GolfGTIforum.co.uk
Model specific boards => Golf mk7 => Topic started by: 2007GTI on 07 July 2017, 17:37
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So I missed the quick delivery and cheaper lease deals on GTIs, but I could get one in late Sept / Oct.
Because of the wait, it got me thinking of buying outright again instead, which I am fortune to be in a position to do at the moment.
The lease would be £7950 total cost over two years (only option met paint), and obviously give the car back. Or buy new outright via Drivethedeal for £25,661.
My question is, is a new one likely to loose more than £7950 over two years? I do 6-7k a year and I keep my cars in good condition, no pets or kids etc.
Thoughts?
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A very rough guide, mine's a 15 plate car which I could've got for about £25k new from dtd. Now, looking at Autotrader, low mileage cars are about £18-20k retail so you'd probably get about 80% of that as a trade in so roughly £15k, meaning a drop of about £10k. :cry:
So if it is purely money then it looks like a lease would be the best option. Personally I like the feeling that I'm driving MY car so owning is important to me.
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Thanks Watts and I totally know what you mean. I've never leased a car, and I just have this feeling that they will try and sting me at the end.
I have been studying Autotrader and HPI valuation tool, which is by no means comprehensive, but it has some handy features and shows private sale, trade in and retail. As you say there is a difference between trade and retail. If only I had a crystal ball...
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Depends how long you intend to keep the vehicle. If you would only keep it 2 years anyway then the lease will almost certainly work out cheaper. The longer you keep it then the lease will lose value appeal. If 3 years or less i'd go for the lease. Any more than 3 years i'd be tempted to buy.
If buying outright costs you £25k, and leasing costs £8k over 2 years, then you also have the chance to do something else with £17k of your money for 2 years instead of having it 'invested' in a depreciating driveway ornament.
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Just a thought but would you consider a clubsport, with the right options not only will it not depreciate less but you may want to keep it long term.
Better looking in my view over any other Mk7 Golf, especially in red with 3 doors.
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If your lease deal is costing you near enough £8k over 2 years, my PCP purchase is costing me not a lot more than that over the same period for the exact model/spec I want including servicing.
The cheap lease deals are great if you aren't fussy but I specifically wanted to add certain options, colour etc and I got a great deal in the end so I think you are in a better position to 'buy' the car, e.g. PCP than lease as you have more flexibility than just pay the rentals and hadn't the car back.
Worth bearing in mind a 2 year lease you're likely to incur any additional maintenance costs e.g. tyres, brakes etc whereas keeping the car longer 3/4 years on PCP you may begin to incur routine maintenance costs.
I think it pays to PCP, but change as often as you can and providing you get a good deal you should have no issues regularly changing the car approx 50% the way through the term.
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Thanks All.
Gaz, firstly I'm not fussy, I don't need any options and I can live with Black Rubin the only solid colour available. I'm going to have to disagree with with you regarding maintenance costs. Doing only 6-7k a year, I won't need to put tyres on it, I'm pretty sensible. Re: brakes, on my Mk5 GTI, I kept it for 8 years, 38,000 miles, never put discs or pads on it, always serviced by VW.
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Thanks All.
Gaz, firstly I'm not fussy, I don't need any options and I can live with Black Rubin the only solid colour available. I'm going to have to disagree with with you regarding maintenance costs. Doing only 6-7k a year, I won't need to put tyres on it, I'm pretty sensible. Re: brakes, on my Mk5 GTI, I kept it for 8 years, 38,000 miles, never put discs or pads on it, always serviced by VW.
If you aren't fussy then a cheap PCH deal will be cheaper for sure, just less flexibility over what you buy and what you do with it once you have it.
There are so many variables when it comes to routine maintenance, as you say if you are sensible low mileage driver then no costs incurred to worry about but day in day out I see tyres and brakes worn out in no time at all, all comes down to driving style and mileage! Also depends on the tyre lottery that Volkswagen now offer with every new car!
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If you take out PCP bear in mind you will also incur about £1k interest charges in the first year alone, slowly reducing throughout the term.
Your £25k car would therefore need to be worth £19k after 2 years to beat the lease in terms of overall cost. If you settle the PCP early to avoid interest charges you will no longer have the option to hand the car back. PCP's work best when there is equity in the car and you are brand loyal.
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If you haven't already gone for the lease - do it quick!
Think there may be a few cars left at the reduced prices.
Way better than the PCP option and yes there are uncertainties over buying new and then trade in values after 2-3 years.
My thinking is that this may be the last chance to get a decent brand new car for under £300 per month before all this Brexit crap happens!
There could be major changes for the car industry in a couple of years - so waiting to see how it plays out.
Will probably go with the 2 year lease and then save up to buy something decent on the 2nd hand market.
No point buying new at the moment - you will get a much better deal on a used MK7 PP or Clubsport (and lose less in depreciation).
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My new GTI is run as a leased company car, came via a small broker the but the actual deal is with ALD who are well known.
Most lease deals are through bigger companies and just offered out by smaller brokers so chances are when it time to return the car, you will be dealing with a reputable company.
We have 7 lease cars at work, and had not really seen any big bills when returning a car unless drive by a very careless driver (director's wife!). My colleague recently returned his Mk7 GTD which was a personal lease and had no extra charges. In 20k miles he out on 1 set of tyres and had a service.
Think the biggest question as already mentioned is how long you intend to keep the car.
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If you haven't already gone for the lease - do it quick!
Think there may be a few cars left at the reduced prices.
Way better than the PCP option and yes there are uncertainties over buying new and then trade in values after 2-3 years.
My thinking is that this may be the last chance to get a decent brand new car for under £300 per month before all this Brexit crap happens!
There could be major changes for the car industry in a couple of years - so waiting to see how it plays out.
Will probably go with the 2 year lease and then save up to buy something decent on the 2nd hand market.
No point buying new at the moment - you will get a much better deal on a used MK7 PP or Clubsport (and lose less in depreciation).
Without wanting to start a debate but how is brexit going to make a difference? You think VW or any other European car maker are going to try putting people off buying their cars? Look at the spec on a performance Golf here compared to Germany, they are throwing a lot of extras at the cars to get their best customers outside Germany to buy their cars.
If you're talking about interest rates then blame the bankers that got the country into the state it's in for the last 10 years. Ironically those bankers will most probably be buying cars from Germany or Italy with their bonuses for loosing money, still.
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Without wanting to start a debate but how is brexit going to make a difference? You think VW or any other European car maker are going to try putting people off buying their cars? Look at the spec on a performance Golf here compared to Germany, they are throwing a lot of extras at the cars to get their best customers outside Germany to buy their cars.
If you're talking about interest rates then blame the bankers that got the country into the state it's in for the last 10 years. Ironically those bankers will most probably be buying cars from Germany or Italy with their bonuses for loosing money, still.
Well no ones what will happen - but I think they will do a separate deal for car makers to keep everyone happy in the long term.
Obviously we build and export a lot of cars here, so manufacturers won't want costs to go up.
I just meant that in my opinion the uncertainty will probably force prices up and especially if the Euro value goes down. Already seen list prices increasing year on year - but yes I agree they are throwing more in to the cars and offering better discounts.
It is the tax situation which is also annoying! Maybe the Germans will have to stop with the stupid RRP values so that they can bring their cars in under the new £40K additional tax rate!
Small things like this which are pushing up the prices.
The Golf has gone up £500 over 2 years on the lease I took out (and that is just from the last quarter)
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Hi guys need some advice. Been offered a gti on a 1*23 deal at £285. Is this a competitive quote? Thanks in advance.
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Hi guys need some advice. Been offered a gti on a 1*23 deal at £285. Is this a competitive quote? Thanks in advance.
5dr or 3dr? Manual or dsg?
Depends on spec and mileage allowance, but doesn't seem too bad to me.
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5 Dr, manual it is. I don't fancy the dsg at the moment. 67 plate and obviously on PCH. I've tried many sites and there's not much in them at all. Cheers for the reply.
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10k it is and standard spec
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Is it the standard black Rubin paint? Not a spectacular price but pretty much on the mark for current pricing.
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They were available for about £205 per month on 6+23 at the beginning of 2nd quarter, but they all went in 24 hours. Not sure if/when we'll see them that cheap again, but current prices are the cheapest they've been since. They're usually somewhere around the £280 to £300 per month mark on 6+23 unless VW do a special promotion.
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That's on black yes and any other colour it's 8 quid dearer I'm sure. I think I'm going to go with it for the 2 years and see how I get on.
Still undecided whether to go lease or pcp but I'll need to make my mind up quick as a few leasing companies I called today don't have the white which I would prefer.
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Thanks guzzle, with nothing to pay up front it's attracted to me that deal. I'll make up my mind tonight and take it from there. I called alot of leasing companies today for quotes and I think out of 5, 2 got back to me and even then it was with colours I don't fancy.
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Before derv gate i would have bought, now reputation and residuals have taken a knock i'd rent as in reality stock GTI and R specs are adequate the mundanity of day to day and i never modify daily (or cars I don't actually own)
Clubsport would have been worth buying though in white or red :cry:
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I'm going leased for the first time. Really can't see how buying makes sense now as discounts and cheap lease deals are hitting residuals. For the deposit I am putting into my lease GTi I would double the monthly payment if going PCP.
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I'm going leased for the first time. Really can't see how buying makes sense now as discounts and cheap lease deals are hitting residuals. For the deposit I am putting into my lease GTi I would double the monthly payment if going PCP.
This is also exactly what I was thinking.
Lease (on a special offer) is definitely the better offer as you have interest, depreciation, road tax, breakdown, car payment and obviously warranty all bundled in to one payment which will not change over the 2-3 years.
The prices will nose dive in 2 years when these cheap lease deals hit the used market. Same happened to the MK7 R.
They are trying to push 2 year old base spec models for £20K which isn't all that great.
Also don't forget the MK8 should be arriving in a couple of years which may also affect deprecation.
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I bought my GTD back in 2014 on a 4 year PCP. Put in a large £5k deposit and won't see a penny of that back. The GTi will be less than £2k deposit
and a similar payment. Yes it's a shorter term but means I get a new car more often!
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Dress it up how you like but car companies are not in the business of losing money, and they push lease and finance options at you until they are blue in the face.
It's cheaper to buy outright if you can afford to and due to the appalling interest rates at the moment, it's not worth keeping money in the bank.
I'm sure there will be any number of people coming on and telling me how they have had VW's pants down with the amazing deal they managed to get but I for one am not having it :tongue:
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Dress it up how you like but car companies are not in the business of losing money, and they push lease and finance options at you until they are blue in the face.
It's cheaper to buy outright if you can afford to and due to the appalling interest rates at the moment, it's not worth keeping money in the bank.
I'm sure there will be any number of people coming on and telling me how they have had VW's pants down with the amazing deal they managed to get but I for one am not having it :tongue:
We will maybe agree to disagree but based on the fact my R depreciated over tow years nearly double what my R estate is costing me over the same period, I cut my losses on it as they were still dropping like a stone, that was a car owned out right. My M2 is fairing far better on the other hand given supply and demand and why I have a deposit down for a M2 CS :)
My wife's R which she bought out right (despite me saying rent) has also dropped more but she will keep it 4-5 years now
Admittedly both had options on which if leasing clouds things but it amazing when you don't have them you don't actually miss them
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I can see the benefits of both leasing and outright purchase. I've also done both so my comments are entirely impartial. However as to which is better really depends on two main points;-
1) How long you intend to keep hold of the car.
2) Driving a hard bargain in the first place. A poor deal is poor no matter whether it is by cash or with credit.
My current Octy is leased and I reckon i'm currently around £1k better off than if I had paid cash via DTD. However as time passes I expect that saving will narrow until the point that cash purchase becomes the cheaper option.
The best advantage of leasing is the fixed monthly costs and avoiding maintenance and upkeep, which become more difficult as a vehicle ages. On the plus side, if you have paid cash the depreciation will eventually become incidental and provided your vehicle remains reliable you should then have cheap motoring.
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Dress it up how you like but car companies are not in the business of losing money, and they push lease and finance options at you until they are blue in the face.
It's cheaper to buy outright if you can afford to and due to the appalling interest rates at the moment, it's not worth keeping money in the bank.
I'm sure there will be any number of people coming on and telling me how they have had VW's pants down with the amazing deal they managed to get but I for one am not having it :tongue:
Well my experience would say different. My GTD is worth considerably less than the final payment so I can now just return the car. If I owned the car it would be worth what it's worth therefore would have cost me more. Yes I paid interest on the PCP loan but of course using cash also has a lost interest cost so it's not free money. I also bought my GTD with a very decent discount matching the best available at that time. For sure the lease companies do aim to make money but in the case of a high volume heavily discounted car that also appears often in the cheap lease deals I think buying with cash is a risky place to be.
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I can see the benefits of both leasing and outright purchase. I've also done both so my comments are entirely impartial. However as to which is better really depends on two main points;-
1) How long you intend to keep hold of the car.
2) Driving a hard bargain in the first place. A poor deal is poor no matter whether it is by cash or with credit.
My current Octy is leased and I reckon i'm currently around £1k better off than if I had paid cash via DTD. However as time passes I expect that saving will narrow until the point that cash purchase becomes the cheaper option.
The best advantage of leasing is the fixed monthly costs and avoiding maintenance and upkeep, which become more difficult as a vehicle ages. On the plus side, if you have paid cash the depreciation will eventually become incidental and provided your vehicle remains reliable you should then have cheap motoring.
Yes if you own the car the depreciation does tail off after a good few years but then you are at that stage driving an old car which will undoubtedly be an old model and perhaps needing expensive repairs as the miles march on. You really can't compare that to someone driving a new model every two years and never having a car out of warranty or needing anything other than one service. Yes that may cost money but that's the choice. When comparing leasing with buying you need to assume someone replaces the car every 2 or 3 years with a brand new model either by cash or lease. On that model of driving it seems leasing is the clear winner by any financial measure I have looked at. One caveat is that this is likely to change as 2 year old cars struggle to find buyers if everyone wants to lease new ones. This will depress the used values further, very bad news if you own your car and bad news if you are leasing as lease costs may go up if the financiers are not getting the same residuals from used cars.
For now it seems lease all the way for me and this has been confirmed by several VW salesmen sme of whom said it wasn't even worth their while trying to work out a PCP deal as leasing on a special deal with be much cheaper.
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Hopefully all you renters/leasers and PCPers won't cause another recession as is predicted by many financial experts :whistle:
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Well it will be the buyers who suffer
most if we do cause that. We simply hand our cars back and have a chuckle at the loss VWFS will absorb, those who own will see the effect in their own pocket.
My equation is currently if you want a high volume model then if going brand new then lease. If you want to own and pay cash then buy at 3 or 4 years old.
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I can see the benefits of both leasing and outright purchase. I've also done both so my comments are entirely impartial. However as to which is better really depends on two main points;-
1) How long you intend to keep hold of the car.
2) Driving a hard bargain in the first place. A poor deal is poor no matter whether it is by cash or with credit.
My current Octy is leased and I reckon i'm currently around £1k better off than if I had paid cash via DTD. However as time passes I expect that saving will narrow until the point that cash purchase becomes the cheaper option.
The best advantage of leasing is the fixed monthly costs and avoiding maintenance and upkeep, which become more difficult as a vehicle ages. On the plus side, if you have paid cash the depreciation will eventually become incidental and provided your vehicle remains reliable you should then have cheap motoring.
Yes if you own the car the depreciation does tail off after a good few years but then you are at that stage driving an old car which will undoubtedly be an old model and perhaps needing expensive repairs as the miles march on. You really can't compare that to someone driving a new model every two years and never having a car out of warranty or needing anything other than one service. Yes that may cost money but that's the choice. When comparing leasing with buying you need to assume someone replaces the car every 2 or 3 years with a brand new model either by cash or lease. On that model of driving it seems leasing is the clear winner by any financial measure I have looked at. One caveat is that this is likely to change as 2 year old cars struggle to find buyers if everyone wants to lease new ones. This will depress the used values further, very bad news if you own your car and bad news if you are leasing as lease costs may go up if the financiers are not getting the same residuals from used cars.
For now it seems lease all the way for me and this has been confirmed by several VW salesmen sme of whom said it wasn't even worth their while trying to work out a PCP deal as leasing on a special deal with be much cheaper.
I don't disagree with anything you said, but the point I was making is that leasing is only going to save you money if you swap regularly anyway.
I understand the arguments about having the newest model/latest tech etc, but not everyone feels the need to do that. Hence point 1 in my previous post. Some on here pay cash and keep their cars way beyond its first MOT, and those people are unlikely to reduce their costs by leasing.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not anti-leasing. Far from it. As I said, my current car is leased. However it was never my intention to keep the car long term.
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Well it will be the buyers who suffer
most if we do cause that. We simply hand our cars back and have a chuckle at the loss VWFS will absorb, those who own will see the effect in their own pocket.
In a recession we would all lose. Loans get repackaged and sold on so that VW can finance new loans. It won't necessarily be VW that loses, it will be whoever is holding the dodgy loans when things turn bad. It wasn't just the mortgage companies that went broke in the last crash, it was also the other companies they owed money to.
Lots of very clever people lost badly in the last recession, people far more intelligent than the likes of me. I think it fairly unlikely you will be able to insulate yourself from it just by handing your car back. After all how will you get to work if car companies went broke and nobody is issuing loans to buy a car?
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Leasing companies still have a thing about white cars being worth less at resale... That's why you won't find a white one.
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Plenty of white Golf R estates going out on lease at the moment.
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I can see the benefits of both leasing and outright purchase. I've also done both so my comments are entirely impartial. However as to which is better really depends on two main points;-
1) How long you intend to keep hold of the car.
2) Driving a hard bargain in the first place. A poor deal is poor no matter whether it is by cash or with credit.
My current Octy is leased and I reckon i'm currently around £1k better off than if I had paid cash via DTD. However as time passes I expect that saving will narrow until the point that cash purchase becomes the cheaper option.
The best advantage of leasing is the fixed monthly costs and avoiding maintenance and upkeep, which become more difficult as a vehicle ages. On the plus side, if you have paid cash the depreciation will eventually become incidental and provided your vehicle remains reliable you should then have cheap motoring.
Yes if you own the car the depreciation does tail off after a good few years but then you are at that stage driving an old car which will undoubtedly be an old model and perhaps needing expensive repairs as the miles march on. You really can't compare that to someone driving a new model every two years and never having a car out of warranty or needing anything other than one service. Yes that may cost money but that's the choice. When comparing leasing with buying you need to assume someone replaces the car every 2 or 3 years with a brand new model either by cash or lease. On that model of driving it seems leasing is the clear winner by any financial measure I have looked at. One caveat is that this is likely to change as 2 year old cars struggle to find buyers if everyone wants to lease new ones. This will depress the used values further, very bad news if you own your car and bad news if you are leasing as lease costs may go up if the financiers are not getting the same residuals from used cars.
For now it seems lease all the way for me and this has been confirmed by several VW salesmen sme of whom said it wasn't even worth their while trying to work out a PCP deal as leasing on a special deal with be much cheaper.
I don't disagree with anything you said, but the point I was making is that leasing is only going to save you money if you swap regularly anyway.
I understand the arguments about having the newest model/latest tech etc, but not everyone feels the need to do that. Hence point 1 in my previous post. Some on here pay cash and keep their cars way beyond its first MOT, and those people are unlikely to reduce their costs by leasing.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not anti-leasing. Far from it. As I said, my current car is leased. However it was never my intention to keep the car long term.
i used to lease every 3 years, which was fine. but when i got my mk5 gti i wanted to keep it longer and as it's been said the longer you keep it the better of you're in buying really (i've had my mk5 9 years). i'll be buying this time too, but i'll be (hopefully) keeping her for 5 to 10 years :)
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I've never had a company car (apart from own business) or leased.
Inherently I'm from the era if you can't buy it with your own cash,you can't afford it.
Until the R the most I've paid is £19k for a car and I've owned around 50.
The R I intend to keep for ? 7 maybe 10 years. There are still some very nice 10 year old R32's out there.
So £31k cash that was earning the princely sum of £310 a year! Makes sense.
It's all relative interest rates / lease deals and the must have it now mentality.
And job security, for a younger me the mortgage took priority and I love cars.
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I've never had a company car (apart from own business) or leased.
Inherently I'm from the era if you can't buy it with your own cash,you can't afford it.
Until the R the most I've paid is £19k for a car and I've owned around 50.
The R I intend to keep for ? 7 maybe 10 years. There are still some very nice 10 year old R32's out there.
So £31k cash that was earning the princely sum of £310 a year! Makes sense.
It's all relative interest rates / lease deals and the must have it now mentality.
And job security, for a younger me the mortgage took priority and I love cars.
Nicely put and I couldn't agree more :smiley: