Author Topic: Golf V GTI OEM Xenon Installation Completed  (Read 21259 times)

Offline Teutonic_Tamer

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Re: Golf V GTI OEM Xenon Installation Completed
« Reply #30 on: 21 October 2008, 14:11 »
After market HIDs are not illegal as long as they pass the beam alignment test.

Sorry, but that is absolute bollox.

Washers are also not a legal requirement when fitted after it has left the factory. The washers are only required on cars that are built in factories (so standard xenons that come with the car)

Again, bollox.  Headlamp washers, and more importantly, automatic dynamic levelers are absolutely and categorically legally required.  It is both a UK and EU legal requirement.  Retro-fitting HIDs without the full OEM gubbins will invalidate the "Type Approval" for the car.  This will then invalidate your insurance (even if you do actually declare it as a mod), and will also lead to potential criminal prosecution for a breach under the "Construction and Use Regulations", and a breach of CUR is also a breach under the Road Traffic Act.

You cant fail an MOT for something you do not have to test, a good example is the spare tyre in some cars; if its bold just take it out before the test, if they cant check its bold they cant fail you!

A spare tyre is NOT a legal requirement - otherwise how come all these cars with "tyre mobility systems" (a bottle of slime and a mini compressor, instead of any kind of "spare wheel") can pass an MoT!

Correctly functioning headlamps which comply with the manufacturers Type Approval ARE a legal requirement, and a testable item.


I have aftermarket HIDs and it flew through the MOT last week. Its now passed in a Honda garage and my local garage.

Then you have just admitted to not only an illegal car, but also a dodgy MoT.  :rolleyes:

Firstly, telling me im admitting to something illegal when an 80+ thread on street racing is only a few posts up is abit silly. My HIDs wont kill anyone, spinning out at 100mph while racing will.

If you actually read through that so called "street racing" thread, you will notice that I have NEVER posted in that thread - so to bring that up whilst quoting my text is a bit of an "own goal".  :wink:

But onto the specifics of this thread.  HIDs, when incorrectly fitted or incorrectly aligned CAN cause fatal accidents.  Because the light generated is actally an "arc", this has much more serious adverse effects on the human retina (I can't speak for hedgehogs, badgers, or other roadside animals - but then they don't drive cars, nor fit illegal HID kits) - and cause much longer temporary blindness.  And just like you should never look directly at an arc welder, or lightning, you should never look at a HID beam.  A proper OEM HID lamp has a very sharp "cut-off", whereas these retro-fit kits have a very, very poor beam definition.

And think about the "excess speed" vs illegal HID argument you posed.  When driving, we all have a choice of weather to exceed the legal speed limit or not, and we all have a choice of weather to travel at an "excessive speed for the road conditions".  No, whilst I am not condoning braking speed limits in any way, I'm sure we would all agree that there are certain times and places where it is an absolute NO-NO to exceed the limit, but there are other occasions when, subject to personal acceptance of any fine/points - then there are contitions which many would deem "safe" to exceed the limit.  However, unless you never, ever drive in the dark or rain, then retro-fit HID kits are ILLEGAL and dangerous at all times when you have them on.

Finally, my father was very nearly killed in a very serious accident caused soley by being dazzled by illegal headlamps, and if there had been anyone in the front passenger seat, they would have been removed body piece by body piece and placed in a black zip up bag - all in the official police report.

Anyway, yes you are correct. My information was from a few threads which i searched for and didnt look at properly (they were dated 2007) so apologies for the false information, at the time this was theoretically correct due to loopholes (although i agree, illegal and so yes incorrect)

There is alot of loopholes currently surrounding aftermarket HIDs and even factory fit HIDs, as you say headlamp washers are a legal requirement;

I'm sorry, but these have always been illegal.  Just because the Government was useless at making the correct info easily available, it didn't make them "less" illegal.  There have been pleanty of editorial comments in the motoring press over the years, even AutoExpress categorically stated they were illegal a few years ago.

There are NO "loopholes".  For EU Type Approval, HID headlamp systems must use a specific headlamp housing, must have headlamp washers, must have automatic dynamic beam leveling - and must all be controlled by an ECU capable of being interrogated by the OBD-II protocol.  I can not see any scope for any such "loopholes".

how is it then that the integra DC5 is legally imported to the country and they come with HIDs as standard with no headlamp washers (as does the JDM ep3) My lights are technically legal as they pass the beam scatter test, unfortunatly most MOT testers (also police) dont realise the actual legal requirement involving HIDs. Also without a complete list of cars that roll out the factory with xenons fitted with all the correct legal parts its impossible to do anything, how would a police officer or mot tester tell someone in a DC5 they cant drive their car with HIDs when it came as standard?

But your lights are NOT legal.  Just because you happen to have an MoT certificate in your hands, it categorically does NOT vouch for the legality of your car.  By retro-fitting your HID kit, you have now invalidated your "Type Approval", which then means your car no longer complies with the UK Construction and Use Regs.  And to use a car on UK public roads which breaches CUR also means you also commit an offence under the Road Traffic Act - which means the Courts could ban you from driving, and order your car to be crushed.

And you really do not know anything about the regulatory system in the UK.  Any Police Officer or VOSA operative can request an online link directly to the factory which made the car (or who certified the Type Approval certificate) - and it will list the EXACT specification of the vehicle.  Insurance Assessors also have access to this info.  Still think you can "beat the system"?

An regarding "imports" - I suggest you Google "SVO".

The fact is unless they stop places like hids4u and other similar sites/traders selling aftermarket HIDs and release every car that has been made with HIDs/xenons as standard (inc plate/vin number) its will be very hard to stop them being fitted to cars.

But "e-commerce", ie web trading is not regulated in the same way that a shop or dealer are.  Secondly, the actual process of selling the stuff is NOT illegal.  It is the actual fitting of the stuff to the car which then makes the car illegal.  Just because my RS4 can travel at a top speed of 171 mph, does that make it illegal if I stick to the speed limits?

All i know is my car is much safer as i can see much better at night, and i have never had anyone flash me in the last year i have had them.

But that is your opinion.  However, the simple fact remains that your car IS illegal.  What if you drove along the M1 motorway at 90mph, and passed a copper without getting nicked - does that mean that it is now legal to drive at 90 on the M1 ???
Sean - Independent Automotive Engineering Technician (ret'd)
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'06/7 Golf Mk5 GTI 5dr (BWA) DSG, colour coded,

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Offline Teutonic_Tamer

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Re: Golf V GTI OEM Xenon Installation Completed
« Reply #31 on: 21 October 2008, 14:13 »
how would a police officer or mot tester tell someone in a DC5 they cant drive their car with HIDs when it came as standard?

The sam eway they can tell someone with an imported yank tank they can't drive on UK roads with flashing red indicators or a person with a jap import that they can't drve without a fog light. Imported cars have to pass a test to be registered in this country. I suspect the HID's are let through due to them not bein gin the current test for imported cars but I don't know the rules on that. I do know that flashing red indicators on yanks and no fog light on jap is a fail.

Nick

Spot on.  The same happens if I were to take my CBR into Germany, complete with my nice loud Micron race can - the German plod couldn't nick me, but if it were on a german registered bike, then they would be done for it.
Sean - Independent Automotive Engineering Technician (ret'd)
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I feel like a homo


Offline Hurdy

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Re: Golf V GTI OEM Xenon Installation Completed
« Reply #32 on: 21 October 2008, 14:15 »
Sean, you must feel a little bit better. Those last two posts were T_T specials :cool:
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Offline Greenouse

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Re: Golf V GTI OEM Xenon Installation Completed
« Reply #33 on: 21 October 2008, 14:18 »
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=3552517

Is this one legal or illegal?

Pity TT aint here to yell and scream  :evil:.

Mike


As others have stated, providing it has the headlamp washers, and the headlamps are the proper OEM units specifically designed for the HID bulbs (which it seems they are) - then they are legal.  :smiley:

Oh, and the auto leveling system is correctly calibrated.  :wink:

Welcome back Mr T_T  :smiley:

Ta.  :smiley:

Still not "firing on all four cylinders" though, if you get my drift:sick:

You mean eight surley  :grin:

Offline 182_blue

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Re: Golf V GTI OEM Xenon Installation Completed
« Reply #34 on: 21 October 2008, 14:19 »
TT. The car has factory fitted Xenon lights. Never have any washers ever jumped out and spraye the lights... The panels you speak of are there. But thats it. Piccie:



he he oops I mean:



Must I give a stealer a call and ask?

Mike

just one thing, did you have your lights on when you tried to wash the windows ?(which also washes the lights in the UK when you have headlight washers on)

Offline Teutonic_Tamer

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Re: Golf V GTI OEM Xenon Installation Completed
« Reply #35 on: 21 October 2008, 14:19 »
Sorry... My head is a little zoned at the moment.  :laugh:

I remember there being a sticker of sorts but the car is 50km away at the moment so wont be looking too soon. Will call VW Tomorrow and ask them.

Mike

Don't get it confused with the engine output sticker which is on the bottom of the drivers side B pillar!  :tongue:  :wink:
Sean - Independent Automotive Engineering Technician (ret'd)
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I feel like a homo


Offline Teutonic_Tamer

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Re: Golf V GTI OEM Xenon Installation Completed
« Reply #36 on: 21 October 2008, 14:22 »

Try and get a trim tool, or credit card, and lift the trim upwards, and see if the actuall washer jet has been fitted.  It takes quite a bit of effort, as the return spring is quite strong, though.

But a trip to your stealer does seem in order, unless you have, or know someone with VAG-COM.
TT can i ask a question, is it ok just to pull the head out ?, will it damage anything (just for future reference)

No, it is perfectly fine to pull the head section out.  You just have to watch your knuckles - even with latex gloves on, some hard plastic edges tend to take a little nibble of your skin.  It is what you have to do to adjust the aim of the jets.  It's a good idea to clean the gunge out from behind them too.
Sean - Independent Automotive Engineering Technician (ret'd)
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'06/7 Golf Mk5 GTI 5dr (BWA) DSG, colour coded,

I feel like a homo


Offline Teutonic_Tamer

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Re: Golf V GTI OEM Xenon Installation Completed
« Reply #37 on: 21 October 2008, 14:23 »
Sean, you must feel a little bit better. Those last two posts were T_T specials :cool:

Nursey, it is soon time for my medication again!  :tongue:  :grin:
Sean - Independent Automotive Engineering Technician (ret'd)
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'06/7 Golf Mk5 GTI 5dr (BWA) DSG, colour coded,

I feel like a homo


Offline 2007GTI

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Re: Golf V GTI OEM Xenon Installation Completed
« Reply #38 on: 21 October 2008, 14:23 »
Im having some serious De Ja Vue, isn't anyone else? good postings T T.
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Offline 182_blue

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Re: Golf V GTI OEM Xenon Installation Completed
« Reply #39 on: 21 October 2008, 14:31 »

Try and get a trim tool, or credit card, and lift the trim upwards, and see if the actuall washer jet has been fitted.  It takes quite a bit of effort, as the return spring is quite strong, though.

But a trip to your stealer does seem in order, unless you have, or know someone with VAG-COM.
TT can i ask a question, is it ok just to pull the head out ?, will it damage anything (just for future reference)

No, it is perfectly fine to pull the head section out.  You just have to watch your knuckles - even with latex gloves on, some hard plastic edges tend to take a little nibble of your skin.  It is what you have to do to adjust the aim of the jets.  It's a good idea to clean the gunge out from behind them too.

Thanks, its just one of mine sits a little proud of the bumper and i wanted to investigate it, as i dont want the cap to come off and loose it, i reckon its more to do woth the way the whole mechanism is held to the bumper though