GolfGTIforum.co.uk
Model specific boards => Golf mk2 => Topic started by: Khare on 05 October 2008, 22:35
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gonna start this topic after mew said i can reach 100hp (ish) with less that £100.
let me state where i am at the moment.
Weber 32/34 carb
GTI camshaft.
thats what i have at the moment and im running 82hp.
Mew suggested gti 8v head and gti 8v exhasut manifold. saw this beauty on ebay.
click here (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=170269014208&fromMakeTrack=true&ssPageName=VIP:Watchlink:middle:uk)
Ive got a 1989 1.6 driver. Exhaust manifold is C clip type. Will this manifold on ebay replace my standard manifold and downpipe?
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Was just about to post the link to that, saw it ealier! Yeah that will replace your current manifold and downpipe.
Btw, i never said you can reach 100bhp, i just said i'm sure you'll get more than what you currently have!
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Btw, i never said you can reach 100bhp, i just said i'm sure you'll get more than what you currently have!
well im gonna try reach 100 anyway :grin:
if i can get over 90 i'l be very happy indeed.
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on a 1.6 with
webber 32/34
PB head and cam (gti) with minor bit of porting
shaved hedghog ( manifold heater)
full gti exhaust
k jet 8v dizzy
ive topped 100 quite easaly
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on a 1.6 with
webber 32/34
PB head and cam (gti) with minor bit of porting
shaved hedghog ( manifold heater)
full gti exhaust
k jet 8v dizzy
ive topped 100 quite easaly
hedgehod thing, is it easy to do? and what does shaving it do?
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the hedghog is lives below the carb in the inlet manifold and it is meant to help mix air and fuel at mega low tempritures but as it never gets that cold here it's not really needed and it has to the most flow restricting thing possible so take it out and and cut the bugger down flat.
the mod to hedghog itself is easy but the inlet manifold is not fun to remove
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Btw, i never said you can reach 100bhp, i just said i'm sure you'll get more than what you currently have!
well im gonna try reach 100 anyway :grin:
if i can get over 90 i'l be very happy indeed.
That is still 100 down on what I have!! :evil: :evil: :evil:
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on a 1.6 with
webber 32/34
PB head and cam (gti) with minor bit of porting
shaved hedghog ( manifold heater)
full gti exhaust
k jet 8v dizzy
ive topped 100 quite easaly
surley the money spent on that lot, you could just buy an old gti engine and install that?
would probably work out cheaper and ur gna have at least 130ish! in there.
Get this a lot in the ford scene, with people trying to make a 1.4 or 1.6 quicker, its so more ecomimical just to change the engine!
I suppose the only argument u may have is "insurance", but from the way i see it i cant think there will be much difference in price between a modified 1.6 on the limit at 100bhp, or a gti engine swap to 130!
Oh and just to add, you will probably spend all that money and a month later u will probably want more power again!!
Ive had 480 bhp before, and even tho i sold it cos it was too quick, i still wanted more power!!
no brainer really. stop buggering around, get on ebay and buy an old gti engine, prob get one for £100!
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Ignore the nay-sayers. If you want to chase BHP on a 1.6 - go for it. A bit of cheap junkyard tuning is good for a bit of low-price fun.
I have a K-jet dizzi here, if you're interested. This came out of a K-jet fueled Scirocco, so it should be the one with the more aggressive advance.
If it were me I'd hold on and get a PB head on at the same time you do the manifold and downpipe. This'll get the motor breathing much better. Porting work can get quite expensive as you're generally paying for time from an experienced engineer.
You *can* always buy a Dremel-type tool and smooth out some of the bigger lumps on the casting (not too smooth though - you need the inlet charge to tumble). If you test fit the exhaust and inlet manifold gaskets you will see if there's any material sticking out past the gaskets. If there is, cut this back with the dremel, to open the ports out. You can do this both on the head and on the manifolds, so you have matched the ports to the manifolds - this will improve flow as there aren't any 'steps' in the system. It's not rocket science, but it might just help you achieve your 100bhp.
Make sure you've got healthy compression, specifically that your bottom end is sound before going down this route. Also bear in mind that if you dramatically improve flow you might lean the fueling out, so after a batch of mods you may need to re-jet the carb - this is really a job best done on a rolling road - more expense, but that's quite a lot of what turning up the wick on car is all about....
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i have an 8v cam somewhere you can have if your ever near guildford
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I have a K-jet dizzi here, if you're interested. This came out of a K-jet fueled Scirocco, so it should be the one with the more aggressive advance.
Im very interested mate. does it also come with the small plug that goes on the side? RJ said i should get the plug to have it working at 100%.
As for the head porting, sounds like its fairly easy, and i might give it a go. Theres an 8v gti head on ebay going pretty cheap at the moment, and ive got my eye on it. So if i do win it, i'l try some porting.
Also been thinking about re-jetting my carb to 1.8, and i think now is about the time.
cheers for the info diamond, and im very interested in the dizzie. PM me how much you looking for it? (bear in mine ive got about £100 for everything so dont be mean!) :smiley:
i have an 8v cam somewhere you can have if your ever near guildford
and thanks buddy, but as i stated in the first post, ive already got an 8v gti camshaft in the 1.6 head, so i wont be needing it. But thanks for the offer anyway :wink:
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i should read the post properly next time :laugh:
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Ignore the nay-sayers. If you want to chase BHP on a 1.6 - go for it. A bit of cheap junkyard tuning is good for a bit of low-price fun.
I have a K-jet dizzi here, if you're interested. This came out of a K-jet fueled Scirocco, so it should be the one with the more aggressive advance.
If it were me I'd hold on and get a PB head on at the same time you do the manifold and downpipe. This'll get the motor breathing much better. Porting work can get quite expensive as you're generally paying for time from an experienced engineer.
You *can* always buy a Dremel-type tool and smooth out some of the bigger lumps on the casting (not too smooth though - you need the inlet charge to tumble). If you test fit the exhaust and inlet manifold gaskets you will see if there's any material sticking out past the gaskets. If there is, cut this back with the dremel, to open the ports out. You can do this both on the head and on the manifolds, so you have matched the ports to the manifolds - this will improve flow as there aren't any 'steps' in the system. It's not rocket science, but it might just help you achieve your 100bhp.
Make sure you've got healthy compression, specifically that your bottom end is sound before going down this route. Also bear in mind that if you dramatically improve flow you might lean the fueling out, so after a batch of mods you may need to re-jet the carb - this is really a job best done on a rolling road - more expense, but that's quite a lot of what turning up the wick on car is all about....
but even the things you have just spoken about all add up to way more than the price of a 2nd hand gti lump.
Theres loads of gti engines around, easily picked up for £150-200.
Dont get me wrong, im not against the chap tuning up the 1.6, after all it can be enjoyable and rewarding.
But from a money point of view, its TOTAL FALSE ECONOMY.
£300,400-500? to tune up the 1.6 with all the parts, rolling road, and not to mention the time to do it all. and all for 90-100bhp
£200 (£300 for a good lump with proven history/milage, or even a whole donor car i.e mot rust failure then sell the scrap shell to get some dosh back) and you have a guranteed 130bhp at least. and could all be done in a weekend!
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i should read the post properly next time :laugh:
dont worry mate i do it all the time :grin:
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but even the things you have just spoken about all add up to way more than the price of a 2nd hand gti lump.
Theres loads of gti engines around, easily picked up for £150-200.
Dont get me wrong, im not against the chap tuning up the 1.6, after all it can be enjoyable and rewarding.
But from a money point of view, its TOTAL FALSE ECONOMY.
£300,400-500? to tune up the 1.6 with all the parts, rolling road, and not to mention the time to do it all. and all for 90-100bhp
£200 (£300 for a good lump with proven history/milage, or even a whole donor car i.e mot rust failure then sell the scrap shell to get some dosh back) and you have a guranteed 130bhp at least. and could all be done in a weekend!
I think everyone knows what you're saying there mate and agree with it, but as mentioned the guy is aiming to do it all for a ton and you'd be very hard pushed to do a gti conversion for that. Also take into account that if he has an accident then the gti lump would be quite obvious to an insurance assessor, whereas a gti head and manifold not so obvious, should he not bother declaring it. :wink: The other bonus to his plans is that it can all be done in a day, whereas the gti engine is a little more involved what with the loom and fuel pumps etc.
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but even the things you have just spoken about all add up to way more than the price of a 2nd hand gti lump.
Theres loads of gti engines around, easily picked up for £150-200.
Dont get me wrong, im not against the chap tuning up the 1.6, after all it can be enjoyable and rewarding.
But from a money point of view, its TOTAL FALSE ECONOMY.
£300,400-500? to tune up the 1.6 with all the parts, rolling road, and not to mention the time to do it all. and all for 90-100bhp
£200 (£300 for a good lump with proven history/milage, or even a whole donor car i.e mot rust failure then sell the scrap shell to get some dosh back) and you have a guranteed 130bhp at least. and could all be done in a weekend!
i know what you mean mate, but if i said gti engine to insurance companies, my insurance would start going up like mad. i know engines can be picked up for £200, but im not gonna spend that on modding this one, if im lucky, and search carefully, i can buy all the bits for under £100 as mew said. ok, some bits like rejetting are better bought new, and it costs £25 to rejet to 1.8, but then i make up for it buy lucky ebay auctions etc.
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on a 1.6 with
webber 32/34
PB head and cam (gti) with minor bit of porting
shaved hedghog ( manifold heater)
full gti exhaust
k jet 8v dizzy
ive topped 100 quite easaly
surley the money spent on that lot, you could just buy an old gti engine and install that?
would probably work out cheaper and ur gna have at least 130ish! in there.
Get this a lot in the ford scene, with people trying to make a 1.4 or 1.6 quicker, its so more ecomimical just to change the engine!
I suppose the only argument u may have is "insurance", but from the way i see it i cant think there will be much difference in price between a modified 1.6 on the limit at 100bhp, or a gti engine swap to 130!
Oh and just to add, you will probably spend all that money and a month later u will probably want more power again!!
Ive had 480 bhp before, and even tho i sold it cos it was too quick, i still wanted more power!!
no brainer really. stop buggering around, get on ebay and buy an old gti engine, prob get one for £100!
did that for a lot less than £100
headset £0.99 + 2.99 postage ( ebay)
dead gti engine £20 (local scrappy)
exhaust £15
carb £15 from renult 5 ( local scrappy )
shaved hedghog £ free
porting £2.99 ( cheep carbide bit for drill )
jets £20
grand total £76.97
it can be done
anyway spending £300 on a counterflow 8 valve woudl be a waste of money id be looking to go 16v
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carb, camshaft ive already got, so that saves me bout £200.
And as danny said. Porting, shaving hedgehog, is cheap/free, and getting hold of bits, f you know were to look it can be very cheap.
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just don't get over excited with the porting, just match the inlet ports on the head to the gasket and the same on the inlet manifold that way it's inpossible to bugger things up, cutting the hedghog down is where the power gain comes from big differance from 4000 rpm
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just don't get over excited with the porting, just match the inlet ports on the head to the gasket and the same on the inlet manifold that way it's inpossible to bugger things up, cutting the hedghog down is where the power gain comes from big differance from 4000 rpm
:wink: cheers for the tips mate. I'l see if i win the head, if i do, i'l pick it up this weekend, and get the work started. I'l buy the bits i need, get it nice and clean and shiny, then give it a lick of paint.
where would you say i buy the HG, head bolts, and other gaskets from? also, if i have a 1.8 gti head, would i need 1.8 gti headgasket, 1.8 exhaust gasket, and 1.8 inlet manifold gasket?
Im thinking somewere like GSF or ECP, but what would you say?
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tuning a driver can be cool, carbs ect but i think youll struggle for £100. just to throw another one into the pot, i know someone who recently bagged an ABF lump on ebay for £70.. 150bhp...
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tuning a driver can be cool, carbs ect but i think youll struggle for £100. just to throw another one into the pot, i know someone who recently bagged an ABF lump on ebay for £70.. 150bhp...
as said before, if i fit an ABF or gti lump, i have to claim it cos tehres a big difference. and being 17 with a gti insurance will rape me.
But if i stick a gti manifold, and head...well, it doesnt look much different than on the driver, so if something ahppens, the insruance man, unless hee's well into his mk2's, he wont be able to tell the difference.
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but even the things you have just spoken about all add up to way more than the price of a 2nd hand gti lump.
Theres loads of gti engines around, easily picked up for £150-200.
Dont get me wrong, im not against the chap tuning up the 1.6, after all it can be enjoyable and rewarding.
But from a money point of view, its TOTAL FALSE ECONOMY.
£300,400-500? to tune up the 1.6 with all the parts, rolling road, and not to mention the time to do it all. and all for 90-100bhp
£200 (£300 for a good lump with proven history/milage, or even a whole donor car i.e mot rust failure then sell the scrap shell to get some dosh back) and you have a guranteed 130bhp at least. and could all be done in a weekend!
i know what you mean mate, but if i said gti engine to insurance companies, my insurance would start going up like mad. i know engines can be picked up for £200, but im not gonna spend that on modding this one, if im lucky, and search carefully, i can buy all the bits for under £100 as mew said. ok, some bits like rejetting are better bought new, and it costs £25 to rejet to 1.8, but then i make up for it buy lucky ebay auctions etc.
Well fair play to you, wasnt knocking you mate. As i said tuning something like that can be fun and challenging, and thats half point isnt it! so good luck to you matey.
Its just from a personal view point, i still feel its money ill spent if you look at it in the long run. And i can promise you in 4-5months time you will be bored and want more power, and u will wish u had fitted a gti lump.
I am shocked that you plan not to tell the insurance tho, ive always declared everything. you only need one thing to go wrong and it could cost u a lot!!
I had an accident once, and they litterally combed the car over to check if it had been fettled with. its serious arse rape stuff if u do get caught!!
but on the other hand i totally understand. With the cosworth (which i only drive on the odd sunny sundays) i was paying £195 PER MONTH!!!! to insure it.
my car insurance premium this year was £3200!!!! and i have a clean licence with 4 years NCB
so i totally understand.
Saying that tho not im 25 my quote last week for a 1.8 gti 16v was £250 for the year
and for the mk2 vr6 with the 2.8 pushing 200bhp, the quote was.... £300. so no supprise which car i bought!!
Anyway good luck matey.
(i give u 5 months befroe ur bored :drool:)
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Out of interest, do you even know how much power your engine is putting out at the moment? Have you questioned the purpose of the Hedgehog someone on here mentions (its there for fuel economy btw, not just to stop icing and think how much fuel costs nowadays)? Do you even have a concept of what to port in a cylinder head should you go down that route or any idea how close the coolant and oil passages are to the ports? Have you considered the cost of the tools you will have to buy to remove and refit the head, the gaskets you will need to replace, the bolts you SHOULD replace, the coolant you will have to replace, the oil and filter you will have to replace, the cambelt and tensioner that you may need and only find out about once the belt is off or even the potential replacement water pump you may find you need? I think that covers most of the bits that you may need to consider before you even buy a cylinder head or whatever else you want to modify to do with the existing head.
Sorry to be so negative but unless you really know what your doing (which asking for advice and not picking up on the above costs suggests you really dont), modifying engines isnt cheap and neither is getting towed home without AA etc cover if your fiddling breaks something down the line. For my peneth worth id spend the £100 on a new set of polybushes for the front wishbones, two new quality front tyres or a cheap suspension kit from ebay but only fit the dampers (the springs are normally complete trash that are worth more in scrap money than they are on any car).
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Out of interest, do you even know how much power your engine is putting out at the moment? Have you questioned the purpose of the Hedgehog someone on here mentions (its there for fuel economy btw, not just to stop icing and think how much fuel costs nowadays)? Do you even have a concept of what to port in a cylinder head should you go down that route or any idea how close the coolant and oil passages are to the ports? Have you considered the cost of the tools you will have to buy to remove and refit the head, the gaskets you will need to replace, the bolts you SHOULD replace, the coolant you will have to replace, the oil and filter you will have to replace, the cambelt and tensioner that you may need and only find out about once the belt is off or even the potential replacement water pump you may find you need? I think that covers most of the bits that you may need to consider before you even buy a cylinder head or whatever else you want to modify to do with the existing head.
Sorry to be so negative but unless you really know what your doing (which asking for advice and not picking up on the above costs suggests you really dont), modifying engines isnt cheap and neither is getting towed home without AA etc cover if your fiddling breaks something down the line. For my peneth worth id spend the £100 on a new set of polybushes for the front wishbones, two new quality front tyres or a cheap suspension kit from ebay but only fit the dampers (the springs are normally complete trash that are worth more in scrap money than they are on any car).
i know what your trying to put across....
but
Ive got a mate who works in the trade, so oil and filter and all that i can get cheap. Tools, well im gonna have to buy sooner or later anyway. headgasket, and all other gaskets are always a plus to change anyway, keep the car healthy. Im confident holding a spanner, and haribo here has done the same mod, and he admited he got all the knowledge from here, before he didnt have mechanical know. Now his car goes like stick. basicaly im trying to achieve what he did.
As for spending the £100 somewere else, tyres are all reasonably new and have loads and loads of grip left, i got coilovers on the car, so handles great already. I will be changing bits as i go along. I will be rebuilding an important part of the engine by doing this and hopefully it should feel like new. Yes i know my MPG is already rubbish (22mpg with mixed driving, pretty heavy footed though)
but i preffer going from A to B, with lots and lots of fun in the proccess, rather than just from A to B. I hope you know what im trying to say.
"better to try make a dog into a horse, than make a horse go into a...horse?"
oh and btw, i already got AA cover :laugh:
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go for it mate you gotta start learning at some point and it might as well be doing something that you want to do rather than somehing that crops but if you were that way inclined i would imagine that a 8v gti engine would drop in and run on a carb
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go for it mate you gotta start learning at some point and it might as well be doing something that you want to do rather than somehing that crops but if you were that way inclined i would imagine that a 8v gti engine would drop in and run on a carb
cheers mate.
thing is, if i was to put a gti engine, i would need to uprate fuel pump, and some other bits and bobs. Also do the loom and stuff. If i stick a gti head and gti distribuitor, with the camshaft i already have, i wouldnt be far off 8v gti performance.
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just won this little beauty on ebay for £16. Gonna pick it up this weekend hopefully, so i'l spend most of saturday cleaning it and getting it painted. then i'l be buying an 8v gti manifold and downpipe to add to the collection, and then the headgasket set and everything.http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&item=290264363707 (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&item=290264363707)
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aye- think your Increase over standard :afro: was the big shock ( apart from the shortfalls bhp of course :shocked: ) on satdee
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aye- think your Increase over standard :afro: was the big shock ( apart from the shortfalls bhp of course :shocked: ) on satdee
was happy with 6hp increase over standard, but now hopefully, with the work im gonna do to the car, my target is gonna be 100hp. RR session again sometime soon guys? :wink:
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SCHTOP! This tuning is not ready. Don't be so hasty, go buy a car with a sealed bonnet, you clearly don't know what you're talking about. Put down the spanners and back away from the Golf.
I think the man does know how much he's running - figures just here (http://www.golfgtiforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=93812.0). If you're going to come in being even more negative and miserable than me then at least do a little research and read up on the guy you're trying to pull apart.
It's like you've not bothered reading the considerable spread of information that's available on this forum - if the guy wants advice he'll ask and we'll probably help him out.
The hedgehog is there for a variety of reasons, to ensure good and consistent fuel vapourisation as well as helping to keep the intake temperatures within range. I took mine down a reasonable distance and with a PB head and cam, with the injector ports blocked off with pennies under the injector collets it went like a proper fun little tool. A LOT better than standard.
If I'd had the advice and support that's on here when I did mine I would have gone down the port-matching route too and liberated a bit more power.
Although there are many reasons to go injection, keeping with a simple Weber 32/34 DTML carb (appropriately jetted) and a suite of engine mods is going to get some cheap gains, as well as a whole load of education for the person doing the mods - if you don't try, you won't learn.
You *could* fit a GTI motor and run it on your DTML - fit up your inlet manifold and fueling systems to the motor and the pennies to the injector ports and away you go - GT motor - it's just missing the I, innit (and all the boring wiring 'n' stuff).
Haterz, eh?
£20 delivered for the dizzi and it has the 3 pin connector on the side of it.
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aye- think your Increase over standard :afro: was the big shock ( apart from the shortfalls bhp of course :shocked: ) on satdee
was happy with 6hp increase over standard, but now hopefully, with the work im gonna do to the car, my target is gonna be 100hp. RR session again sometime soon guys? :wink:
dont do yourself down man its not 6
82.2 minus 74 = 8.2 :wink:
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dont do yourself down man its not 6
82.2 minus 74 = 8.2 :wink:
:shocked: thank god i didnt take up maths for A-level!!!
my god, now im shoked at how cr@p my maths are :undecided:
i think im gonna pull out the old mental arithematic book and start going over it :nerd:
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tuning a driver can be cool, carbs ect but i think youll struggle for £100. just to throw another one into the pot, i know someone who recently bagged an ABF lump on ebay for £70.. 150bhp...
as said before, if i fit an ABF or gti lump, i have to claim it cos tehres a big difference. and being 17 with a gti insurance will rape me.
But if i stick a gti manifold, and head...well, it doesnt look much different than on the driver, so if something ahppens, the insruance man, unless hee's well into his mk2's, he wont be able to tell the difference.
Have you been keeping a list of everything u have bought.
i do it to all my cars, just so i know where i stand, and its also a usefull thing to do for reference if u do something similar in the future!
Id be really intrested to see the exact figure you spend. and also a rough estimation of time whenits all done.
Its always nice i think when doing something like this to be able to know your MONEY:BHP INCREASE ratio!
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Its always nice i think when doing something like this to be able to know your MONEY:BHP INCREASE ratio!
Money:% BHP increase would be more useful.
Kharekatoh - have you stripped out any excess weight from your car? Sound deadening etc. Losing that will make a big difference to your performance (rather than just the naked figures).
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cheers for all the support DH :wink: top lad.
As for the dizzie, £20 sounds very very very very good mate :cool:
Although, i was told on the golf mk2 forums that i need dizzie from the PB engine :undecided:
if your right, and the scirocco dizzie will fit 100% guaranteed, then i'l be able to send you the money later this week. Just need confirmation of the dizzie workin g100% though :wink:
Id be really intrested to see the exact figure you spend. and also a rough estimation of time whenits all done.
Its always nice i think when doing something like this to be able to know your MONEY:BHP INCREASE ratio!
i'l create my own topic here or in dub projects when works starts taking place mate. i'l make sure i take plenty of pics too.
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Kharekatoh - have you stripped out any excess weight from your car? Sound deadening etc. Losing that will make a big difference to your performance (rather than just the naked figures).
i did have the rear of the car fully stripped a couple of months back, but it was very very noisey, and very unconvenient. I rather keep the rear seats, trim and carpeting. All in all it weighs no more than 25-30kg, and the gain was so little it wasnt worth the noise and inconvenience.
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cheers for all the support DH :wink: top lad.
As for the dizzie, £20 sounds very very very very good mate :cool:
Although, i was told on the golf mk2 forums that i need dizzie from the PB engine :undecided:
if your right, and the scirocco dizzie will fit 100% guaranteed, then i'l be able to send you the money later this week. Just need confirmation of the dizzie workin g100% though :wink:
Might be wrong here, but i'm pretty sure the PB dizzy won't have the vacuum advance that you need
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The dizzi out of the Scirocco motor will fit and does have the vacuum advance that you crave - it fitted right up to my GU (1.8 carb) motor.
I'm not bored of my 130bhp yet - it's about what you do with it, remember :wink:
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The dizzi out of the Scirocco motor will fit and does have the vacuum advance that you crave - it fitted right up to my GU (1.8 carb) motor.
I'm not bored of my 130bhp yet - it's about what you do with it, remember :wink:
in that case, we have a deal mate. you have PM.
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just need some things cleared up before i start the shopping.
Now i'l be having an 8v gti head on my standard 1.6 bottom end, what headgasket do i need to use? 1.6 or 1.8 gti?
same with the inlet manifold gasket, and exhaust manifold gasket (got my eyes on a gti manifold and downpipe on ebay)
1.6 or 1.8 GTI?
also, head bolts, where can i get them from? i read somewhere GSF ones unscrew themselfs, and it was better getting them from vw, although they were very very expensive.
Also, the drill bit for the head porting, what exactly do i need? any chance of an ebay link so i can buy it?
Any other bits i missed out i need to buy so i can get the project started when all the bits are together?
Im gonna have to change everything in one day, so i cant afford to spend a week with the head apart while i wait for bits to arrive or i have to go shopping half way through a weekend :undecided:
please someone make a list of what i need to buy and from where?
(scrappys near me are rubbish, none contain ANY mk2's!!! :shocked: so im gonna have to rely on ebay, GSF and ECP)
thanks
Andres
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gsf head bolts are fine. never had issues with them.
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gsf head bolts are fine. never had issues with them.
perfect mate :smiley: thanks very much, and at £1 each i'l bag myself a bargain.
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just need some things cleared up before i start the shopping.
Now i'l be having an 8v gti head on my standard 1.6 bottom end, what headgasket do i need to use? 1.6 or 1.8 gti?
same with the inlet manifold gasket, and exhaust manifold gasket (got my eyes on a gti manifold and downpipe on ebay)
1.6 or 1.8 GTI?
Head, inlet and exhaust gaskets should all be the same for gti and driver. Don't forget to use the 10% gsf discount too :wink:
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iirc the headset for 1.6 and gti is same anyway
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Head, inlet and exhaust gaskets should all be the same for gti and driver. Don't forget to use the 10% gsf discount too :wink:
cheers guys. Will be doing some shopping this week then :wink:
for the head porting, do i need to buy this?http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/10-pieces-Tungsten-Carbide-Rotary-Burr-SET-1-8-shank_W0QQitemZ180296845703QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item180296845703&_trkparms=72%3A1298|39%3A1|66%3A2|65%3A12|240%3A1318&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14 (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/10-pieces-Tungsten-Carbide-Rotary-Burr-SET-1-8-shank_W0QQitemZ180296845703QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item180296845703&_trkparms=72%3A1298|39%3A1|66%3A2|65%3A12|240%3A1318&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14)
andres
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doing the shopping list for GSF, and for the exhaust gasket it has 3 choices...
11830 EXHAUST MANIFOLD GASKET (2 required per car) G2 1.05 / 1.3 £3
11831 EXHAUST MANIFOLD GASKET G2 Turbo Diesel All £1
11832 EXHAUST MANIFOLD GASKET G2 16V All £3
which one do i need??? doesnt say 1.6 carb/1.8 GTI. :undecided:
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shopping list so far. please tell me what i need to add/remove.
(ignore thermostat seal, and thermostat, i need them anyway)
with the CYL.HEAD GASKET SET-BQ, do i need to buy the 10 head bolts seperatly as i did on the shopping list? or do they come with the cyl head gasket set that costs £34.50?
(http://i254.photobucket.com/albums/hh115/kharekatoh/untitled-2.jpg)
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Pretty sure inlet and exhaust manifold gaskets should be part of head gasket set, as should the rocker cover gasket. Confirm that with gsf first, pretty sure a head gasket "set" on a corsa had the lot in though. The bolts however won't be included.
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Pretty sure inlet and exhaust manifold gaskets should be part of head gasket set, as should the rocker cover gasket. Confirm that with gsf first, pretty sure a head gasket "set" on a corsa had the lot in though. The bolts however won't be included.
cheers mew, gonna give gsf a call now then and confirm it. the rest of the list is ok though right? water flange and all that?
