news/autoexpressnews/233923/ultimate_golfs_ready_to_turn_up_the_heat.html
Prices expected around 25k, not far off current mk6 Gti prices. :smiley:
Im getting married next May (which plays havoc with a fellows finances). If it looks like that I will be down to the dealers upon return from my honeymoon.
Sadly I fully expect it to be Scirroco R running gear with maybe a little tweak but I can't see it being 4wd :sad:
I found this on the Scirroco's set up
http://www.autocar.co.uk/News/NewsArticle/AllCars/240236/
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If R20 is 4WD then who would want to buy an inferior Scirocco R? R20 must be FWD.
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I agree - as much as we enthusiasts would love 4WD on the Golf R20, it plays havoc with emissions when trying to get the same performance as its 2WD counterparts - the engine would have to be uprated to produce more power than the Rocco R20 to match the in-gear acceleration times and in todays climate, emissions seem to be the most important thing to manufacturers.
So my money is on - 2WD & 260bhp, so pretty much a replacment for the Ed 30 (but I've been told the engine isn't as strong as the Ed30 lump, so will need internals)
BTW, the GTi engine is a toyota unit - not sure on the R20 though??
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Im getting married next May (which plays havoc with a fellows finances). If it looks like that I will be down to the dealers upon return from my honeymoon.
Goodbye to freedom, hello to a housefull of shoes! :lipsrsealed: :lipsrsealed: :lipsrsealed: :lipsrsealed:
:grin: :grin:
Sadly I fully expect it to be Scirroco R running gear with maybe a little tweak but I can't see it being 4wd :sad:
I found this on the Scirroco's set up
http://www.autocar.co.uk/News/NewsArticle/AllCars/240236/
It looks like you may be right. :sad:
I wonder if Audi have got anything to do with this? Afterall, the new Mk6 engine, the EA888 was created and developed by Audi - and if Audi don't want it to be developed further, particularly increasing its power, then they might just put the stops on it. And I doubt they'd want a VW eclipsing their S3.
But the older EA113 Mk5 engine is now 'fair game', being used in all VAG marques.
:undecided: :undecided: :undecided: :undecided:
The R’s engine gets a new head, uprated pistons and conrods, and higher-pressure injectors. The turbo produces more boost, and there’s a new intercooler to deal with the extra heat.
So the above is IDENTICAL to the BHZ & CDL engines used in the S3 and TTS. So maybe VW is saying to Audi "if you won't let us develop your new engine, we'll just steal your current S3 one" :tongue: - because according to AutoCar, the anticipated 261 bhp and 258 <Jeremy Clarkson mode=on> torques <Jeremy Clarkson mode=off> - is identical to the imperial conversions of the S3s BHZ lump, even the torque rev-range spread is identical. :nerd: Or maybe AutoCar have just been stealing ideas from Wikipedia? :rolleyes: However, I've noticed a nugget of horse sh!t from AutoCar - the state "all of the torque is available from 2500rpm through to 5000rpm, one of the advantages of using direct injection on a petrol engine"!!! Erm, no, you stoopid journos - torque spread like that is a result of turbos, not how the fuel is injected - fcuking muppets . . . :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:
And why the fcuk are they (AutoCar) blatantly misleading readers over the XDS?
GTI’s electronic XDS differential
It is NOT an "electronic differential"! XDS is just an old skool jurassic conventional open differential, but the limitations of the conventional diff is merely anticipated by some pre-emptive braking of the inside driven wheel by . . . wait for it . . . . the ESP system! Fcuking muppets part deux. What else can I rip to shreds in AutoCars 'journalism'? :rolleyes:
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I agree - as much as we enthusiasts would love 4WD on the Golf R20, it plays havoc with emissions when trying to get the same performance as its 2WD counterparts - the engine would have to be uprated to produce more power than the Rocco R20 to match the in-gear acceleration times and in todays climate, emissions seem to be the most important thing to manufacturers.
I just don't get what all this 'craving' for it to be 4WD is anyway? Because the Haldex system, as a four wheel drive system, has bucket-loads of limitations and disadvantages over a 'true' 4WD system which uses a dynamic centre differential, rather than just a clutch.
And when Haldex operates, whilst it may give slightly superior traction, especially in a straight line - it actually upsets the handling, and messes with the dynamics of the vehicle. So if you can get a well-developed front end, coupled to a generally sweet-handling chassis - which the Mk5/Mk6 platform IS.
So my money is on - 2WD & 260bhp, so pretty much a replacment for the Ed 30 (but I've been told the engine isn't as strong as the Ed30 lump, so will need internals)
Where did that info come from? :huh: If it does get 261 ponies - then that is exactly the same as the current S3 - which has uprated internals over and above the Ed30 mota! :nerd:
BTW, the GTi engine is a toyota unit - not sure on the R20 though??
More horse sh!t! Care to name your source? :rolleyes:
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Autocar's journalism has really gone down hill over the last few years. Shame.
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Autocar's journalism has really gone down hill over the last few years. Shame.
Was it ever any good? :rolleyes:
Even our 'praised' VAG specialist mags, Volkswagen Driver, and Audi Driver - both suffer from some very poor journalism - which is why I cancelled my subscription to both! :rolleyes:
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I used to really enjoy Autocar, have bought it every week since 1992.
Definately not as good as it was though, loads of spelling and grammatical errors now, as well as poorly researched articles and 'photoshop' scoop pics.
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I agree - as much as we enthusiasts would love 4WD on the Golf R20, it plays havoc with emissions when trying to get the same performance as its 2WD counterparts - the engine would have to be uprated to produce more power than the Rocco R20 to match the in-gear acceleration times and in todays climate, emissions seem to be the most important thing to manufacturers.
So my money is on - 2WD & 260bhp, so pretty much a replacment for the Ed 30 (but I've been told the engine isn't as strong as the Ed30 lump, so will need internals)
BTW, the GTi engine is a toyota unit - not sure on the R20 though??
TOYOTA?! That remark almost got your post reported ;)
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Although I know TT will probably disagree the haldex system is more than capable for the job. Long sweeping bend yesterday and all my 2 fronts could manage was slight understeer and a whole load of bouncing around. The R would have been flat out and nailed that bend!!
I never realised how much the Haldex actually worked!!
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I guess that demonstrates how good the system was if you never noticed it working.
Are you going to update your sig pic with a shot of the new MK6?
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I guess that demonstrates how good the system was if you never noticed it working.
Are you going to update your sig pic with a shot of the new MK6?
Will eventually but not had a chance to give it a good clean. Going scotland tomorrow so no point yet. Probably will by the end of the week. But I still got the R... so its still a valid sig :tongue: :evil: