How not to drive round combe in an RS4

[Diamond Hell]

Errrr

1. Someone's already posted that link - it's a guy getting a slap on, on an oil spill on a motorway.  Almost any car would have stepped out.  Nothing to do with it being an Audi.  Big question is why was the guy filming himself in the first place?  Maybe he knew about the oil, maybe it was a set up for him to show off his car control.

2. Sweeping generalisations make you sound dumb.  You seem to be saying Audis are all snappy.  The TT's handling foible was due to poor aerodynamics causing instability at high speeds.  This was amplified by the damper set up on the car.  The problem was picked up post launch and the cars were recalled to have not only the spoiler fitted, but also substantial modifications to the suspension.  

The TT and the A3 are Golf4 platform-based, so if they had endemic handling issues the Golf4 etc would handle similarly.  Their 4WD systems are Haldex, not Torsen (as proper quattros are).  The earlier A4 is Passat/A4 platform which is totally different to the Golf4 platform.  The A4 which the RS4 is based on is a different platform again and uses Torsen set up 60% rear 40% front drive.  All of Audi's previous 4WD systems were 50:50 drive split.  This means older Audis are more prone to understeer than the RS4.

All this means it's comparatively much easier to provoke a tail-slide in an RS4 vs earlier Audis.  The original clip was just someone in a high-power car, exceeding his talent quotient and failing to safely deal with a big car having a big tail-out moment.  Lack of talent was the problem, not poor handling trait.

[clipperjay]

Errrr

1. Someone's already posted that link - it's a guy getting a slap on, on an oil spill on a motorway.  Almost any car would have stepped out.  Nothing to do with it being an Audi.  Big question is why was the guy filming himself in the first place?  Maybe he knew about the oil, maybe it was a set up for him to show off his car control.

2. Sweeping generalisations make you sound dumb.  You seem to be saying Audis are all snappy.  The TT's handling foible was due to poor aerodynamics causing instability at high speeds.  This was amplified by the damper set up on the car.  The problem was picked up post launch and the cars were recalled to have not only the spoiler fitted, but also substantial modifications to the suspension.  

The TT and the A3 are Golf4 platform-based, so if they had endemic handling issues the Golf4 etc would handle similarly.  Their 4WD systems are Haldex, not Torsen (as proper quattros are).  The earlier A4 is Passat/A4 platform which is totally different to the Golf4 platform.  The A4 which the RS4 is based on is a different platform again and uses Torsen set up 60% rear 40% front drive.  All of Audi's previous 4WD systems were 50:50 drive split.  This means older Audis are more prone to understeer than the RS4.

All this means it's comparatively much easier to provoke a tail-slide in an RS4 vs earlier Audis.  The original clip was just someone in a high-power car, exceeding his talent quotient and failing to safely deal with a big car having a big tail-out moment.  Lack of talent was the problem, not poor handling trait.

DH have debated with American on politics?
Sounds like you have a no BS policy of your own going on there fella?

Lets be fair all tech in a car helps you out, but if you are going to drive speeds beyond your capabilities then when something is going to happen you either over compensate or do nothing like a scared rabbit in headlights? The guy did do the right moves to get it back into shape still his hands must have been shaking afterwards.
   

[Thom89]

Errrr

1. Someone's already posted that link - it's a guy getting a slap on, on an oil spill on a motorway.  Almost any car would have stepped out.  Nothing to do with it being an Audi.  Big question is why was the guy filming himself in the first place?  Maybe he knew about the oil, maybe it was a set up for him to show off his car control.

2. Sweeping generalisations make you sound dumb.  You seem to be saying Audis are all snappy.  The TT's handling foible was due to poor aerodynamics causing instability at high speeds.  This was amplified by the damper set up on the car.  The problem was picked up post launch and the cars were recalled to have not only the spoiler fitted, but also substantial modifications to the suspension.  

The TT and the A3 are Golf4 platform-based, so if they had endemic handling issues the Golf4 etc would handle similarly.  Their 4WD systems are Haldex, not Torsen (as proper quattros are).  The earlier A4 is Passat/A4 platform which is totally different to the Golf4 platform.  The A4 which the RS4 is based on is a different platform again and uses Torsen set up 60% rear 40% front drive.  All of Audi's previous 4WD systems were 50:50 drive split.  This means older Audis are more prone to understeer than the RS4.

All this means it's comparatively much easier to provoke a tail-slide in an RS4 vs earlier Audis.  The original clip was just someone in a high-power car, exceeding his talent quotient and failing to safely deal with a big car having a big tail-out moment.  Lack of talent was the problem, not poor handling trait.

Pretty much all fair comment, and points that could be argued all day long, but I feel that I have grounds for my point to be made!
I have an Audi A4 Avant that I like to throw about. generally entering a bend, or a roundabout (in this case) too fast,would result in mild, but controllable understeer, totally predictable, only this day I pushed a little harder, just as the understeer came in, It was all over, the back end just went, completely without warning, an instant 180 on the apex of a roundabout, no other traffic involved, no damage, it was a warm day and no problems with he car
A week or so later we were testing one of our race cars at Bruntingthorpe, after the session I decided to recreate what had happened, on one of the tarmac sections, bottom line here is that I could get it to oversteer again, and again, but not once could I get it back!
Tom

[Wayne]

Errrr

1. Someone's already posted that link - it's a guy getting a slap on, on an oil spill on a motorway.  Almost any car would have stepped out.  Nothing to do with it being an Audi.  Big question is why was the guy filming himself in the first place?  Maybe he knew about the oil, maybe it was a set up for him to show off his car control.

2. Sweeping generalisations make you sound dumb.  You seem to be saying Audis are all snappy.  The TT's handling foible was due to poor aerodynamics causing instability at high speeds.  This was amplified by the damper set up on the car.  The problem was picked up post launch and the cars were recalled to have not only the spoiler fitted, but also substantial modifications to the suspension.  

The TT and the A3 are Golf4 platform-based, so if they had endemic handling issues the Golf4 etc would handle similarly.  Their 4WD systems are Haldex, not Torsen (as proper quattros are).  The earlier A4 is Passat/A4 platform which is totally different to the Golf4 platform.  The A4 which the RS4 is based on is a different platform again and uses Torsen set up 60% rear 40% front drive.  All of Audi's previous 4WD systems were 50:50 drive split.  This means older Audis are more prone to understeer than the RS4.

All this means it's comparatively much easier to provoke a tail-slide in an RS4 vs earlier Audis.  The original clip was just someone in a high-power car, exceeding his talent quotient and failing to safely deal with a big car having a big tail-out moment.  Lack of talent was the problem, not poor handling trait.

Taken from wikipedia:

Early TT models gained press coverage for a series of high-speed accidents in Europe. Reported crashes and related fatalities occurred at speeds in excess of 110 mph (180 km/h) during abrupt lane changes or sharp turns. Both the coupe and roadster models were recalled in late 1999/early 2000 to improve predictability of the car's handling at very high-speeds. Audi's Electronic Stability Programme, and rear spoiler were added, along with suspension modifications. All changes were subsequently incorporated into future versions of the car.

[Diamond Hell]

Is there a point to that last post, or are you just quoting from Wikipedia for a laugh?

Every car has a limit - you've described pushing through the initial understeer that the car has be set up to provide as a safety 'warning' to the driver.  If you've pushed through that then you're into the far land of no-grip and there are myriad things that might happen. 

Audis are set up to understeer in a fairly determined manner.  They're not sold as 'drift' cars, they're sold as a conservative, well-built car with safe handling.  If you're prepared to push through that which the manufacturer has set up to kick people away from the limit (which is quite a reasonable way to go about things) then really you're into bush/armco investigation mode.

Your A4 is a very different beast to the RS4, so the comparison is disingenuous.  By extension the TT/A3 etc comparisons are also inappropriate as the architecture under the car is totally different.

[Horney]

then really you're into bush/armco investigation mode.

This just one click away from stun on most of my cars. A good mode for sunday afternoons, but best avoided on the daily comute.

Nick