GolfGTIforum.co.uk
General => The garage => Topic started by: Mars Attacks on 18 November 2003, 09:48
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strange one this one...
got a mate who has an 8v k-jet gti and he is having all sorts of problems with the running of it. Basically it starts ok from cold, but then starts to hesitate badly and misfire until its warmed up. then it runs ok. But after about 15 miles, you can hear the lift pump in the tank whining as if its pulling harder and as you slow down, the car starts to stutter and stammer until there is no acceleration at all and the car cuts out due to no fuel getting to engine. Strange thing is that if you stop the car and start it again, it starts again and all is well for the next 15 miles, then the same thing happens again. Its almost like a pressure has built up to a point where the car cant pump the fuel along the line anymore, and by switching the car off, it clears it, but i don't know. I would have said blockage in fuel lines, but as the fault clears after a restart, it sounds like something electrical. I do know that he has had a mess about with his idle and mixture/timing recently. It has had a new lift pump recently and new fuel filter.
Any clues as to what it is as he is avoiding driving his car at the moment. I say he should get to garage and get mixture and timing done first of all. anyone else had problems like this??
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ive got the same problem with mine. only diffrence is that mine stalls then takes forever to start up the engine again. need help. dont want to take it to garage cos it might cost a bomb!! dont wanna spend more then i already have.
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Fuel pump relay?
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does the fuel pump relay cause intermittant problems or is it either working or not working? i have wondered if this could be the problem
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check all your tank breather hoses are clear, also use an airline and blow the pipe between tank and pump, back into tank (make sure filler cap off) see how ya get on,
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The fuel pump relay can cause intermittent problems with the car cutting out.
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I use a number 17 X contact relay for a fuel one after I fried the 2 number 62's I had and don't want to pay ?40 for a new one. hrrmm, I wonder if that's my problem then.
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so i should use an air pipe and blow into the fuel tank with the petrol cap off. also do you think it could be the air fuel mixture.
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his car cut out twice again on the way home yesterday, the lift pump starts to sound as if its over working or sucking up thin air, then any press on the throttle results in either stuttering or complete starvation resulting in car cutting out. Restarts car and is okish for a few more minute, but then same again. Car is ok first thing in morning when its cold. strange one this...
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Change the fuel pump relay, its got to be worth a try.
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looks like the easiest thing to check, will make sure breathers are clear too from tank. sounds like a pressure build up somewhere in there
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You should hear the main fuel pump buzzing for 2 secs on start up and then continuously once started. If that is the case then I doubt the fuel pump relay is faulty.........but for the sake of ?12 or so (long time since I've bought one), it might be worth changing all the same.
I'd try disconnecting the fuel supply pipe to your main fuel pump. There is a small strainer in there and it sounds very much like that could be blocked/blocking. Its almost the first line of defense from crud in the tank.
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i was told that if a relay is damaged, it can slowly deteriorate. Its not simply a case of it works or it doesn't work. At least I hope thats the case as he has ordered a new one today!
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Its worth changing as a matter of course just as 'vr6 says. If that doesn't fix it, try that fuel pump inlet.........the symptons you're describing are exactly the same as MK1_BOY's and that blocked strainer was the cause.
If the relay doesn't fix, it doesn't hurt to have a spare in your glovebox so you won't have wasted your money either way.
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yeah, its worth getting for 20 notes. the lift pump is new and the white filter on the end was cleaned at the weekend, but the next job is to check for those tank breathers. where exactly should we be looking and how do you go about unblocking them?
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The white filter on the end of the lift pump is not the one I think you need to look at. Take the fuel supply line off the fuel pump and look into the pump.........there is a small conical filter in there, I reckon that may be blocked.
Just trying to find you a diagram to show you the vent and breather lines.
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Does the 8v have a lift pump and a in-line pump? or just the lift pump?
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You'll definately have an in-line pump as well as the lift pump. Its located just forward of the rear o/s wheel........you should hear it buzzing under there.
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Some of the Mk1's don't have the lift pump........all have the inline.
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I'm not really up on mk1s , i've never owned one. Surely if the car has a lift and in-line pump, the lift pump is new so have a closer look at the in-line pump.
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Not sure if this will work, but try clicking this for your breather and vent lines:-
http://www.elcats.ru/audivw/vag5.asp?subm=%CF%EE%E8%F1%EA&btsnr=066-00&cid=7
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Yep......check out the inlet to the inline pump, costs nothing.
I'm not really up on mk1s , i've never owned one. Surely if the car has a lift and in-line pump, the lift pump is new so have a closer look at the in-line pump.
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You'll have to copy and paste the link as not all of the text is enabled.
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You're just too good mate :-*
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Thanks 'vr6, I do my best..........
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thats great info thanks. we will get right on it tonight or at weekend in the light and let you know how we get on. Thanks again
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I think you need to look at items 9, 12, 40 and 43.
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Rich is the one for mk1s ::)
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tell me about it, the car has been threatened with the bin if it wasn't sorted. probs like this ruin the whole drive. but if what you have suggested works....
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Good luck and thanks again 'vr6
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Good News!! Had car jacked up at weekend, Physically blew down breather under tank and it seemed clear, then i fitted new fuel pump relay that i had got that day (was a 63 and not the 62 that was on the car) and touch wood the problems seem to have gone away! Were not getting too excited yet, will give it a few weeks, but he drove to work today with no stops, and no whining from the fuel tank. Thanks for the help guys and we will prey thats the end of it all.
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Nice one :)
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really good advice there, that description at the begining
is EXACTLY what happens to my 85cabby. I was quoted ?700 to fix it!!!
I have had a new 'big'? pump fitted and it has cleared up the dying, however its still very 'buzzy' down there in the tank so maybe its just a tempoary solution to a long term problem (beer! ;D)
theres is also like a hissing air noise coming from near the driver side rear wheel - from looking at the diagram you posted this is the 43 hose or 9 breather tube???
how much noise does this and the pump make on a healty cab?
thanks guys - this place is an info goldmine - shame i have no tools etc.
Podge
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a few days gone and all is still well. got our fingers crossed that this is it!
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well, we spoke too soon. the Problem has come back again. When you start the car hot or cold, fine the car starts and idle settles down at about 1000. Set off in car and you will get the occassional misfire and judder if you try and put your foor down even slightly.
But as soon as its had a good run of a few miles, you come to a stop, the revs, shoot up to between 1500 and 2000 or they do the exact opposite and kangerroo from 1000 to 300 nearly stalling. then in slow traffic, for no reason and with not warning, power dissapears, and the car either cuts out or judders until you turn the ignition off and restart it. The car is running like a bag of crap. were just about sick of it and running out of ideas. Maybe the liftpump we put in from GSF was crap? (It is vocal at all times now) the main pump may be knackered, the metering head may be sticking (plunger inside). Tried blowing thru tank breathers and they seem clear enough. Running out of ideas guys.
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Sorry to hear that its come back.
Have you tried sticking an ammeter in series with the pump to see what kind of current draw you're getting? That'll give you an idea of how hard the pump is having to work.
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Had a similar problem on my 8v k-jet a few years ago - normally it was ok but when engine got hotter than normal - hot days/sat idling in traffic, it would missfire and eventually cut out. as soon as the engine cooled down it would start and run ok. The in tank riser pump would get louder before the problem started so I thought it was a blockage somewhere.
Turned out to be the in tank riser pump - its easy to change and pretty cheap too. Give it a try!!
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I put in a new intank lift pump that i got from gsf just a few months ago along with a new fuel filter.
is it possible i was sold a duff intank lift pump. It was a lot more vocal than the old one straight away.
Do GSF sell duff gear?
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Do GSF sell duff gear?
Yep i would say they do.
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i'll have to get it back out of the tank on saturday and have a look again. If i have the receipt i'll try and get my money back and order one from somewhere else.
if all these problems are because of this I will sue them for wasted saturday play time over the last 2 months!!
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Always buy genuine bits if you can.
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yes, i am thinking that now!! has anyone got the volkswagen code for the that paticular K-jet 1.8 injection cabriolet golf in tank lift pump by any chance???
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what year/reg? do you want the part no. for the in tank pump?
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its a 1990 (g) golf gti cabriolet 1.8 kjet. just need lift pump part number.
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I can only find the in-line pump. Has your car definately got an inline and a in-tank pump?
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it has the main pump under the car near the drivers side rear wheel and a lift pump attached to the tank level indicator accessible by removing rear seats and lifting unit out of tank.
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poor old girl, its like a 1.1 for power which cuts out every 10 miles. shame to see it like this. we will try again on saturday, but i fear it has something seriously wrong with it.
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Good luck mate :)