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Model specific boards => Golf mk7 => Topic started by: Shandy77 on 11 July 2019, 14:38

Title: Cobra Resonated Cat Back
Post by: Shandy77 on 11 July 2019, 14:38
I'm about to pull the trigger on a cat back resonated system for my 2017 Golf GTi (pp) which also has the ABT engine control module.

Does anybody have any experience with this system? I've had Milltek and Scorpion on previous cars so want to try something new. I'm too old for non-res.

Title: Re: Cobra Resonated Cat Back
Post by: Exonian on 11 July 2019, 16:28
Absolutely no experience of the exhaust system from me but I’d be very interested to know your thoughts on the Abt module, cost of it etc.
Title: Re: Cobra Resonated Cat Back
Post by: Gnasher on 11 July 2019, 18:14
I had a Cobra Sport cat back on my previous car - Astra H VXR. To be honest I wasn't that impressed with it.

It did sound good and fitted pretty well but the quality of the stainless was very poor - the boxes and welds all had masses of corrosion on them and in the end (despite fairly regular polishing) I had to scotchbrite the tailpipe and sprayed it satin black (which actually looked quite good on that car lol) but I wouldn't have another exhaust from them.

Went for a Milltek cat back on the Golf and the difference in quality is like night and day. So much better than the Cobra Sport I had before on the Astra. The extra  money is definitely worth it.
Title: Re: Cobra Resonated Cat Back
Post by: Shandy77 on 12 July 2019, 07:46
Absolutely no experience of the exhaust system from me but I’d be very interested to know your thoughts on the Abt module, cost of it etc.

The ABT module was expensive compared to a regular remap but I wanted something that was easily reversible and kept the existing ECU untouched. I've had the ABT module installed since around 5,000 miles and it's just ticked over 22,000 with zero issues. I just didn't fancy race chip and I really liked the idea of having an ABT Golf GTi. 

It really does make a difference, you can feel the extra torque low down and if you rev it out it keep pulling very hard. If you have ever driven an R - that's the feeling of power the ABT module gives the Golf GTi. If you are in the market for a piggy back system then I can't recommend the ABT module highly enough.   

I had it installed at Richter motorsport in Milton Keynes, zero install issues. I'm going to get my car on a rolling road soon to see if the claimed figures are actually true - it certainly feels as quick as an R on the move (smaller turbo in the GTi but less weight might even it out)
Title: Re: Cobra Resonated Cat Back
Post by: sjw on 12 July 2019, 09:39
I really liked the idea of having an ABT Golf GTi. 

Ah, marketing  :rolleyes:
Title: Re: Cobra Resonated Cat Back
Post by: fredgroves on 12 July 2019, 16:14
Just be aware that even the plug in boxes are detectable by VW.... provided you are happy with what that *could* mean at some point, bash on.
Title: Re: Cobra Resonated Cat Back
Post by: sjw on 12 July 2019, 20:59
Just be aware that even the plug in boxes are detectable by VW.... provided you are happy with what that *could* mean at some point, bash on.

If you quote that "official" document, you'll probably hear my eye roll
Title: Re: Cobra Resonated Cat Back
Post by: Exonian on 13 July 2019, 05:53
Absolutely no experience of the exhaust system from me but I’d be very interested to know your thoughts on the Abt module, cost of it etc.

The ABT module was expensive compared to a regular remap but I wanted something that was easily reversible and kept the existing ECU untouched. I've had the ABT module installed since around 5,000 miles and it's just ticked over 22,000 with zero issues. I just didn't fancy race chip and I really liked the idea of having an ABT Golf GTi. 

It really does make a difference, you can feel the extra torque low down and if you rev it out it keep pulling very hard. If you have ever driven an R - that's the feeling of power the ABT module gives the Golf GTi. If you are in the market for a piggy back system then I can't recommend the ABT module highly enough.   

I had it installed at Richter motorsport in Milton Keynes, zero install issues. I'm going to get my car on a rolling road soon to see if the claimed figures are actually true - it certainly feels as quick as an R on the move (smaller turbo in the GTi but less weight might even it out)

Thanks for writing your thoughts and impressions out in such a detailed way.
Very interesting reading.
Having owned an R (both modified and standard) for 18 months and a couple years in a CS Ed40 as well as a standard and modified PP GTI I have a tiny bit of experience with the engines and power deliveries. I’d perhaps disagree the Abt GTI would feel like an R as the modified GTI has loads more torque than an R plus runs out of boost much lower in the range.
I get what you’re saying though, it gives R like power levels and similar sporty eagerness but at much more accessible revs making for fast and easy progress without having to work the engine too hard.

What I really like about the Abt module is it’s easy plug in integration (on a DSG car, the manual is the opposite).
What I really dislike is the price!



What drew you to the Cobra exhaust amongst the others on the market?
Did you not like the previous Milltek?

Title: Re: Cobra Resonated Cat Back
Post by: mcmaddy on 13 July 2019, 08:34
Just be aware that even the plug in boxes are detectable by VW.... provided you are happy with what that *could* mean at some point, bash on.

If you quote that "official" document, you'll probably hear my eye roll
what Fred has said is totally accurate. Boxes can be detected.
Title: Re: Cobra Resonated Cat Back
Post by: Shandy77 on 14 July 2019, 08:56
Just for the avoidance of doubt, I never said it couldn't be detected, simply I wanted something I could easily remove.

On paper Golf R stock is different power wise but I didn't think it was night and day as it would have if my car was stock.



Title: Re: Cobra Resonated Cat Back
Post by: mcmaddy on 14 July 2019, 11:10
Just for the avoidance of doubt, I never said it couldn't be detected, simply I wanted something I could easily remove.

On paper Golf R stock is different power wise but I didn't think it was night and day as it would have if my car was stock.
Yeah it was the other comment not yours Shandy 👍. Some companies particularly one based up here in the North East have said the box they sell can't be detected which is utter nonsense. It's a shame abt don't do a refer a friend scheme. I've looked at them a couple of times but the price is just so off putting.
Title: Re: Cobra Resonated Cat Back
Post by: Shandy77 on 14 July 2019, 23:53
To be fair, I did have to use complex man maths to justify it. :whistle:

I've cooled on the cobra, given the clamps seem to rust. Maybe scorpion after all. I just found the milltek resonated too subtle and over resonated - I guess because of the ec approval?
Title: Re: Cobra Resonated Cat Back
Post by: sjw on 15 July 2019, 09:18
Just for the avoidance of doubt, I never said it couldn't be detected, simply I wanted something I could easily remove.

On paper Golf R stock is different power wise but I didn't think it was night and day as it would have if my car was stock.
Yeah it was the other comment not yours Shandy 👍. Some companies particularly one based up here in the North East have said the box they sell can't be detected which is utter nonsense. It's a shame abt don't do a refer a friend scheme. I've looked at them a couple of times but the price is just so off putting.

I'd love for you to shed light on how they can be detected. Are you talking about the car maybe logging overboost? Or holes in wires etc? Because I don't think the overboost logging is an issue as the ECU never sees the boosted values (I'm using a JB4 for reference) and a tiny hole in a wire is not really going to be spotted. Perhaps you'd like to let these tuners know where they're going wrong? If you're so knowledgeable, I mean :) 
Title: Re: Cobra Resonated Cat Back
Post by: Jim_mk7.5 on 15 July 2019, 10:18
Just for the avoidance of doubt, I never said it couldn't be detected, simply I wanted something I could easily remove.

On paper Golf R stock is different power wise but I didn't think it was night and day as it would have if my car was stock.
Yeah it was the other comment not yours Shandy 👍. Some companies particularly one based up here in the North East have said the box they sell can't be detected which is utter nonsense. It's a shame abt don't do a refer a friend scheme. I've looked at them a couple of times but the price is just so off putting.

I'd love for you to shed light on how they can be detected. Are you talking about the car maybe logging overboost? Or holes in wires etc? Because I don't think the overboost logging is an issue as the ECU never sees the boosted values (I'm using a JB4 for reference) and a tiny hole in a wire is not really going to be spotted. Perhaps you'd like to let these tuners know where they're going wrong? If you're so knowledgeable, I mean :)

Have a read of this:

http://www.golfgtiforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=280858.0
Title: Re: Cobra Resonated Cat Back
Post by: Jim_mk7.5 on 15 July 2019, 12:09

I've cooled on the cobra, given the clamps seem to rust. Maybe scorpion after all. I just found the milltek resonated too subtle and over resonated - I guess because of the ec approval?

What about Remus, think their systems are popular on the GTI.
Title: Re: Cobra Resonated Cat Back
Post by: sjw on 15 July 2019, 15:28
Just for the avoidance of doubt, I never said it couldn't be detected, simply I wanted something I could easily remove.

On paper Golf R stock is different power wise but I didn't think it was night and day as it would have if my car was stock.
Yeah it was the other comment not yours Shandy 👍. Some companies particularly one based up here in the North East have said the box they sell can't be detected which is utter nonsense. It's a shame abt don't do a refer a friend scheme. I've looked at them a couple of times but the price is just so off putting.

I'd love for you to shed light on how they can be detected. Are you talking about the car maybe logging overboost? Or holes in wires etc? Because I don't think the overboost logging is an issue as the ECU never sees the boosted values (I'm using a JB4 for reference) and a tiny hole in a wire is not really going to be spotted. Perhaps you'd like to let these tuners know where they're going wrong? If you're so knowledgeable, I mean :)

Have a read of this:

http://www.golfgtiforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=280858.0

Yes, as I suspected, the mystical "TB1" flag.

Show me anyone who has had a warranty claim denied for this flag.
Title: Re: Cobra Resonated Cat Back
Post by: mcmaddy on 15 July 2019, 18:04
It's not mystical at all and if you Google it plenty of people have had warranty refused. Anything you change is detectable if you know where to look but that's IF you know where to look. It's the fact some companies and people say it can't be detected when it actually can.
Title: Re: Cobra Resonated Cat Back
Post by: SRGTD on 15 July 2019, 19:45
It's not mystical at all and if you Google it plenty of people have had warranty refused. Anything you change is detectable if you know where to look but that's IF you know where to look. It's the fact some companies and people say it can't be detected when it actually can.

I also suspect that since Dieselgate, VAG have looked at all areas of the business to see where cost savings can be achieved, and warranty claims will be one such area.

And judging by what I’ve read on various VW forums. VW do seem to be doing more checks now than they used to prior to warranty claims being authorised. With wheels that had succumbed to white worm, the dealer used to just take a photo of the defective wheel to submit for the warranty claim to be authorised. They now measure the thickness of the paint / powdercoat / lacquer to check for signs of refurbishment.

So I’d be surprised if VW don’t also now carry out more thorough checks with powertrain warranty claims for evidence of a tuning box having been fitted to a car, as well as checking to see if a car has been mapped.
Title: Re: Cobra Resonated Cat Back
Post by: sjw on 16 July 2019, 09:11
It's not mystical at all and if you Google it plenty of people have had warranty refused. Anything you change is detectable if you know where to look but that's IF you know where to look. It's the fact some companies and people say it can't be detected when it actually can.

Please stop saying they're detectable and actually link some proof. I'm genuinely interested.
Title: Re: Cobra Resonated Cat Back
Post by: mcmaddy on 16 July 2019, 17:37
It's not mystical at all and if you Google it plenty of people have had warranty refused. Anything you change is detectable if you know where to look but that's IF you know where to look. It's the fact some companies and people say it can't be detected when it actually can.

Please stop saying they're detectable and actually link some proof. I'm genuinely interested.
Please stop saying they aren't! The box I had on my gtd caused over boost issues and these were logged and seen with vcds. Any car that goes into limp mode from a box will also have it logged.
Title: Re: Cobra Resonated Cat Back
Post by: Jim_mk7.5 on 17 July 2019, 09:05
It's not mystical at all and if you Google it plenty of people have had warranty refused. Anything you change is detectable if you know where to look but that's IF you know where to look. It's the fact some companies and people say it can't be detected when it actually can.

Please stop saying they're detectable and actually link some proof. I'm genuinely interested.

I don't think anyone needs to prove anything. The point is, this forum is for people to offer advice and experience on matters relating to what we all have - Golfs. You can take the advice or not. The link I shared from a previous clearly shows the VW information provided to dealers. Whether this happens in real life no doubt will be case by case.

And to be fair, the thread was about an exhaust and started by someone else so you should respect that and start a new thread re detectable tuning if you are really that interested.
Title: Re: Cobra Resonated Cat Back
Post by: sjw on 17 July 2019, 10:30
It's not mystical at all and if you Google it plenty of people have had warranty refused. Anything you change is detectable if you know where to look but that's IF you know where to look. It's the fact some companies and people say it can't be detected when it actually can.

Please stop saying they're detectable and actually link some proof. I'm genuinely interested.

I don't think anyone needs to prove anything. The point is, this forum is for people to offer advice and experience on matters relating to what we all have - Golfs. You can take the advice or not. The link I shared from a previous clearly shows the VW information provided to dealers. Whether this happens in real life no doubt will be case by case.

And to be fair, the thread was about an exhaust and started by someone else so you should respect that and start a new thread re detectable tuning if you are really that interested.

Started a new thread in the garage section