GolfGTIforum.co.uk
Model specific boards => Golf mk2 => Topic started by: Ben Lessani on 31 January 2008, 23:59
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Hi guys, I went about sticking the PAS pump and brackets onto my block and have run into a couple of hurdles.
1 - Where the two bolts go into the rear side of the block for the support bracket - I had to tap threaded holes in as they didn't have a thread before.
2 - How on earth do I get the pulley's sorted, I don't have Autodata installed, so I can't see the belt configuration, but the PAS pulley is about 2cm further out from the alternator, crank and water pump, the guy I got the bits off gave me another pulley - its got 4 holes so I can only assume it goes in the crank - but it sits about 4cm away from the PAS pulley?
Does anyone have a photo of how the belts are setup.
Thanks!
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Okay, after a bit of random browsing I found this in Ben's thread
(http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y68/judderi/DSC00208-1.jpg)
Theres double the amount of pulleys there! Which means I need to get 2 new pulleys that I don't have :(
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Is it possible to use the pulleys off a MK3 or something else. There isn't a single scrapyard in the whole of Glasgow that has a MK2 in it and I hate paying dealership prices.
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Anyone, anything?
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MK3 setup will bolt on lovely, and trust me if you want PAS its definitly worth the upgrade!
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All I need is the pulleys - all the other bits I have, so I take it the MK3 pulleys will fit fine. I shall be scrap yard prowling tommorow then!
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the crank pulley setup is the expensive bit, the waterpump pulley is dirt cheap from VW, like £5! The pas pump pulley shouldnt be too much? You can't use the MK2 PAS pump either, the spacing is wrong, gotta be a MK3 one. Look at passats too, the ones after around 92-93 have the same belt setup!
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I've got the PAS pulley, just missing the crank and waterpump - seems a shame to get a whole new PAS pump for the sake of a couple of pulleys. What I'm confused about is the extra pulley that the fella gave me. It does bolt onto the crank (same 4x holes and spacing), but its really far offset (about 1" further than the PAS pulley) - what on earth could this be from?
So the crank pulley is too expensive to buy, and I've a fat chance of getting it, $&%^!
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yeah crank pulley costs a bomb, but as I said pretty much all 8v MK3/Passats have the same pulley, even ABF one is the same, but good luck getting one :grin:
ebay could be a good place to get one?
The extra pulley on the crank would be for the PAS pump usually, maybe aircon?
I cant remember if the offset was too low or too high on the PAS pump, once you get the other MK3 pullies do a test fit, if its too low you make yourself a spacer with some washers and longer bolts :)
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Pulleys from the stealership are:
£16.03 + VAT Water pump
£33.88 + VAT Crank
Which makes my cheap conversion, extremely expensive. Ignore my stupidity, but I'm not clear on whether the MK3/Passat stuff will fit with my existing MK2 pump, or will I have to replace the pump and the new set of pulleys?
For the time being, just how stiff will the steering be without the PAS hooked up? I took the engine out the car months ago and haven't driven it since and its driving me mad, I want to go out and play in it!
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to be honest with u mate...ive owned mk2 with pas and without and always prefer them without it...bit heavy on parking but such a better feel to the car when its on the move....but ur car do as u please...will have a look in scrappy up here in perth for you....
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everything will fit straight on except the pas pump pulley. The actual pulley mounting face is a different offset to the MK2 pump, meaning that the pulley wont be in the correct position. I can't remember if the pulley sticks out too far, or if its the other way round though! If its not out far enough you could use some washers to space it out I guess?
Looking at etka theres also the vibration damper which is £238!!
PAS rack with a disconnected pump is gonna be much heavier than a std mk2 without pas I'm afraid :(
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Ok cool, I'll hit the scrappies tommorow then and see what I can find. Rubjonny - you're like the oracle of VW's!
Btw, I've driven my car for 12 months without PAS and I'm certain that I want PAS, its balls for city driving and parking - which is all I do.
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So I went to the scrapyard today and found a MK2 golf.......shell. I checked the MK3 but thats an entirely different pulley system, ribbed belt, not toothed. Then I saw a lonely looking Corrado sitting in the corner, popped the bonnet and there was a nice little 16v K-Jet engine in there, pulley system looked similar, so went about stealing it.
A lot of swearing and bodging and 2 hours later, yes 2 hours! I got the water pump pulley and the crank pulley off, but there is 1 issue. The water pump pulley was slightly damaged, there is two, the inner and outer. It looks like the inner pulley serves no real purpose and just spins freely and its the PAS belt that drives the water pump. As the inner pulley was damaged, I doubt I can stick with my original pulley, as the water pump will be driven by two different belts, not to mention it probably won't fit, so it looks like I'm back to square one!
I will test fit the components tommorow and see how it looks. Whats the risk of running the water pump off two different belts (if its even possible).
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Thats the slipper pulley setup, the inner pulley is £Â£Ã‚£
For the mk3 system all you have to do is unbolt the alternator, pas pump and brackets/bolts, then take the pulleys. Make sure you grab all the studs on the block as well...
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Stupid slip pulley! Ok, how about just getting a really short PAS belt, and just wrap it round the crank and PAS pump - that should do the trick surely?
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thats how most 8vs were, if you can find one the right length you'll be laughing. Use a piece o string to measure up what length you need, then take a trip down to chav-fords :)
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Sounds like a plan, when I actually get out of bed I'll see how it fits up. I did buy a new belt yesterday from Maccess but I'll drop by and swap it out for a shorter length one.
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Ok, just because I had the belt I bought, I fitted this up using my existing water pump pulley, and the new one I got from the scrappies, just to see if it fitted alright (not using slip pulley!)
(http://img136.imageshack.us/img136/7445/minicimg4780tq0.jpg) (http://imageshack.us)
(http://img136.imageshack.us/img136/2666/minicimg4781gj8.jpg) (http://imageshack.us)
(http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/2457/minicimg4782fu1.jpg) (http://imageshack.us)
Effectively the water pump is now driven by two different pulley systems, both the alternator belt and the PAS belt. Would this be ok to run it like this, or do the pulleys move at different rates (can't think why they would though). At least theres a little redundancy in the way I have it setup at the moment. I turned the crank a few times to see if it looked ok and there didn't seem to be any slipping/blinding.
My question is, is this safe, will it work?
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if both belts turn properly that looks like it will be ok since both pulleys on the crank are the same size as the pulley on the waterpump it is driving.
Only thing is if one belt starts slipping I'm not quite sure what would happen :undecided:
Just to confirm though, if you take off the outer waterpump pulley you end up with the std fitment setup as fitted to most 8vs and some 16vs, all you need is a belt to fit round the outer crank pulley & pas pulley. As I said before if you run some string round em you'll see what length you need.
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You're probably right - best being on the safe side. I'll pull that belt off and swap it for a shorter length and hook it solely to the crank.
This is quite exciting now, all I need to find is some loom tape, bolt the g/box back on, and I can refit the engine, I hope to get this all done by tommorow evening - so I can finally drive my car again!
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Bad Rubjonny! So that didn't work either, I went and grabbed a shorter belt from Halfrauds, but it catches on the water pump pulley, even at full tension.
(http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/5003/minicimg4801fm6.jpg) (http://imageshack.us)
(http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/4263/minicimg4802pg2.jpg) (http://imageshack.us)
I've got a deeper crank pulley, but this requires me to use about 2cm of spacers on the PAS pulley! It clears the water pump pulley then, but seems very dodgy with the expanse of spacers, I will post a pic of how I mean.
I did manage to fix the slip pulley - but again, the spacing is different and sits about 1cm further out than the crank and alternator pulley - so it would serve no good anyway. I'm really starting to struggle here. I don't suppose you have a photo of your water pump pulley?
(http://img91.imageshack.us/img91/8308/minicimg4803vk3.jpg) (http://imageshack.us)
(http://img89.imageshack.us/img89/7564/minicimg4804ca8.jpg) (http://imageshack.us)
(http://img91.imageshack.us/img91/3708/minicimg4805bb0.jpg) (http://imageshack.us)
(http://img91.imageshack.us/img91/1136/minicimg4806jy4.jpg) (http://imageshack.us)
(http://img89.imageshack.us/img89/9619/minicimg4807td6.jpg) (http://imageshack.us)
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heres one I got handy:
(http://www.cmathiesen.com/golf/Images/2L16v45s042.jpg)
looks like the pas pump pulley mounting face is out more...
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well, i had to cheat as none of the proper ways were working. i ended up using spacers, about 4mm worth in the end. scan through this post in my blog if you want to see the end result.
http://www.golfgtiforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=49436.msg627229#msg627229