GolfGTIforum.co.uk
Model specific boards => Golf mk8 => Topic started by: alland on 04 July 2024, 12:36
-
Hi, I have taken delivery of an ex-demo Mk8 GTI. I am still getting to know the car (have owned many GTI's before) and have read lots of interesting stuff you don't get in the (VERY GENERIC) VW manual. Incidentally, so far I have had absolutely no trouble with the infotainment system or the haptic buttons - I think it works well!
However, there are a couple of things I kind of baffled with:
1) Voice Control. This was demonstrated to me during the vehicle handover, and worked impressively - but when I use it via the steering wheel button, I get a "function not available" message! Why? I've seen it working! The only change made was me becoming the prime user instead of the dealer.
2) The car has the 19" Adelaide wheels - very smart. I have learned that when this option is chosen, sport suspension must also be included. What is the difference between this and the standard non-DCC set up? It's OK, but feels pretty stiff on our pot-hole strewn roads up here in Scotland. Seems a strange thing to do when using 35 aspect-ratio tyres
(https://i.postimg.cc/6qFy5kpJ/20240524-110628.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)
-
As far as I know the non DCC suspension is called sports suspension and I'm sure there is not more than one type of it so that's what you'll have. And as for the other question on voice control I can't help as mine doesn't have it. What I will say though is that when I connect my phone to my car you can use voice control via the apps so it's a work around. I have to say I didn't see any need for the voice control as I heard it was very hit and miss but in a real life situation I find the voice control for the sat nav to be absolutely excellent. Trying to input addresses with my sausage fingers is far more stressful than just shouting at the thing, it works great for me, so in that respect I love it.
-
Hi. Thanks for your input - interesting, and I'm already seeing the benefit on being a member of this forum!
To be fair, I can't see me using voice control very much, I just thought it was weird that during the handover the guy said "Hello Volkswagen" and the thing replied "How can I help you today" which I believe is the procedure - and yet it won't talk to me! I can get get a very basic form of voice control via Android Auto, but it is basic.
As for the suspension, it is what it is - just have to keep memorising where the potholes are. (Anyone who could write software for "pothole alert" and load it into the satnav will become a millionaire in seconds!)
Previous GTIs
Mk1 8V
Mk2 8V
Mk2 16V (the best - wish I'd kept that!)
Mk3 8V
Mk3 16V
Mk5 16V
Mk6 16V
-
If your Mk8 is a newer one they took voice control out of the built in options.
You could buy it in the online shop though.
If the former owner did that then its tied to that vehicle VIN and their VW account...
Swap the logged in account to your VW account and magically....its gone!
Its garbage anyway...
-
As for the suspension, it is what it is - just have to keep memorising where the potholes are. (Anyone who could write software for "pothole alert" and load it into the satnav will become a millionaire in seconds!)
Use Waze on your phone via AndroidAuto or AppleCarPlay - it does that!
-
As for the suspension, it is what it is - just have to keep memorising where the potholes are. (Anyone who could write software for "pothole alert" and load it into the satnav will become a millionaire in seconds!)
Use Waze on your phone via AndroidAuto or AppleCarPlay - it does that!
Yes it does, and it was very useful when I did a few long-ish journeys on unfamiliar roads earlier this year. Advance warning of potholes saved me from damaging my alloys on more than one occasion :smiley:.
-
alland, it’s your accent it couldn’t cope with! 😁
Just kidding, the later mk8’s don’t have it, as above. My 2020 Clubsport had the feature and it was woeful. I switched it out eventually. My Dec 2023 R doesn’t have it but again, as above, it can be purchased from VW’s “store”. I wouldn’t recommend spending actual money on activating it.
Obviously not relevant here but the ChatGPT AI voice add on fitted to 8.5’s should be a massive improvement in that department.
Nobody that I’m aware of has been able to determine the differences in non adaptive suspension between 18” and 19” wheel options. VW definitely do make a point of mentioning it but it might be one of those oddities in their marketing descriptions which hint at differences that aren’t actually there.
The 19’s do give a knobblier ride but that’s not a bad thing as it trains you to avoid potholes. The wheels can and will bend on hard pothole impacts so think of it as a money saving feature.
By the way, it might be worth checking the dealer hasn’t put silly high air pressures in the tyres.
What sort of wheel/tyre/suspension combo did your immediately previous car have?
-
Good point regarding checking the tyre pressures something I should have done in any case really. I must stress that the A-road surfaces around here are particularly poor, so I'm probably being picky about the suspension thing. My previous car was a Porsche Macan S so that's not really comparable with the GTI, although it was pretty bumpy around here as well.
Another topic: have any of you had any experience of having a reversing camera retro-fitted by VW? It's the one thing I really miss on my car. (Being an ex-demo, it was specced by the dealer. I would much rather have had the camera than the pano roof!) Do the VW techs do the install, or do they bring a 3rd party specialist in to do the job? I'm thinking warranty issues, trim being removed resulting to rattles, etc.
-
The Mk8 has been around long enough for any competent retrofit company to have done quite a few by now, so I wouldn't expect electrical problems or rattles to be a problem anymore.
Last time I looked it was about £600 all in but that was two years ago. I'm sure there will be others on here who will have recommendations. In the end I didn't bother and have got used to reversing more cautiously.
https://www.autologics.co.uk/vw-reverse-camera/VW-Golf-8-Reverse-Camera-Retrofit
-
OK, just checked my tyre pressures after reading various opinions on what they should be (19" Adelaides, Bridgestone tyres). All were set at 42 psi, so I've reduced this to 38 psi all round as per the door sticker for partial loads. Tested it on a local section of bumpy road, and noticed an immediate improvement in ride quality. As a retired hydraulic engineer, I wouldn't have thought 3 psi would have amounted to much difference, but it has.
-
Re- revering camera question, thanks for the link to the Autologics website. They certainly have excellent Trustpilot ratings, and I was intrigued that they carry out the installation at your home free of (extra) charge. However, unless they use GENUINE OEM parts (and they don't mention that on their website), I do wonder how this installation NOT carried out by VW technicians, would impact the car's warranty conditions given that they will eventually connect into the infotainment system?
Coincidentally, the £600 quoted by them is nearly the same as that quoted by the dealer that I bought the car from, but using them would not be so convenient, but would surely would not affect my warranty.
I reckon I'll give it more time to see if I get used to reversing "like in the old days" when I passed my test!
-
OK, just checked my tyre pressures after reading various opinions on what they should be (19" Adelaides, Bridgestone tyres). All were set at 42 psi, so I've reduced this to 38 psi all round as per the door sticker for partial loads. Tested it on a local section of bumpy road, and noticed an immediate improvement in ride quality. As a retired hydraulic engineer, I wouldn't have thought 3 psi would have amounted to much difference, but it has.
It’s surprising how much a few PSI alters the ride comfort.
A few years ago manufacturers twigged that setting up the car to run very high air pressure was another trick in their armoury to getting lower emissions under test conditions. I had one of the first 2019 BMW F40 M135i’s and those early models were set up to run silly high pressures and subsequently felt a bit skittish. Once dropped to around 38 psi they drove (and rode) significantly better.
I went from a couple of cars with standard reversing camera (GTI TCR, M135i) to a GTI Clubsport that didn’t have one and rarely missed the RVC. Very rarely. I’m now running a Golf with rear camera and although it’s handy it’s not £600 handy.
-
Re- revering camera question, thanks for the link to the Autologics website. They certainly have excellent Trustpilot ratings, and I was intrigued that they carry out the installation at your home free of (extra) charge. However, unless they use GENUINE OEM parts (and they don't mention that on their website), I do wonder how this installation NOT carried out by VW technicians, would impact the car's warranty conditions given that they will eventually connect into the infotainment system?
Coincidentally, the £600 quoted by them is nearly the same as that quoted by the dealer that I bought the car from, but using them would not be so convenient, but would surely would not affect my warranty.
I reckon I'll give it more time to see if I get used to reversing "like in the old days" when I passed my test!
Under the Technical Specifications when you click the link it does say "Genuine VW Golf 8 reverse camera" and they provide a two year warranty (although confusingly there is also reference to a one year warranty elsewhere!)
I don't have any personal knowledge of them as I didn't bother with a camera in the end.
-
Like others have mentioned previously in other posts, it seems a bit tight of VW not include a reversing camera as standard on a 40K+ car! But then again, if they've also deleted a cheap plastic warning triangle (due to favourable legislation changes) and left a gaping hole in the tailgate trim in it's place, maybe they're more strapped than we think!
I too will give the camera a miss. By the way, I did notice that the camera fitting company used "genuine VW parts" but at the end of the day it is not genuine VW personnel installing them. Academic now anyway
-
Don't think they've included the warning triangle on UK models for a very long time... My mk7 certainly never had one nor any since.
Maybe in other countries where it's a legal requirement to have one?
-
I’ve owned five VW’s in the last 22 years and none have had a warning triangle.
-
I never realised it had been that long since the warning triangles had been deleted in this country! However, my last GTI was a MK6 bought new in 2009 and it came with a triangle and a first-aid kit, which I assumed at the time was standard. Maybe not it seems. Anyway, if they are not supplying warning triangles now (does anyone remember actually using one?) you would think VW would attempt to make a cover over the hole where it should be.
(https://i.postimg.cc/fLg5ndnC/DSCN0026.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)
-
I never realised it had been that long since the warning triangles had been deleted in this country! However, my last GTI was a MK6 bought new in 2009 and it came with a triangle and a first-aid kit, which I assumed at the time was standard. Maybe not it seems.
Perhaps the warning triangle and first aid kit with your mk6 was a gift from the VW dealership as a thank you for buying the car? I didn’t get warning triangle or first aid kit with my mk5 Golf GT bought new in 2007 or my mk6 GTD bought new in 2011 (so bought either side of your 2009 mk6 GTI).
Anyway, if they are not supplying warning triangles now (does anyone remember actually using one?) you would think VW would attempt to make a cover over the hole where it should be.
I think it’s mandatory to carry a warning triangle in some countries, hence the hole in the tailgate trim to accommodate one, even if VW don’t supply the warning triangle as part of the standard spec in those countries. Making a cover for the hole would be an added cost (albeit a small cost), and with car manufacturers these days - not just VW - it’s all about cost reduction to help improve the bottom line.
-
When I picked up my car new from Inchcape Chester at a substantial discount I was amazed to discover the proper triangle was in place. Was this a mistake or an act of responsible kindness?
We will never know but this and the camera should be standard on an expensive car.
They are standard on many lesser cars so the arguments about the bean counters doesn’t always stand up.
-
Options are all about whether your target market will pay for them... Vw think you will... Dacia not so much
-
When I picked up my car new from Inchcape Chester at a substantial discount I was amazed to discover the proper triangle was in place. Was this a mistake or an act of responsible kindness?
We will never know but this and the camera should be standard on an expensive car.
They are standard on many lesser cars so the arguments about the bean counters doesn’t always stand up.
Yes, a mid range Renault Clio costing £19k - £20k get a reversing camera as part of standard equipment.
-
I think the idea of "options" is a relatively recent thing.... it always used to be just various trim levels.
Individual options and custom builds were something you had on the ultra-expensive end of the market. In fact the likes of Ford, Vauxhall etc only ever sold you cars from stock... no factory orders at all.
The only "options" were things the dealer could fit - eg stick on heated rear screen heaters or electric antennas!
(jeez I'm old!)
I think a lot of OEM's now are going back to trim levels and stock too. It makes their operation cheaper and easier to run.
I remember asking for a Escort Ghia in a particular colour and being told I could only have some other colours or a different trim level. Conversation closed!
-
I think the idea of "options" is a relatively recent thing.... it always used to be just various trim levels.
Individual options and custom builds were something you had on the ultra-expensive end of the market. In fact the likes of Ford, Vauxhall etc only ever sold you cars from stock... no factory orders at all.
The only "options" were things the dealer could fit - eg stick on heated rear screen heaters or electric antennas!
(jeez I'm old!)
I think a lot of OEM's now are going back to trim levels and stock too. It makes their operation cheaper and easier to run.
I remember asking for a Escort Ghia in a particular colour and being told I could only have some other colours or a different trim level. Conversation closed!
I remember the Smiths stick on rear screen demisters. I helped my father fit one to his car back in the early 1970’s.
The ‘no options’ approach already exists within VAG as it was adopted by Seat a good while ago. I think cars are still built to order, but the choices are limited to trim level, engine / transmission and paint colour. I’m not sure but I think with some trim levels there might be a choice of alloys, but that’s it. As you’ve said, it removes cost and complexity from vehicle production and presumably reduces customer wait times too.
-
Oh and wing mirrors! I remember getting wing mirrors fitted by the dealer! Drill em in!
-
We had to keep our car in a cardboard box….
-
We had to keep our car in a cardboard box….
You were lucky……….
-
Regarding options, my dealer told me there was school of thought among most of the big manufacturers, including premium brands, whereby they would build all models of their vehicles with options like heated seats and steering wheel, cruise control, various levels of satnav, various infotainment levels, folding door mirrors, central locking variations, keyless entry - stuff like that but not paint or wheel choices, etc. During the buying process, the customer would then choose their options by ticking the appropriate boxes, at which point the customer would then enter into an annual subscription agreement to have those options activated.
The manufacturers reckon this would enable them to build the cars quicker and cheaper with consequent faster delivery times. Also, if the buyer discovered that any of the options he had chosen was not being used enough, he could annually have that option removed (de-activated) and have his subscription adjusted accordingly.
I think BMW already do this with some of their options.
-
Yeah subscription revenue stream.... its all the rage...
BMW tried it first with heated seats... and faced a backlash.
VW do do it too in some respects.... if you buy a non-performance golf there are all sorts of things you can pay to enable. However I think VW its a one off payment not a monthly sub like BMW tried to pull.
One you've even got - the voice control (or rather lack of it)
-
Usually if no one posts pics of the backs they reps usually amd also why mk7.5 caps on mk8 wheels?
-
Usually if no one posts pics of the backs they reps usually amd also why mk7.5 caps on mk8 wheels?
I think you intended to post the above in the ‘Adelaide alloys 19 inch’ discussion topic. :smiley:
https://www.golfgtiforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=290531.0
I agree with your comments above - they’re probably reps.
-
@alland My understanding is, that ‘sports suspension’ when specced along with the 19” wheels, lowers the car by something like 15mm, this is why I had to have Eibach Pro-Kit springs fitted to my car when I replaced the factory fit 18’s, as the arch gap visually increased with 19’s on the car, this is also why there are two DCC options depending on wheel choice.
-
The 15mm quoted ^^^ is compared to a base model Golf not a performance model which all have lowered suspension from the factory as compared to a Life, Match etc.
-
The 15mm quoted ^^^ is compared to a base model Golf not a performance model which all have lowered suspension from the factory as compared to a Life, Match etc.
The suspension on GTI’s with 18’s is definitely higher than those supplied with 19’s, the exact specifications I’m not sure of. The overall final ride height remains the same though due to the different wheel sizes in conjunction with the suspension changes.
-
I’d say the difference you’re talking is the minuscule difference in overall diameter of the wheel and tyre combo going from 225/40/18 to 235/35/19 which will be not far off the equivalent to the difference between a new tyre and one at the legal minimum.
Seriously, too much internet gospel is taken from VW’s notoriously dodgy press bulletins and spec sheets.
The differences will be negligible. We are talking about splitting hairs here I’d imagine.
Happy to be proven wrong if presented with hard facts.
36 years of crawling around, in and under VW’s, modifying and de-modifying.
-
(https://i.postimg.cc/jjjgwTNQ/IMG-1228.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/v4pLkp0c)
19” wheels with standard fit tyres will be 9.9mm larger overall diameter than 18” with standard fit tyres. Which is 4.95mm less arch gap and 4.95mm higher ride height. Depending of the offset (ET) they may poke out further which will also give the illusion of filling the arches more
-
The factory 19” wheels are 8J ET50 not 8.5J and ET45 as in the table above so only 6mm or so extra “poke” but I do agree that wheel offset can visually make a big difference to how the wheel/tyre combo fills the arch.
Assuming the same rate of tyre wear at any given time then I guess you could say “every little helps” with the 5mm less arch gap.
I’m still to be convinced there’s much difference to the factory spring & damper set up between wheel size options. I’ve taken so many factory fit dampers off over the decades noting how little pressure is needed to compress the piston into the body and how slowly it pushes back out again compared to a good aftermarket damper. The main differences I noticed in the varying mk7’s I had (GTI PP, R, GTD, Ed40, TCR) were the spring rates.
-
I do not know that this is the case by any means @exonian, and I’m sure you’re correct about spring rates as that makes a lot of sense, , I’m simply basing my (now seemingly rather dubious😣) claim of height difference on 3 things, firstly Andrew Chapple (Volkswizard) mentioned something similar when he fitted 19’s to his club sport a couple of years back, secondly, just seeing the difference between my factory 18” GTI and a factory 19” GTI side by side at the dealership once I had 19’s on my car, and finally, being told that this was the case by Jamie @ Turner race developments when he fitted my Eibach springs in order to reduce the increased arch gap, I cannot confirm any of this however, and now question if I am at all correct! 😬
Maybe simply switching the wheels gave the illusion of a bigger arch gap?
https://www.turner-race-developments.co.uk/
-
Of the three, I’d say your own eyes were the most reliable source!
Andrew’s net is cast quite wide.
TRD much more familiar with components as they’re working on cars constantly, but likely more familiar with things they sell rather than things they remove when it comes to tiny differences in factory specs. If it’s something significant such as larger bump stops to stop bigger wheels making contact on compression then I’d 100% trust them as there’s no arguing that, but factory dampers look very similar even if valving is slightly different and springs all look pretty much the same aside from the colour of paint blobs. If the windings were noticeably different and they’d seen enough examples of certain cars to take note then that would be really useful to know.
It’s just VW’s tech spec vagueness that brings out the cynicism in me.
An easy example is the 7.5 TCR where you had the standard passive suspension which was unknown spec but same ride height as the GTI Performance (same components?) and optional stand alone DCC (ditto GTI Perf) but the wheel and tyre DCC packs with the Reifnitz or Pretoria had “20mm” lower springs according to VW but in actuality that was 5mm compared to the other GTI’s (same ride height as Golf R in essence) plus front axle camber changes similar to the Clubsport S (and subsequently mk8 Clubby and R).
The springs on these optional packs were pretty firm and put me off DCC for life as the dampers couldn’t keep up with the springs unless set to firm, then it was just too firm!
Point being these specifics were mentioned in the press releases and tech specs albeit vaguely in most cases, but with the mk8 Golfs VW hint at things without any specifics making me very dubious.
-
I don't have a great deal of knowledge about VW suspension dynamics as such, but back in the day a friend and I did quite a bit of rallying at National standard. In that scenario, the biggest influencer of suspension stiffness, comfort (yes, even in a rally wagon!) and ride height (even more important) was the springs. A huge amount depended on spring length, compression characteristic, and most of all, the actual steel the springs were made of - which was why aftermarket or specialised units were a lot dearer since they were made from superior quality steel than the stock items. Although we did use "sports" dampers (Koni) they had a secondary influence on handling.
So perhaps the same applies to modern day cars like our MK8 GTIs: lowered springs (and therefore less wheel arch gap (purely aesthetic), give progressive compression and therefore improved handling. Dampers (or shock absorbers as they were once known) do just that - absorb the shocks, albeit to varying degrees in the case of adjustable ones.
Of course, when we fit 19" wheels with 35 aspect-ration tyres, we're asking even more of the system!
-
This may be a daft question, but has anyone noticed a reduction in the Mk8 GTI turning circle when 19" wheels are fitted? I ask because when manoeuvring my car the turning circle does not seem that good - although perfectly adequate once familiarised.
My Porsche Macan S had a similar trait, and the dealer told me that when larger wheels were installed (in this case 21"), stops were installed to limit the maximum steering movement in each direction to avoid the wheels contacting the inner bodywork and suspension components. Sounded like bullsh!t to me, so I never bothered about it.
I just wondered if VW did this on the Golfs
-
I immediately noticed the increased turning circle when I changed from mk6 GTI to new R with 19” Pretoria alloys. The first time I reversed off our drive.
Seems to be a common problem. Often grumbled about on the VWROC Golf R forum.
-
I thought the turning circle issue was more R itself related and not wheel size? Maybe something to do with the diff?
-
Yes, the turning circle on mk7 R’s was canal barge like.
I went from a mk7 GTI PP to a 2015 R (both came from the factory with 18’s but subsequently swapped to 19’s) and immediately noticed the reduction in manoeuvrability. The R was followed by a few more FWD Golf 7’s and eventually a mk8 Clubsport at the arse end of 2020. The mk8 didn’t seem to have the same turning circle as the mk7 FWD cars but I wondered whether it was my imagination as the mk8 Clubby steering seemed improved in other aspects.
-
Very interesting. I've done some trawling through the internet and this turning circle issue does get a load of discussion time on other forums, especially in the USA. According to the dimensions info in the VW Mk8 brochure, the turning circle for all models is 10.9 metres; there is no mention of type or size of wheels fitted, or suspension specs.
However, a person in the US was adamant the wheel size DOES make a difference; he has a Mk8 Golf GTI and runs it in winter with 225/45R17 wheels/tyres. In summer he changes to a 235/35R19 set up (same as myself) and immediately notices a marked difference in the turning circle (larger).
I cannot get my head around this; if all racks are the same "stroke", i.e same lateral movement of the rack lock-lock, then the wheel(s) angle must be the same, irrespective of the wheel diameter since the pivot point is the wheel centre line. The only way to change the turning circle would be a physical restriction of some kind, either externally or within the rack itself. But surely nobody fitting aftermarket larger wheels would go to that bother?
-
Here's another twist to the turning circle question: I recently looked at my vehicle details in the VW Connect app. In that section it lists the "selected vehicle equipment" and one of those items was "Progressive Steering for 19" Wheels". I've never seen this listed as an option or standard equipment in any VW brochure before, so what is this? If it is real, is this why the turning circle seems large? Or is it just VW speak for some that doesn't actually exist?
-
Here's another twist to the turning circle question: I recently looked at my vehicle details in the VW Connect app. In that section it lists the "selected vehicle equipment" and one of those items was "Progressive Steering for 19" Wheels". I've never seen this listed as an option or standard equipment in any VW brochure before, so what is this? If it is real, is this why the turning circle seems large? Or is it just VW speak for some that doesn't actually exist?
Yes its possible that a car built with 19's has a reduced steering range to 18's (presumably to prevent it striking the wheel arches)
The only way to know for sure is if someone with a factory 18'er fitted 19's and noticed the same...
-
A stab in the dark but I’m going to say it’s possibly more likely to be an electronic adjustment to counter the fractionally bigger (circumference) wheels and 1cm wider tyres and a few millimetres offset difference.
As fredgroves says, most likely to stop any potential fouling under conditions such as full suspension compression with steering on full lock.
I ran 8x19’s on my Clubsport which came with factory 18’s and it was absolutely fine. No noticeable drawbacks.
-
My GTI had 18’s from factory, I swapped them out for 19’s, i haven’t notice any ill effects or difference in turning circle, in fact I’m pretty sure it has the same turning circle as my old Mk7 with factory 19’s, as I have to put on full lock to leave the driveway, and it just misses the gate post just like 7 did.