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Model specific boards => Golf mk7 => Golf mk7 GTD/TDI => Topic started by: Silvadadi on 25 April 2015, 19:02

Title: Road tax - 5dr DSG GTD
Post by: Silvadadi on 25 April 2015, 19:02
ive read that 5dr DSG GTD's pay more road tax than £30 for manuals - is this correct as renewal is imminent?

Cheers
Title: Re: Road tax - 5dr DSG GTD
Post by: Diehammer on 25 April 2015, 19:32
Manual is £20 IIRC the DSG is a fair bit more.
Title: Re: Road tax - 5dr DSG GTD
Post by: mcmaddy on 25 April 2015, 20:01
Dsg is 110 quid I think.
Title: Re: Road tax - 5dr DSG GTD
Post by: fredgroves on 25 April 2015, 22:21
Band B for manual (£20), Band D for DSG (£110).
Title: Re: Road tax - 5dr DSG GTD
Post by: Mark V GTD on 26 April 2015, 10:08
But three-door DSG's remain at 30 quid...
Title: Re: Road tax - 5dr DSG GTD
Post by: fredgroves on 26 April 2015, 10:18
VED bands B (£20) and C (£30) for 3 door.

I can't really work out why it makes so much difference, other than some arbitrary figure the government has decided is a "bad" co2 figure.
Title: Re: Road tax - 5dr DSG GTD
Post by: Silvadadi on 26 April 2015, 23:11
Thanks for replies.

I'm sure when I took delivery from the dealer the tax disc showed £30.........will have to check it again.....is there a difference between tax at first registration and renewal?
Title: Re: Road tax - 5dr DSG GTD
Post by: fredgroves on 27 April 2015, 08:01
Its quite easy, just go to the VW website, start building a new car, choose whether or not your car is 3 or 5 door, select the engine (DSG/manaual) read the info on that page and it tells you the VED band.

Then, go here and discover how much they want to rob you:

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/419799/V149_Budget_2015_Final_version.pdf
Title: Re: Road tax - 5dr DSG GTD
Post by: Sootchucker on 27 April 2015, 08:04
Never, ever understood this.

The 5 Door DSG version has a higher CO2 output than the 3 door which pushes it into the next tax bracket. Fair enough you would think, the 5 doors obviously add a bit of weight and therefore push the CO2 up. However if you check the manual versions of the GTD, both 3 and 5 doors are exactly the same CO2 output, and even more bizarrely, if you look at the GTI, it doesn't affect the groupings all be it manual or DSG, the 3 and 5 door versions are exactly the same ?

For example:

GTI - 139g Manual - the same for 3 door and 5 door - VED Band E
GTI - 148g DSG     - the same for 3 door and 5 door - VED Band F

GTD - 109g Manual - the same for 3 door and 5 door - VED Band B
GTD - 119g DSG     - 3 door only                            - VED Band C   
GTD - 122g DSG     - 5 door only                            - VED Band D

WTF ?
Title: Re: Road tax - 5dr DSG GTD
Post by: fredgroves on 27 April 2015, 09:38
It looks to me like the DSG box adds roughly 10g/km (which is surprisingly efficient compared to older automatics it has to be said!). Quite possibly the difference is actually weight? I have no idea what the weight differences are mind you.

What's the weight difference between a 3 door and a 5 door manual GTD? I couldn't find that either.

However, the 5 door DSG figure is really odd, unless there actually is a weight difference between the 3 door and the 5 door?

BTW, I didn't answer Silvadadi's other question - yes the first registration fee is different to the subsequent renewals - its all on that link I put up for tax rates.
Title: Re: Road tax - 5dr DSG GTD
Post by: fredgroves on 27 April 2015, 10:01
I just remembered where the weights will be... in the brochure!

It doesn't tell me about 3 vs 5 door weight differences... maybe they are exactly the same... but I doubt it!

Things that it does show though are fuel consumption figures which are only different for DSG equipped 3/5 door vehicles - the manual box ones are identical.

It also shows me that DSG adds 30kg to the weight 1850kg vs 1880kg, which is approx. 1.6% heavier, which doesn't account for the ~10% increase in CO2 emmissions on its own, which either means that weight adds to emmisions in a non-linear way or that its a combination of extra weight and inefficiency - the latter sounds likely.

I am still 100% surprised that a 3 door and a 5 door weigh *exactly* the same. I find that hard to believe.

Title: Re: Road tax - 5dr DSG GTD
Post by: fredgroves on 27 April 2015, 10:40
Just had one last stab at this, going to VW Germany and reading their brochure (I've noticed VW Germany have a lot better information than their poorer UK relatives!)

It seems in Germany there are only two CO2 figures published for the Mk7 GTD, 109g for manual, 119g for DSG.

Weird.

Also, no extra information about weights either.

I did learn that the GTD Estate is known as a "GTD Variant" in Germany though :)
Title: Re: Road tax - 5dr DSG GTD
Post by: monkeyhanger on 27 April 2015, 13:30
I just remembered where the weights will be... in the brochure!

It doesn't tell me about 3 vs 5 door weight differences... maybe they are exactly the same... but I doubt it!

Things that it does show though are fuel consumption figures which are only different for DSG equipped 3/5 door vehicles - the manual box ones are identical.

It also shows me that DSG adds 30kg to the weight 1850kg vs 1880kg, which is approx. 1.6% heavier, which doesn't account for the ~10% increase in CO2 emmissions on its own, which either means that weight adds to emmisions in a non-linear way or that its a combination of extra weight and inefficiency - the latter sounds likely.

I am still 100% surprised that a 3 door and a 5 door weigh *exactly* the same. I find that hard to believe.

The 5 door model weighs 32kg more than the 3 door, and DSG weighs about 18kg more. A 5 door DSG weighs 50kg more than a 3 door manual. They must have tried so hard to have the 3 door DSG scrape in under 120g CO2 per km that the 5 door or an average for both 3 and 5 doors wouldn't cut it. My dad pays significantly more road tax for his 5 door DSG GTD than I do for my 5 door manual.
Title: Re: Road tax - 5dr DSG GTD
Post by: fredgroves on 27 April 2015, 13:35
Sounds like some sort of skullduggery has happened there then!

But yes, 5dr DSG is £110 VED for 2015 and no doubt even more difference in 2016...

Even more of a kick in the sack if you are a BIK payer!
Title: Re: Road tax - 5dr DSG GTD
Post by: monkeyhanger on 27 April 2015, 14:06
Unless the DSG is noticeably less efficient than the manual, you'd expect a 3 door DSG to come in at £20 VED with the 5 door manual as it weighs 14kg less, rather than coming in at £30 VED. Seems to me then that the difference between manual and DSG is more important than small weight differences attributed to the number of doors in determining CO2 emissions banding.
Title: Re: Road tax - 5dr DSG GTD
Post by: J400uk on 27 April 2015, 18:00
RHD might have something to do with it also

I'm sure I remember back when the MK6 first came out the 2.0 TDI 110 and 140 models had lower Co2 in LHD EU markets compared to UK.