GTI vs GTD the eco question

[rgb]

Strange question for a performance car - I know - but in reality most of the cars milage will be stuck in traffic, taking kids to school etc etc.

From what I've read, the GTI has better handling and is more fun than the GTD. On the other hand, there's a big difference in CO2 emissions  (170 g/km for the GTI compared to 140 g/km for the GTD, I think).  I don't cover a lot of miles per year (<8k), so the difference in costs isn't particularly important, it's just an eco-responsibility-thing that has me thinking I should be ordering the GTD.

...but is it as straight-forward as the CO2 figures suggest?

Diesels used to have high levels of Nitro-oxides and produce lots of soot. My current '05 A3 TDI certainly stinks when it starts up and leaves a cloud of soot behind it when accelerating hard. Anyone know if these issues have been fixed in the new generation engines?

[jdjd]

Basically m8 if your worried about green, Just go for an LPG conversion. Quite honestly a cars co2 emission has no bearing on what  car I buy whatsoever. Only time im ever bothered is when I go down to the postoffice to tax the **** You answered the question yourself the GTI is faster,nicer and alot more fun to drive, If milage isn't an issue then why would any1 ever opt for a diesel? I bet there's nothing in it for insurance either.

[Spartacus]

Sounds as if your A3 needs an italian tune up !. My MkV Golf diesel does the same thing on accelerating but stops after a good blast, a fill up from Shell V Diesel or when I add some Millers Sport.

If you are worried about the economic impact then you should be buying second hand. The GTi emissions are amazingly low when you look at the competition it has, but also when you look at other diesels. The Ford 2.0 diesel is 168g/km for goodnesss sake.

The manufacturing of a car is equivelent to 30,000 miles. Don't get me started on the hybrids and the impact that their battieries have on the environment in manufacturing and disposal. Anyway A little perspective on the matter :

"carbon dioxide in the atmosphere = 0.039% by volume

carbon cycle proportion of carbon dixoide contributed by mankind 3.4% (IPCC)

UK contribution to global emissions 2% (DEFRA)

Proportion of this due to cars = 16% (DEFRA again)

So cars in the UK are responsible for 16% of 2% of 3.4% of 0.039% which is precisely bugger all. Globally - just take out the 2% and it increases from bugger all to naff all.

If you go further, and consider the devil's chariot (the 4x4) then as these make up 8% of UK car sales (SMMT) then they are responsible for 8% of 16% of 2% of 3.4% of 0.039% which is the square root of bugger all.

Does that make you feel better ?

[R32UK]

Sounds as if your A3 needs an italian tune up !. My MkV Golf diesel does the same thing on accelerating but stops after a good blast, a fill up from Shell V Diesel or when I add some Millers Sport.

If you are worried about the economic impact then you should be buying second hand. The GTi emissions are amazingly low when you look at the competition it has, but also when you look at other diesels. The Ford 2.0 diesel is 168g/km for goodnesss sake.

The manufacturing of a car is equivelent to 30,000 miles. Don't get me started on the hybrids and the impact that their battieries have on the environment in manufacturing and disposal. Anyway A little perspective on the matter :

"carbon dioxide in the atmosphere = 0.039% by volume

carbon cycle proportion of carbon dixoide contributed by mankind 3.4% (IPCC)

UK contribution to global emissions 2% (DEFRA)

Proportion of this due to cars = 16% (DEFRA again)

So cars in the UK are responsible for 16% of 2% of 3.4% of 0.039% which is precisely bugger all. Globally - just take out the 2% and it increases from bugger all to naff all.

If you go further, and consider the devil's chariot (the 4x4) then as these make up 8% of UK car sales (SMMT) then they are responsible for 8% of 16% of 2% of 3.4% of 0.039% which is the square root of bugger all.

Does that make you feel better ?

Certainly makes me feel better

[mds69]

...but is it as straight-forward as the CO2 figures suggest?

Checkout :-
http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/front_website/facts_and_figures.php?id=238867

and

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/front_website/facts_and_figures.php?id=237421

..came across these a while ago...Autoexpress's 'actual CO2' figures for their (admittedly two completely different probably) test drives reckon the GTD puts out more!  So, if you drive a GTi/GTD like you should the GTi is possibly greener (whatever that means)!    Wouldn't normally take AutoExpress that seriously but they were good reviews in this case.

I think the DPF on the latest diesels sorts out most of the NoX issues but, saying that, was reading the other day that the EuroVI engine emissions stuff is much more strict on this and Diesels are going to need the expensive exhaust treatments they have to use in the US now...

[Graeme1978]

The GTD I'm getting this month is a company car, I only opted for the GTD over the GTI because the company car tax is over £200 cheaper and I'll save a fair bit in fuel over the 2 years as well.

[Jkctr]

Do a search on DEFRA, they piss away money given to them to find 'global warming evidence' (just writing that makes me cringe seeing as there isnt any)

Get what car you want, they are going to struggle to keep making out we affect the climate soon and we can go back to driving awesome cars (not remapped diesels packaged as fun hot hatches  )

[mds69]

The GTD I'm getting this month is a company car, I only opted for the GTD over the GTI because the company car tax is over £200 cheaper and I'll save a fair bit in fuel over the 2 years as well.

I have a GTD - my point was that, essentially it's all just BS really isn't it?  Both cars are reasonably good CO2 wise.  I got the GTD for the same reasons as you (i.e. I'm a miser who doesn't want a Prius!)  

[mac7]

Choosing a diesel engine over petrol has to be about cost of ownership - such as taxation on a company car, or mpg. Otherwise the arguement falls in favour of petrol every time. Unless perhaps you are a caravanner. 

Diesel engine emissions pose a far greater risk to health and the local environment in towns and cities and should be banned.

And as man-made climate change is a myth you can buy whatever petrol engined car you like/can afford and 'drive it like you stole it' with a clear conscience. CO2 is irrelevant unless it's all you have left to breath.

[Exonian]

If you're that worried about being green you'd have a job that didn't involve travelling or a company car and would cycle to work. If you were one of the middle class eco-conscious career types who was a bit concerned some of your colleagues were looking at you in the wrong way you would order a blue motion or something that would save you money (as long as you're not paying the bills yourself as the blue motion uses special tyres and stuff like that).
If on the other hand you just want a bit of fun in your motoring and want to save a bit of company car tax (what it really sounds like from you post reading between the lines) then the GTD is fine. Just as quick as a GTI in every day driving.
The GTI is something you would spend you own money on, the GTD is something you're happy to spend someone elses money on. In my not very humble opinion.