GolfGTIforum.co.uk
Model specific boards => Golf mk7 => Topic started by: adekil on 12 January 2014, 19:13
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So I know theres various posts about performance and tyres which mention problems with tramping in 1st & 2nd gear but I'm interested to know if you continue to push your car and this happens will there be any long term damage or degrading of the car?
Since its become wetter my Bridgestones are living up to their poor reputation and I'm not thinking when I put my foot down and each time I get that awful banging under the chassis and I do cringe thinking I'm not doing my car any good here :sad:
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So I know theres various posts about performance and tyres which mention problems with tramping in 1st & 2nd gear but I'm interested to know if you continue to push your car and this happens will there be any long term damage or degrading of the car?
Since its become wetter my Bridgestones are living up to their poor reputation and I'm not thinking when I put my foot down and each time I get that awful banging under the chassis and I do cringe thinking I'm not doing my car any good here :sad:
I just can't believe VW fitted Bridgestones when the GTD spec states "anti-tramping feature" - clearly not! Don't think it does the car any harm - never needed a realignment on my MK5 170TDI which was very bad for tramping (also Bridgestones).
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It just sounds damaging when it happens and that's why I'm now thinking is it worth waiting out the life span of the Bridgestones or replace them now! I can't keep cringing and saying I will drive more carefully tomorrow, as I always give into temptation.
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I also want to know this, sounds much more painful when it happens than it did in my Leon?
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In the long term there is potential damage that could be done in the short term, not really, but I guess the driveshafts and associated joints (cv) would be the most at risk.
If you think about what tramping (the driven wheel(s) losing contact with the road surface) is then you could cause potential damage to the drivetrain: clutch, gearbox, differential, driveshafts as well as adding extra stress to the front struts and other suspension components... over time.
There is a way to stop tramping... use less throttle :smiley:
If you can't do that, then some other tyres may be the way forward :smiley:
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or.... fit a WALK, which I intend to do when they release one :grin:
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Fit new tyres - you shouldn't have to drive like you bought an UP!, just because VW fitted sh!te tyres.
Could this be a warranty issue? VW stated that the GTD had an anti-tramping feature in the brochure that was available when I ordered. Could the argument be that with these tyres (Bridgestones) on, the anti-tramping feature does not appear to work? More likely they will tell you that you have to rein in the throttle. If the GTD shod with Bridgestones isn’t capable of achieving 7.5s for the 0-62mph sprint in optimal conditions (because of tramping) then I think there may be a case to answer.
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You could raise the argument but we've harldy got a Firestone case here, plus what are optimal conditions? whatever the definition is your not going to find it in January.
How does this anti tramping differ from previous traction control on other models, it certainly makes more noise on my car than ever before?
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Fit new tyres - you shouldn't have to drive like you bought an UP!, just because VW fitted sh!te tyres.
Could this be a warranty issue? VW stated that the GTD had an anti-tramping feature in the brochure that was available when I ordered. Could the argument be that with these tyres (Bridgestones) on, the anti-tramping feature does not appear to work? More likely they will tell you that you have to rein in the throttle. If the GTD shod with Bridgestones isn’t capable of achieving 7.5s for the 0-62mph sprint in optimal conditions (because of tramping) then I think there may be a case to answer.
So, as I've said before... I have not experienced any tramping with my GTD but I don't have Bridgestone Tyres, I have Continentals.
I should be interested to see what sort of response you receive from VW if you take that approach.
As for you statement regarding optimal conditions: damp, cold roads are hardly optimal conditions especially if your car is shod with summer tyres. Hence my statement about other tyres which perhaps are better suited to current conditions. You said the Bridgestones are poor (and agree they may not be the best) but they are not dangerous and I think you will have a job arguing that they are not fit for purpose...
I understand your frustration (and even sympathise) and understanding whether this is a car limitation (it certainly isn't with mine) or a tyre limitation (I don't know because, I've only experienced the Bridgestones on a 120d and whilst they spin up there is no tramping) would be quite interesting...
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They were tramping in the dry during our unusually warm September and October. I’d consider these worn in at 300 miles (as per the Golf manual) and at the end of Sept, with 700 miles on the clock, in 20C temps in the dry at ½ throttle, they were tramping.
I wrote VW a letter at the end of September on the subject and sent it by recorded delivery - they have chosen to ignore it. The letter stated that whatever “anti-tramping function” they had incorporated into the GTD (as per the brochure), it wasn’t working and that I felt disappointed that my GTD was not performing at its best due to VW’s poor choice of tyres. I also stated that my MK5 was also terrible with tramping (with Bridgestones) and it was pretty unfortunate that they hadn’t resolved the issue by now, especially with reference to the anti-tramping advice.
I also asked them why VW fitted windscreen wipers on the drivers side continued to smear on the downstroke, as has been the case with my previous 4 VWs. I suggested that many items considered consumables were arguably unfit for purpose and I did not expect them to fit substandard components to a £26k car that hamper the performance and could be considered safety concerns (un-necessarily slippy tyres and wipers that don’t properly clear your windscreen, especially in the drivers primary view are a safety concern for me).
I have felt the front of the car being on the verge of losing grip (and traction control about to intervene after flashing a warning) going around a wet but otherwise unremarkable roundabout no faster than the flow of traffic was going around it. Many “inferior” cars of all size and marque appeared to be doing the same without incident. My Scirocco stuck to the road like glue, driving the GTD around a corner sometimes feels like you’re walking barefoot over wet tiles.
You shouldn’t have to drive a warm/hot hatch like a nun in the wet (in the ice and snow, yes) or barely damp.
This feels strongly like a tyre limitation rather than a car limitation as the Scirocco (pretty much a MK5/6 under the skin) was so grippy on Dunlop SP01s, Pirelli P7s and Michelin PS3s.
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I too have also experienced tramping with the Bridgestones whether it is wet or not.
However, i have found there traction in terms of lateral load pretty impressive. No worse than any other tyres previously used. Especially once up to temperature.
I do agree though, traction under acceleration is poor. Braking performance seems good though.
J
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I too have also experienced tramping with the Bridgestones whether it is wet or not.
However, i have found there traction in terms of lateral load pretty impressive. No worse than any other tyres previously used. Especially once up to temperature.
I do agree though, traction under acceleration is poor. Braking performance seems good though.
J
I'll second this, very confident in the car once its moving and i have tried to drift a bit on wet roundabout and its remained firmly planted. Just getting it going is an issue
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If provoked the GTI will drift on a roundabout. It requires a good chuck in to the apex and then a big lift off the throttle. The back came round nicely, although was nice and predictable. Apply some more throttle and everything comes back in line nicely.
J
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If provoked the GTI will drift on a roundabout. It requires a good chuck in to the apex and then a big lift off the throttle. The back came round nicely, although was nice and predictable. Apply some more throttle and everything comes back in line nicely.
J
Oh im sure it has its limits but you have to be pushing very hard to pass them is all i mean
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The Bridgestones are possibly the most sensitive tyres I've come across to carcass/tread temperature (as I've stated my experience with them is on the g/f's 120d M-Sport) and I've driven plenty of cars and karts with slicks and semi-slicks (which are typically seen as quite bad in this regard).
The Bridgestones are certainly poor when cold for traction but also, and for me worse, feel. The initial temperature issue is fairly short lived (only a mile or two) but the feel thing (which I assume is down carcass temperature) seems to last much longer and is there almost all the time in the wet.
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You can stop your car "tramping". Just switch off the ASR...
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You can stop your car "tramping". Just switch off the ASR...
But won't wheel spinning cause more damage to the car? Also can you switch this to sport mode separately? Or is it in sport mode? Sure I've seen something in the menus
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It would be nice to get a new car and drive it how it is exactly advertised without the need for disabling or enabling features.
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But then we'd have no buttons to push :smiley:
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You can stop your car "tramping". Just switch off the ASR...
But won't wheel spinning cause more damage to the car? Also can you switch this to sport mode separately? Or is it in sport mode? Sure I've seen something in the menus
No, because it is the shock loading of tramping that would cause most of the damage.
There must be something different with my car... it doesn't tramp, it appears to have decent traction in both wet and dry...
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youre probably just a better driver :smiley:
And what about switching it to sport mode?
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Had my first experience of this on the way to work this morning. Pretty cold out (car told me it was 2oC), came up to a roundabout and when I pulled away a got a massive judder / clonking noise. I assume this is Tramping? gave me a bit of a shock as ive not experienced it before.
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Had my first experience of this on the way to work this morning. Pretty cold out (car told me it was 2oC), came up to a roundabout and when I pulled away a got a massive judder / clonking noise. I assume this is Tramping? gave me a bit of a shock as ive not experienced it before.
pretty much mate, sounds painful dont it
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looks like this :shocked:
(http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/fetch/t_original/http://img.gawkerassets.com/img/19b3ljnbcymlxgif/original.gif)
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youre probably just a better driver :smiley:
And what about switching it to sport mode?
I drive in sport mode, almost exclusively...
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looks like this :shocked:
(http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/fetch/t_original/http://img.gawkerassets.com/img/19b3ljnbcymlxgif/original.gif)
Yes, that's certainly axle tramp... in that case the spinning wheel twists the axle against the leaf spring, lifting the wheel, the twisting motion is instantly reduced, the suspension "untwists" and the wheel settles back... repeat ad nauseum.
The effect that is being experienced on the golf is, I suspect, the front strut twisting longitudunally under load... the potential damage is done when the wheel(s) spinning freely in the air hit the ground - can cause damage to driveshafts, joints, gearbox, diff, suspension components, springs, dampers - probably not in the short term but over time wear will be increased...
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youre probably just a better driver :smiley:
And what about switching it to sport mode?
I drive in sport mode, almost exclusively...
But is there not a separate section for the asr in the car menu?
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youre probably just a better driver :smiley:
And what about switching it to sport mode?
I drive in sport mode, almost exclusively...
But is there not a separate section for the asr in the car menu?
Lol I can confirm that turning the asr to sport does feck all for the for the tramping!
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You can either switch off the ASR or (by pressing for three seconds) enable the sports mode. I was meaning switching it off completely.
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You can either switch off the ASR or (by pressing for three seconds) enable the sports mode. I was meaning switching it off completely.
So you don't have to go through all the menus that's a good bit of Info there 'thanks