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yup. you were right. The inlet manifold, valve cover and exhaust gaskets come with the HG set, but the bolts i have to buy seperatly.
What special tools do i need to do this conversion? I dont have a torque wrench but i may be able to borrow one...if not, does it really matter?
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torqe on head bolts is critical, so is the torqeing sequence
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Speak to Beavis on here - he works at Vee W Services in Bristol who are normally cheaper/better quality than GSF or ECP and might be able to do you a deal for what you need, as well as shipping it down to you.
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torqe on head bolts is critical, so is the torqeing sequence
ok mate. says on the haynes stage 1 2 and 3. what stage do i have? 1 im guessing :undecided:
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Speak to Beavis on here - he works at Vee W Services in Bristol who are normally cheaper/better quality than GSF or ECP and might be able to do you a deal for what you need, as well as shipping it down to you.
cheers mate. will PM him about it and let him know :wink:
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ok mate. says on the haynes stage 1 2 and 3. what stage do i have?
It's the amount of torque that you're putting on the bolts - go to 40NM on all bolts, then 60NM, then 90degrees normally - means it's all tightened down properly.
When I fitted my PB head I took it to an engineering shop and got it skimmed and the valve stem seals replaced. Any good shop will clean it before it comes back to you, too. This means you do your DIY porting, then send it off and don't have to worry about the swarf in the head.
Costs a bit more, but de-risks what you're doing.
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ok mate. says on the haynes stage 1 2 and 3. what stage do i have?
It's the amount of torque that you're putting on the bolts - go to 40NM on all bolts, then 60NM, then 90degrees normally - means it's all tightened down properly.
When I fitted my PB head I took it to an engineering shop and got it skimmed and the valve stem seals replaced. Any good shop will clean it before it comes back to you, too. This means you do your DIY porting, then send it off and don't have to worry about the swarf in the head.
Costs a bit more, but de-risks what you're doing.
Ahh right ok. I understand. How much would it cost to get the head skimmed and valve stem seals replaced?
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You're in quite an expensive area, so call around. Maybe speak to a couple of garages or auto-factors to see who they recommend.
Shouldn't *really* be over £50.
The key is the risk you're removing by doing it - nice clean face to make sure the head gasket seals, knowing it's a flat face helps the cause, too. It'd be a bit of a p1sser to do all this and then have it smoke like mad when you trail the throttle because the stem seals are shagged.
I seem to recall there are different thicknesses of headgasket, too. You need the right one, or your compression ratio could be off. Too high = detonation and short engine life, too low = reduced power. The engineering shop will be able to advise how much is 'left' to come off the head when they've skimmed it.
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You're in quite an expensive area, so call around. Maybe speak to a couple of garages or auto-factors to see who they recommend.
Shouldn't *really* be over £50.
The key is the risk you're removing by doing it - nice clean face to make sure the head gasket seals, knowing it's a flat face helps the cause, too. It'd be a bit of a p1sser to do all this and then have it smoke like mad when you trail the throttle because the stem seals are shagged.
I seem to recall there are different thicknesses of headgasket, too. You need the right one, or your compression ratio could be off. Too high = detonation and short engine life, too low = reduced power. The engineering shop will be able to advise how much is 'left' to come off the head when they've skimmed it.
i'l call around different auto specialists in the area then, and find out some prices. How do i find out the HG thickness i need? i thought the HG set from GSF would be fine to use.
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I'm not 100% on this, but a totally unskimmed head uses a gasket with a single circle on the edge of it.
One that's had a skim would be fitted with a two circle one.
One that's close on done (so only good for another 100k) would use a three circle gasket.
The circles denote increasing thickness of the gasket - compensating for the reduced depth on the head.
Some ETKA gimp will be along to give a better explanation, no doubt.
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so what gasket do i need to buy? or do i decide after the head is skimmed?
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Updated shopping list.
Hopefully now should all be correct.
I just need to double check how many/what water flanges ive chosen are the right ones. Any water flanges missing or are there too many on there?
(http://i254.photobucket.com/albums/hh115/kharekatoh/untitled-3.jpg)
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skim dosen't effect gasket on this engine, there are no clearance issues and it not desile. nor is compression an issue @ 9:1 a littel higher can only help
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TC - Youre thinking of Diesel head gaskets. 1hole, 2 hole 3hole or notch.. Have a lot of dealing with them with people in work and ahve to ask the same questions.. Petrol Head gaskets are the same regardless :smiley:
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skim dosen't effect gasket on this engine, there are no clearance issues and it not desile. nor is compression an issue @ 9:1 a littel higher can only help
TC - Youre thinking of Diesel head gaskets. 1hole, 2 hole 3hole or notch.. Have a lot of dealing with them with people in work and ahve to ask the same questions.. Petrol Head gaskets are the same regardless :smiley:
so i just buy the normal HG from GSF correct? need to verify this this week as i'l be doing the shoppin gon saturday morning when i pick the head up.
can someone please confrim the shopping list is ok? or do i need to add/remove things?
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TC - Youre thinking of Diesel head gaskets. 1hole, 2 hole 3hole or notch.. Have a lot of dealing with them with people in work and ahve to ask the same questions.. Petrol Head gaskets are the same regardless :smiley:
aaaaaaaaand there's yer ETKA gimp :tongue:
I said I wasn't 100%.
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:grin:
woo. now i know whos the ETKA gimp :laugh:
you seen my PM matt?
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for cylinder head swap you need a head gasket set (this will come with all gaskets and seals needed for head including stem seals) as for which one i think you should get one for your model of car as you are not increasing bore size
and a set of head bolts
as for skimming i got mine done and pressure tested for £50
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for cylinder head swap you need a head gasket set (this will come with all gaskets and seals needed for head including stem seals) as for which one i think you should get one for your model of car as you are not increasing bore size
and a set of head bolts
as for skimming i got mine done and pressure tested for £50
Cheers mate. Will take all into account. i got no special tools or anything, just basic stuff like pliers, hammers, screw drivers, spanners and a socket set. Nothing amazing.
How easy to do are stem seals?
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How easy to do are stem seals?
There's a guide in the MK2 maintenance section :smiley:
here (http://www.golfgtiforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=69439.0)
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How easy to do are stem seals?
There's a guide in the MK2 maintenance section :smiley:
here (http://www.golfgtiforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=69439.0)
says i need patience. Something i lack of very much!! :grin: :grin:
also some tools which i dont have.
i think gettin the skimmed and doing valve stem seals by a professional is the wiser choice. just need to find an engeneering house near southampton/bournemouth that would do it for around £50.
also, for porting, are these any good?
click me! (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=150301858633&_trksid=p3907.m32&_trkparms=tab%3DWatching)
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They look too good to be true for that price, and they might turn out to be too. But you don't know till you try, so I'll watch this space :smiley:
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also, for porting, are these any good?
click me! (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=150301858633&_trksid=p3907.m32&_trkparms=tab%3DWatching)
If I was going to attempt porting myself I wouldn't use any of those, Id go for something more like this (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/NEW-AIR-DIE-GRINDER-KIT-tool-tools-for-porting-heads_W0QQitemZ170083538683QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item170083538683#ebayphotohosting)
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also, for porting, are these any good?
click me! (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=150301858633&_trksid=p3907.m32&_trkparms=tab%3DWatching)
If I was going to attempt porting myself I wouldn't use any of those, Id go for something more like this (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/NEW-AIR-DIE-GRINDER-KIT-tool-tools-for-porting-heads_W0QQitemZ170083538683QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item170083538683#ebayphotohosting)
cheers jay. jsut emailed the guy asing for shipping cost to UK.
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you have a compressor to drive that gun though right?
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cheers jay. jsut emailed the guy asing for shipping cost to UK.
Can get these pretty cheap from your local tool shop, not worth the effort of shipping from the US!
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TC - Youre thinking of Diesel head gaskets. 1hole, 2 hole 3hole or notch.. Have a lot of dealing with them with people in work and ahve to ask the same questions.. Petrol Head gaskets are the same regardless :smiley:
aaaaaaaaand there's yer ETKA gimp :tongue:
I said I wasn't 100%.
How very dare you.. I'm no ETKA gimp, I can use proper catalogues and books at work 'unlike some people' :grin:
:grin:
woo. now i know whos the ETKA gimp :laugh:
you seen my PM matt?
Oi! :laugh: Johns the ETKA gimp and he should admit that freely - hell he even psots prices :wink:
No PM sir. Not even a sign of one :sad:
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Oi! :laugh: Johns the ETKA gimp and he should admit that freely - hell he even psots prices :wink:
No PM sir. Not even a sign of one :sad:
haha ok i'l wait till he posts then :grin:
PM about to be sent off to you mate :wink:
you have a compressor to drive that gun though right?
oh do i need one for that dremel tool? :undecided: i dont have a compressor, i would need it to be electric :sad:
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Yeah, a dremel type would do, but if you can get some tungsten carbide tip bits for it like the ones you showed earlier, that would be the nuts, because you would use tungsten tips to port the shape, then the stone tips to smooth. Then use fibre tips with cutting compound to polish.
Something like these perhaps http://www.northerntooluk.com/products.asp?partno=1806763E or http://www.machinemart.co.uk/shop/product/details/crt40-40pce-rotary-tool-kit/path/17-mini-multi-purpose-power-tools
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if you start skimming/porting etc the head your gonna go well over budget! id just clean it up and whack it on. whats the mileage on the head?
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if you start skimming/porting etc the head your gonna go well over budget! id just clean it up and whack it on. whats the mileage on the head?
Home porting won't cost much and you have tools you can use on other jobs, so they shouldn't be counted against the budget.
It will should ensure the man makes his target BHP, too.
A skim is precautionary and should ensure the new headgasket seals. The clean is necessary to get the swarf out from the skim and the home porting waste, too.
While it's there having work done, why wouldn't you get the stem seals replaced? Who says the seller either knows or is genuine about the mileage the head's done.
As I said previously, it's de-risking the job - spend £50 now to avoid possibly spending another £100 in a short while.
A £100 budget for anything where the head is coming off an engine is rather optimistic, just based on parts alone. Is it the budget that is crucial here, or the output of the motor?
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if you start skimming/porting etc the head your gonna go well over budget! id just clean it up and whack it on. whats the mileage on the head?
doesnt say milage on head or anything. But by porting it i can get a couple extra hp...
This one looks good value and good kit. (http://www.machinemart.co.uk/shop/product/details/crt40-40pce-rotary-tool-kit/path/17-mini-multi-purpose-power-tools)
ive got around £130 to spend. I should be able to buy the dremel without going overboard. see how it goes :wink:
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As I said previously, it's de-risking the job - spend £50 now to avoid possibly spending another £100 in a short while.
A £100 budget for anything where the head is coming off an engine is rather optimistic, just based on parts alone. Is it the budget that is crucial here, or the output of the motor?
if i can get the head skimmed and the valve seals replaced for a cheap price then yeah i'l do it, but not if its over around £50.
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just called robinson engineering in bournemouth, and they quoted me £90 for skim and valve stem seals, and £37 for skim only. Also £12.50 for a clean. (not acid dipped)
to be honest, the £90 i would pay for skim and valve seals is alot of money and pretty much all my budget, so i think im gonna go for the skim only (i know its riskier but i actually dont have enough money if i did get the seals replaced)
so skim and maybe a clean, to get it ready for porting and painting. What do you guys think? good deal?
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do the porting before a skim, incase you drop a tool on it, or the head falls off the bench or whatever. And have read around the net on doing the stems yourself. It's not like your in a rush is it, or is it? lol
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do the porting before a skim, incase you drop a tool on it, or the head falls off the bench or whatever. And have read around the net on doing the stems yourself. It's not like your in a rush is it, or is it? lol
not in a rush but at the same tiem i am, if you know what i mean. Thing is for stem seals i need special tools i dont have, and to be honest patience, which is needed, well i lack of that very much. I'd like everything on the car by about 2 weeks time when all the work is done. And thanks for the tip about porting before the skim :wink:
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the head will seal fine without a skim, what rubbish! just make sure its clean. you skim the head if you want to raise compression or the heads warped.
all your risking putting it on without doing all this is a set of head bolts. its up to you but id just whack it on. maybe port match the manifolds but id leave the head alone. why do you think porting a head is so expensive? its because your paying for knowledge!
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the head will seal fine without a skim, what nuts! just make sure its clean. you skim the head if you want to raise compression or the heads warped. all your risking putting it on without doing all this is a set of head bolts. its up to you but id just whack it on. maybe port match the manifolds but id leave the head alone. why do you think porting a head is so expensive? its because your paying for knowledge!
since the call i was actually thinking about that. Unless the head has some warping, its wasting £37. £37 is nearly 2/5ths of my budget lol.
And for the £37 i could buy a decent dremel tool. got my eyes on a £30 baby from the last page.
I'l see how the head is on saturday when i pick it up, then i'l evaluate if it needs skimming or not.
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you are dealing with an UNKOWN. if i take a head off my car or another car i know for some reason other hean headgasket failure it dosen't get skimmed, fine grit wet and dry with WD40 will bing the surface up a treat ( block need this to ) an unknown head i'll allways throughyl inspect and normaly skim before fitting or at least put some oil on the head and place a think piece of glass over it to check
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you are dealing with an UNKOWN. if i take a head off my car or another car i know for some reason other hean headgasket failure it dosen't get skimmed, fine grit wet and dry with WD40 will bing the surface up a treat ( block need this to ) an unknown head i'll allways throughyl inspect and normaly skim before fitting or at least put some oil on the head and place a think piece of glass over it to check
so fine wet and dry and WD40, on the head surface? would it come out the same as if i skimmed it?
how do i do the glass method to check if it should be skimmed or not?
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The object of skimming is to ensure you have a perfectly flat and square surface to mate to the block. If you don't have this then your chances of a head gasket sealing right are substantially diminished.
Going crazy with some wet 'n' dry and a block might result in an even less flat face, one with high points.
You also need to ensure that the mating face is as clean as possible after any work you do - wash it and the block with white spirit after you've cleaned them up.
All the way down the line what Danny and I are suggesting is based on experience and (dare I say it), what we see as 'best practice'.
What we're suggesting is aimed at reducing the risk of your project failing.
Maybe we're both time-poorer than you and prepared to spend where necessary, but how annoyed will you be if you dump the head on and then have to take it off, cos it doesn't work as you expected?
The risks so far are:
headgasket not properly sealed as head not flat and square
stem seals that don't seal
Both risks will mean your car is off the road for rather than you expect. You're going to be a lot more inconvenienced if you do the work and then have to do it again (and have the car off the road for a week or two while you sort the work and parts).
Pays yer money and takes yer chances. Paying a bit more reduces yer chances of failure in this situation.
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i know what you mean mate.
I'l get the head skimmed, but the valve stem seals are £90 including the skim, and i just dont have that £90.
First im gonna port the head, then i'l get it skimmed and cleaned.
Quick questing, it comes with both inlet and exhasut manifolds, i'l port the exhaust outlet according to the exhasut (im gonna stick a gti exhasut in there anyway). but does the size around the head of a gti inlet manifold and 1.6 carbed manifold differ?
If you know what i mean? cos i cant port the inlet manifold after getting the head cleanied if not it will be full of crap, so basically, can i port it for a carb manifold using a gti manifold? same size fit?
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wet and dry should only be use to bring the surface up it cannot be compared to skimming. if you have a head known to be flat running over it evenly with wet and dry to bring up the surface won't cause problems but all of the head has to have the same attention. you cannot try and sand it flat if it isn't
for the glass method a pice of THICK FLAT glass is needed turn head upside down apply thin oil and plonk glass ontop the oil bridges between the head and the glass if it dosent the head isn't flat.
i would seriusly reccomend that you do skim the head, that way it's known to be true, and untill you done a few you want as meany things known as possible. would also reccomend doing the valve guide seals as they are a common problem even heads that have apparently been reconditioned have been found to have had knackerd stem seals.
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when port matching you go to the gasket. stick gasket on and open out to it and just bend it in from that on the head and manifold.
stem seals ain't hard to do yourself the only tricky bit is getting the collets back in the valve spring retainer after 2 or 3 you'll have the knackand it'll just be tediuos by number 8 but think yourself lucky 16 is a right bore
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yeah i'l get the head skimmed then. Im having talks with a mate whos a mechanic and he said he would do the stem seals for me but at a price :undecided:
He also said in the headgasket set frm gsf it also includes the valve stem seals. is it true?
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right stem seals arnt that scary will need to borrow valve spring compressor tho to put them back in but takeign to bits is easy
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v643/dannyp1595/16v%20head%20strip/16vheadcamsout.jpg)
then loose the tappets
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v643/dannyp1595/16v%20head%20strip/16vheadcolletsremoved.jpg)
BUMP BUMP BUMP that gets the collets out the way a bit quick
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v643/dannyp1595/16v%20head%20strip/16vheadhighspeedcolletremovaltool.jpg)
pull the valve out the bottom and lift the upper retainer springs and lower retainer out
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v643/dannyp1595/16v%20head%20strip/16vheadvalveassembly.jpg)
then you'll see someting a bit like this, in the middel thats the guide the seal sits on top, it;ll have gone hard and will need some getting off but not that hard really. new ones go on easyer. socket is most usefull tool oilthem before fitting to preven damage.
if feelign really keen useing one of the 10 spectial valve guid extractors they come out easy as well sadly refitting them is a machene shop job unless you have a press and the correct reamer
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v643/dannyp1595/16v%20head%20strip/16vheadvalveguideextractor.jpg)
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yes stem seals in gasket set. glad to hear you've decided to do it properly
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yes stem seals in gasket set. glad to hear you've decided to do it properly
yeah he conviced me to do the stem seals. Better, wiser choice to be honest.
:smiley:
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Do you know anyone with a valve spring compressor? You say that your mate in the trade would do it for you but at a price. Just ask him if you can borrow his spiring compressor over a weekend.
As for skimming the head, that is the best idea. If you opt for just a clean up, don't use wet and dry! It comes in various grades and if you are too keen on cleaning the head, you will remove material as well as the crap. Use scotch brite to clean things up with a little fuel, (wear gloves) or a spirit of some kind. If skimming, ask them to take the minimum off, purely to plane the surface smooth. You then should not have an issue as to which head gasket to use. A standard one will suffice.
Porting...do not use stone grinders. The grit can get lodged in the cylinder head material without you seeing it and cause problems later. Use carbide hi-speed grinders, but be aware, you will take off alot of material very quickly. You do not need to spend megga amounts of money on tooling, compressors etc. A cheaper version of the dremmel can be bought for a fraction of the price, and as you probably will not be using it that much, it will suffice.
You talked about stages earlier in this thread. This does not refer to the tune of your engine, but the torque of the head bolts. I cannot remember the torque figures, but the first stage of torque will be X, the second stage of torque will be Y and the third stage of torque is, I think a further turn of 90 degrees in one movement.
BTW, if you do the valve stem seals yourself, when using the valve spring compressor, wear goggles in case the valve collets decide to take flying lessons into your eyes. :wink:
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Do you know anyone with a valve spring compressor? You say that your mate in the trade would do it for you but at a price. Just ask him if you can borrow his spiring compressor over a weekend.
As for skimming the head, that is the best idea. If you opt for just a clean up, don't use wet and dry! It comes in various grades and if you are too keen on cleaning the head, you will remove material as well as the crap. Use scotch brite to clean things up with a little fuel, (wear gloves) or a spirit of some kind. If skimming, ask them to take the minimum off, purely to plane the surface smooth. You then should not have an issue as to which head gasket to use. A standard one will suffice.
Porting...do not use stone grinders. The grit can get lodged in the cylinder head material without you seeing it and cause problems later. Use carbide hi-speed grinders, but be aware, you will take off alot of material very quickly. You do not need to spend megga amounts of money on tooling, compressors etc. A cheaper version of the dremmel can be bought for a fraction of the price, and as you probably will not be using it that much, it will suffice.
You talked about stages earlier in this thread. This does not refer to the tune of your engine, but the torque of the head bolts. I cannot remember the torque figures, but the first stage of torque will be X, the second stage of torque will be Y and the third stage of torque is, I think a further turn of 90 degrees in one movement.
BTW, if you do the valve stem seals yourself, when using the valve spring compressor, wear goggles in case the valve collets decide to take flying lessons into your eyes. :wink:
thanks dude!
My friend who works in the trade doest ave a valve spring compressor himself, he has to borrow it off other work mates. But he has torque wrench, good socket set, lots of other tools, and most importantly experience.
As for the porting, i'l going to buy this tool set. (http://www.machinemart.co.uk/shop/product/details/crt40-40pce-rotary-tool-kit/path/17-mini-multi-purpose-power-tools) What do you think? should do the job??
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I've got a brand new OMP red strut brace for a Driver going for cheapish if you're interested? Comes with cool OMP baseball cap! ;)
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I've got a brand new OMP red strut brace for a Driver going for cheapish if you're interested? Comes with cool OMP baseball cap! ;)
how is that gonna help me reach 100hp :huh:
Im on an extremly tight budget of 100hp for £100 and you wanna sell me a strut bracE? no offence...but LOL!
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[/quote]
thanks dude!
My friend who works in the trade doest ave a valve spring compressor himself, he has to borrow it off other work mates. But he has torque wrench, good socket set, lots of other tools, and most importantly experience.
As for the porting, i'l going to buy this tool set. (http://www.machinemart.co.uk/shop/product/details/crt40-40pce-rotary-tool-kit/path/17-mini-multi-purpose-power-tools) What do you think? should do the job??
[/quote]
It looks OK, but make sure you can buy replacement and extra grinding bits for it. It is certainly cheaper than the dremmel.
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cheers mate. will give them a ring soon and ask them if replacementa can be bought.
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those arn't all that, the tool is good and you'll find it easy to get in and around the port without snagging it but ali will clog those pink stones allmost instantly and will end up useing the sanding rolls, those cheep tungsten carbide bits on ebay will shift metal a lot faster and last much longer than stones, those tungsten carbide burrs one ebay with one of those clarke engraveing tools should work, think they were both 1/8" to rip round ports my top favoret is a 1/4" shaft bur on cheep electric drill then do the delicate stuff with a smaller machene, only problem with that is snagging a 1/4 burr is not good news
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so you recommend the ones from ebay then? there cheaper too :smiley:
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A bit of guidance here (http://www.clubgti.com/forum/showthread.php?t=146976), good pics, links to tool shops.
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that is a most excelent thread
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A bit of guidance here (http://www.clubgti.com/forum/showthread.php?t=146976), good pics, links to tool shops.
agreed that is awesome. Ive been thinking abut it, and i think im gonna first stick the gti manifold and downpipe and shaved hedgehog, and then, while i make full use of that work on the head over the weeks, by porting it as best as i can, polishing it and getting it rebuilt. So gti dizzie, gti manifold + downpipe and shaved hegdehog will be going on very soon, but head i'l be workin gon it for a month or two.
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those arn't all that, the tool is good and you'll find it easy to get in and around the port without snagging it but ali will clog those pink stones allmost instantly and will end up useing the sanding rolls, those cheep tungsten carbide bits on ebay will shift metal a lot faster and last much longer than stones, those tungsten carbide burrs one ebay with one of those clarke engraveing tools should work, think they were both 1/8" to rip round ports my top favoret is a 1/4" shaft bur on cheep electric drill then do the delicate stuff with a smaller machene, only problem with that is snagging a 1/4 burr is not good news
so what should i buy? im gonna be using an electric drill.
this (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&item=180297432099)
or
this? (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/5pc-1-4-INCH-SHANK-RASP-ROTARY-BURR-BIT-BITS-SET_W0QQitemZ300263844829QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item300263844829)
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I've got a brand new OMP red strut brace for a Driver going for cheapish if you're interested? Comes with cool OMP baseball cap! ;)
how is that gonna help me reach 100hp :huh:
Im on an extremly tight budget of 100hp for £100 and you wanna sell me a strut bracE? no offence...but LOL!
There's more to a car than 100bhp though! ;) You can tighten up the car a bit with a strut brace! :D
Worth a try, just thought you might have fancied a bargain.
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There's more to a car than 100bhp though! ;) You can tighten up the car a bit with a strut brace! :D
Worth a try, just thought you might have fancied a bargain.
yeah i know what you mean mate. I might be interested but not this month. PM me how much your looking for it though just out of itnerest.
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just bought these on ebay. (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&item=300263844829)
should do the job and for £4 all in its worth trying. What do i use for polishing?
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Those are only suitable for wood, as they have rasp like edges, they will only bounce and scratch the surface of metal & alloys.
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just bought these on ebay. (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&item=300263844829)
should do the job and for £4 all in its worth trying. What do i use for polishing?
WRONG!!!
What Bomp said.
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I would have thought this would give it away:
Suitable for Wood , Plastic , Fibreglass and similar softer
materials
Not suitable for metals and stone.
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I guess its true what they say
''a little knowledge is a dangerous thing!''
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haha well i learn my lesson. dont buy without reading.
i feel like a bellend now :embarassed:
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i feel like a bellend now :embarassed:
Well there are certain bars you could go to I suppose... :lipsrsealed: (Is there not one in the triangle, in Bournemouth?) :grin: :laugh:
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i feel like a bellend now :embarassed:
Well there are certain bars you could go to I suppose... :lipsrsealed: (Is there not one in the triangle, in Bournemouth?) :grin: :laugh:
haha i yeah there are a couple but i dont fancy going there. I think im gonna go on ebay and find some other carbide burrs :grin:
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Right, so what about these?
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/10-pieces-Tungsten-Carbide-Rotary-Burr-SET-1-8-shank_W0QQitemZ180297432099QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item180297432099&_trkparms=72%3A1301|39%3A1|66%3A2|65%3A12|240%3A1318&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14 (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/10-pieces-Tungsten-Carbide-Rotary-Burr-SET-1-8-shank_W0QQitemZ180297432099QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item180297432099&_trkparms=72%3A1301|39%3A1|66%3A2|65%3A12|240%3A1318&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14)
doesnt state what it cuts but they look like the ones that cut metals including steel and aluminium.
Should i buy these? let me know cos if yes, then i'l buy them now as they take about a week to arrive.
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They will do! But why don't you go to Machine Mart on the Bournemouth Road in Parkstone? They will be able to help you choose exactly what you need.
Its very close to the church with the green roof, next to the pub if I recall.
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Well, you could risk a chance on them, there's a uk ebayer here (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=220290261297&ssPageName=MERC_VI_RSCC_Pr12_PcY_BID_Stores_IT&refitem=220260878648&itemcount=12&refwidgetloc=active_view_item&usedrule1=StoreCatToStoreCat&refwidgettype=cross_promot_widget&_trksid=p284.m184&_trkparms=algo%3DDR%26its%3DS%252BI%252BSS%26itu%3DISS%252BUCI%252BSI%26otn%3D12) oh, some cheaper ones too here (http://stores.ebay.co.uk/Gloster-Tooling_Carbide-and-steel-Burrs_W0QQcolZ4QQdirZ1QQfsubZ8QQftidZ2QQtZkm)
Bit expensive, but then tungsten tips usually are, also they have a 3mm shank, which is the same collet size as the tool you want to get from Machine Mart.
I might get the same one on Sunday, (Clarke rotary tool) as Machine Mart sent me a Tax Free Sales Day letter, so ask your local Machine Mart if their doing a tax free promo any time soon.
