GolfGTIforum.co.uk
General => New forum members => Topic started by: CJ_NSR on 25 July 2023, 12:28
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Hi, looking at a Mk7 GTI or R as I have one on the way and need 5 doors. Currently own a Clio 200cup (which is hot hatch perfection*), which would make me smile like the Clio does?
Opinions please!
Thanks
*Sorry/not sorry if that offends you
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Decision is irrelevant, if you have a little one on the way you won’t get much time to drive anyway.
Seriously, both great cars, sure you will enjoy either. Some folk say a GTI is more exciting but maybe that’s just opinion.
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I might have some time haha
I think the gti might be more rewarding than the r. Want one that likes to be revved and handles really well. R might be too powerful?
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Welcome CJ_NSR :smiley:
I’ve owned all the versions of mk7 performance Golfs: GTI Performance Pack, R, GTD, Clubsport 40 and a 7.5 TCR.
What age of car are you looking at?
I’d say purely looking at you coming from a Clio 200 that a GTI power delivery might feel a bit flat. The turbo boosts low down but runs out of puff at lowish revs to what you’re used to. The chassis is lighter on its toes and it’s better on fuel than an R. Remap it and it comes alive.
The R chassis feels more solid and less wieldy but the engine loves to rev.
Lots of them have been thrashed.
The TCR is the best of all worlds but isn’t cheap. Oh, and it’s DSG only.
The clutches are a weak point on manual cars. DSG takes a bit of getting used to.
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Thanks!
Around 2015/16. Think I'd prefer a manual for the involvement
Budget would be 15-16k. I'm not really one for modding cars.
Anything would feel flat compared to what I have now!
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I'd echo what Exonian said regarding the GTI. I had a 2015 PP manual and it feels great at first, once you have decent tyres to cure the lack of traction when pulling away, a decent bit of go but, once you hit about 5k revs it suddenly gives up. Whilst for me that was rarely a problem, when it did happen it spoilt the drive. So I swapped to a TCR which has a 290PS version of the R engine, basically the same, and whilst it doesn't have that instant pull like the PP, the power keeps coming up the rev range and makes for a more exciting drive. Downsides, thirst and it's only in DSG.
An R for me is lacking a bit in the looks but that engine is fantastic. Not too much power at all, I'd say it would make a great daily. I haven't driven an R though so can't comment on how it feels versus a GTI so you'd probably be best getting a test drive in both.
For both models, be aware of the clutch which can slip and waterpumps/thermostat housings do start to leak around 40k miles and could be £800ish to replace so check if it has been done and if not, expect it.
Both are great cars and generally reliable but different, only you can decide which is best!
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Thanks!
Around 2015/16. Think I'd prefer a manual for the involvement
Budget would be 15-16k. I'm not really one for modding cars.
Anything would feel flat compared to what I have now!
Is the Cup totally unusable as a family car? It sounds like you love it. Does it not have rear seats or a useable boot? Apologies but I know nothing about them other than that they are extremely highly rated by Evo magazine types.
I managed perfectly well with a small child in a Polo G40 which has a tiny interior. Kids haven’t got much bigger since the mid 90’s surely? 😁
People go overboard with crap when they have a first child and soon realise they don’t actually need most of it. Travel light, just take with you what you actually need. Don’t buy a stupidly big pram and pushchair, buy small, light and manoeuvrable just like the car itself.
Oh, and congrats on the impending arrival :smiley:
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Well it doesn't have the Isofix points (standard 200 does), couldn't add them if I wanted to as the seats are slightly different. Typical French, and I have the bucket seats that don't help! From what I've read the performance pack on the gti helps?
I want to grow up without growing up too much if you get what I mean haha
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The Performance Pack gives you a 10bhp hike that you’ll not notice, bigger 340mm brakes the same spec as an R and a diff.
The diff does make a ‘diff’erence to how it handles and adds traction when on lock, and the brakes are good. Well worth having.
One thing that’ll be essential is a device called a PedalBox (similar devices are sold by other companies) but we’ll cross that bridge when you actually find a car. Search in the mk7 forum for heaps of info on it.
Also have a good look at Leon Cupras.
R engine, GTI PP chassis and brakes…
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(https://i.postimg.cc/gcDJ7zXD/Screenshot-20230729-101742.png) (https://postimg.cc/WtdTFP7F)
Going to look at this next week, anything I should look out for.
It's got a partial SH, they've all been done at dealers but not the same time every year. Sailed through all its Mots , hpi is good.
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FWIW my opinion is the R is a fantastic car, it’s quick, will eat b roads all day, has plenty of power and sticks to the road like red wine on a cream carpet. If you want something that’s effortlessly fast, a bit understated and great value for money the R is a great car, but I didn’t love it. It felt almost clinical at times, and in order to push it enough to make it really playful, the speeds I was seeing were a good bit the wrong side of legal.
The GTI on the other hand is playful from the get go. It’s not as quick as the R, even in clubsport form, but it feels lighter and more nimble, and you can feel the back start to rotate a little more freely on lift off. Where the R was jaw droppingly quick, the GTI (in the 245 Performance spec at least) made me smile from ear to ear the whole time I was in it. It had proper character, driving it felt almost empathetic. I have an a35 now, and there’s a reason I’m coming back to the GTI fold. I’ve test drive almost every hot hatch (I can’t drive a manual for medical reasons unfortunately) and there are few that feel as special as the golf does to me.
The one caveat, is that it’s all about how you feel. Find a dealer with a used R and GTI you can test drive, and make sure it’s the same rough spec as you’d buy (performance for the diff or standard without) and see how they feel, because it’s purely a personal decision.
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FWIW my opinion is the R is a fantastic car, it’s quick, will eat b roads all day, has plenty of power and sticks to the road like red wine on a cream carpet. If you want something that’s effortlessly fast, a bit understated and great value for money the R is a great car, but I didn’t love it. It felt almost clinical at times, and in order to push it enough to make it really playful, the speeds I was seeing were a good bit the wrong side of legal.
The GTI on the other hand is playful from the get go. It’s not as quick as the R, even in clubsport form, but it feels lighter and more nimble, and you can feel the back start to rotate a little more freely on lift off. Where the R was jaw droppingly quick, the GTI (in the 245 Performance spec at least) made me smile from ear to ear the whole time I was in it. It had proper character, driving it felt almost empathetic. I have an a35 now, and there’s a reason I’m coming back to the GTI fold. I’ve test drive almost every hot hatch (I can’t drive a manual for medical reasons unfortunately) and there are few that feel as special as the golf does to me.
The one caveat, is that it’s all about how you feel. Find a dealer with a used R and GTI you can test drive, and make sure it’s the same rough spec as you’d buy (performance for the diff or standard without) and see how they feel, because it’s purely a personal decision.
A great description. I’ve never driven a Golf R so I can only comment on the GTI. It’s simply the best car I’ve ever been fortunate enough to own.
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(https://i.postimg.cc/gcDJ7zXD/Screenshot-20230729-101742.png) (https://postimg.cc/WtdTFP7F)
Going to look at this next week, anything I should look out for.
It's got a partial SH, they've all been done at dealers but not the same time every year. Sailed through all its Mots , hpi is good.
That looks quite nice, a Westcountry plate on it too :cool:
The mileage looks good.
It would be worth trying to find out if the water pump has been changed out at some point.
Have a check to see if there’s a silicon bag in the coolant expansion tank too.
Check panel gaps are even, Golfs are usually quite good in that area so misaligned panels might point towards past dramas. HPI won’t always show this.
The wheels are likely to have surface corrosion on the painted sections at that age. If they don’t then it’s a huge bonus!
See if the VAQ diff has had an oil change, if not ask for it to be done.
Check the aircon blows cold, Groupon often do cheap regas deals via ATS if not.
On test drive accelerate briskly in sixth gear from around 1200 - 1600 revs to see if the clutch slips.
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A 5 door is best bet for family use by far. Can’t think you’ll be hammering it much with a bairn on board,,,,,
so super safety option has to be an R because of any weather stocking grip and stability.
A GTI will be more playful to drive on your own of course.
Either in 5dr will be great - just depends on your preferences. Some regard an R as a bit inert, but has fantastic A to B capability. Rain, snow or shine….
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Update: went to look at it today. A couple of things to check out.....
Oil in the diff was last changed in October 19.
No sign of water pump being done on the service history.
Couldn't open the tank to check for the bag, although it has the German word written on it. Not really sure if bag or no bag makes a difference? Couple of wheels were messy, but they'd sort those and a couple of chips etc........if I go ahead......but being a car supermarket they won't budge on price. HPI say it's £1100 over what it should be.
Decisions, decisions!
Thanks for the input.
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You at least know what you’re getting at a car supermarket type place - no frills, take it or leave it and busy sales people who need to sell a lot of cars to earn their keep.
Vehicles vary wildly in quality so you will see them on a take it or leave it basis and have to judge whether you can get them tidied to your own standards without shelling out heaps of money.
If you’re in doubt either walk away or bide your time to see if they drop the price a bit.
If any alarm bells ring for you then move on, another will come up, they’re not rare cars.
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I don't think it'll hang around with that mileage, it was certainly a nice change from the Clio. But I've found that a set of rear seats from the standard Clio 200 would fit and they have Isofix & split. So that's certainly the cheaper option!
Cheers for your help. I might look again in the future!
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In your shoes I know what I’d be doing :wink:
Better the devil you know.