GolfGTIforum.co.uk
Model specific boards => Golf mk7 => Topic started by: carbonevo on 02 March 2020, 16:09
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Hey guys,
apologies if this has been discussed here before, I could not find any results on a direct comparison between these two GTI models, therefore creating a new thread.
Not even a year back I got myself a golf gti performance for a brilliant deal in my country. However, ever since the TCR's price went down, I am finding myself speculating on whether I should sell my car and get the TCR. I hate the new MK8 GTI's look and not interested in owning it, which only fuels my speculation on getting the mk7 TCR.
I would love some inputs from those who owned both cars or had an opportunity to drive them both. In general what I am interested in;
1-How's the power? On paper the 45hp might not seem like much, but reviews clearly state that the TCR is even faster than an R. In daily driving conditions is the TCR - much more powerful than the PP?
2-Does it really look much better than the PP? On videos it looks stunning, imho the best looking hot hatch after the AMG45s, I know that's subjective but the TCR's look is the main reason why I want to switch. In my country I would simply not find one for a test drive unless imported or directly ordered...
3-Does it feel much more sporty or different driving than the PP? In terms of steering, chasy, limited slip differential behavior? Daily driving dynamic, track does not interest me as I would not take my car there.
4-Would the switch be worth it?
Thanks in advance for any inputs/opinions.
Cheers!
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Look out for legendary wordsmith Exonian's posts :afro:
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Look out for legendary wordsmith Exonian's posts :afro:
Legendary wordsmith sums him up perfectly. :grin:
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1. Yes its more powerful, 45 extra horses you will feel for sure.
2. Look better than a PP - absolutely. Its definitely the best looking Mk7 Golf made.
3. Probably not much in it. It is loaded with all of the late Mk7.5 toys though.
4. I'd say if you have a Mk7.5 PP.... probably not. No idea where you live, but the TCR is an expensive Golf - because of all of the bits on it. The exhaust in particular really bumps the price up - it wasn't included to start with, but all of the later to end TCR's had it as "standard" - but it wasn't free!! Which makes it a just under 40,000 GBP car, possibly more if you option even more things. Given that a GTI PP was probably 7000 cheaper, that's a lot more and basically for all of the options optioned. Great if you want them but...
You've still got a long time before you can see a Mk8 GTI in the flesh - something I read suggested not even being able to order a UK one until November 2020!
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I came from a MK 7 R so there was lots to compel me to make the change - the MK 7.5 lifts, plus the add on for the TCR as well as the different feel in the drive from being 100 KG lighter but the retaining of the R pace with the 290 BHP - The styling, Akrapovic and the relative exclusivity are nice to have must admit
But, imagine the MK 7.5 GTI PP is not overly different from the TCR in terms of ride and more so in terms of cabin and so is that extra bit of pace and additional trim worth the extra ££? - Will caveat that comment as it as always depends on the deal you can strike for changeover?
I think I would personally have stuck with a MK 7.5 GTI PP if that was my present ride as I think even with some decent haggling it would be a few thousand ££ to make the change for not too much of a change in experience.
If was in a MK 7 GTI PP, then its likely that be looking to change anyway and not forcing one, and so with the MK 7.5 lifts in the TCR it would be far more justifiable.
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I saw my first TCR on the road today. It looked decidedly different to PP even at a distance. Very smart indeed. If I had a gti PP would I change? As others say, it depends on the deal.
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The 7.5 gti pp IMO is just as good looking I know it doesn’t have the extra horses or the exhaust system upgrade but on daily driving it’s more than enough If you have few extra spec upgrades as well it still a lovely space to sit
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I'm going from a 7 pp to a TCR and probably only being able to do it because of the 0% finance and the deal I got. Have had one test drive and new straight away I wanted one.
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I can't help exactly as I had a MK7 PP rather than a 7.5 as I assume the OP means but do have a few comments that might help. One thing is that the OP hasn't stated what spec their current car is which would be useful such as gearbox and DCC. These aspects might assist with point 4.
One of the things that bothered me with the PP was the flattening of power when the IS20 turbo ran out of puff. In fairness it wasn't often given where I live not allowing for much in the way of spirited driving but it was a bit annoying. So far the TCR has been great in that respect although again, the opportunities to find out have been few and far between :rolleyes: Just something to consider.
Looks wise, I think all the MK7/7.5 performance models look great but there is something a little special about the TCR. Even my OH who wouldn't normally make much comment said it had real presence. The Reifnitz wheels do look great and unless it is my imagination, seem to fill the arches better, possibly the extra little bit of lowering helps plus being a bit wider with 235 tyres. I also find the seat materials a nice upgrade with alcantara on the door cards too, the design on the seats is smart too and the steering wheel feels better with the perforated leather.
I'm very happy I changed however the cost to change is a personal choice which the OP can only answer.
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This may or may not be helpful as I've not owned a GTI PP but have test driven several. From my limited experience of both cars the TCR rides a bit harder but it's very subtle. In comfort mode it's still great.
I picked my TCR up on 1st March and haven't regretted it for a moment. I'll post up more details when I can get a few pictures and have driven it a bit more.
I'm still running it in so haven't explored the performance fully but coming from a Fiesta ST - it's f**ing fast, even at half throttle!
The car is really lovely to look at - it really stands out with all the little details like the rear diffuser, side skirts, spoiler, akra exhaust, etc. Inside it's not that much different to a normal GTI but there are a few nice touches as mentioned by others. Mine is pure grey with the 18" wheels (i.e. not reifnitz or pretoria), which are way nicer in real life than in pics but I still might change them. I do not like the stickers on the side - they're coming off ASAP.
Overall I'm really happy, if a little skint! :)
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Look out for legendary wordsmith Exonian's posts :afro:
Legendary wordsmith sums him up perfectly. :grin:
:tongue:
“Full o’ shoite” might be more accurate!
Just like when you see a (usually female) colleague greet another with the words “ohhh, you look sooo well, have you lost some weight?” to which the (usually female) recipient replies “yes! I lost a couple pounds last week!” whilst you stand there wondering how the hell anyone could actually notice that on a 5’5” person. I mean it’s not like Janet came into work with an inner-tube under her chin the week before last and this week has a defined Hollywood jawline.
Same with a car engine. The difference between a 290PS engine and a 245PS version of the same basic unit which share very similar peak torque figures and power spread is less easy to tell in general use without resorting to using timing gear under almost scientific conditions.
What the TCR engine does offer though is the feel of more speed. In reality, day to day, I very much doubt it’s any quicker than a GTI P but it feels more lively, more eager to rev and more responsive.
I’m sure the tech boffins and chassis engineers invest much time and effort into producing small performance improvements in extremis but in daily use it’s partly a placebo effect due to sharper responses. Unless you’re Billy Bigballs trawling the ring road after dark looking for other likeminded souls to prove a point to.
The engine mapping and different turbo do provide a different feel in the TCR from a regular GTI though.
Likewise the chassis. The car sits fractionally lower and looks lower with the different skirts and chin splitter. Again it’s minimal but it’s there.
The brakes look meaner on the TCR, the suspension may or may not have a bit of negative camber (looks like it to me but it could be pothole after effects on my car!). The inside has more of a sense of occasion shunning the ‘classic’ tartan for a more luxurious feeling cloth in a much more “in yer face“ pattern and shade; a lovely to hold perforated section steering wheel is the icing on the TCR cake.
You could easily add parts to a GTI P to look, perform and handle even better than a TCR for far less money than it would cost to change from a recent GTI to a new TCR (using UK prices) but that’s not the question here.
There’s just no way you could justify the cost to change using any sort of logic.
However, to car enthusiasts logic can easily go out of the window.
It’s easy to dismiss the mk8 right now too, but give it a couple years it’ll have grown familiar and less divisive looking so might end up on your radar in the end.
It’s all money at the end of the day.
Yes, the TCR is different enough to a regular 7.5 GTI P to a GTI enthusiast, but you’d really need to be an enthusiast to make swapping from one to the other worthwhile.
It might be worth waiting until VW have released details of the Ed45 or 8R before making a firm decision if the costs to change to a TCR right now are high.
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Very well put
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So the consensus is "it's not worth it.....unless you think it's worth it"
I was at the VW dealer today booking my car in and had a good look at 2 TCRs- a white one on the 18" quaranta wheels and a grey one on 19s.
My view was- and still is- the TCR is too expensive for what a hot hatch is all about.
I looked both these cars over and thought- wow- they do look good. It would be nice to have a bit more power. And sharper handling.
Then I looked inside. Not too bothered about the seats- material looks better ( than my PP) but I prefer the tartan.
Then I saw the gearbox- and stopped dreaming.
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So the consensus is "it's not worth it.....unless you think it's worth it"
I was at the VW dealer today booking my car in and had a good look at 2 TCRs- a white one on the 18" quaranta wheels and a grey one on 19s.
My view was- and still is- the TCR is too expensive for what a hot hatch is all about.
I looked both these cars over and thought- wow- they do look good. It would be nice to have a bit more power. And sharper handling.
Then I looked inside. Not too bothered about the seats- material looks better ( than my PP) but I prefer the tartan.
Then I saw the gearbox- and stopped dreaming.
Stick with what you’ve got for sure. No modern hatch will be as much fun as the 205 GTI! Modern hatches are faster, squeak less, better on fuel too maybe, but nowhere near the (road legal) fun on British roads.
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I'd wait and see what the Mk8 is all about if you're ready to change..... I might go S3 or Cupra next as I'm just not a fan of the Mk8. The new A3 looks superb imho
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I'd wait and see what the Mk8 is all about if you're ready to change..... I might go S3 or Cupra next as I'm just not a fan of the Mk8. The new A3 looks superb imho
the new A3 has a Mégane front end look about it!
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I'd wait and see what the Mk8 is all about if you're ready to change..... I might go S3 or Cupra next as I'm just not a fan of the Mk8. The new A3 looks superb imho
the new A3 has a Mégane front end look about it!
Is your TCR due soon mcmaddy?
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So the consensus is "it's not worth it.....unless you think it's worth it"
I was at the VW dealer today booking my car in and had a good look at 2 TCRs- a white one on the 18" quaranta wheels and a grey one on 19s.
My view was- and still is- the TCR is too expensive for what a hot hatch is all about.
I looked both these cars over and thought- wow- they do look good. It would be nice to have a bit more power. And sharper handling.
Then I looked inside. Not too bothered about the seats- material looks better ( than my PP) but I prefer the tartan.
Then I saw the gearbox- and stopped dreaming.
Stick with what you’ve got for sure. No modern hatch will be as much fun as the 205 GTI! Modern hatches are faster, squeak less, better on fuel too maybe, but nowhere near the (road legal) fun on British roads.
It's great fun, the 205. I use it regularly and I know that every journey will be a thrill- all I need is a roundabout en route.
I have some pretty good driving roads near me, which I've watched become increasingly congested over the last 3 decades. And that's the problem with the modern hatch- they get faster and handle better- while opportunity to enjoy their dynamic qualities is less. So while the TCR is a very desirable hot hatch, I wouldn't be tempted to pay the significant premium over a P.
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I'd wait and see what the Mk8 is all about if you're ready to change..... I might go S3 or Cupra next as I'm just not a fan of the Mk8. The new A3 looks superb imho
the new A3 has a Mégane front end look about it!
Is your TCR due soon mcmaddy?
build week 12 which is 16th march I believe 🤞
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So the consensus is "it's not worth it.....unless you think it's worth it"
I was at the VW dealer today booking my car in and had a good look at 2 TCRs- a white one on the 18" quaranta wheels and a grey one on 19s.
My view was- and still is- the TCR is too expensive for what a hot hatch is all about.
I looked both these cars over and thought- wow- they do look good. It would be nice to have a bit more power. And sharper handling.
Then I looked inside. Not too bothered about the seats- material looks better ( than my PP) but I prefer the tartan.
Then I saw the gearbox- and stopped dreaming.
Stick with what you’ve got for sure. No modern hatch will be as much fun as the 205 GTI! Modern hatches are faster, squeak less, better on fuel too maybe, but nowhere near the (road legal) fun on British roads.
It's great fun, the 205. I use it regularly and I know that every journey will be a thrill- all I need is a roundabout en route.
I have some pretty good driving roads near me, which I've watched become increasingly congested over the last 3 decades. And that's the problem with the modern hatch- they get faster and handle better- while opportunity to enjoy their dynamic qualities is less. So while the TCR is a very desirable hot hatch, I wouldn't be tempted to pay the significant premium over a P.
Can't say I blame you. Don't get me wrong though, I'm really pleased with the change, the TCR is truly great but my PP was more fun on every drive. The gearbox is not perfect and can be a bit annoying at times but as a whole the car feels really special.
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I'd wait and see what the Mk8 is all about if you're ready to change..... I might go S3 or Cupra next as I'm just not a fan of the Mk8. The new A3 looks superb imho
the new A3 has a Mégane front end look about it!
Is your TCR due soon mcmaddy?
build week 12 which is 16th march I believe 🤞
Excellent! Loving mine :smiley:
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I doubt it'll be here before 1st April.
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So the consensus is "it's not worth it.....unless you think it's worth it"
I was at the VW dealer today booking my car in and had a good look at 2 TCRs- a white one on the 18" quaranta wheels and a grey one on 19s.
My view was- and still is- the TCR is too expensive for what a hot hatch is all about.
I looked both these cars over and thought- wow- they do look good. It would be nice to have a bit more power. And sharper handling.
Then I looked inside. Not too bothered about the seats- material looks better ( than my PP) but I prefer the tartan.
Then I saw the gearbox- and stopped dreaming.
Stick with what you’ve got for sure. No modern hatch will be as much fun as the 205 GTI! Modern hatches are faster, squeak less, better on fuel too maybe, but nowhere near the (road legal) fun on British roads.
It's great fun, the 205. I use it regularly and I know that every journey will be a thrill- all I need is a roundabout en route.
I have some pretty good driving roads near me, which I've watched become increasingly congested over the last 3 decades. And that's the problem with the modern hatch- they get faster and handle better- while opportunity to enjoy their dynamic qualities is less. So while the TCR is a very desirable hot hatch, I wouldn't be tempted to pay the significant premium over a P.
Can't say I blame you. Don't get me wrong though, I'm really pleased with the change, the TCR is truly great but my PP was more fun on every drive. The gearbox is not perfect and can be a bit annoying at times but as a whole the car feels really special.
Good to hear you're enjoying it. When I saw the 2 TCRs today it was with a slightly sceptical eye ( "what's all the fuss about, its just a mk7 golf!")- I was surprised at how good they looked.
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I doubt it'll be here before 1st April.
You might hear next week Chris - VW have a habit of building cars a week earlier than official build week given.
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the TCR is truly great but my PP was more fun on every drive.
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Watts, I know your view is personal but I would appreciate you adding a few more words to the above, what made it more fun? Reason for me asking is I am in two minds about changing my ED40 manual for a used TCR. Discounted a new TCR as the depreciation hit is mental!
Cheers
Paul
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I doubt it'll be here before 1st April.
You might hear next week Chris - VW have a habit of building cars a week earlier than official build week given.
I hope so 👍
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the TCR is truly great but my PP was more fun on every drive.
Watts, I know your view is personal but I would appreciate you adding a few more words to the above, what made it more fun? Reason for me asking is I am in two minds about changing my ED40 manual for a used TCR. Discounted a new TCR as the depreciation hit is mental!
Cheers
Paul
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Hi Paul, the TCR is a truly impressive car, powerful, comfortable yet very relaxing and easy to drive. I miss a manual, no messing about, no selecting sport on the gearbox, just put your foot down when you want to. Having said that the TCR gearbox is great most of the time and the rest not annoying enough to be bothered about. Performance wise I doubt a CS will be noticeably different but some of the other TCR features might be worth considering. It was difficult enough for me to decide to change from my PP, for you I'd expect there would be little reason to change unless you just want to. I'm really happy overall but coming from a CS, that will be tricky. Good luck!
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Thanks for the good feedback Watts, I am 90% sure I will keep the CS and introduce a few subtle mods.
Have you still got the shift bushings you had on your previous car?
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Thanks for the good feedback Watts, I am 90% sure I will keep the CS and introduce a few subtle mods.
Have you still got the shift bushings you had on your previous car?
I'm not surprised and in your position would likely do the same. I do have the bushes still, also the Audi bracket which is a good upgrade over the plastic VW one. I'd prefer to sell them together, if you are interested just PM me :smiley: I'd be happy selling them to someone who us going to use and enjoy them!
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Cheers guys, thanks so much for your valuable inputs, as much as I love the look of the TCR, I will probably put my plans on hold, first due to the fact that unless driving like a maniac I won't see much of a difference, second fact - my current gti PP is fully specced, except the leather seats which I did not want. Going to a TCR I won't afford having all the specs I have now. And lastly with the current situation with the corona virus and uncertainty in markets, probably spending more money on a new car is not wise.
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I am 90% sure I will keep the CS and introduce a few subtle mods.
Definitely keep the CS and do a few mods.
Cheers guys, thanks so much for your valuable inputs, as much as I love the look of the TCR, I will probably put my plans on hold, first due to the fact that unless driving like a maniac I won't see much of a difference, second fact - my current gti PP is fully specced, except the leather seats which I did not want. Going to a TCR I won't afford having all the specs I have now. And lastly with the current situation with the corona virus and uncertainty in markets, probably spending more money on a new car is not wise.
Never mind the media induced zombie apocalypse, there’s absolutely no point in swapping a highly specced late model GTI for a TCR unless you’re going to be exploiting its full performance.
Buying one because you wake up one day thinking “I feel like buying one...” is a good excuse, anything involving the money aspect makes no financially justifiable sense!
There are some very attractively priced examples currently on dealer forecourts though :whistle: