GolfGTIforum.co.uk
Model specific boards => Golf mk7 => Topic started by: Diggz on 04 July 2013, 12:32
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Have searched the forum and Im sure this has been discussed elsewhere but apologies cant see it.
Looking to place an order soon and keep jumping between GTI and GTD as I cover upwards of 20k a year. Heart is saying GTI but head is saying GTD.
I was lucky to get upwards of 30mpg out of my Mk5 Ed 30. If the new Mk7 really is a step change in fuel consumption what realistically could be expected from real world driving (mainly B roads and motorways), 35-40mpg?
Cheers
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Gotta be getting 40mpg to be honest.
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I'd expect 40 from the GTI and 60 from the GTD (in manual) after run in, in the summer (subtract 10% for the winter) if it is not thrashed nor babied. You could get 5 more mpg from the GTI if you drive it like a nun, but if that's the plan, why buy a GTI, buy the GTD and drive it a little harder! :evil:
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Would really hope so, I know you dont buy a GTI for economy but anywhere near 40 would be excellent. Amazing what you can justify with a spreadsheet
GTD and GT TDI figures on paper are good but the GT TDI models havent been getting particularly great mpg results so far, like you say though the engines need to settle in a bit
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Yup, my spreadsheet told me that (forgetting relative depreciation, which is meaningless to me over the years I'm keeping it) the extra running costs for a GTI over a GTD were just £450 a year in total (fuel, tax etc.) I only toodle around in my GTI anyway most of the time, just nice to have the power on reserver when you need it or want a bit of fun. If I did many 10s of thousands of miles a year, of course I'd have thought differently, but I don't, so... ;)
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I'd expect 40 from the GTI and 60 from the GTD (in manual) after run in, in the summer (subtract 10% for the winter) if it is not thrashed nor babied. You could get 5 more mpg from the GTI if you drive it like a nun, but if that's the plan, why buy a GTI, buy the GTD and drive it a little harder! :evil:
I think you would be lucky to see 40mpg to be honest. Even if it's 35 i'd be quite happy, still an improvement on my TT :smiley:
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40 mpg, are you kidding? I just about managed that in my MK6 GTD.
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I remember going to a clients once and I'd just got my mk 6 GTI. The director came in to ask who's car that was. Told him it was mine and then proceeded to talk about the car, highlighting the fact that I was getting around 35mpg. He stopped me dead in my tracks at this point; now given he was German and had the whole accent thing going on, and had scary eyes too, he then cut me down with "DON'T GIVE ME THAT SH!T, YOU DON'T BUY A GTI FOR GOOD FUEL CONSUMPTION!" - not much I could say after that, but the point being that you don't buy a GTI if you're primary concern is fuel consumption!!
(Saying that I expect around 35-40mpg driven hard as I used to get 35mpg on a good day in the mk 6 :smiley:)
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On a decent run, with a decent proportion on Motorway driving (under 80mph) i think you'd get close to the stated figures - maybe 44mpg once run in.
I used to get 35mpg+ out of my Mk4 25th Anniversary GTI on longer runs...
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On a decent run, with a decent proportion on Motorway driving (under 80mph) i think you'd get close to the stated figures - maybe 44mpg once run in.
I used to get 35mpg+ out of my Mk4 25th Anniversary GTI on longer runs...
Yeah, but how late were you for wherever you were going? :grin:
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driving (under 80mph)
:grin: :grin: :grin:
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Get the GTI, it's a Hot Hatch :wink:
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Gotta be getting 40mpg to be honest.
How on God's Earth would anyone get that sort of consumption out of a GTI?
Its a drivers car and the mk7 is higher geared than the mk5/6 so you'd drive it like a 5 speed car most of the time in the UK to make sure you're 'in the zone' at legal speeds.
I'm far from a boy racer but these cars are meant to be driven not nannied. 258lb ft of torque is just there to be used!!
30mpg I reckon.
280 lb ft on the GTD? 45 MPG maybe? and an aching left elbow if you use the thing to its full enjoyment factor.
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You can do a comparison on the VW site that shows running costs etc between the 2
http://www.volkswagencomparison.co.uk
There are also sites online that allow you to compare running costs of cars if you put simple figures in.
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Gotta be getting 40mpg to be honest.
How on God's Earth would anyone get that sort of consumption out of a GTI?
Its a drivers car and the mk7 is higher geared than the mk5/6 so you'd drive it like a 5 speed car most of the time in the UK to make sure you're 'in the zone' at legal speeds.
I'm far from a boy racer but these cars are meant to be driven not nannied. 258lb ft of torque is just there to be used!!
30mpg I reckon.
280 lb ft on the GTD? 45 MPG maybe? and an aching left elbow if you use the thing to its full enjoyment factor.
Agreed. Anyone expecting regular 40+ MPG from their GTI is completely deluded. Or intending to drive it like Miss Daisy.
My MK6 GTD averaged around 38-42 MPG but that was with a lot of short journeys and city driving - one of the main reasons I've opted away from diesel this time.
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I have to disagree chaps. I drive hard (and I mean hard, ie. like its stolen - not dangerous or like a c0ck eg. up people's ar7es, but whenever there's an opportunity to nail it I will) and I used to get 33-35mpg on a 45 min run out of the mk6 every day. So expecting 40mpg isn't beyond the realms of possibility.
Saying that, at the moment I get 23mpg if I'm lucky so even 30 will be good! :laugh:
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Gotta be getting 40mpg to be honest.
How on God's Earth would anyone get that sort of consumption out of a GTI?
Its a drivers car and the mk7 is higher geared than the mk5/6 so you'd drive it like a 5 speed car most of the time in the UK to make sure you're 'in the zone' at legal speeds.
I'm far from a boy racer but these cars are meant to be driven not nannied. 258lb ft of torque is just there to be used!!
30mpg I reckon.
280 lb ft on the GTD? 45 MPG maybe? and an aching left elbow if you use the thing to its full enjoyment factor.
Agreed. Anyone expecting regular 40+ MPG from their GTI is completely deluded. Or intending to drive it like Miss Daisy.
My MK6 GTD averaged around 38-42 MPG but that was with a lot of short journeys and city driving - one of the main reasons I've opted away from diesel this time.
40mpg on the combined cycle will not be that difficult, BUT if your only doing short journeys then looking at the combined figure is pointless anyway as you'll be lucky to get mid 30's on shorted runs.
As everyone has said if mpg is a big factor in car choice then get the GTD (but be prepared to regret it!).
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Thats the thing, for the extra driving pleasure and the sake of a few quid I wouldnt want to regret not going for the GTI, tough call
Will be interesting to see how people are getting on once the orders start to arrive
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Ok it is not a Golf but my 170BHP engine had me achieve 52MPG on mainly Motorway trip yesterday with some bursts of speed on M and A roads when opportunity to, if babying imagine near 60 MPG but that never going to happen! - Normal use is 45-50MPG and if pushing it around 40-45 MPG so unless the 184BHP is engine is worse which by figures provided it should not be (and Monkey comments on his Dad GTD) then I see that 60MPG as very reasonable and 50MPG my low figure which is not a lot of fuel for having some decent fun in :)
I agree with comments here that if doing low mileage and it is a private and not lease/company then GTI all the way as there will be a difference but not as much to justify not going for GTI.
Company drivers with incentives for C02 and likely with higher mileage then the performance/ecoonmy balance in GTD is a no brainer also.
Not going to dispute that GTI has real driver pleasure but GTD is in same suit and do not underestimate the power in day to day driving that it delivers - All I can say is my present is far from a slouch and when pushed brings smiles every time so yes I might lose a drag race now and again but for most part my experience is going to pretty damn good :)
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Gotta be getting 40mpg to be honest.
How on God's Earth would anyone get that sort of consumption out of a GTI?
I get 38 out of my current car and the GTI's combined cycle is basically the same.
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not much I could say after that, but the point being that you don't buy a GTI if you're primary concern is fuel consumption!!
I'd also argue that you don't buy a GTD either if your primary concern is fuel consumption, because if fuel really is so important, what are you doing spending so much on a car in the first place?! I know, I know, we all have different budgets and requirements and all that, but still...
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I'd also argue that you don't buy a GTD either if your primary concern is fuel consumption, because if fuel really is so important, what are you doing spending so much on a car in the first place?! I know, I know, we all have different budgets and requirements and all that, but still...
True, but there's looking for fuel consumption and still having a cool car, or there's looking for fuel consumption and buying a prius or some other old dross! :laugh:
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True, but there's looking for fuel consumption and still having a cool car, or there's looking for fuel consumption and buying a prius or some other old dross! :laugh:
So true, ongoing "feel it in your pocket" costs are often more of a concern than the cost of the car itself!
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All fair points. The way I justify spend on a car is I spend enough time in it so its worth it to be comfortable and have my mod cons, as long as the depreciation is half decent which isnt an issue with the Golf
Think GTDs going to get the nod but the spreadsheet will be getting some scrutiny few over the next few days
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not much I could say after that, but the point being that you don't buy a GTI if you're primary concern is fuel consumption!!
I'd also argue that you don't buy a GTD either if your primary concern is fuel consumption, because if fuel really is so important, what are you doing spending so much on a car in the first place?! I know, I know, we all have different budgets and requirements and all that, but still...
My dad's maiden run (350 miles @45mpg and driving it quite hard)) was better than a few 1.6TDI (105PS) owners got in the early days of their MK7s, and around the doors going to work the last few days he's been getting 55mpg. The 1.6TDI boys are having loads of DPF issues and piss poor economy - an even greater reason to get a GTD over the smaller engined Golfs.
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real world i'd say 33 for gti and 52 for gtd driven normally. based on this and 20k a year its a difference of £1300 per annum.
similar to what i have seen moving from edition 30 (27mpg) to GTD (45mpg) over the last 2.5 years saving around £1700 pa
however my circumstances have now changed and my annual milage has dropped by 10k to 10k.
So I have cancelled my MK7 GTD and will wait for an R. :evil:
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Current long term average on the mk6 is 34.
I'm expecting at least +5mpg on the mk7.
Not that bothered really but I suppose every little helps.
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not much I could say after that, but the point being that you don't buy a GTI if you're primary concern is fuel consumption!!
I'd also argue that you don't buy a GTD either if your primary concern is fuel consumption, because if fuel really is so important, what are you doing spending so much on a car in the first place?! I know, I know, we all have different budgets and requirements and all that, but still...
GTD is the one in middle, great economy and really decent performance of likely 7 sec to 60 and all that torque and acceleration through gears that only those driving 2.0TDi 170BHP cars can really appreciate - We have an advantage by experience where as anyone choosing coming from pretty standard petrol or diesel vehicles really need to test drive the cars first to not eliminate the GTD out of hand as think they be going around like Miss Daisy due to the GTI comparisons. :wink:
My GTD expectation
1. Very quick in it's own right
2. Great handling which does not comprise a comfortable ride
3. Again with the GTI suit, the interior being a great place to be.
4. Great looking in the GTI suit and them Nogaro !!
5. Minimum 50MPG economy to 60MPG + on a long run.
Understand the GTI has more performance but day to day driving conditions is quite an equaliser and the GTD will be holding it's own as get's about. - So to me it really does boil down to that red stripe and 3 letters that say GTI and how much value the iconic kudos these 2 things bring? Because it does, it has a huge play on heart.
So it is not really too much about performance or economy but more the stigma of not having a GTI that really is hard for people to get over.
Of course the GTI (PP) will seemingly have something over the standard GTI drivers with any head to head having the drivers sneakily looking at the calipers haha
Remember this is all subjective I respect everyone choices without question, I just think the stripe and GTI tag have more sway than the performance and economy issues do - to feel inferior is a high hurdle :wink:
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not much I could say after that, but the point being that you don't buy a GTI if you're primary concern is fuel consumption!!
I'd also argue that you don't buy a GTD either if your primary concern is fuel consumption, because if fuel really is so important, what are you doing spending so much on a car in the first place?! I know, I know, we all have different budgets and requirements and all that, but still...
GTD is the one in middle, great economy and really decent performance of likely 7 sec to 60 and all that torque and acceleration through gears that only those driving 2.0TDi 170BHP cars can really appreciate - We have an advantage by experience where as anyone choosing coming from pretty standard petrol or diesel vehicles really need to test drive the cars first to not eliminate the GTD out of hand as think they be going around like Miss Daisy due to the GTI comparisons. :wink:
My GTD expectation
1. Very quick in it's own right
2. Great handling which does not comprise a comfortable ride
3. Again with the GTI suit, the interior being a great place to be.
4. Great looking in the GTI suit and them Nogaro !!
5. Minimum 50MPG economy to 60MPG + on a long run.
Understand the GTI has more performance but day to day driving conditions is quite an equaliser and the GTD will be holding it's own as get's about. - So to me it really does boil down to that red stripe and 3 letters that say GTI and how much value the iconic kudos these 2 things bring? Because it does, it has a huge play on heart.
So it is not really too much about performance or economy but more the stigma of not having a GTI that really is hard for people to get over.
Of course the GTI (PP) will seemingly have something over the standard GTI drivers with any head to head having the drivers sneakily looking at the calipers haha
Remember this is all subjective I respect everyone choices without question, I just think the stripe and GTI tag have more sway than the performance and economy issues do - to feel inferior is a high hurdle :wink:
100% spot on couldn't agree more.
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Um something I worked out with my mk6: on less than 20k miles close to it mind.
Interesting (well to some anyway) that if fuel was the same price (which it hasnt been for the past three years):
GTD:
50000miles / 50mpg (approx) = 1000 gallons of fuel
1000 gallons * 4.55 litres = 4550 litres of fuel
4550 litres * £1.40 = £6370 worth of fuel
If I had bought a GTI:
50000miles / 35mpg (approx) = 1428.5 gallons of fuel
1428.5 gallons * 4.55 litres = 6500 litres of fuel
6500 litres * £1.33 = £8645 worth of fuel
GTD:
50000miles / 60mpg (approx) = £5308
If I had bought a GTI:
50000miles / 40mpg (approx) = £7564
If I had bought a GTI:
50000miles / 30mpg (approx) = £10085
Potential Real World Mk6 figures, I wish I had a run in mk7 GTD to try and my normal trip to work.
(http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3713/9211731414_26560887e0_c.jpg) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/techie_ali/9211731414/)
73mpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/techie_ali/9211731414/) by Techie_Ali (http://www.flickr.com/people/techie_ali/), on Flickr
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That's a fine rave there mjh_056, some very valid points, but screams of self-justification! GTI is more than just 3 letters and some red trim, but this has been done to death already!
As a private buyer who is keeping the car for a long time, and who does very low mileage (7,000 miles a year on average), the difference in fuel costs is not a significant factor for me.
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Jimble/Doc
TDI section???
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If I did low mileage I would have a mk6 GTI, I am glad that I didn't as I am financially better off, even to the point where I can actually afford to decide if I want to change again. But in reality the mk7 is just too much of a price hike and the mileage I do it would lose £16,000 in 3yrs. Which is pretty much what the mk6 GTD has lost.
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That's a fine rave there mjh_056, some very valid points, but screams of self-justification! GTI is more than just 3 letters and some red trim, but this has been done to death already!
As a private buyer who is keeping the car for a long time, and who does very low mileage (7,000 miles a year on average), the difference in fuel costs is not a significant factor for me.
No justification from me, as like you I have convincing personal circumstance - Like said, it is all so personal, so not judging anyone just throwing it out there as pretty sure it has some validity in what is really the barrier for some and particularly those who would probably benefit from GTD due to their regular mileage.
If it was a straight decision I would have gone for a GTI without question, 100%! and the Iconic status would have played a large part as well as the additional performance that not denying at but it would have been base manual 3 door model at high personal cost - Due to concessions I get 5 door loaded DSG GTD at zero personal cost, so not even a decision for me and more so as I fully understand the performance getting.
Such is the iconic pull to me though as soon as GTD arrives to which wife will drive regularly her Mini Cooper (I hate it! awful thing) is to be sold and a £6-7K MK5 GTI will replace it that will do relatively low mileage so I will likely be on other forums seeking a well loved one.
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Yeah I know your personal circumstances quite well from past posts mjh, and I completely agree with what you have gone for. What makes the GTI even more compelling for me is that a decent chunk of my mileage is travel to and from our remote office and clients, all of which I can claim fuel at 45p per mile.
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Jimble/Doc
TDI section???
Many visiting here and all the reviews are comparing the GTI against GTD (Even though we all know GTI wins head to head with ease as a hot hatch) and to those visiting they are weighing up so many personal intangibles and using everyone knowledge and experience to make as informed choice as can.
Unfortunately the days when MPG was not an issue are long gone and to many it is a consideration now and I think this is a good thread to not only compare the two but also highlight the fact the GTI actually is not just a true hot hatch but is pretty good in MPG stakes also.
In purist sense the GTI should be only car in this section and GTD shipped out but fact is there is many who are interested in such comparisons.
Think this is great forum, plenty of banter, respect and hugely knowledgeable and informative posts with anyone spending enough time here being able to not make anything less than the best choice possible :)
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Yeah I know your personal circumstances quite well from past posts mjh, and I completely agree with what you have gone for. What makes the GTI even more compelling for me is that a decent chunk of my mileage is travel to and from our remote office and clients, all of which I can claim fuel at 45p per mile.
I have a fuel card so no such benefits, that is a very good one and again for you makes it a no brainer!! Any vacancies?! :wink:
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45p a mile isn't all for fuel, it's for miles on the car and tyre wear, contribution towards having a service sooner because of those miles etc the whole cost of running a car. For me i'd be reimbursing myself 20p per mile for fuel with a GTI and saving 25p per mile to grow into a lump sum towards the next car when additional mileage accrued for business purposes eats into your p/x value (unless business miles are pretty small over the year).
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45p a mile isn't all for fuel, it's for miles on the car and tyre wear, contribution towards having a service sooner because of those miles etc the whole cost of running a car. For me i'd be reimbursing myself 20p per mile for fuel with a GTI and saving 25p per mile to grow into a lump sum towards the next car when additional mileage accrued for business purposes eats into your p/x value (unless business miles are pretty small over the year).
I see that now, brings it down a little as some is for wear and tear - always had a card so never claimed so was not aware of that, another thing learnt :)
Personal minefield these days making a decision!
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Jimble/Doc
TDI section???
Many visiting here and all the reviews are comparing the GTI against GTD (Even though we all know GTI wins head to head with ease as a hot hatch) and to those visiting they are weighing up so many personal intangibles and using everyone knowledge and experience to make as informed choice as can.
Unfortunately the days when MPG was not an issue are long gone and to many it is a consideration now and I think this is a good thread to not only compare the two but also highlight the fact the GTI actually is not just a true hot hatch but is pretty good in MPG stakes also.
In purist sense the GTI should be only car in this section and GTD shipped out but fact is there is many who are interested in such comparisons.
Think this is great forum, plenty of banter, respect and hugely knowledgeable and informative posts with anyone spending enough time here being able to not make anything less than the best choice possible :)
We might have a TDI section down the road a little but as with the mk6 section most of the discussion go's on in the main board so we'll see.
All the talk of a GTI not getting in excess of 40mpg is rubbish, my mk6 will easily do 45mpg on a motorway run at around the speed limit, if your going to do 80+ then of course it's going to suffer and btw i would beware what you write on a public forum with regards to speeding....
Yes i like to give the car some stick now and again but i also appreciate the fact that i can get a decent distance from a tank of fuel,
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45p a mile isn't all for fuel, it's for miles on the car and tyre wear, contribution towards having a service sooner because of those miles etc the whole cost of running a car. For me i'd be reimbursing myself 20p per mile for fuel with a GTI and saving 25p per mile to grow into a lump sum towards the next car when additional mileage accrued for business purposes eats into your p/x value (unless business miles are pretty small over the year).
I see that now, brings it down a little as some is for wear and tear - always had a card so never claimed so was not aware of that, another thing learnt :)
Personal minefield these days making a decision!
Was commuting Cambridge to Durham each week for a while and got 50p per mile back, mostly for depreciation.
Anyway, with the new variable cam timing the GTI should be able to make good use of high octane fuel to get better efficiency and performance. From that article posted a while back it seems without this tech the high octane has less effect.
To the posts way back calculating GTI fuel cost vs GTD to assume 33mpg or similar for the GTI is loading the deck against it. I'll get 40 minimum without driving all that sensibly or I'll eat my hat! I get this on my current car which is much older, with a smaller engine, slightly worse efficiency and only 5 speed (I commute on A14 so the GTI will be much more suited to me, no more running my engine hard).
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btw i would beware what you write on a public forum with regards to speeding....
Are you a copper James? :whistle:
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45p a mile isn't all for fuel, it's for miles on the car and tyre wear, contribution towards having a service sooner because of those miles etc the whole cost of running a car. For me i'd be reimbursing myself 20p per mile for fuel with a GTI and saving 25p per mile to grow into a lump sum towards the next car when additional mileage accrued for business purposes eats into your p/x value (unless business miles are pretty small over the year).
I know it's not all for fuel, it's for all you said. Like I said though, in total I only do around 7 - 8k miles a year, so the "service" contribution from the apportioned business miles isn't that great, certainly not relative to what I put away in savings each month.
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btw i would beware what you write on a public forum with regards to speeding....
Are you a copper James? :whistle:
Maybe....... :whistle: