GolfGTIforum.co.uk
Model specific boards => Golf mk7 => Topic started by: DorsetDC on 05 February 2017, 09:18
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For those who, like me, have had the pleasure of owning both, which is the best for everyday use? I love my R, the performance and handling are outstanding, but the wonderful Dorset roads leave a lot to be desired in terms of smoothness, especially when on 19" wheels. For 75% of the time I drive around the town so my old GTI PP on 18" wheels gave a more comfortable ride, especially when carrying passengers. The reason for this question, I visited my local dealer yesterday to pick up my wife's car and was offered a relatively good deal for a trade in for the revised model.
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I don't think there is a best, they are both pretty much the same.
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Maybe the GTI clubsport is the best all rounder.
GTI looks with a bit more power if needed. No four wheel drive but a lighter, nimbler car.
Or maybe I'm wrong :undecided:
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Maybe the GTI clubsport is the best all rounder.
GTI looks with a bit more power if needed. No four wheel drive but a lighter, nimbler car.
Or maybe I'm wrong :undecided:
No I think you're right.
Just a shame it's a bit ugly from the front. Too many angles going on.
From the driver's seat I'd imagine it was by far one of the best cars out there that VW have ever made.
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For some reason I think my R rode better than any of the GTI's I've driven in that although it felt a bit more hefty it didn't crash over sharp ridges in the road which every GTI (and GTD for that matter) seemed to do.
If you're 'on it' then obviously the superior traction and top end power of the R trumps the GTI hands down. Looks wise it's 50/50 with the R looking lower and meaner in a discreet sort of way and the pre FL GTI looks a bit prettier, especially in lighter colours with the red accents giving it a bit of contrast.
I'm not overly sold on the looks of the FL cars in any of the pics I've seen, or vids for that matter. The frontal styling has just got a bit too busy for me. I can understand why VW did this and I don't dislike it, but I'm just not sold on it, preferring the simplicity of the earlier mk7's. The rear of the FL cars looks a bit better.
My R was quite a thirsty beast, but probably no worse than my mk5 GTI and my mk7 GTI one of the most frugal petrol engine's I've ever owned. The easy going and very flexible power delivery of the GTI made it feel a bit flat at times where the R comes alive over 4000rpm. So I guess it depends on how often you use over 4000rpm because there ain't much between them below that point.
Inside? The GTI has a bit more panache to its styling but the dials in the pre FL R are absolutely lovely. I also found the seats in the R (non leather) to be amongst the most comfortable I've ever sat on/in. Being as it's basically exactly the same seat as a GTI/D then it must be the nice alcantara bolsters that are so grippy.
Ask the same question on the R forum and prepare for the incredulous comments about how the two names should never even be mentioned in the same breath!! :laugh:
(and they'd be absolutely right if you lived somewhere with no speed limits)
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I've recently changed over from a GTi PP to an R. I always thought the GTi was a great car to drive, but it made me a bit nervous if I had to accelerate quickly to get out of a side road into traffic, especially in the wet, because wheelspin could get me into a lot of trouble. Discretion was always the better part of valour.
With the R that is simply not an issue, it just gets away from a standing start with no drama and was superbly controllable in the recent snow. In simple terms the R gives you much more confidence that the car will do what you want it to when you want it to.
I'm still in the mythical "running in" period below 1000 miles so I haven't really given it full wellie, but it does feel a bit quicker than the GTi when overtaking on country roads. The R seats immediately felt more comfortable, but the turning circle is horrible compared to the GTi.
So it's swings and roundabouts and will depend a lot on your typical journeys and your own driving style.
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I may have read your question wrong but it looks like the only thing you aren't keen on in the R is the 19" wheels.
Can you not just change them to 18"
Problem sorted :laugh:
I agree with Tweedside and its one of the reasons I went from GTD --> R. Apart from always promising myself one :grin:
The wheels spinning and not even just from a standing start but when you are rolling is pretty bad.
My wife has the GTI and while it feels slightly lighter it still does it.
Heaven knows what the Clubsport & S are like.
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I may have read your question wrong but it looks like the only thing you aren't keen on in the R is the 19" wheels.
Can you not just change them to 18"
Problem sorted :laugh:
I agree with Tweedside and its one of the reasons I went from GTD --> R. Apart from always promising myself one :grin:
The wheels spinning and not even just from a standing start but when you are rolling is pretty bad.
My wife has the GTI and while it feels slightly lighter it still does it.
Heaven knows what the Clubsport & S are like.
You can't beat a bit of childish wheelspin!! :laugh:
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Only suffered wheel spin once in my GTI and that was my own fault for driving like a tit.
Maybe calm your driving style and you'll save your tyres and not feel the need for all wheel drive 😀
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You can't beat a bit of childish wheelspin!! :laugh:
No you can't. :grin: But when the Nissan Micra sitting next to you zooms into that roundabout gap and you don't move an inch, it all becomes very embarrassing :embarrassed: :rolleyes:
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I chose the GTI over the R for these reasons:-
(all in my opinion of course)
- Styling - I prefer the GTI styling to the R, i find it less 'in your face' (chrome mirrors, quad exhuasts)
- My Mrs uses my GTI every day for work and i use it evenings and weekends (i have a company car) So the GTI works extremely well for this
- Insurance - The insurance is a lot lower for me on the GTI (Im 24)
- Security - It seems a lot of R's are going missing off peoples drives, which i'd rather not happen. Not saying my GTI won't go missing, but it seems more common with the R's
- Running costs - My GTI is a keeper and i think overall the running costs will be less. Factoring in fuel, servicing, insurance, tax.
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I'm also wondering about this. 90-95% of my driving is city driving, so I'm not sure if its worth getting an R over a GTI. I only do around 4k miles a year too. Some people I've asked say I should still go for the R since there aren't many cars available that can reach the highs an R can.
For some reason I think my R rode better than any of the GTI's I've driven in that although it felt a bit more hefty it didn't crash over sharp ridges in the road which every GTI (and GTD for that matter) seemed to do.
Did your R or any of the GTI's/GTD's have DCC? I think a R/GTI/GTD on 18inch wheels with DCC should be comfortable.
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I'm also wondering about this. 90-95% of my driving is city driving, so I'm not sure if its worth getting an R over a GTI. I only do around 4k miles a year too. Some people I've asked say I should still go for the R since there aren't many cars available that can reach the highs an R can.
For some reason I think my R rode better than any of the GTI's I've driven in that although it felt a bit more hefty it didn't crash over sharp ridges in the road which every GTI (and GTD for that matter) seemed to do.
Did your R or any of the GTI's/GTD's have DCC? I think a R/GTI/GTD on 18inch wheels with DCC should be comfortable.
City driving might benefit the R more than you think. There's nothing worse than being stuck at a very busy roundabout, looking for a gap, but also wary that if you give the throttle more than a tickle if it is wet and/or you have Bridgestones, the GTI or GTD will be sat tramping away. This is the main reason I ditched my DTUK'd GTD for an R. Depending on what you're coming from, you might not feel the need for DCC. the MK7 chassis is so good, I can honestly say that my R on 19s (and no DCC) is more comfortable in ride than my MK5 GT Sport TDI170 on 17" rubber.
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This 'getting onto a roundabout' sh!te as a reason to buy an R is ludicrous. I don't see run of the mill cars struggling to do it so I'm sure 300 bhp and all wheel drive is hardly an essential.
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I'm also wondering about this. 90-95% of my driving is city driving, so I'm not sure if its worth getting an R over a GTI. I only do around 4k miles a year too. Some people I've asked say I should still go for the R since there aren't many cars available that can reach the highs an R can.
For some reason I think my R rode better than any of the GTI's I've driven in that although it felt a bit more hefty it didn't crash over sharp ridges in the road which every GTI (and GTD for that matter) seemed to do.
Did your R or any of the GTI's/GTD's have DCC? I think a R/GTI/GTD on 18inch wheels with DCC should be comfortable.
I actually find that one of he great strengths of the R is city driving. I thought it would be a bit heavy after a GTI (albeit it a mk6), but it really excels at lights, junctions and busy roundabouts, and as monkeyhanger, it's made for maximising those tight gaps, for a quick sure-footed getaway (on Conti 5Ps) and then when out of the city, shows another face out in open roads. Sure the mpg can be on the lean side, but not a world of difference to a GTI.
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(http://i1381.photobucket.com/albums/ah214/pete_caz/2012-07-11-a-small-amount-of-horse_zpse8ivclwg.png) (http://s1381.photobucket.com/user/pete_caz/media/2012-07-11-a-small-amount-of-horse_zpse8ivclwg.png.html)
Horses for courses :smiley:
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My car right now is an Audi A3 2008 1.4TFSI Sport with 18 inch S-line alloys so I am expecting the ride to be firmer on the GTI and R but not sure by how much.
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This 'getting onto a roundabout' sh!te as a reason to buy an R is ludicrous. I don't see run of the mill cars struggling to do it so I'm sure 300 bhp and all wheel drive is hardly an essential.
Run of the mill cars with run of the mill tyres don't have tramping bother as they can put down what they develop - my wife's 116ps 1.6TDI A1 on 16" Hankooks is far more surefooted than my GTD on Bridgestones ever was - in the wet and dry.
There are 2 very busy roundabouts on my old commute that gave me bother in the GTD (my 2 Sciroccos without Bridgestones never had bother, but my MK5 170TDI on Bridgestones had tramping issues also), small gaps that an 80PS car gunning it with sure-footed grip could manage to take advantage of. If my GTD had come on Contis/Dunlops/Pirellis and not tramped under all but the most heavy-footed getaways, I may never have thought about getting an R.
Maybe you're right, don't change your car, change your tyres (I changed my car and then changed the tyres - double whammy). :grin:
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My car right now is an Audi A3 2008 1.4TFSI Sport with 18 inch S-line alloys so I am expecting the ride to be firmer on the GTI and R but not sure by how much.
I think you'll be pleasantly surprised - yours is built on the MK5 Golf platform and the MK7 MQB chassis is way more compliant and way less crashy on the ride. Go take a test drive.
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If you can't drive for sh!t buy an R... If you simply want the fastest golf, buy an R...
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:grin:
I went R as I knew it was going to be modded, my MK6 GTi at 300bhp (modded) was struggling with getting the power down on anything other than warm dry roads.
Personally I love the GTi, and would have 100% bought a Club Sport if the numbers had stacked up.
The R is the car which motoring forums love to hate, always high praise IMO as if it's become the villain its often due to great success in the motoring world/press.
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VW really need a GTR model, an R with the GTi trim and aesthetics, they would have all bases covered then. :)
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Had a M7Gtipp for 13 months before trading it in for an R (both DSG). My opinion is that the R is a far superior car, feels better finished, quieter, except in Sport/Race, smoother, faster and far better road holding - just grips, squats and goes, gives supreme confidence under any road conditions, on winters at the moment which helps.
But thats just the opinion of a pensioner who wanted a fast discrete car
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VW really need a GTR model, an R with the GTi trim and aesthetics, they would have all bases covered then. :)
I think the Facelift is going that way... the current colour coded side skirts are gone in favour of the GTI style slim black ones. Less chrome bits on the front too.
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My car right now is an Audi A3 2008 1.4TFSI Sport with 18 inch S-line alloys so I am expecting the ride to be firmer on the GTI and R but not sure by how much.
I came from an Audi A3 Black edition (S-Line)1.8TFSi on 18s' to 19inch Santiagos with DCC on my Golf. Even in sport mode the 19s are a smoother ride. The chassis platform on the mark7 in my opinion has a lot to do with it. The Audi fidgeted around a lot more on poor roads than the Golf does. Also, because you're driving a GTi life will be much better all round!
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I have been reevaluating my take on fast golfs in the last few months and the use of the term 'fast' to describe cars recently
First R was pretty much modded from day 1 and not my daily driver and trips in the wife's R were limited, I have now racked up 10K in the R estate as a daily and now have BMW
The standard R in theory ticks all the boxes as an allrounder but for me actually bores me senseless
The chassis can cope with more power and torque but for me in stock form is lacking in the mid range so things you will think you will get the legs on you do not, there is plenty of traction which in reality makes it easy to make swift progress
I have to admit whilst I love the cloth and alcantara from a seat choice it just lacks the sense of being special inside and just does not have the wow
I think if you plan to mod then a R with DSG is a great base as it starts to challenge you but for me remains a blunt tool given the limitations of the haldex and power transfer lacks some finesse
Is the R fast, well off the line it is and can do this whatever the weather
Does the R really communicate with you, well having had time to reflect and drive a rwd BMW I have to say no, what you get back actually feels very diluted and you could never truly tell what it was going to do on a damp track
A lot of GTI loving friends have been ditching their Rs for similar reasons as they have not truly loved it and been trading them on
The internet if numbers obsessed and this comes to my use when peoples only response to a car is 'its fast' which is something banded around in relation to the TT-RS, I am sure it is but you never hear about its handling or steering
So in terms of GTI v R I actually have a hankering for a PP GTI next so I can hustle it a bit and have to drive it a bit and probably have more fun as a result, for the same reason I thought the Fiesta ST was way more fun than a R
I think the term by Clubsport of GTI-R is an interesting one as there still remains something iconic and they way GTI interiors, even the leather has the red stitching to set it apart.
So what is best is of course subjective but less can sometimes be more and whilst the R is superb it is just a bit boring as its too easy and you do not really have to drive it and for me is a now a car for going to A to B rather than going for a drive from A to B.
Interesting thing when the M2 turned up was I thought the R would be the better daily and bar snow and ice I have to say its the other way round, what the M does is just gives you feedback all the time through the wheel which after a life of Golfs takes some getting used to and might not be every ones cup of tea but oddly because the feedback is there in the rain I actually prefer the M as you have to drive it and actually remember how to apply the throttle and whilst firmer the damper set up means it actually rides better than the R, but oddly its a car I do not know how quick it is or what the actually bhp is because it all seems a bit secondary.
So for me I think if you bagged a normal Clubsport you made a shrewd move on the Golf front and I will be looking at GTIs in 12 months as well as the R for daily humdrum
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Interesting points especially as you had or have the M2.. I am close to pulling my deposit partly because of terrible service from BMW FS.. So much so I settled the finance on my 330 d a couple of weeks ago. But also I think although the the CS isn't cheap, do I think the m2 is 50% better given the extra price ? Not sure tbh.
Also I think the gti styling is far better than the R and I do feel the regular clubsport sits in a nice middle ground - exclusive appeal, seems fun to drive, no compromises like the CSS.. Far less common than the R, etc etc.
Like the 330d for me is the sweet spot in the 3 series range, the CS I hope is the same in the golf range.
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for the same reason I thought the Fiesta ST was way more fun than a R
We sold a '14 Fiesta ST-2 for the R and I would concur with this statement, the Fiesta is far more fun stock for stock - has a proper old school hot hatch feel about it and this comes from someone who has owned both a 205 1.9 GTi and Clio Williams 1.
Plan is to mod my R as I would agree it's far too grown up in standard form, and have also been caught out with the mid range feeling flat if you're not running up and down the gears.
But I absolutely love how accessible the power is 100% of the time, it's a great all rounder and I wish it could be my daily rather than my 320d.
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for the same reason I thought the Fiesta ST was way more fun than a R
We sold a '14 Fiesta ST-2 for the R and I would concur with this statement, the Fiesta is far more fun stock for stock - has a proper old school hot hatch feel about it and this comes from someone who has owned both a 205 1.9 GTi and Clio Williams 1.
... could that be why the GTI might be a better buy for some.
This review seems to think so - https://www.motoringresearch.com/car-reviews/2017-volkswagen-golf-gti-review (https://www.motoringresearch.com/car-reviews/2017-volkswagen-golf-gti-review)
"2017 Volkswagen Golf GTI review: why this is the best fast Golf money can buy"
"The cheapest fast Golf you can buy is arguably the best, because it harks back to what the Golf GTI has always been about. It’s a shopping car that’s been given a fun amount of power, without being over the top."
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Another interesting review of the GTI - https://www.carthrottle.com/post/2017-vw-golf-gti-review-proof-that-big-horsepower-isnt-necessary/ (https://www.carthrottle.com/post/2017-vw-golf-gti-review-proof-that-big-horsepower-isnt-necessary/)
"So really, what our GTI drive at the Mk7.5 launch in Majorca constituted was a refresher drive to remind us of the hot-ish Golf’s place in the world. And hot damn, does it hit a sweet spot.
Yes, there are hot hatches around with outputs over 300bhp, clever front differentials (VW’s own VAQ diff is available in the GTI as part of the Performance Pack) and even all-wheel drive, but the beauty of the GTI is that it feels awesome without all of that."
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VW really need a GTR model, an R with the GTi trim and aesthetics, they would have all bases covered then. :)
I think the Facelift is going that way... the current colour coded side skirts are gone in favour of the GTI style slim black ones. Less chrome bits on the front too.
Cheaper to build too...