Keyless repeater thefts

[kmpowell]

Can I ask where these “facts” can be found? Sounds like near field communication technology might be better named far field technology. I am prepared to be educated, but the thought that this feature could be so radically flawed is disturbing.

Here you go, a simple video from December 2016 when the problem first started to gain traction, showing you don't have to be very close/near to a person to grab the signal...

https://www.nbcnews.com/nightly-news/video/consumer-alert-thieves-getting-into-vehicles-using-remote-car-keys-827471939792

Technology has now advanced that the 'scanner' is even stronger. I have no reasons to make anything up, I'm simply trying to help people be more aware of the dangers. Each person's scenario is different, but the basic 'relay' premise is the same and the distances have been tested by thieves who have openly bragged and shown it on 'dingers' pages.

[fredgroves]

The answer is simply - the vehicle OEM's designed their transmitter/receiver to operate at close range, but with high gain equipment its possible to receive the signal at much greater ranges.

Remember the bad guys kit isn't about "normal" operability, its about gaming the technology.

I've not seen the kit myself, but I suspect it even has a function to enable drive by scanning for likely targets - so you can cruise a street and ID a likely target without having to walk up driveways and check for a keyless vehicle by looking in the window...

The scuzzbags doing this aren't technically savvy btw - the clever people are the ones building this stuff. In the same way as you don't understand how your mobile phone is designed or constructed, they are just users of off the shelf technology for a purpose.

[Gtiless]

So can you get the keyless turned off altogether does anyone know?

And if you can does that then stop the possibility of this kind of repeater theft altogether?

Another thought- I may be buying one which has keyless, I wonder if I could get the dealer to turn it off ready for me to collect it?

[Vwjap]

If I remember correctly you can either do the doors but not the boot, or everything but then you have to hold the key next to the steering column

[Booth11]

So can you get the keyless turned off altogether does anyone know?

And if you can does that then stop the possibility of this kind of repeater theft altogether?

Another thought- I may be buying one which has keyless, I wonder if I could get the dealer to turn it off ready for me to collect it?

If I remember correctly you can either do the doors but not the boot, or everything but then you have to hold the key next to the steering column

Link to another forum but take a look on this thread for how to disable keyless with obdeleven. Also mentions the boot locking.

https://www.vwroc.com/forums/topic/30978-how-to-disable-kessy/

[hog_hedge]

Can I ask where these “facts” can be found? Sounds like near field communication technology might be better named far field technology. I am prepared to be educated, but the thought that this feature could be so radically flawed is disturbing.

NFC is called so due to the power involved. Add a simple circuit with an amplifier, a few filters and a large enough power source you can re-transmit any frequency for miles.

[Talk-torque]

Can I ask where these “facts” can be found? Sounds like near field communication technology might be better named far field technology. I am prepared to be educated, but the thought that this feature could be so radically flawed is disturbing.

NFC is called so due to the power involved. Add a simple circuit with an amplifier, a few filters and a large enough power source you can re-transmit any frequency for miles.

It’s picking up the signal from 25m that I struggle with.

[fredgroves]

Some proper technical description here:

https://eprint.iacr.org/2010/332.pdf

Yes, the year 2010....nine years ago.

I also read some other technical articles that basically say that short of signal blocking or disabling it, there is no technical solution to relay attacks.

The next generation solution.... mobile device (aka "phone") based "keys" that do not transmit over unsecured airwaves, but instead talk to your car over the internet... (I can hear the Luddites screaming now!). Bosch already have a packaged solution ready to roll...

[Watts]

How about a simple solution, a physical device shaped individually to each car, lets call it a "key"

[Vwjap]

So can you get the keyless turned off altogether does anyone know?

And if you can does that then stop the possibility of this kind of repeater theft altogether?

Another thought- I may be buying one which has keyless, I wonder if I could get the dealer to turn it off ready for me to collect it?

If I remember correctly you can either do the doors but not the boot, or everything but then you have to hold the key next to the steering column

Link to another forum but take a look on this thread for how to disable keyless with obdeleven. Also mentions the boot locking.

https://www.vwroc.com/forums/topic/30978-how-to-disable-kessy/

so exactly what I said