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They will do! But why don't you go to Machine Mart on the Bournemouth Road in Parkstone? They will be able to help you choose exactly what you need.
Its very close to the church with the green roof, next to the pub if I recall.
ahh nice one. I'l see if i can go sometime next week and get them. cheers mate.
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Well, you could risk a chance on them, there's a uk ebayer here (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=220290261297&ssPageName=MERC_VI_RSCC_Pr12_PcY_BID_Stores_IT&refitem=220260878648&itemcount=12&refwidgetloc=active_view_item&usedrule1=StoreCatToStoreCat&refwidgettype=cross_promot_widget&_trksid=p284.m184&_trkparms=algo%3DDR%26its%3DS%252BI%252BSS%26itu%3DISS%252BUCI%252BSI%26otn%3D12) oh, some cheaper ones too here (http://stores.ebay.co.uk/Gloster-Tooling_Carbide-and-steel-Burrs_W0QQcolZ4QQdirZ1QQfsubZ8QQftidZ2QQtZkm)
Bit expensive, but then tungsten tips usually are, also they have a 3mm shank, which is the same collet size as the tool you want to get from Machine Mart.
I might get the same one on Sunday, (Clarke rotary tool) as Machine Mart sent me a Tax Free Sales Day letter, so ask your local Machine Mart if their doing a tax free promo any time soon.
i would double check the letter, i got sent one ages ago and it was trade only!
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managed to get a refund on the ebay c*ck up :smiley:
not all bad after all :wink:
i'l be makeing a trip to machine mart this coming week some time and get a set of carbide burrs and some sort of rotary tool.
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i would double check the letter, i got sent one ages ago and it was trade only!
To qualify: £30 minimum spend with VAT inc, pluss I can take 3 mates. Just got to find a mate now :laugh:
managed to get a refund on the ebay c*ck up :smiley:
not all bad after all :wink:
Jolly good of him to do a refund :smiley:
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can someone link me to a suitable valve spring compressor on ebay so i can buy it and give it a go myself? dont think i'l be able to borrow one anymore :undecided:
from the guide and people on here it sounds pretty straight foward.
What do i need to do the stem seals?
Valve spring compressor
new valve stem seals
...?
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ummm.... are taking the lump out? :huh:
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Halfords will do a spring compressor, but you will need a long reach one as the valve stems are recessed into the head. There is a very good car shop too in the upper Parkstone main road. (The road that goes from sea view to top of Alder road. Can't remember the name.) The shop name is specialist motor components, or SMC. Knowledeable people in there too. Or GSF may also do one.
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ummm.... are taking the lump out? :huh:
Just the head. Gonna go pick it up in about an hour or two and get work started on it.
Gonna strip it down completly, new seals all round, gonna rebuild the tappets, and port and polish it myself.
I'l be getting it skimmed and while its all in bits i might get it acid dipped so i have a good base to work on.
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right. Got the head today, and its very dirty but doesnt look bad. I took exhaust and inlet manifold off and injector railing. also removed the camshaft and tappets (gonna recondition the tappets).
Also got the headgasket kit from GSF, along with front and side water flanges. Gonna be removing the valves and putting new stem seals on there and gonna get the head acid dipped (its covered in a very thick layer of ola oil) and then skimmed (doesnt look tooooo bad, but, when i picked it up, it was in the shead, uncovered, so doesnt look like it was properly kept).
Happy with the buy though and a bargain for £16.
i'l keep you updated and i'l get plenty of picks of the build.
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Ive just taken the tappets apart and they are soaking in petrol so i'l have quiet tappets when new head is in.
Had a look at the valves, and inlet valves are nice and clean (im on about the inside of them by the way), but exhasut valves has a very thick layer of some crap. so when valves are out i'l be polishing them nicely.
quick question. How do you remove the injectors?
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once the rail is off you just pull HARD and they come out
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once the rail is off you just pull HARD and they come out
cheers mate :wink:
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won this beauty on ebay (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=170269014208&_trksid=p3907.m32&_trkparms=tab%3DWatching)
for connecting it to my 1.6 system, what size reducer do i need? is it 50mm to 42mm?
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Try get the rest of the zhaust system otherwise imo getting the GTi manifold is a waste mate as the driver system is only going to restrict the air flow and NOT get you where you want :wink:
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Try get the rest of the zhaust system otherwise imo getting the GTi manifold is a waste mate as the driver system is only going to restrict the air flow and NOT get you where you want :wink:
ive got a 50mm inlet sports exhasut and pipe that runs over the rear axle. The only bit i would have left from the driver system would be the center silencer, which im thinking of removing anyway, so i might get a 50mm replacement pipe from gsf. Can anyone confirm its 50mm for a gti?
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just had a look on GSF site and tehre are two pipes.
21325 SHORT PIPE 42.5mm G2 1.6 Carb (Without Catalyst) 8/83 >10/91 6.5
and
21330 SHORT PIPE 54.5mm G2 1.8 8v F.Inj (Not G60) 8/83 >10/91 5.5
im guessing i need the 54.5mm 1.8 8v pipe right?
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If you're replacing the entire driver system with the GTi system a pipe from a GTi would be a good idea :wink:
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If you're replacing the entire driver system with the GTi system a pipe from a GTi would be a good idea :wink:
well the backbox and intermediate pipe are aftermarket and im pretty sure they are 50mm. I'l get the 54mm pipe from gsf and with all that and manifold and downpipe car should breather bloody well!! :grin:
should sound pretty loud too! :laugh:
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http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Mini-Rotary-Drill-Tool-60-Acessory-will-fit-dremel_W0QQitemZ380070274857QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item380070274857&_trkparms=72%3A1298|39%3A1|66%3A2|65%3A12|240%3A1318&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14 (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Mini-Rotary-Drill-Tool-60-Acessory-will-fit-dremel_W0QQitemZ380070274857QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item380070274857&_trkparms=72%3A1298|39%3A1|66%3A2|65%3A12|240%3A1318&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14)
is that perfect for porting and polishing??
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Nope, it's ok for light work (I know coz I got the exact same tool, but different brand name) but not enough power on the motor. Plus the collets wears on them, so it looses grip on the shanks, thus the burs stop dead but the motor still turns.
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check head for pitting where water flanges mount to head if pitted get some wet and dry and a flat block and rub it down until pitting has gone
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check head for pitting where water flanges mount to head if pitted get some wet and dry and a flat block and rub it down until pitting has gone
head is gnna get acid dipped so it should clear the lot.
Very thick layer of oil all over it and i want it nice and clean. So im gonna port it, then get it skimmed and dipped, then polish it :wink:
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i dont think acid ipping will remove pitting
its not hard and doesnt take long to remove when i did my head it was a case of i did it to reduce the chance of having water leaks on rebuild (mine seemed to be pitted quite a bit but doesnt leak from the water flanges any more just the valves that stop the heater matrix bursting)
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ok. what is pitting lol
Is it the limescale thingy?
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no it is tiny little holes that the antifreeze leave's if it has been left for too long in the engine as it becomes acidic after time , thuse eating away at the head :)
if this happen's the head casting can become thin and then you will get oil/water mix even though the headgasket is new/ok
hope i ain't baffeled you :grin: :grin: :grin:
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i think it is where the water leaks and starts to corrode the alloy and leaves lots of ittle pits/craters on the machined flat surface
if you look where the water flanges mount they should be flat and smooth if not just get your block/wet or dry and wet flat until it is smooth
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cheers lads. will inpsect when its daylight.
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finished reconditioning the tappets. Now i just need to buy some bolts and get the head acid dipped and skimmed.
need to know 2 things first.
How do i take out the bolts that the exhasut manifold bolts to? (also the ones the valve cover bolts on)
And
Where can i get some more? (need 2 for exhasut (one i had to drill the nut out and it went into the screw, other is stuck to the nut so it unscrewed from head)
(http://i254.photobucket.com/albums/hh115/kharekatoh/SS101070.jpg)
(http://i254.photobucket.com/albums/hh115/kharekatoh/SS101071.jpg)
(http://i254.photobucket.com/albums/hh115/kharekatoh/SS101072.jpg)
(http://i254.photobucket.com/albums/hh115/kharekatoh/SS101073.jpg)
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To remove the studs, fit two nuts onto one stud and tighten them up against each other, but don't over do it. Use plenty of penetrating oil, then gently work the nuts back and forth until the stud starts to move, then start, again gently, removing the stud. To refit them or fir new ones, degrease the threads thouroughly, both male and female threads, and fit studs the same way you removed them, but use thread lock too, to prevent them from coming out again.
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cheers dude :wink:
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Give the studs a few taps with a hammer as well, seemed to help in my case.
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As regards the pitting,...pitting is caused by corrosion due to the proximity of water, or moisture contained within an area. Acidic fluids will aggravate it causing the corrosion to become apparent more rapidly. Not much you can do about it except for skimming or weld reairs if it is too severe.
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from what you see in the pics, is there any pitting?
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from what you see in the pics, is there any pitting?
Er yes! Around the exhaust ports and water jacket. But not too much that would scare me. You will get away with a good clean up and decent gaskets.
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exahsut ports are just extremly dirty full of carbon. Dont think that is pitting :undecided:
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dont worry about pitting in the port's fella , usually just on the head face and the water jacket's :)
i would change all the exhaust stud's , you will be glad of it in a few year's if you wanna take the exhaust off :wink: :wink:
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dont worry about pitting in the port's fella , usually just on the head face and the water jacket's :)
i would change all the exhaust stud's , you will be glad of it in a few year's if you wanna take the exhaust off :wink: :wink:
yeha i wanna change them all too. Saves elbow grease when it comes to fitting too.
where can i buy them from?
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Pretty sure gsf do, they definitely do the nuts...
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you then can just use moley grip's to remove them :)
also if you got a little heat gun i would warm the head/the stud's a little first , makes them easier to remove
:grin: :grin:
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about the studs for the rocker cover if you do a search im sure rubjonny has posted something about fitting ones for a mk3 gti will enable you to use the rubber gasket instead of the cork one
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you then can just use moley grip's to remove them :)
:grin: :grin:
And if they don't come out, you are left with a knackered stud that nothing will screw onto! Mole grips are a last resort for beasting things out with.
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about the studs for the rocker cover if you do a search im sure rubjonny has posted something about fitting ones for a mk3 gti will enable you to use the rubber gasket instead of the cork one
the head came with a rubber one when i bought it, so im sure it can be fitted using mk2 studs.
-
could it be off a mk3 GTi ???
-
could it be off a mk3 GTi ???
no, im pretty sure its from a mk2 lol.
-
studs for a cork gasket have a shoulder on them, on a rubber gasket the metal ring is in the gasket not studs.
-
it's a late mk2 head
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this is the studs ive got. rubber gasket correct?(http://i254.photobucket.com/albums/hh115/kharekatoh/untitled-4.jpg)
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Looks like the ones for a cork gasket to me. For a rubber one the studs should go straight into the head, looks like yours have got the shoulder on them.
EDIT: Had a look at picture of the head. Are my eyes deceiving me or are there both kinds of studs on there?
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Looks like the ones for a cork gasket to me. For a rubber one the studs should go straight into the head, looks like yours have got the shoulder on them.
EDIT: Had a look at picture of the head. Are my eyes deceiving me or are there both kinds of studs on there?
if u see closely at the stud missing, what looks like a collar is infact dirt, so maybe all studs have dirt around it? maybe it is a rubber gasket type.
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I think the rubber gaskets are for the G60 or MKIII's. My G60 is certainly a rubber gasket job where as my two 8v, the first one being a '92 model, (yes they sold the last of them in '92) were cork affairs.
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On the exhaust, when you fit the manifold, make sure you have the correct copper nuts from GSF or similar and that you've got plain washers under them. The nuts are designed to lock, even when hot, so shouldn't come loose.
If all of those studs don't have shoulders then you're fit to fit a rubber gasket. If some of them do, then buy a rubber gasket kit that comes with the right studs - could save any aggro and spilt oil all over your nice engine. Remember that the torque on those nuts is only 15NM (IIRC) which isn't a lot. If you crank them up more you'll distort the rocker cover and it'll be a right b!tch to get sealed.
That head really is gagging for a good acid dip, isn't it!
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That head really is gagging for a good acid dip, isn't it!
amen :grin:
-
COPPER NUT-8mm General Use - VW/Audi Manifold Etc. > 0.25
imguessing thats what i need. 8 of them infact. where can i find the studs?
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vw dont charge much for them, about a quid each i think
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vw dont charge much for them, about a quid each i think
yeah but im running out of funds mate. would have to pay £16 for 8 nuts and 8 studs.
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get the nuts from gsf and the studs from vw = £10 :smiley:
they might be less i cant remember
-
do you know where the closest vw dealer to so41 9bg is? i have no idea :grin:
-
do you know where the closest vw dealer to so41 9bg is? i have no idea :grin:
GOOGLE FFS....
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do you know where the closest vw dealer to so41 9bg is? i have no idea :grin:
GOOGLE FFS....
LOL
for added effect..
btw volkswaagen website ahs a dealer locator..
and ill get backto your PM asap. :smiley:
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dont owrry about PM mate too late :grin: got all the bits i needed from GSF. Thanks anyway.
-
do you know where the closest vw dealer to so41 9bg is? i have no idea :grin:
GOOGLE FFS....
OMG, what is happening tonight? This forum has me in hysterics!
-
do you know where the closest vw dealer to so41 9bg is? i have no idea :grin:
GOOGLE FFS....
OMG, what is happening tonight? This forum has me in hysterics!
breeze in southampton.
might make them a visit for the studs. if not, then ECP it is.
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do you know where the closest vw dealer to so41 9bg is? i have no idea :grin:
GOOGLE FFS....
OMG, what is happening tonight? This forum has me in hysterics!
+1 :grin: :laugh:
-
ive stripped the head and im gonna try get it acid dipped and skimmed over the weekend. Im aiming to have it in the car next weekend sometime.
-
got some questions.
1) now with gti distribuitor, do i need to keep the 16 degrees tdc or do i need more/less?
2) for head bolts, do i need a socket extension or something? (or are they allen screws?)
3) head bolt torque, i dont have a torque wrench and cant get one. So its either buy one, with money i dont have...or tighten by hand. Is there any method of tightening by hand? or do i HAVE to use toruqe wrench??
-
Does having this thread mean you don't have to use the search function anymore?
Torque wrenches are not just for fun, they do have a purpose.
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Does having this thread mean you don't have to use the search function anymore?
correct.
Not really its just that its late at night and i forgot about the search.
-
Aren't the head bolts the ones with a spline socket? More tools to buy/beg/borrow
-
got some questions.
1) now with gti distribuitor, do i need to keep the 16 degrees tdc or do i need more/less?
look in you haynes book of lies or fourums and have a serarch for the timeing figures for a 1.6 mk1 GTI and use that as your baseline ( it's the closest speck engine to what you will have )
2) for head bolts, do i need a socket extension or something? (or are they allen screws?)
they are spline drive M10 i think go buy set there not expensive and very usefull to have as vw liked useing them
3) head bolt torque, i dont have a torque wrench and cant get one. So its either buy one, with money i dont have...or tighten by hand. Is there any method of tightening by hand? or do i HAVE to use toruqe wrench??
stop being a muppet
-
:grin:
haha ok cheers danny. i'l see what i can do :wink:
-
got a slight problem.
The exhasut valves are covered in a thick layer of carbon. ive left them 2 nights in petrol and got sand paper out but it aint coming off :sad:
is there anything i can use? I got a drill sanding attachement thing and used that, it did go through it but with some effort and i dont wana risk deforming the valve. At the momentits not sealing airtight because of the carbon. is there some sort of liquid that will remove the carbon with ease?
-
wire brush, idelaly on bech grinder, keep away from the stem tho
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wire brush, idelaly on bech grinder, keep away from the stem tho
cheers mate. will try that. what about a wire brush on a drill? or shall i stick to hand wire brush?
-
btw the carbon crap is not only on the face of the valve. its on the stem and above the valve seat on the angled bit. still sure i can wire brush it?
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No one said it would be easy. I'd try a wire cup with your drill, but ffs go gently and wear gloves, goggles and air mask.
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No one said it would be easy. I'd try a wire cup with your drill, but ffs go gently and wear gloves, goggles and air mask.
drill wire cup would probably damage valve seat though. has to be some sort of liquid that dissolves carbon or another method of removal without damaging the seat
btw earlier i was stupid enough to use the drill with a stone bit at the end for polishing, well i used it to remove carbon thing and it did remove it but i did hit the stem and the curved bit. Although it doesnt look damaged, it has taken the top coat of polish frm the valve off. Should i worry? earlier i put inlet and that exhaust valve in the head and then turned it around and filled the cavaty with water and none leaked out either from cavity or from the exhaust and inlet port side. if you know what i mean.
-
as long as youve not damaged/took chunks out of the valve i would have thought youd be ok
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as long as youve not damaged/took chunks out of the valve i would have thought youd be ok
tahts alright then, its jstu very lighty scratched and i havent deformed it or anything :smiley:
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clean the carbon with a wire brush , try to get all of it off as gently as pos but use a little bit of force (i think it's known as engineers feel ) :laugh: if not in my cause hot spot's in burn the valve out early ,
i've done a few (working for landrover we take heads off K series in our sleep :shocked:)
and USE A TORQUE WRENCH :wink: :wink:
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my input, whats going to get to a 100 first, the car or this thread :grin: :wink:
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well were at 203 post's now
100 pages then :grin:
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we can make this happen fellas!! :grin:
today is a crap day, so im gonna wait for a good day to come along (probably august 09 :grin:) so i can wash the head with pressure washer.
valves i'l probably get working on them this evening at some point. cheers dudes.
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also if your gonna try clean the head try getting some of that wheel acid cleaner from a garage / valeter :) will come up a treat :wink: :wink:
-
whats going to have more by the end of it, pages in this thread or bhp in the car :smiley: Place your bets now
-
£100 on the page's
i'll just keep posting :grin: :grin:
-
whats going to have more by the end of it, pages in this thread or bhp in the car :smiley: Place your bets now
:grin:
quick update.
polished the valves this evening. came up a treat :smiley:
(http://i254.photobucket.com/albums/hh115/kharekatoh/golf/SS101076.jpg)
(http://i254.photobucket.com/albums/hh115/kharekatoh/golf/SS101077.jpg)
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It'll have more pages than BHP :grin:
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It'll have more pages than BHP :grin:
did the pics make you decide that?? :grin: :grin: