GolfGTIforum.co.uk
Model specific boards => Golf mk7 => Topic started by: Sootchucker on 01 June 2015, 08:06
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Just after info really for a friend. Is there a definitive answer as to if the post BW22 GTD, GTi and R models now come with the new MIB II 6.5" head units with Nav built in or not. Dealer couldn't tell him and neither could a call to VW UK (no surprise there then), and from the latest catalogue on the VW website, it still states a 5.8" Composite Media system (that it's always been fitted with).
I notice all the prices jumped by quite a bit lately so was wondering if that was VW sneakily adding Nav to the spec "for free", but actually raising the list price to compensate ?
Basically he wants Nav in whichever model he decides to go for, but is being told by the dealer that he either has to pay for Discover Navigation @ £750.00 or Discover Pro for £1,765.00 (or Tech Pack - discover Pro & Dynaudio for £1,840.00). He's also told if he specs Car-Net for £100, although it does the apple car-play thing, it won't allow him to mirror the sat nav on his phone whilst driving (he has an Iphone 5s).
Is this dealer supplied information correct please ?
Thanks.
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CarNet has nothing to do with mirrorlink AFAIK. The mirrorlink functionality is part of the MIB2 units basic operation.
If it has mirrorlink then approved (not VW approved) applications can work while the vehicle is in motion.
The obvious first candidate is the Apple/Android nav software.
From what I've seen, neither of the nav units are free, CMS is still the zero cost option, just that it will support mirrorlink.
The big bear trap here of course though is that nobody knows this for sure - none of these units have been seen by anyone (dealer or otherwise) and that if you get it wrong then you are stuffed because you can't retro fit any of this.
To be 100% certain I'd either wait until a MIB2 unit is either in the dealer's showroom or someone on here has got one.
I'd also chuck in that its also possible that the Iphone/Android/handset version whatever doesn't work with it either...its a strong old possibility.
Just pay for the nav unit?
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Hi Sootchucker
Don't know if it's of any help, but I asked my dealer to confirm the MY2016 changes last week and this was what he stated (relevant to GTI/GTD/R).
1. Composition Media moves from MIB generation 1 to generation 2
2. Optional Discover Nav/Discover Nav Pro moves from MIB generation 1 to generation 2
3. Any model ordered with Discover Nav will get 3 years Car-Net ‘Guide and Inform’ included"
He confirmed that my car (est BW29) would be built to the MY2016 specification.
This doesn't definitively answer your question about whether DNS is standard on the GTI/GTD but number 3 suggests that nav is NOT included as standard and has to be specced as before.
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Booth 11 - The message from your dealer mirrors exactly what my dealer showed me on his screen in the dealership about the 2016 MY changes!
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CarNet has nothing to do with mirrorlink AFAIK. The mirrorlink functionality is part of the MIB2 units basic operation.
Unfortunately it isn't standard functionality on the new units. You need to select the £100 CarNet app connect option to get:
"Combined functionality of Apple ‘CarPlay’, Google ‘Android Auto’ and ‘MirrorLink’ TM allowing ‘mirroring’ of smartphone display on the infotainment touch-screen via USB connection. Display and operation of certified apps including audio and voice control (if supported by the app). Usage of certified apps only while driving. Only available with compatible smartphones including iPhone 5 and 6. Please see www.volkswagen.co.uk to check smartphone compatibility"
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I'm utterly confused.
Not least of which after reading the other thing on here the other day that lead me to read someone's disassembly of carnet which actually seems to consist of a piece of hardware that's basically a mobile phone on a plug in board (buried in the dash) that does the data logging and network access.
Carnet is software for the MIB or a plugin ONSTAR style tracking device or both?
Shame nobody can actually tell you quite what you need to buy or even what its exact function will be.... kind of frustrating when you are talking about some sophisticated tech now, not just electric windows or a tow hitch.
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It may not be standard but I'm thinking it is possibly a very simple thing that a dealer / VCDS can enable at a later date.
See my post on "the other" forum: http://www.vwroc.com/forums/topic/9246-carnet-option/?p=153300
I'm utterly confused.
Not least of which after reading the other thing on here the other day that lead me to read someone's disassembly of carnet which actually seems to consist of a piece of hardware that's basically a mobile phone on a plug in board (buried in the dash) that does the data logging and network access.
Carnet is software for the MIB or a plugin ONSTAR style tracking device or both?
Shame nobody can actually tell you quite what you need to buy or even what its exact function will be.... kind of frustrating when you are talking about some sophisticated tech now, not just electric windows or a tow hitch.
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CarNet seems to be an umbrella term for three different types of added functionality. VW have a website to explain:
http://volkswagen-carnet.com/int/en/start/online-devices.html (http://volkswagen-carnet.com/int/en/start/online-devices.html)
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Yes, I have just read that site :)
I tell you what though, I wouldn't trust it as far as I could throw it - when I ordered my car in January 2014 the same VW website told me that if I got NavPro then it had "guide and inform" and that it was dsefinitely available in the UK.... and funnily enough all I get is an annoying pop up in Nav telling me that "street view is not available" all the damned time.
If you absolutely definitely need this stuff to work, you need to go and see it physically in a car, working. Don't accept VW's website lies.
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Fred it won't work just now because it involves online services and the current models don't go online!! That would involve a hardware upgrade.
I've mentioned this before :grin:
The carnet will be like Audi's Connect system and with that it has a SIM slot between the SD cards in order for you to get get online.
You can though connect your phone via Bluetooth RSAP but anyone with an iPhone will know you can't do it with one of them so things will get complicated.
http://volkswagen-carnet.com/int/en/start/car-models/golf_r_since_2015.html is the R offering
Or click here (http://api.kewego.com/video/getStream/?appToken=34b54efcb338fb42a12f479ae493780f615893e414ee93ce250eb43194566a8031c7adf10296beccc0bb87826b7f40cb32390252b0a857272d3668c28c872fe3&sig=aa5b4865eb9s&format=webm_hq)and it actually shows you a video about the system and shows you the SIM slot
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@Sootchucker - bet you wished you'd never asked :grin:
It is utterly confusing and I take the VW website and it's many descriptions of Carnet with a massive pinch of salt. The words Volkswagen and confusing are interchangeable!
Question is, as I will be getting MIB II, is it worth speccing CarNet app?
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Question is, as I will be getting MIB II, is it worth speccing CarNet app?
I would think the added functionality will be well worth the £100, but as it sounds like just a software change to the MIB II system it would be annoying to spend £100 and find you could switch it on yourself later. Although, it would be annoying not to spec it and then find out you couldn't activate it later. Bloody Volkswagen should just switch it on as standard and save confusion.
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I'm utterly confused.
Shame nobody can actually tell you quite what you need to buy or even what its exact function will be.... kind of frustrating when you are talking about some sophisticated tech now, not just electric windows or a tow hitch.
That's just it Fred, I think there is so much going on behind the scenes between VWUK and Wolfsburg that possibly there's not much information coming through, and you're dealing with managers that are more used to electric windows and tow hitches that are now having to get to grips with 21st Century technology 'in-cab' and market it along with all the support. I'd imagine it was an expensive upgrade at VWUK level when looking at the telecoms side.
Maybe a change at the top of VW isn't helping matters either, a new leader will have his own business model and we've been riding a bit of a crest of a wave with VW models recently so we just have to hope we don't have a move 'forward' like we did when the mk3 Golf generation hit the ground with all its 'improvements' which just translated into cost cutting.
Somewhere lost in Mademoiselle Booth's huge thread, I contacted our resident forum sales guru evo1986 and he told me exactly what the dealerships know which was pretty non specific but there was no mention of standard nav on the GTI/D and we will basically have to wait until either the dealerships get a new bulletin (now we've just had the last quarter end before the reg change quarter) or someone gets full confirmation of a post BW22 car.
I'm still guessing that the bigger price rise of the GTI/D and Tech Pack price anomalies around the R means that the GTI/D will get standard Nav unless someone at VW has panicked and pulled the plug on that due to unseen issues (cost?) which means we should see a revised pricing structure again or maybe a sales promotion of some kind? But that is literally a guess, it's just "wait and see" right now.
I took quite a keen interest in it as I'd been hedging my bets around the Edition 40 next year and was half tempted to gamble on a late April order this year before the two end of April rises bearing in mind the long build wait, hoping to get a 2016 spec car at early 2015 prices if the ED 40 didn't float my boat. I was offered an 11% discount on an R with a half decent trade in price too with a fully refundable deposit (as they said they'd happily order the car into stock due to the popularity of the model if I changed my mind).
In the eventuality of it all the ED40 really didn't float my boat in ClubSport guise, and the R offer wasn't taken up but I'll update on all that at some point.
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Question is, as I will be getting MIB II, is it worth speccing CarNet app?
I would think the added functionality will be well worth the £100, but as it sounds like just a software change to the MIB II system it would be annoying to spend £100 and find you could switch it on yourself later. Although, it would be annoying not to spec it and then find out you couldn't activate it later. Bloody Volkswagen should just switch it on as standard and save confusion.
I think the only way around that is to spec it as it's "only" £100 which is small fry in the bigger picture of the entire price of the car, and it might become something that buyers would want at resale time if it ends up quite a useful tool as it gets developed and expanded - or with the ever increasing advance of tech it might end up a lame duck and soon outmoded like our MIB 1 units which are obsolete after 2 years. At £100 over the lifetime of the car it's not really worth worrying about, it's the same price as an unexpected blow out on a tyre or a wheel fefurb after a kerb kiss or maybe a smart repair after some careless git in a car park has let their door swing open...
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Oh, and I've just remembered that after talking to a sales chap last week he said currently VW are mostly concentrating on upgrading models that previously came as standard with the RNS 315 nav units to the MIB II Discover nav, so it's a flow through upgrade across the whole range not just Golfs.
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Question is, as I will be getting MIB II, is it worth speccing CarNet app?
I would think the added functionality will be well worth the £100, but as it sounds like just a software change to the MIB II system it would be annoying to spend £100 and find you could switch it on yourself later. Although, it would be annoying not to spec it and then find out you couldn't activate it later. Bloody Volkswagen should just switch it on as standard and save confusion.
I think you are damned if you do, damned if you don't.
Don't forget to chuck in that the next phone you buy probably won't support it, because they've moved to another technology and VW implemented the old one only (and can't/won't upgrade it).
Its really early days with all this stuff and car makers really haven't got their heads around the basics yet, yet alone the concept of actual long term sustainability in a fast moving tech world - things like easy software upgrades with new features and compatibility enhancements.
They are still locked in a world where if you want something new, you buy a whole new car - whereas computer/mobile phone/other tech has been all about software upgrades and feature enhancements for a very, very long time - which is ironic given that the home tech is hundreds of pounds and a VW is tens of thousands.
Much like other industries, the car industry is still living in the 1980's.
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@Sootchucker - bet you wished you'd never asked :grin:
It is utterly confusing and I take the VW website and it's many descriptions of Carnet with a massive pinch of salt. The words Volkswagen and confusing are interchangeable!
Question is, as I will be getting MIB II, is it worth speccing CarNet app?
If you had your dealer order the Tech Pack (W8L) with Discovery Pro nav (MIB II) it includes Car-Net App Connect (9WT)
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Much like other industries, the car industry is still living in the 1980's.
Very true.
If you had your dealer order the Tech Pack (W8L) with Discovery Pro nav (MIB II) it includes Car-Net App Connect (9WT)
Does it? Are you sure? Where's this info coming from? Not that I'm doubting your word but as the vast majority of info VW have put out lately has been a utter garbage, I'm a little sceptical.
IF, it's not included for the sake of £100 I might as well spec it, in the great scheme of things and as Mr Ex says it's a relatively small cost to bear, even though I imagine that it will be redundant tech by the time I come to sell the car in 3/4 years.
I feel another email to my dealer coming on!
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No I'm not absolutely sure !! (having been there with previous misleading information with the configurator, brochures, price lists etc when the MK7 originally launched) and I ordered.
My point to the dealer was that you can spec the Car-Net Connect app ( £100 ) in addition to the Tech Pack on the configurator ?? yet it is supposed to be included ( i think it was shown as included on the latest price list description )
Anyway my dealer got in touch with VW to get the Tech pack breakdown and the above is what I have been told !!
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Yep it is shown as included on the latest price list for the Discover Nav Pro but not the Discover Nav unit.
The configurator normally knocks an option out price wise if its already included in something else this time it didn't thats why I pursued it with the dealer.
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So basically what we are saying is it's a lottery :laugh: :laugh: Spec everything and hope for the best ?
I remember when I was specifying my GTD at the beginning of 2013, no-one (not the dealers or VWUK), had any idea what was available and what wasn't. My order got screwed up as both the dealer and VWUK said Lane assist was available and that the colour MFD was a £100 option. Not only did the lane assist get thrown out 7 weeks later (as they realised then you couldn't spec it on a GTD), and as we now all know, the colour MFD was standard equipment. Seems 2 years on VW still haven't got their act together ?
Can anyone explain then why since mid 2013, the GTD (5 door DSG) has gone up by £1650 (5.7%) and the GTI (5 door DSG) by £1665 (5.6%) in less than 2 years without a spec increase at all ? This is especially since the Sterling to Euro X-rate has gone from 1.1478 on the 11th March 2013 when I ordered) to 1.3962 today a better X-rate to VW UK of 17.8% (surely the cars should be cheaper not more expensive) ?
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Yep it is shown as included on the latest price list for the Discover Nav Pro but not the Discover Nav unit.
The configurator normally knocks an option out price wise if its already included in something else this time it didn't thats why I pursued it with the dealer.
Mmm! I wondered if your dealer was confusing the Car-net Connect App with the Car-Net ‘Guide and Inform' which is included with the MIB II units. But if it showing on the new pricelist as included???
I'll see what my dealer says.
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Yep I thought there would be that confusion myself so made it absolutely clear we were talking about Car-Net App here.
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I think the mistake we are all making is that the main dealers, VW UK and the VW factory are not the same company and one doesn't tell the others sh1t all.
The factory makes things, VWUK selects packages (from the secret factory price/option lists) and makes list prices for the UK market and the dealer has to try and second guess the results without ever having seen the delivered items any more than you or I have.
Once again, if this was a 400 quid mobile phone you'd not be quite so piddled off...
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I think the mistake we are all making is that the main dealers, VW UK and the VW factory are not the same company and one doesn't tell the others sh1t all.
The factory makes things, VWUK selects packages (from the secret factory price/option lists) and makes list prices for the UK market and the dealer has to try and second guess the results without ever having seen the delivered items any more than you or I have.
Once again, if this was a 400 quid mobile phone you'd not be quite so piddled off...
Very valid points. That being the case, and it very much seems that way - if the sales section of a UK VW dealership has no idea what they are selling and cannot tell the prospective customer anything about their product with any certainty, then there is absolutely no point in the dealer's existence :whistle:
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The back end of this VWROC thread (http://www.vwroc.com/forums/topic/9246-carnet-option/page-4) is fairly helpful. In summary:
- Car-Net App-Connect is VW's catch all name for its connectivity solutions, including CarPlay, Mirrorlink, etc as well as Guide and Inform. Some of these options will only work on top end nav units, some will work on all. The smartphone stuff should work on all.
- It is available as a £100 option on MY16 cars but included with Discovery Pro.
- Indications are that it will be an easy retro-fit but only to MY16 cars.
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Can anyone explain then why since mid 2013, the GTD (5 door DSG) has gone up by £1650 (5.7%) and the GTI (5 door DSG) by £1665 (5.6%) in less than 2 years without a spec increase at all ? This is especially since the Sterling to Euro X-rate has gone from 1.1478 on the 11th March 2013 when I ordered) to 1.3962 today a better X-rate to VW UK of 17.8% (surely the cars should be cheaper not more expensive) ?
This is because VW UK are greedy sh!ts. The UK has virtually zero inflation, the Pound is 15% up on the Euro and still these price increases that put it pennies cheaper than the Audi. No longer the people's car, VW are pricing themselves firmly into the premium bracket.
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According the vw website (and a post on another thread on here) the DNS, Keyless and Winter Pack are all now standard on GTD and GTI but not R
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Yep I thought there would be that confusion myself so made it absolutely clear we were talking about Car-Net App here.
@TwoSheds - I emailed my dealer today and he came back to me saying he had contacted VWUK with that question already (about another order) and that VWUK state that Car-Net Connect App is listed as included with Pro Nav. So same as your dealer told you.
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Hi all,
Have placed an order for GTI (no build week yet, apparently due around September). The forum has been the only useful (and honest) source of info !
I was also unsure about app-connect option for £100 even though I took tech pack (Discover pro). Online & dealer configurator wanted £100 for it, yet the latest price list: http://www.volkswagen.co.uk/assets/common/pdf/pricelists/golf-gti-vii-pricelist.pdf (page 12) seems to clearly say that it's included and thus can't be added with Discovery Pro. Spoke dealer who said that it's not included; I added it to be safe, but hope can get it back if new info comes to light!
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Keyless / winter pack do seem standard now - they change rather sporadically!