GolfGTIforum.co.uk
Model specific boards => Golf mk7 => Topic started by: master_hayabusa on 22 April 2013, 15:37
-
Does anyone know if the adaptive chassis control (ACC) in normal mode is the same as a standard GTI's normal mode? In other words if two cars were identical but one had ACC (set in normal mode) would they feel the same?
The reason I ask is because in both the autoexpress and whatcar reviews they both had them fitted. And now I'm wondering if ACC in normal mode improves ride over a standard gti chassis.
-
Does anyone know if the adaptive chassis control (ACC) in normal mode is the same as a standard GTI's normal mode? In other words if two cars were identical but one had ACC (set in normal mode) would they feel the same?
The reason I ask is because in both the autoexpress and whatcar review they both had them fitted. And now I'm wondering if ACC in normal mode improves ride over a standard gti chassis.
Also, any word from anyone on ACC coming as standard or is it still an option?
-
Does anyone know if the adaptive chassis control (ACC) in normal mode is the same as a standard GTI's normal mode? In other words if two cars were identical but one had ACC (set in normal mode) would they feel the same?
The reason I ask is because in both the autoexpress and whatcar reviews they both had them fitted. And now I'm wondering if ACC in normal mode improves ride over a standard gti chassis.
ACC in normal mode "should" be better than a regular GTI, because it is constantly adjusting the shocks. In a regular GTI the suspension is fixed.
-
I have it on my Scirocco (came as standard spec) and ACC is quite different from a standard chassis set up.
Read here:
http://www.volkswagen.co.uk/technology/braking-and-stability-systems/acc
However, I won't be specifying it on my new GTD as I feel the £800 cost isn't worth it - others will disagree :wink:
-
I've had it on both my Sciroccos definitely not worth 800. I must change the setting about once a month for five minutes when having a hoke. You will never get the money back at resale...
-
I've had it on both my Sciroccos definitely not worth 800. I must change the setting about once a month for five minutes when having a hoke. You will never get the money back at resale...
But if you have it on both the Sciroccos how can you tell the difference? I don't mean putting it in comfort or sport mode, just leaving it in normal. Have you driven a Scirocco without ACC to compare?
-
I've had it on both my Sciroccos definitely not worth 800. I must change the setting about once a month for five minutes when having a hoke. You will never get the money back at resale...
But if you have it on both the Sciroccos how can you tell the difference? I don't mean putting it in comfort or sport mode, just leaving it in normal. Have you driven a Scirocco without ACC to compare?
Only the 122ps Scirocco don't come with it as standard, i've driven a mk6 gti with standard springs for the last 3 years and although very good it can become a little tiresome on poor surfaces when pootling, i've driven 3 scirocco's with it, my brother had a 1.4tsi and now has a bluemotion diesel and imo it is definatlely worth the £765, i've also driven a Roc R and left it in sport which imo makes that car a bit of a weapon!! :drool:
-
I've had it on both my Sciroccos definitely not worth 800. I must change the setting about once a month for five minutes when having a hoke. You will never get the money back at resale...
But if you have it on both the Sciroccos how can you tell the difference? I don't mean putting it in comfort or sport mode, just leaving it in normal. Have you driven a Scirocco without ACC to compare?
Only the 122ps Scirocco don't come with it as standard, i've driven a mk6 gti with standard springs for the last 3 years and although very good it can become a little tiresome on poor surfaces when pootling, i've driven 3 scirocco's with it, my brother had a 1.4tsi and now has a bluemotion diesel and imo it is definatlely worth the £765, i've also driven a Roc R and left it in sport which imo makes that car a bit of a weapon!! :drool:
Cheers mate. Ye it does seem like something worth getting for poor roads and speed breakers.
-
Found this really in depth article on it too :)
http://www.my-gti.com/2653/volkswagen-dcc-adaptive-chassis-control-design-and-function
-
No fair point I have never driven a Scirocco without it. It's more that I never make use of any other setting than Normal. Maybe I don't realise the benefit of the tech. I can only hope it's as close to normal springs as you can get :smiley:
-
Fantastic system. Would always spec it or look for it on a used example. Worth it for comfort alone, it's like having two cars.
-
No fair point I have never driven a Scirocco without it. It's more that I never make use of any other setting than Normal. Maybe I don't realise the benefit of the tech. I can only hope it's as close to normal springs as you can get :smiley:
As mentioned earlier though, even in normal the suspension is being constantly monitored and adjusted to your driving and road conditions, normal shocks are just that.. Normal.
-
The DCC on the new GTI is futher improved and specifically tuned for the GTI :)
DCC
A second generation DCC dynamic chassis control system is at work in the Golf GTI. DCC offers the three driving modes “Comfort”, “Normal” and “Sport”, which are now selected and displayed under “Driving profile selector” on the touchscreen of the centre console. Besides offering a “Normal” mode, the DCC system, which was specially tuned for the GTI, now offers the “Comfort” mode, which is indeed comfort-oriented but still reflects typical GTI properties. In “Sport” mode, especially dynamic and agile handling is implemented. In the “Individual” driving profile, the DCC mode can even be configured with any other desired driving profile properties.
The DCC system adaptively regulates the damper valves via a further developed and refined Volkswagen control algorithm which sets the damper characteristic. In doing so, DCC evaluates input signals from wheel displacement sensors and accelerometers as well as vehicle bus information from the Chassis-CAN bus. It then computes the optimal damper force for every driving situation and adaptively adjusts this force. Damping forces are selectively applied to the four wheels individually.
In the new DCC generation, it is now also possible to fully independently vary rebound and compression damping for transverse dynamic manoeuvres – a significant benefit in optimising vehicle dynamics. The damper valves were also modified for further improved response.
Driving profile selector. The Golf GTI is now available with a driving profile selector for the first time. A total of four programmes are available, and in conjunction with DCC (dynamic chassis control) five driving programmes: Eco, Sport, Normal, Individual, and in combination with DCC the additional Comfort. In the Eco driving profile, the engine controller, air conditioning and other auxiliary units are controlled for optimal fuel economy. In addition, vehicles with the optional dual-clutch gearbox (DSG) have an additional coasting function in Eco mode; when the driver releases the accelerator pedal – e.g. when slowing down to a traffic light or in route segments with descents – the DSG disengages and the engine idles. This enables optimal utilisation of the kinetic energy of the Golf. In “Sport” mode, on the other hand, damping is increased (which further reduces movements of the body structure) and engine response and shift points of the DSG are configured to be even more dynamic.
-
I don't know if this is similar to Audi Magnetic Ride.
Had that on my TT and was very disappointed.
Wouldn't bother again
-
Any maintenance issues with this for those who've had it on a Mk6/Rocco?
-
None it worked without issue..
-
Any maintenance issues with this for those who've had it on a Mk6/Rocco?
Worked flawlessly for three and a half years! So I can't complain.
The thing is a do rate the system but I can't stomach paying another £795 for it. As it came as standard spec in my Scirocco.
TBH I leave it in Comfort 55%, Normal 40% and Sport 5% due to bad road surfaces, tyre roar and pot holes.
-
I've had 2 Rocs and my first Roc had big failures of the ACC system in 2 consecutive winters, starting up the car at sub-zero temperatures. The selector button flashed and the ride was like a bag of hammers. After the car had warmed up you could turn the ignition off and then back on and the fault was gone. Apparently some sensory failure in each case, not had issue with the current Roc's ACC.
-
Without this option can you still choose steering and accelerator settings?
-
yes through the driver profile.
-
Ive just had an email from my dealer and he has listed this in my spec by error even though i didnt ask for it, should i keep it in im not sure, or save the cash?
-
Are you sure they mean ACC (a £795 option) as opposed to the Aircon or ADC (adaptive distance control radar thingy) which are both standard?
I have venhemently argued against ACC and PP... but I caved and added them in the end.
Seems like these are the arguments in favour:
- If you want to remap later (PP more than ACC)
- If you plan to put it on a track or otherwise push the car
- Adds to resell, unlike most options
- Can make the car a much better ride, especially on rough roads
And against:
- Costly
- Everyday driving its debatable if you'll see a difference
-
Yes its the Acc as the cost was listed alongside :cool:
Ive gone for it, i live in the countryside, the roads are pretty bad here in most places, going to be fun,,, :evil:
-
Yes its the Acc as the cost was listed alongside :cool:
Ive gone for it, i live in the countryside, the roads are pretty bad here in most places, going to be fun,,, :evil:
If you can afford it the ACC is probably not such a bad idea, I've come around to like it. The PP I'm still not sure about, but I couldn't very well argue for one and against the other so I grabbed it this afternoon. My bank balance is gonna be well into the red. I'm secretly praying that my order will be delayed until September so I can cash another pay cheque or two!
-
To be fair, a lot of it is how you feel driving the car, not necessarily how the car feels, if that makes sense. It's a major purchase and one I plan on keeping for at least as long as I have my current GTI. Having DCC does make a difference in sport vs comfort, and I'm sure the PP will come into it's own in poor/sloppy road conditions and of course when you give it a boot out of the corners.
-
I've been thinking of adding the adaptive chassis control to my gtd order. both the salesman and the sales manager where I'm buying from have both said its a waste of money. surprising considering they are in the business to sell cars and options but very refreshing and honest.
-
agree with Gryzor here. I intend keeping the car for at least 4-5 years (if not longer), and i know that if i had skimped on an option now, i would regret it and look into ways of retrofitting it. That's why Ive gone a little mad with the options, so that it's totally equipped and i can then fully enjoy it. If you can afford it, why not ?
-
Damn it Norbreck :laugh: ive too and froed about ordering it and then finally decided not to. Now after reading your post im back in two minds. i intend to keep my gtd for at least 5 years (I said the same about the R Line Tiguan and thats going after 9 months!) I dont want to start going down retro fit routes and I suspect you probably cant with the adaptive chassis control anyway. Does it make that much difference having the chassis control??
-
Damn it Norbreck :laugh: ive too and froed about ordering it and then finally decided not to. Now after reading your post im back in two minds. i intend to keep my gtd for at least 5 years (I said the same about the R Line Tiguan and thats going after 9 months!) I dont want to start going down retro fit routes and I suspect you probably cant with the adaptive chassis control anyway. Does it make that much difference having the chassis control??
There have been a few posts from chaps who had mk6 without ACC and say the car is great with or without it, but mostly they'd spec it this time round. Roc drivers get it as standard and say the car is great, but we have nothing to compare to in this case. Hard to know. The reviewers rate ACC and PP very highly, but again they haven't been driving both with and without (or they are keeping it quiet if they have) so how do they know?
I think its like Gryzor says, you want to feel happy with your choice. So if you'll regret it I'd say get it even if the sales guy is right about it not being worth it. If the cost is too high then stay clear, you don't want to be feeling like you were ripped off.
Logically the ACC and even more so the PP will not be of any real use to 99% of your driving. But if you want to go flying around corners and know you are doing so in a car no rival can do better then grab PP, and if you want to know you're driving a car that can do sporty and super comfort at the flick of a button grab ACC.
EDIT:
This post and the thread in general have quite a few experiences of ACC posted:
http://www.golfgtiforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=252900.msg2319977#msg2319977
-
Damn it Norbreck :laugh: ive too and froed about ordering it and then finally decided not to. Now after reading your post im back in two minds. i intend to keep my gtd for at least 5 years (I said the same about the R Line Tiguan and thats going after 9 months!) I dont want to start going down retro fit routes and I suspect you probably cant with the adaptive chassis control anyway. Does it make that much difference having the chassis control??
Sorry bud :grin: :grin:
To be honest, I wasn't going to tick this option, as the system in my Scirocco is very subtle, however as the roads round my way are so damn poor, I thought the GTD with its 18" alloys and lowered suspension, might need a little hand every now and then.
Also the system on the MK7 Golf is he newer mk2 version of ACC and is supposed to be much improved over the mk1 system installed in the Scirocco and MK6 Golf platforms ?
Andrew
-
Also the system on the MK7 Golf is he newer mk2 version of ACC and is supposed to be much improved over the mk1 system installed in the Scirocco and MK6 Golf platforms ?
I did not know this. What they change?
On second thoughts its probably more of an 'evolution' than a change I guess.
-
I'm going for a test drive in a mk 7 with acc tomorrow with the intention of adding it to my order. Will it increase the wait seeing as though I don't have a confirmed build date yet?
-
I'm going for a test drive in a mk 7 with acc tomorrow with the intention of adding it to my order. Will it increase the wait seeing as though I don't have a confirmed build date yet?
Cool, keep an open mind as the car you drive will have have softer springs than the GTI/GTD.
-
I'm going for a test drive in a mk 7 with acc tomorrow with the intention of adding it to my order. Will it increase the wait seeing as though I don't have a confirmed build date yet?
I'd check with the dealer, but as I understand it you can make changes up until confirmed build week. So I think you're good to go at least until week 22.
-
Also the system on the MK7 Golf is he newer mk2 version of ACC and is supposed to be much improved over the mk1 system installed in the Scirocco and MK6 Golf platforms ?
I did not know this. What they change?
On second thoughts its probably more of an 'evolution' than a change I guess.
Bill, I've got some information on it at work in one of the self study manuals I downloaded. I'll pop some details up tomorrow for you.
-
Awesome, cheers!
-
I already posted that it's 2nd gen. Here you go bear...
A second generation DCC dynamic chassis control system is at work in the Golf GTI. DCC offers the three driving modes “Comfort”, “Normal” and “Sport”, which are now selected and displayed under “Driving profile selector” on the touchscreen of the centre console. Besides offering a “Normal” mode, the DCC system, which was specially tuned for the GTI, now offers the “Comfort” mode, which is indeed comfort-oriented but still reflects typical GTI properties. In “Sport” mode, especially dynamic and agile handling is implemented. In the “Individual” driving profile, the DCC mode can even be configured with any other desired driving profile properties.
In the new DCC generation, it is now also possible to fully independently vary rebound and compression damping for transverse dynamic manoeuvres – a significant benefit in optimising vehicle dynamics. The damper valves were also modified for further improved response.
-
As he said :wink:
-
Cheers chaps, sounds good!
-
Been for a drive of a 62 plate scirocco gt diesel with 19" alloys with acc. Must say I wasn't blown away with the acc but did notice how fantasticly quiet it was over bumps and pot holes, and that was on all settings. Didn't like the comfort seeing on a motorway at all as I felt it wallowed/rebounded too much. Can still change my order with no cost implications up until build day.
-
Can still change my order with no cost implications up until build day.
The dealer says that? Over in this other thread VW are saying that and changes made after today will trigger a full repricing at the new price level. So if you want to change your order it will be cheapest to do so today.
http://www.golfgtiforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=252146.msg2321198#msg2321198
-
There is definitely some mismatch between what some of us are being told, which pretty much sums up everything else experienced so far! You watch, when our cars arrive they will be nothing like what we hoped! :grin:
-
As long as they don't turn up looking like Honda Civics. I hate it when that happens.
(for context: http://www.dontevenreply.com/view.php?post=107)
-
As long as they don't turn up looking like Honda Civics. I hate it when that happens.
(for context: http://www.dontevenreply.com/view.php?post=107)
Haha! Urgh, the Civic is one ugly car, made even worse with its recent facelift!
-
All your doing is changing an option. Your not actually ordering a new one. Salesman said this happened a few years ago but dealers complained and VW did the orders as agreed. You shouldn't get penalised for amending your order.
-
I agree, it's crazy, and at the very most all you should do is get charged the higher rate on the new option added, not the whole damn car and existing options!
-
gryzor - are you getting adaptive chassis control on yours?
-
Yes I am.
-
I can't decide whether to go for it or not?
-
I can't decide whether to go for it or not?
Spin a coin? :whistle:
What is your location? Many bumpy surfaces? Plan any track driving?
I'm still sceptical its really needed, but yeah I added it.
This might help pursuade you to pick it:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=96fxpepWb7w
If you want the opposite article consider that there is little to no evidence that it makes any noticeable difference. So why would you pay another 800?
-
Definitely no track driving and I suppose the roads are no worse or better than other areas. Without driving the mk7 I don't really know what the suspension is like. the last golf I had was a 2004 GT TDI.
-
For what it's worth, I took a GT out with DCC on, and while it did make a difference between the modes (especially at lower speeds over humps and stuff) it wasn't a massive difference, but then why would it be? However, it did definitely soften the car up in comfort mode. What I didn't do is take a standard GT out with no DCC to do a comparison.
The DCC in the GTI is meant to be a new 2nd generation tweaked specifically for the GTI. So, by all accounts it should be pretty good. DCC isn't just about making the car more comfortable, it's about making it feel more connected to the road.
Whether you go for it or not depends on how much regret you think you might feel if you don't. It's for that reason I went for the PP and Heated Screen options today. I'm keeping my car for a long while too, so it had to be right in my mind!
-
I'm planning on keeping mine for a good few years too. never had it on a car before so what I don't know won't hurt supposedly haha
-
There's a lot of merit to the old, "you can't miss what you never had" argument! But, what can I say? I love my gadgets and toys! :grin:
-
the thing that's making me really think about it is even in normal mode it doesn't behave like a car without DCC. its constantly doing it's thing no matter what mode it's in so even if I left in in normal mode it should in theory be better than normal shock absorbers.
-
the thing that's making me really think about it is even in normal mode it doesn't behave like a car without DCC. its constantly doing it's thing no matter what mode it's in so even if I left in in normal mode it should in theory be better than normal shock absorbers.
Yup. :)
-
The more you contemplate it, the more you'll want it, and if you don't get it, the more you'll regret it! There is only one solution! Remember, the placebo effect is very real, and very powerful ;) Even if you just think the car is better, then it will be!
-
I feel like asking which way you want to be convinced, then we'll throw all those arguments at you so you can feel happy when you inevitably make the choice. :whistle:
But seriously, you can go either way. There is, if we're honest, no actual evidence to say that the normal GTI is in any way not awesome or that the DCC GTI is clearly better. Obviously it won't hurt to add DCC but if any of us are looking for a proper informed and objective decision about is it worth the near 800 squids the VW boys want off you, or would it be a bad choice to miss out then, no one has that information. Even the journalists who've driven the cars don't. They haven't driven all the possible options, and even if some eventually do they have all the confirmation bias in the world to ensure they can't give an objective opinion, let alone a quantitative one.
In the end I picked it because I don't want to be riding on a rough surface and think, 'damn, should have got DCC'. Secondly I like playing around with options and I know I'll feel a little sad to play with the software and think that the guys who got PP and DCC have even MORE toys to play with. Is that worth the £1750 for PP and DCC? Probably no, but the money is unreal to me right now as the payment isn't due for 2-3 months and since part of it is coming from a loan the per month cost didn't go up much. Financially that was impulsive and maybe irresponsible, but hey, its fun to splurge occasionally!
I'm probably not helping right? :embarrassed:
-
It's simple really. If you can afford it, and are otherwise secure and sensible with money, why not go for it? The only person you need to make happy is yourself, not the other people on this forum :) I'm glad I've gone for them, for my own reasons that are much like yours.
-
Another thing is its the 2nd generation DCC on the mk 7 so if I thought the 1st generation one gave a good smooth ride then the new one should be even better. It's nice to get real world opinions sometimes and I was happy with my previous cars without DCC. Comes a point though when a little comfort is needed for sedate jaunts and the DCC will give me that option. The 5 year extended warranty will give me piece of mind on the tech breaking too. Cheers fellas, Chris
-
the thing that's making me really think about it is even in normal mode it doesn't behave like a car without DCC. its constantly doing it's thing no matter what mode it's in so even if I left in in normal mode it should in theory be better than normal shock absorbers.
The mode that is most like a car without ACC/DCC is "Sport". This is the mode where the damping is fixed (or does it have very limited adjustment?) at the hard end of the ACC adjustment range. "Normal" is anything but, although on the Roc it errs on the hard end of the adjustment spectrum most of the time. I actually never use "Normal", I either keep it in the comfort setting or the sport setting. I suspect that "sport" is a little softer than a plain sprung VW with lowered sports suspension, it's definitely less harsh than my old MK5 Golf 170TDI on 17" wheels - maybe that is just down to refinement advances which should be even better on a MK7 Golf than on a Scirocco.