GolfGTIforum.co.uk
Model specific boards => Golf mk3 => Topic started by: Len on 29 April 2014, 12:59
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No fuel no spark!
This is the first try of the new engine!!
Fuel - very little in tank so may not be picking any up as car is still up on stands at the front.
So will go get some juice in a couple of cans/containers.
But no spark at all?
All connections are made.
Only thing I'm not sure of is the coil pack earth strap. I put that to the corner cam cover stud, as it seemed to be the only diameter the spade connector fitted. So not sure if that is right! But no idea where else to put it!
Other than that maybe the coil has died during the time car has been off road. (since before Xmas)
Or maybe a wire has broken somewhere??
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I trust you've tested for spark by holding a plug (connected to an HT lead) against the engine or something earthed?
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Of course! First thing I did! Plus as that cylinder gave no hint of fuel I knew that too!
Smelt the plug and also when I turned it over with plug out no fuel vapour!
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Check relays and crank sensor.
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I literally just had this problem and fixed it today man. New ECU relay!!!.
http://www.golfgtiforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=266878.0
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Well looks like I have connected up everything correctly!
So I'm now thinking immobiliser! And dont know why I didnt think of it first!
Funny what you think of laying in bed trying to get to sleep!
So I will close the windows and doors etc hold down the bonnet sensor and go through a few locking/unlocking sequences and see if that resets it!
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Pretty sure you'd still get spark and fuel if the immo was kicking in, they start up and then cut out straight away.
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My Cobra alarm/immobiliser cuts out the fuel, so I'm pretty sure its that for the fuel.
have tried a full car lock/unlock a couple of times and still the same, so will have to find the reset fob thing and try that next!
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I'm not sure which is worse out of immob or other electrics!
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I just cant think what else would cause both no fuel and no spark.
Its a brand new crank sensor so cant be that.
I was worried about all the electrical connections but as someone said all the connectors are different in some way and you cant mix things up as the loom leads you to each point.
There is another thread on here of an Aussie guy who changed relay E30 and that worked for him, but I cant see why mine should just fail completely! It was fine before I stripped down and swapped engines.
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oo its a cobra, i thought you had the factory immo. in that case you could try bridging the fuel pump relay if you cant find the fob to reset it
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I drove my car like usual, got home, parked it, went to it the next day and it just wouldn't start and had no spark and fuel injector wasn't activating when I turned the ignition. So ignition coil isn't cracked or anything? A few people were having similar symptoms with that issue. And the E30 relay was $40 from my VW dealer, was going to buy used but thought I better not with the relay haha. Worth replacing since it's a pretty cheap option.
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Sure I have the fob with the spare set of key/alarm fob.
Just a matter of finding those!
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Found fob easily, but still no go!
Need a good auto-electrician me thinks! Will see what vag-com throws up!
A mate has a proper one so see when he can come look.
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Codes tested, only one fault! Crank sensor :angry:
Wish I hadnt wasted time on the alarm/immobiliser now!
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didn't you say you had a brand new crank sensor? mk3's will report a crank sensor fault if the engine isn't running when you scan them.. could be a red herring.
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check the timing and dizzy position....
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didn't you say you had a brand new crank sensor? mk3's will report a crank sensor fault if the engine isn't running when you scan them.. could be a red herring.
I thought it was the hall sensor that came up when the engine isn't running .
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yeah you're right.. i don't have to work on many mk3s anymore, thankfully :grin:
if the crank sensor was a genuine item it could be wiring. cheap sensors on the other hand can be faulty right out of the box.
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Crank sensor was the only code that showed up.
Was cleared then engine start attempted and fault re-appeared straight away.
Yes it was a new crank sensor, a Febi part.
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check the timing and dizzy position....
Timing is spot on, checked and double checked.
Dizzy went back in, in the same position it came out. I memorised that.
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And the timing being out would still produce a spark!
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New crank sensor arrived and I fitted it!
No friggin difference!
Just been looking through the photos I had taken and the cog on the two cranks (diesel/abf) look the same!
I was thinking maybe if they were somehow different that the sensor wouldnt pick up the signal.
So not that or maybe it is! Think I am going to have to take the sumps off just to make sure!
But other than that, what could it be? If I get it scanned again and it still says crank sensor could it be wiring? I mean the loom got pulled and pushed out of the way getting engines out/in etc. Maybe a wire has broken???
I am lost!
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Which engine is it?
Cobra immobiliser, so pre MY95? Do you have the factory alarm fitted? Could be it's motherboard (sits behind and slightly below light switch), common fault for solder spots to break on the board... If you do have it worth taking out and checking solder spots on the board - if you see cold spots that are cracked then resolder and see if that helps!
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16v abf
Guess its old tech now! Yes the Cobra was bought over 11 years ago now.
But I tested it and reset it so should be fine!
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Didn't think a crank sensor would make any difference!
I'd be using a multimeter to find out where the coil power has stopped.
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Yes Josh that's one thing I will be doing.
I don't think there will be any power going to the coil
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Well the crank sensor is getting power!
So it must be the pick up!
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what is the fault code? when you clear it does it return after cycling the ignition or does it only come up after cranking the starter?
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Well on the other thread we have no rev counter working so it does seem like a crank sensor issue.
I have no idea what they even look like on a MK3, but I'm wondering if something could be made up on the crank pulley like FIAT Puntos have.
Assuming it would have to be the same diameter as stock or some clever coding would be needed at a guess but I'm wondering if with a custom pulley and a bracket it would work, probably fairly pricey though.
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Have you got pictures of your crankshaft?
Google shows a few TDI crank shafts from the MK2/MK3 area without the sensor teeth.
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(http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/02/25/e8a7e4yh.jpg)
http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?6914534-external-crank-trigger-sensor
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That's on the outside of the engine. The sensor sits inside on the right hand end of the crank. (flywheel end)
I thought I had pics of the crank but not sure now!
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Ah I see that is an interesting workaround! Still a heck of a lot of work!
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Thank you very much for that Josh! Looks like one of those solutions will work for me!
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have found another one that comes as a kit and easier to fit as it sits on the outside of the pulley wheels.
However have also been talking to someone with a lot more knowledge than me and it may only be the length of the sensor! so need to do some measuring and checking over the weekend.
Yes I will be taking the sump off!
Maybe! lol
If I can measure the distance in the hole in the block and then the sensor to see how close it is, then I don't need too!
If that is the reason.
Then I will have to get hold of a diesel crank sensor and see if that works!
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Diesel sensor is a different type! Inductive instead of the Hall effect I need!
Plus looking into the hole where the sensor goes it looks like there is a metal shroud to the crank trigger wheel!
So sump off and have a look!
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I'm thinking you needed an ABF timing gear on it.
No worries for the link, I think whip the sump off if you want to and have a look but I'd leave all well alone and just go external, I mean if people with big power do it just do it once and forget about it!
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Yea but I need to take sump off to look for the next stage as an inductive sensor will work with the new kit thats going on there!
DTA ecu and no Dizzy! Plus ITB's
So the guy thats doing that next bit for me wants to know if the diesel one will fit.
Need to take some accurate measurements as well.
But in the meantime the external workaround is probably my only solution!
That is if I can source the parts!
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my dizzy was out of whack on my passat and i got spark on the engine block with the plug out ouf the block, but the timing was so off that the fuel delivery was not getting to the plugs when needed. the best indication of this is the car tries to start but when you release the key in the ignition it will hiccup but not start.. i wasted money on a crank sensor when all that was needed was the timing mark on the timing belt and the dizzy being in sync....my mechanically inclined friend said he couldn't guess how it had gone out of whack but there you go....after it was found that the tensioner had allowed the belt to slip....and that's all it took for it to not want to start .....:)....headache for a longtime it was before the cause found
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But I have no spark at all and no fuel either!
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External crank trigger and sensor can be obtained but has to be scratch built!
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:afro:
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my dizzy was out of whack on my passat and i got spark on the engine block with the plug out ouf the block, but the timing was so off that the fuel delivery was not getting to the plugs when needed. the best indication of this is the car tries to start but when you release the key in the ignition it will hiccup but not start.. i wasted money on a crank sensor when all that was needed was the timing mark on the timing belt and the dizzy being in sync....my mechanically inclined friend said he couldn't guess how it had gone out of whack but there you go....after it was found that the tensioner had allowed the belt to slip....and that's all it took for it to not want to start .....:)....headache for a longtime it was before the cause found
this is exactly what has happened to mine.
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I need a 60-2 trigger wheel the set ups readily available are 36-1
So I need to get the dimensions of the wheel from my existing engine and pass that onto the guy who is going the machine it for me.
that's going to be Monday at the earliest.
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Took the crank out of my old abf engine and measured the trigger wheel.
Not sure how that can come off as its internal diameter is smaller than the end boss on the crank!
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getting a one-off crank trigger wheel and sensor set up made by some very nice guys called BAM Racing, based in London UK.
(no connection with a US company)
Great thanks and gratitude goes to Bellend for finding the workaround for me!