GolfGTIforum.co.uk
Model specific boards => Golf mk7 => Topic started by: whit6402 on 25 August 2014, 18:44
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Hi,
Newbie to the site. Currently own MK6 GTi manual but placed deposit on new MK7 GTi PP DSG [unregistered showroom model] for September 1st pick up [64 plate].
I had initially fancied the R but chose not to pursue due to running costs [I know... touchy subject for most hot hatch owners... why buy a hot hatch etc etc...]. Anyway, unless it goes in the meantime, I could get a bog standard red 5dr R and for over £200 less per month on PCP :shocked:. Over the two year period I could save over £3k even accounting for the lost deposit and the mpg.
My dilemma is, I love the GTi [though never owned a DSG] and it more than covers my needs. I have a wife and two young sons I occasionally ferry around, so am a little conerned about the ride / cabin noise with the R :undecided:. Guess it would be a win, win either way but I am torn by GTi v R plus significant savings.
So, back to the question, has anyone chosen the GTi over the R after a test drive and what would you do?
Cheers
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It's really only something you can decide yourself. The GTI is a more than capable car but having driven the R after having the GTI, the R is on a different planet performance wise.
Have you ordered many options on the GTI? If so, what will bring you the most pleasure, performance or nice toys?
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Hi,
It's a dealer showroom car so is quite well spec'd... Santiago 19's, PP, Leather, Winter Pack and Dynaudio.. oh and the DSG box.
As I said in the inital post, it's not about the speed or spec of the GTi, which more than cover my bases, it's the financial element. If both cars were the same monthly cost I genuinely think I'd go for the GTi but I am being tempted away as the R is theoretically the higher model but is a third of the monthly finance cost :shocked:.
Interested if anyone has driven both and whether there were any comments on the R refinement [ride/noise]. I realise the exhaust sound is seen as a big plus for the R but don't want to deafen the wife and kids or rattle their bones on the road!
Cheers
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Am I reading this correctly the R is £200 per month less than the GTI? If yes buy the R its a no brainer. That will more than cover the fuel usage each month :smiley:
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If it's the financial element then as mentioned above its a no brainer. The roadnoise in the R won't be any worse than the GTI. When you realise you can afford the R then there's really only one outcome.
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Buy the GTI and help me keep the value of my R up!! With all these lease deals flying around i'll be lucky if it's worth 20p in 2 years time!! >:D
There is very little between the two in terms of road noise regardless of wheel size from my experience, i'd recommend DCC on either car though tbh if your worried about the ride, neither are bone breakers without but DCC adds that extra comfort from time to time, if your ferrying family around the cabin is plenty spacious but the boot on the R is quite a bit smaller, the running costs are higher in the R but not £200 higher! I can't believe how cheap they're leasing them and tbh it makes them a bit less desirable to me if the cheap option. :(
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Hi Jimble, thanks for the reply.
Don't think it is lease as such, though appreciate doesn't make much difference to your point. It's the finance option where you pay off the guaranteed FVF at the end, give the car back or exchange for another car. I'd defnitely be changing car after two years, which is why this scheme works for me.
I'm a fairly sensible driver apart fom the odd moments where someone winds me up or I just feel the need. What am I likely to get MPG wise.. I have anticipated 28 though would hope to squeeze out a bit more. How noisy is tha R engine/exhaust compared with the GTi pin the cabin]? Also, the R is manual, what's the manual box like?
Agree with you, I don't understand why VW structure their finance solution like this. If I was prepared to wait, I could order a new R for less than £150/mth if I put down the maximum 30% deposit. It all revolves around the FVF, which is higher on the R.
Cheers
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Yeah i understand the options type finance deals work for a lot of people and it seems they're increasingly popular.
There is a difference in engine sound inside the cabin mainly when the R is in race mode, it sounds like some kind of mini V8! :grin: it sounds great imo but drop it into normal it sounds very sedate and doesn't drone at all.
MPG could be a lot worse tbh, my daily urban drive it'll do between 28-30 when driving miss daisy and will do 37-38 at a push on the motorway, if you have a heay foot you'll be lucky to get into the 20's urban and 30's extra urban! Having said that it's scary how quick the needle moves and it has a 5ltr bigger tank than the GTI! :shocked:
My R is manual and generally the shifting action is excellent, a little notchy with a short throw for a standard box which is nice, i find it a bit tricky to shift from 1st to 2nd as smoothly as i'd like but others say they don't have that problem so could be me? I've also noticed some slight hesitation at 2500k which i will eventually ask the dealer to have a look at, i'm not the only one to feel this though, could just be a mapping thing though, not a massive deal tbh.
I have had both the GTI and now the R and for my driving style and taste i prefer the GTI. :tongue:
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I sense a touch of sarcasm on your last point!! :grin:
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I sense a touch of sarcasm on your last point!! :grin:
I believe Jimble does genuinely prefer the GTI overall, correct me if i'm wrong.
I've driven both cars. My brother has an R on order. The R sounds better inside the cabin in race mode but it absolutely drinks fuel compared to the GTI. In my opinion it didn't feel much quicker than my GTI, maybe slightly. It felt heavier and more sorted/planted definitely due to the Haldex system.
GTI with Stage 1 gives the standard R a run for it's money as shown in APR's uploaded vid so I don't think you should worry about performance. The front looks better on the GTI and the back looks better on the R.
Just go for either, both are great cars and then change it for the R400 in a couple of years. :laugh:
I'm absolutely baffled by VW Solutions....just checked their finance site and it's £60 cheaper a month for me to have an R than a GTI. I feel well, ripped off? :/
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'Mr Savage', I am assuming from your reply that you would have the R out of the two?
I am still a bit unnerved by the mpg quotes, which are varied to say the least reading across forums and reviews. If I could guarantee 28-30 I would take it but read of some between 20-25. I am a little more at ease following the advice about the drone being lessened by selecting normal mode, as the noise was also a real concern with the wife and kids in mind.
Honestly, I wouldn't consider the R just to get more performance.. I would be happy with the GTi and am still tempted with sticking to the GTi. It's literally just the thought that I could save so much money by choosing the R, which is wacky :undecided:.
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With the way vw solutions are operating anyone would think that the r isn't the top of the range.
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If it's literally only the finances that you are considering then go for the R mate, my GTI was a DSG and did very similar MPG to my manual R, the quoted figures from VW are way off and apart from some hypermiler manual GTI drivers on here you'll get nowhere near them! The main differences between the two cars are:
Appearance (obviously) which do you prefer?
Interior, which do you prefer? Sedate (boring?) R, or interesting GTI?
Performance, general daily driving is very similar but when pushing on the R has the edge with it's AWD.
Economy, not a great deal between DSG GTI and manual R in my experience.
Comfort, again is very similar but i'd still reccommend DCC.
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'Mr Savage', I am assuming from your reply that you would have the R out of the two?
I am still a bit unnerved by the mpg quotes, which are varied to say the least reading across forums and reviews. If I could guarantee 28-30 I would take it but read of some between 20-25. I am a little more at ease following the advice about the drone being lessened by selecting normal mode, as the noise was also a real concern with the wife and kids in mind.
Honestly, I wouldn't consider the R just to get more performance.. I would be happy with the GTi and am still tempted with sticking to the GTi. It's literally just the thought that I could save so much money by choosing the R, which is wacky :undecided:.
I wouldn't say I prefer the R over the GTI. It's difficult to separate the two in my opinion. Even though the R is very planted I still love the way the GTI handles in the corners with the Limited Slip Diff, intact it feels more fun to drive for me.
If I bought again would I consider the R? Probably and i'd probably be in the same boat as you are now too. But with everything summed up i'd still probably buy the GTI.
When the R400 comes out though, that's a whole different story ;)
Oh and Jimbles right. My GTI averages 30MPG and that's even driving 'normally' around town to work and back. I have seen 56MPG once on the trip computer but that was a long motorway run with 50 average speed cameras for miles so I can see how VW got it's figures. But driving the car and enjoying the power? Yeah expect 28. Thrashing it then expect somewhere down 22. With the R then expect a little less, not a huge amount less but a little. I think from a spirited run in one I saw somewhere around the 19MPG mark.
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Yes, must sayy I am edging more to sticking to the GTi, personally think it looks a little nicer and the spec gives it a definite edge... I'm fancying the DSG. That MPG is still a concern and hoping if I go GTi that I can improve on 30mpg as 75% of my work commute is m/way. Cheers guys.
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Blimey, if you can get an R for less than a GTI then I can't believe the GTI gets so much as a second's consideration!
I've always been a bit old fashioned and saved all my overtime payments and ad hoc work stuff to buy my cars out of my own money.
But nowadays if you can lease or whatever for that sort of cash for an uber hatch like an R then that's where the future lies! It'd probably work out even cheaper £££ wise over a few years than running a second hand older hot hatch.
Ok, the fact I normally buy cars the old fashioned way is partly because I tend to lightly modify them (or have in the past) counts against leasing and I've also never driven a mk7 R
(Wasn't keen on the turbo response on the earlier K04 Cars, but hell, for less or even the same £££ a month as a GTI... I know where I'd be signing (probably)
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I'm fancying the DSG. That MPG is still a concern and hoping if I go GTi that I can improve on 30mpg as 75% of my work commute is m/way.
Dsg is brilliant..I regularly get 37-40 mpg on motorway trips, 33mpg on short urban commute (mk5 gti never bettered 27mpg on same journey)
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Your'll definitely get more than 30 on motorways mate in the GTI. I get around 40 on mix trips involving motorways. Yes DSG is amazing.
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I'm absolutely baffled by VW Solutions....just checked their finance site and it's £60 cheaper a month for me to have an R than a GTI. I feel well, ripped off? :/
The GTI and GTD GFVs have softened when you look at the latest solutions figures, the R seems to be extremely generous.
GTD = 53.5% (was 56% when I ordered mine last March)
GTI = 49.2% (it was 51% in March 2013)
R = 60.5%
The R's GFV is amazing, beating the likes of an S3, the new TT or Porsche Cayman by a margin. I've been looking at an S3 for next time - maybe placing an order when my GTD is 2 years old (next Sept). Audi garages seem to be very cautious with their GFVs - I was quoted £17.5k (56%) at 3 years, but was told by the dealer the actual value offered in p/x was far more likely to be around £3k more (66% retained RRP). Seems VW are wearing their heart on their sleeves and Audi are not. That discretionary extra £3k p/x price does allow them the potential to twist your arm up your back when it comes to trying to get additional discounts.
Right now, with figures like that it seems that picking an R over a GTI makes perfect sense when the R can be had for £34 a month less on solutions (with an extra £357 down as deposit = £10 a month), meaning £24 a month net (£864 over the term) cheaper, subsidising the extra thirst of the R. Leasing over 2 years of £250 or so a month makes even more sense (£302 a month in reality if on a 6+23 plan).
I still prefer the S3, but only for the noticeably superior interior - the R could do with some special seats to raise the interior up a bit.
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Hi all,
Many thanks for all the views and comments, much appreciated, informative and very interesting [and genuinely unbiased, which was great].
I am afraid I am walking the dark side and have decided to go for the R :cool:. Going back to the dealer I initially sourced the GTi with, they have provided a couple of R options... Limestone Grey DSG 3dr or Lpaiz Blue manual 3dr and for the sake of the DSG I think I will be going grey :nerd:.
Will keep an eye on the GTi forum for sure though.
Cheers
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Posted this before but seems appropriate again.
Monthly figures after a deposit of £5000.
OTR £26,330 £29,900 £25,765
Term GTI R GTD
x18 £482 £376 £406
x24 £382 £310 £326
x30 £360 £322 £318
x36 £338 £316 £298
x42 £322 £318 £295
x48 £307 £310 £282
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Posted this before but seems appropriate again.
Monthly figures after a deposit of £5000.
OTR £26,330 £29,900 £25,765
Term GTI R GTD
x18 £482 £376 £406
x24 £382 £310 £326
x30 £360 £322 £318
x36 £338 £316 £298
x42 £322 £318 £295
x48 £307 £310 £282
Is this accurate? As to get an R on a 24 month deal for 310 is absolute buttons!! Took my car over three years, itl be a year oldin November but getting itchy feet already. Next car will be a 24 month affair. Keen for an s3 or an R but from a GTD to an R would be phenomenal but its a golf to a golf.
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Fill your boots :laugh:
https://www.volkswagen.co.uk/financeCalculator/generateDefaultCalculation?modelId=1478&derivativeId=1706&price=30555
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Fill your boots :laugh:
https://www.volkswagen.co.uk/financeCalculator/generateDefaultCalculation?modelId=1478&derivativeId=1706&price=30555
Look at that...you're right :laugh: Even better when you negotiate harder on the price. Hindsight is a wonderful thing
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What a surprise, I'm gobsmacked :rolleyes: :rolleyes:
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What a surprise, I'm gobsmacked :rolleyes: :rolleyes:
Sarcasm much lol
Just amazed that for a car like an R for as cheap as that surprises me. Always perceived them to be ludicrously expensive but far from
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Took my car over three years, itl be a year oldin November but getting itchy feet already. Next car will be a 24 month affair. Keen for an s3 or an R but from a GTD to an R would be phenomenal but its a golf to a golf.
Ditto. I've never got so bored so quickly with a car. I can't put my finger on it - it handles well, it's the best equipped car I've ever had, it has the best interior of any VW I've ever owned, it's conservatively good looking. If I didn't have the extra shove of the DTUK box, I'd be extremely bored with it. As lively as the R undoubtedly is, I'm struggling with the thought of going from one Golf to another. It has to be an S3, or maybe a MK3 TT (although that looks poor value next to an S3, and TTS for similar performance seems far too pricey for what it is, I'd rather have a Cayman for that price).
The main things that have pissed me off are Bridgestones, the 5 month wait, and the GTD being neither frugal nor feeling any more powerful than my Scirocco (I loved that car!). Maybe my midlife crisis is upon me! :laugh:
Modern cars feel so sterile (generally).
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Took my car over three years, itl be a year oldin November but getting itchy feet already. Next car will be a 24 month affair. Keen for an s3 or an R but from a GTD to an R would be phenomenal but its a golf to a golf.
Ditto. I've never got so bored so quickly with a car. I can't put my finger on it - it handles well, it's the best equipped car I've ever had, it has the best interior of any VW I've ever owned, it's conservatively good looking. If I didn't have the extra shove of the DTUK box, I'd be extremely bored with it. As lively as the R undoubtedly is, I'm struggling with the thought of going from one Golf to another. It has to be an S3, or maybe a MK3 TT (although that looks poor value next to an S3, and TTS for similar performance seems far too pricey for what it is, I'd rather have a Cayman for that price).
The main things that have pissed me off are Bridgestones, the 5 month wait, and the GTD being neither frugal nor feeling any more powerful than my Scirocco (I loved that car!). Maybe my midlife crisis is upon me! :laugh:
Modern cars feel so sterile (generally).
Totally agree that the DTUK box is whats keeping me happy at the moment. Driving it back from work today with it off wasnt much fun...no real excitement behind planting your right foot, however with it fitted it makes it a joy to drive. The GTD is a good car just not a great car but for the money and what comes as standard as you say its the best all rounder in its class.
I used to go on and on and on about my last Audi a3 but I just havent done with this car. Maybe and personally speaking its because ive made a sideways step with the a3 to a gtd. I will for sure be in the market in a years time for another car and sure as punch be testing an R.
Loads of lads/ladies raving about their GTIs but does seem rather quiet on the GTD front
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I'd think 99% of GTD drivers are company car drivers so wouldn't bother with forums. They might read them and post maybe an occasional remark when they order and maybe once they've taken delivery, but after that they've moved on, quietly happy with the steed they have use of.
GTI drivers are perhaps more private buyers(?) or those who have a company car allowance and are more prepared to take a hit on tax to get a petrol engine, and to be honest looking at those figures - why the hell would anyone buy one now no matter how good a car it is?!!
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Oh no, with sums like that the R is going to be so common :sad: :grin:
Still getting one though :whistle:
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Some interesting numbers for sure. That would mean a cash buyer could run an R for 3 years for £241 pm and a GTI would cost £288 (assuming 10% discount). The R really is a bargin...
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Some interesting numbers for sure. That would mean a cash buyer could run an R for 3 years for £241 pm and a GTI would cost £288 (assuming 10% discount). The R really is a bargin...
I plan on doing exactly that with an S3 in about a years time, maybe it'll cost me closer to £280 a month
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And those numbers assume the GFV after 3 years. If you look after your car the monthly figures will be even lower :smiley:. It makes you realise how expensive car finance actually is..
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And those numbers assume the GFV after 3 years. If you look after your car the monthly figures will be even lower :smiley:. It makes you realise how expensive car finance actually is..
Aye, it certainly does, VW engineer it that way - the higher the GFV, the higher the amount of interest they get out of you. Interest on a GTD/GTI/R will easily add £100 a month over 3 years, if you're easy on the options and don't put a huge deposit down. The Audi dealer quoted me £17600 GFV on an S3, but said Audi are very conservative on theirs, and to expect £3k on top of that if it's in good condition and nothing screwy happens with the used car market during ownership duration. VW seem to quote on the high end of reality. Probably only another grand on top of GFV in p/x if we're lucky, but then the R GFV is already set higher than the S3's.
VAG finance is currently running at 6.5-7.5% APR for most models, they are making a killing on finance, considering how low interest rates are in the UK and across the Eurozone right now. When we had a base rate of 4.5%, finance and personal loan interest rates were barely higher, certainly lower than they are right now, with a base rate of 0.5%. The Germans get to buy VWs on VW finance for less than 2% APR.
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Some interesting numbers for sure. That would mean a cash buyer could run an R for 3 years for £241 pm and a GTI would cost £288 (assuming 10% discount). The R really is a bargin...
Am i being thick but how do you come to £241 a month for a R ? I'm a potential cash buyer.
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Some interesting numbers for sure. That would mean a cash buyer could run an R for 3 years for £241 pm and a GTI would cost £288 (assuming 10% discount). The R really is a bargin...
Am i being thick but how do you come to £241 a month for a R ? I'm a potential cash buyer.
If you wangle a 10% discount and have no options (they are the bane of depreciation, major ones like leather and DSG hold about 20% of cost, lesser ones can add between 0 and 10% of their RRP to your p/x price), you'll be paying £26991, GFV is £18104. If you get no more than GFV at 3 years old, you'll have lost £8887. Split that over 36 months and you have lost £247 a month on it. That's £247 with nothing else down, compared with leasing on 6+23 terms for a 2 year lease or 6+35 terms on a 3 year lease and ultimately paying about £1200 more out.
If you add £3k worth of options however and they're adding £600 to future p/x value, you've lost £2400, or added £67 a month to your costs. £3k options on a £30k car adds 33% to the cost of your purchase's depreciation - something to think about! For someone buying on finance, those options will be costing them an extra £100 a month when interest is factored in.
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Thanks monkeyhanger you beat me to a response.
Imagine the scenario of leaving an immaculate R back to the dealers in three years and they give you 1k more over GFV. That would mean a depreciation of ~£7887 or £219 PM. A ford fiesta would cost as much. Sorry i'm getting carried away selling an R to myself...
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^^^^ monkeyhanger and Mk7gti I'm a bit lost excuse me :laugh: Do you mean selling it private for at least the GFV or on PCP
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Yeah sell it privately or a good trade-in value. The forecourt price will always be above the GFV unless the market goes Pete Tong.
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Oh yes i'm with you now, i nearly bought a white 5dr with nav for 26k privately with less than 2k miles. That was a good buy but i couldn't be bothered in the end too far away. I saw it on the VW site last week 30k, it sold within days.
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You should be able to get GFV figure from your supplying dealer to sell the car to them, or a grand more in part ex towards another. In a year's time the MK7 GTI/GTD will be too new for them to find in meaningful supply from outside the dealership network.
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So, how do you go about handing your GTI back early while it's on Solutions and changing it to an R? :laugh:
No, seriously. How? :evil:
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My GTI has just turned 1. I could see an R in the drive in 12 months time :smiley:
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So, how do you go about handing your GTI back early while it's on Solutions and changing it to an R? :laugh:
No, seriously. How? :evil:
They'll propose a current value for the car that the dealership is comfortable to accept and VW solutions will give you a settlement figure (there's a 2 month interest penalty) that'll seem low and then present you with an interest "rebate". If you have any equity in the car between the settlement and what the dealership will give you, you can use it towards your new R and then you start again.
You will lose a small fortune in less than 2 years though, At about 2 years old the big initial hit has been watered down and further depreciation should equal out the capital part of your payment from thereon in.
The difference in what a dealer will give you at 6 months, 12 months and 18 months is negligible. If you have a £26k GTI that's 6 months old, the dealership would probably be looking to get £25k for it, which means they will probably give you £20-21k for it (they want to make 20-25% on the used lot). They'll give you a similar amount at a year old, but at 2 years old you might be looking to get £16-17k. Every month you own the car you'll be making around £250 equity in your payment. Keep the car 2 years rather than 1 and you will have an extra £3k equity in it vs the car having lost £4k on what they'll give you vs 1 year old when the car has lost £5-6k (on what they'll settle with you for) vs your £3k equity.
Look at the solutions examples for 18 months and 2 year PCP, the GFV is the same for both.
If you are looking to chop the GTI in and they don't crucify you on the settlement, you might be better walking away from the dealer and doing one of those 2 year £250pm leases. If you've added a load of options on your GTI then you've pretty much lost that money. The dealership will give you next to nowt for them but will capitalise on those extras when they sell it used. A loaded £29k GTI will probably only fetch you £500 more than the figures above, but they'll probably be looking for £27k sticker price rather than £25k for a vanilla one.
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Thanks Monkeyhanger. I always got confused with the equity thing and whether or not you get money towards your next car if you choose to change it for another car at the end of the agreement. Is it that equity that acts as your deposit for your next car then?
Yes mines pretty loaded so i'd lose a ton. Or well, it's no big deal, i'm happy with my GTI I just found it hilarious the R is cheaper and would never have anticipated that or i'd have waited. :sick:
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Thanks Monkeyhanger. I always got confused with the equity thing and whether or not you get money towards your next car if you choose to change it for another car at the end of the agreement. Is it that equity that acts as your deposit for your next car then?
Yes mines pretty loaded so i'd lose a ton. Or well, it's no big deal, i'm happy with my GTI I just found it hilarious the R is cheaper and would never have anticipated that or i'd have waited. :sick:
Yes, your "equity" used as deposit on the next one is the positive difference between what they are willing to give you in p/x vs GFV if you went full term, or what you owe on it if you didn't wait the full term. If you were to change right now, you'd likely be in deficit unless you put a decently sized deposit down when you bought.
Looking at your options, you still might not lose too much - PP is considered a model designation for the whole car, rather than a £1000 extra that retains very little, you'll see a sizeable lump of that back (or you should), DSG might not lose a drastic amount, and your Nav unit might be transferrable to the new R (for a swap out with the R's standard unit - it's certainly feasable). You'd only be kissing the sunroof and DCC money goodbye completely.
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The Audi dealer quoted me £17600 GFV on an S3, but said Audi are very conservative on theirs, and to expect £3k on top of that...
That statement reminded me of when we were setting up our first mortgage and every Financial Advisor we spoke to were very keen for us to go with an Endowment mortgage and basically refused to discuss a repayment one.
It went along the lines of "After your endowment finishes, you will end up with more money and be able to buy a wee sports car with" That was literally the script of each FA. And we know what happened with endowment mortgages :shocked:
Why am I mentioning this? Well if the Audi dealer are so sure you will be offered an extra £3k on top of the GFV why aren't they upping the figure or at least closing the gap? Is it not a line to get you to buy?
The salesman who sold me my Mk6 told me I should realistically expect £1500 as equity on a deposit for a new car. Now that car was in pristine condition. All machine polished and spotless and the very same salesman offered me £500 over the GFV. He never even looked at the car. In fact several dealers never even looked at the car.
I personally think when the salesman asks for your registration and permission to access your finance account, they are looking for that magic GFV figure and offer you slightly over to give you a feeling you've made some money on the car. If they were honest then that should be the last thing they look at.
I'd be curious to see what they do offer.
If they are anything like the majority of the Audi dealers I dealt with when buying the A1 then I wouldn't hold my breath.
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The Audi dealer quoted me £17600 GFV on an S3, but said Audi are very conservative on theirs, and to expect £3k on top of that...
That statement reminded me of when we were setting up our first mortgage and every Financial Advisor we spoke to were very keen for us to go with an Endowment mortgage and basically refused to discuss a repayment one.
It went along the lines of "After your endowment finishes, you will end up with more money and be able to buy a wee sports car with" That was literally the script of each FA. And we know what happened with endowment mortgages :shocked:
Why am I mentioning this? Well if the Audi dealer are so sure you will be offered an extra £3k on top of the GFV why aren't they upping the figure or at least closing the gap? Is it not a line to get you to buy?
The salesman who sold me my Mk6 told me I should realistically expect £1500 as equity on a deposit for a new car. Now that car was in pristine condition. All machine polished and spotless and the very same salesman offered me £500 over the GFV. He never even looked at the car. In fact several dealers never even looked at the car.
I personally think when the salesman asks for your registration and permission to access your finance account, they are looking for that magic GFV figure and offer you slightly over to give you a feeling you've made some money on the car. If they were honest then that should be the last thing they look at.
I'd be curious to see what they do offer.
If they are anything like the majority of the Audi dealers I dealt with when buying the A1 then I wouldn't hold my breath.
I totally get where you're coming from with this post. £3k expectations on top GFV does make Audi seem extremely cautious - why can't they put their money where their mouth is?
On the other hand, compared to the GFV on the R, the S3 does look genuinely too low for the car. There'll be fewer of them made than the R, you have the "premium" of the Audi badge and that sumptuous interior over the R. It makes sense to me that if a £30k R is worth £18100 at 3 years according to the GFV, then a £31k S3 should be worth £20k after 3 years. Of course i've also considered the leverage they can hold over you when you're looking for a discount on your next car: "you want £3k over GFV for your p/x and 10% off the new car?"
When I gave DTUK Andrew's S3 a look over and tapped a few panels - it did seem more solid than the MK7 Golf. I think the use of Aluminium on a lot of their panels has kept the gauge thickness up. I much prefer the old solid feel of pre MK7 Golf, for the sake of 23Kg saved. The new Golf does feel a bit more hollow when you tap the panels, and i'm sure they'll ding/dent easier than before.
There was a lot of sales patter/bullsh!t coming from Mr Audi at my local dealership. I said i'd be after an S3 or an R next time, but the S3 interior may swing it if a deal can be done. He made out that they pretty much only share 20% of the tech and components. Inside I was scoffing at that remark - save for the better interior, some Aluminium panels and minor software differences to the way the engine/haldex/electric steering works, they're undoubtedly the same car under the skin.
It does make me laugh when I chop a car in and i've kept it pristine, they give it a cursory glance at most and it looks twice as good as some of their used stock of the same age (scuffed alloys, dings, dents, bumper scuffs etc). When it's in the dealership network, the monetary difference between pristine and reasonable condition seems negligible. When I look to chop my car in, I have a good look around their used lot and expect to get 80% of their sticker price as p/x value. If they expect to get more than 125% of my p/x value on the used lot then I consider them to be greedy.
My current GTD isn't under VW finance, but I know what the 2 year and 3 year GFVs were quoted to me prior to purchase and I expect any dealership buying my car off me to match those figures at the very least (and realistically only expect another £500 at best), especially at 2 years (next Sept) when I doubt there'll be many used 2 year old ones to choose from on the used lot and they haven't yet left the dealership network.
If i'm part-exing within the VAG group I'd expect a bit more. At the end of the day, the salesperson can be as friendly as they like, but while i'm negotiating the cheapest cost to change for my next car they are not my friend.
If I can lease an R for £100 a month less than leasing/buying (without finance) an S3, I think i'd forego the better interior of the S3 for that level of saving.
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To answer the original question, for me the answer is yes - so much so that I found a dealer that had an R available in the spec I wanted and I get it in a few weeks :cool: I love my GTI (it's the best GTI yet) - but the R is something else - couldn't resist :evil:
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To answer the original question, for me the answer is yes - so much so that I found a dealer that had an R available in the spec I wanted and I get it in a few weeks :cool: I love my GTI (it's the best GTI yet) - but the R is something else - couldn't resist :evil:
Nice one Mark :smiley: :smiley:
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Nice one Mark :smiley: :smiley:
Thanks mate :smiley:
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To answer the original question, for me the answer is yes - so much so that I found a dealer that had an R available in the spec I wanted and I get it in a few weeks :cool: I love my GTI (it's the best GTI yet) - but the R is something else - couldn't resist :evil:
Cool beans! :cool: what spec you gone for?
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This has been such an interesting thread....... I'm contemplating moving back to an R from an S1.
There is no PCP/HP on the S1 but I am so tempted by some of the comments in this thread to throw in max deposit of 30% have the rest as Cashback & pay £200 or so per month on PCP.
List price on my S1 was £28K but with such limited supply at present (possibly due to limited demand) not sure how much I'd get in p/ex. Especially in September!
Any good dealers people can recommend? Don't mind travelling!
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This has been such an interesting thread....... I'm contemplating moving back to an R from an S1.
There is no PCP/HP on the S1 but I am so tempted by some of the comments in this thread to throw in max deposit of 30% have the rest as Cashback & pay £200 or so per month on PCP.
List price on my S1 was £28K but with such limited supply at present (possibly due to limited demand) not sure how much I'd get in p/ex. Especially in September!
Any good dealers people can recommend? Don't mind travelling!
How old is the S1? Trouble with the S1 is that by the time you bring up the spec to that of a standard S3, you're up to about £28k, not a kick in the arse off S3 money, and 70ps down.
If it's a year old, it'll probably fetch £25k tops on the Audi/VW used forecourt, which means they'll be looking to make £5k on it and give you £20k in p/x at most. I'd bank on £19k for a realistic 1 year old price if the dealer isn't feeling massively generous (if he is feeling generous with the p/x, he'll not give you much money off the R).
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To answer the original question, for me the answer is yes - so much so that I found a dealer that had an R available in the spec I wanted and I get it in a few weeks :cool: I love my GTI (it's the best GTI yet) - but the R is something else - couldn't resist :evil:
Cool beans! :cool: what spec you gone for?
I actually was going for a stock car that was available in Lapiz Blue - then I saw an R today and have gone for a factory order instead - so loooooong wait for me, but it will be worth it! Reflex Silver (actually couldn't believe how good it looked in the flesh), 19" Pretorias and DNS - that's it :smiley: Have the whole tracker thing to go through again, must be a glutton for punishment ha ha!
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This has been such an interesting thread....... I'm contemplating moving back to an R from an S1.
There is no PCP/HP on the S1 but I am so tempted by some of the comments in this thread to throw in max deposit of 30% have the rest as Cashback & pay £200 or so per month on PCP.
List price on my S1 was £28K but with such limited supply at present (possibly due to limited demand) not sure how much I'd get in p/ex. Especially in September!
Any good dealers people can recommend? Don't mind travelling!
How old is the S1? Trouble with the S1 is that by the time you bring up the spec to that of a standard S3, you're up to about £28k, not a kick in the arse off S3 money, and 70ps down.
If it's a year old, it'll probably fetch £25k tops on the Audi/VW used forecourt, which means they'll be looking to make £5k on it and give you £20k in p/x at most. I'd bank on £19k for a realistic 1 year old price if the dealer isn't feeling massively generous (if he is feeling generous with the p/x, he'll not give you much money off the R).
Best deal today was £5.5K to change which is £24K p/ex.
Spec on the R is black, carbon leather, nav pro, roof, 19 inch wheels but its 3 door.
Against a pre-reg S3 (14 plate) I was offered less but the car was £36K :shocked:
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To answer the original question, for me the answer is yes - so much so that I found a dealer that had an R available in the spec I wanted and I get it in a few weeks 8) I love my GTI (it's the best GTI yet) - but the R is something else - couldn't resist >:D
Cool beans! 8) what spec you gone for?
I actually was going for a stock car that was available in Lapiz Blue - then I saw an R today and have gone for a factory order instead - so loooooong wait for me, but it will be worth it! Reflex Silver (actually couldn't believe how good it looked in the flesh), 19" Pretorias and DNS - that's it :) Have the whole tracker thing to go through again, must be a glutton for punishment ha ha!
The R looks stunning in silver imo, seems to have an almost bluey tint in some lights, i kind of wish i'd gone for it myself tbh mainly cos it'll be much easier to keep looking good than my Lapiz blue! The wait for my R was about 2 months less than the GTI so fingers crossed for ya mate! :)
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The R looks stunning in silver imo, seems to have an almost bluey tint in some lights, i kind of wish i'd gone for it myself tbh mainly cos it'll be much easier to keep looking good than my Lapiz blue! The wait for my R was about 2 months less than the GTI so fingers crossed for ya mate! :)
I couldn't believe how good it looked, never even considered silver before. So it was a toss up between that and the blue as the blue is also stunning - and thought I'd go with something different!
Ha ha, I remember your wait, was one of the longest for your GTI :shocked: - hopefully my wait will be less!! Cheers James!
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I'm off to the dealers tomorrow to hopefully take an R out for a test drive and discuss a deal trading in my GTI.
I love my GTI but the R just looks fantastic. I hope for the sake of bank balance the R doesn't feel much quicker than my GTI with my DTUK box.
I'm not too bothered about spec, 19's and either white or lapiz.
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Not posted here for a long time since I had my mk 6 GTI which I then replaced with a mk6 GTD. anyway I have been getting the itch lately for a return to the petrol models so tested the R and GTI PP back to back.
In short they a both massively impressive cars and I would be happy to own either, I did find with the R though that you really get the feeling that you are piloting a car with huge performance due to the extra noise etc, it just feels special. For me the R has won out and the order has gone in, this decision in part was influenced by the finance deals available with the R which make the ownership costs over 3 years very attractive.
In my example I'm paying the max deposit with the VW pcp and the equivalent spec GTI was coming in at over £100 more than the R. It really makes justifying the GTI difficult in this situation.
For people paying in full then the GTI will make more sense.
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What's the estimated delivery of your R? How man weeks?
I'm getting itchy myself but going to wait till next march when my GTI hits three years (since I bought it) before I start test driving!
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It should arrive in time for march delivery if all goes well, current estimates are all around the 20 week mark for a new order.
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Thanks that's not bad really cos if I did get one I'd sell the GTI and use a spare to run around so can put some extra cash away whilst waiting for it to arrive.
Even more reasons to get one :laugh:
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I ordered an R today and managed to get a cancellation with the exact spec I wanted :laugh: arrives mid-October!!