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Model specific boards => Golf mk3 => Topic started by: stainesy on 02 May 2012, 20:36

Title: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: stainesy on 02 May 2012, 20:36
ok took my side skirts and arches off today to have a real good look for rot. and the sills seem solid apart from where they meet the rear arch.
what i want to no is how structural is the bit where i have rot?
i am on a very tight budget and can not afford to have welding done. is it safe to drive as it is till i get the cash to have it sorted?
tomorrow i am going to sand it back and put rust converter on it to stop the rot.
the sills all the way down the side are fine its just a hole at the end inside the rear arches.

a mechanic mate of mine said to just treat it, fill it will expanding foam, trim foam to the shape them fibreglass it but i aint doing that if its structural  :grin:

(http://i1189.photobucket.com/albums/z430/slammed_golf/531209_3562237731252_1132106970_33313912_952870598_n.jpg)
(http://i1189.photobucket.com/albums/z430/slammed_golf/295057_3562238571273_1132106970_33313913_171938858_n.jpg)
(http://i1189.photobucket.com/albums/z430/slammed_golf/564917_3562239891306_1132106970_33313914_175986813_n.jpg)
(http://i1189.photobucket.com/albums/z430/slammed_golf/559464_3562241691351_1132106970_33313915_1463745511_n.jpg)
(http://i1189.photobucket.com/albums/z430/slammed_golf/523897_3562243931407_1132106970_33313916_1598525809_n.jpg)
(http://i1189.photobucket.com/albums/z430/slammed_golf/149698_3576424765919_1132106970_33320974_736532508_n.jpg)
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: CJA321 on 02 May 2012, 20:45
It will fail an MOT for structure put it that way as its 30cm from a jack point.. Dont fill it with expanding foam, will make it a total ball ache when you actaully go to weld it.

As to say how safe it is to drive, tbh... The state MK3's are anyway i wouldnt think it would make much differance, but i wouldnt like to say especially with kids involved
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: Luke1981 on 02 May 2012, 20:49
If the jacking points are solid I would just treat it as you have stated. Prob won't get picked up on an MOT if the rust is treated and cleared up properly.I bet your arse was twitching when removing the trim?  :grin:
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: daz veedub on 02 May 2012, 20:52
oh dear thought u said u checked everywhere before buying 
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: CJA321 on 02 May 2012, 20:52
If the jacking points are solid I would just treat it as you have stated. Prob won't get picked up on an MOT if the rust is treated and cleared up properly.I bet your arse was twitching when removing the trim?  :grin:

Tester would have to pritty blind to miss a hole in the inner wheel arch  :tongue: :lipsrsealed:
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: stainesy on 02 May 2012, 20:54
yep i removed that bit first and thought oh fcuk. but luckily its just the rear ends of the sills and the rest is solid.
the rear jacking point on one side was bent up but i have hammered it back into place and is fine now.
been over the hole car now and these are the only bits of rust.
so how stuctual are they? i mean what could actully happen if these bits are treated and not welded with new bits whats could actully happen
will the car fold in half?  :grin:
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: Gavv8 on 02 May 2012, 20:57
It could be a lot worse but i'd try and get it all welded up asap as i can't see it passing the mot like that as that rot at the back is very close to a main structural load point, considering how bad some mk3's can get it's far from a catastrophe.
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: CJA321 on 02 May 2012, 20:58
yep i removed that bit first and thought oh fcuk. but luckily its just the rear ends of the sills and the rest is solid.
the rear jacking point on one side was bent up but i have hammered it back into place and is fine now.
been over the hole car now and these are the only bits of rust.
so how stuctual are they? i mean what could actully happen if these bits are treated and not welded with new bits whats could actully happen
will the car fold in half?  :grin:

Not really... You could do a pritty good job of hiding it tbh... But i personally I use a magnet along the sills of older cars to check if they have been botched or look suspicious for an MOT.

wont fold in half  :grin: Rot might get worse thou, Id just get it welded instead of doing a botch job though. Your mechanic friend must know a welder in his line of work? then get it done on a casher  :wink:
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: Luke1981 on 02 May 2012, 21:02
If the jacking points are solid I would just treat it as you have stated. Prob won't get picked up on an MOT if the rust is treated and cleared up properly.I bet your arse was twitching when removing the trim?  :grin:

Tester would have to pritty blind to miss a hole in the inner wheel arch  :tongue: :lipsrsealed:

That will teach me to look at the photos instead of just the text  :embarassed:

Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: stainesy on 02 May 2012, 21:03
Yeah I will be getting it welded and mot isn't for a long time yet.
But is it safe to drive is the question?
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: stainesy on 02 May 2012, 21:07
oh dear thought u said u checked everywhere before buying 

i did have a good look at the sills. them end bits were under a thick coat of underseal i peels off to have a good look
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: CJA321 on 02 May 2012, 21:09
Yeah I will be getting it welded and mot isn't for a long time yet.
But is it safe to drive is the question?

Well its just going to get worse thats the only thing, you can treat it now, and use expanding foam, but when you come to weld it, it will turn into a ball ache because of all the foam etc. So kinda sticky situation  :tongue:

Well it is structurally weakened, personally i would drive it, but it depends how big you are on saftey etc, but tbh, welded or not i wouldnt think it would make that much differance
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: stainesy on 02 May 2012, 21:12
my plan is to just treat and drive it till i get the cash to have it welded. not going to foam it.
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: CJA321 on 02 May 2012, 21:15
my plan is to just treat and drive it till i get the cash to have it welded. not going to foam it.


Just go for that then, you can only do what you can afford  :smiley:
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: Wayne on 02 May 2012, 22:03
It needs sorting asap and will be a lot weaker as is.
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: stainesy on 02 May 2012, 22:49
It needs sorting asap and will be a lot weaker as is.

Weaker in what situation?
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: tshirt2k on 02 May 2012, 22:52
Yea it's a common fault. Looks like the inner skin section needs fixing also. I used the rear section of a sill repair panel to fix mine.

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v458/tshirt2k/16vt%20project/b10e8102.jpg)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v458/tshirt2k/16vt%20project/e99409a2.jpg)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v458/tshirt2k/16vt%20project/9ffc26c2.jpg)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v458/tshirt2k/16vt%20project/e17378ef.jpg)
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: search on 02 May 2012, 23:11
sorry to jump on your thread but would this need welding to or can i treat it another way?
(http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k34/xsjado-man/578639_10150860669135491_753170490_12199108_1135949012_n.jpg)
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: stainesy on 02 May 2012, 23:15
Yea it's a common fault. Looks like the inner skin section needs fixing also. I used the rear section of a sill repair panel to fix mine.

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v458/tshirt2k/16vt%20project/b10e8102.jpg)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v458/tshirt2k/16vt%20project/e99409a2.jpg)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v458/tshirt2k/16vt%20project/9ffc26c2.jpg)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v458/tshirt2k/16vt%20project/e17378ef.jpg)

How much are sill repair kits? Did you do the welding yourself mate?
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: CJA321 on 02 May 2012, 23:23
Its just sill pannels iirc. Then cut them to fit. You checked all the rubber bungs underneath and on inside sill/floor. Just thought if its bad there what like elsewere
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: stainesy on 02 May 2012, 23:36
Its just sill pannels iirc. Then cut them to fit. You checked all the rubber bungs underneath and on inside sill/floor. Just thought if its bad there what like elsewere

Yeah iv checked all the runner bungs under the car and they are all ok.
Where's the best place to get a panel for that rear bit I need doing?
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: CJA321 on 02 May 2012, 23:49
Well i just searched golf mk3 sill on ebay. Theres afew replacemant skins on there, but need cutting etc. Or any motor factor usually sell bodypanels etc
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: chrisbeg34 on 03 May 2012, 18:47
I am sure when I did m astra I got the skin from milehams mate
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: kahunajb on 03 May 2012, 19:02
You can get replacement sills from eurowagens which are fairly cheap and supposed to be good quality but as its only the end bit it might work out cheaper for the body shop to just fabricate something.
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: Gti_Jamo on 03 May 2012, 19:04
Surely you would be better getting wheel arch repair panels as they come with that end of the sill and the bottom section of the arch. I got mine of ebay they were no more than £30 each posted if I remember correctly. Not really a big job sorting that out but you want to get it done sooner rather than later.
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: stainesy on 03 May 2012, 19:21
Surely you would be better getting wheel arch repair panels as they come with that end of the sill and the bottom section of the arch. I got mine of ebay they were no more than £30 each posted if I remember correctly. Not really a big job sorting that out but you want to get it done sooner rather than later.

yeah i was thinking is that bit the sillm or the wheel arch?
the main problem i have is the cost of somebody welding it up as welding costs a fortune
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: tshirt2k on 03 May 2012, 21:08
If your gonna Play with old dubs, it might be worth investing in a mig welder and teach yourself to weld. Could save you £££

I did all the welding myself.
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: Gavv8 on 03 May 2012, 21:13
If your gonna Play with old dubs, it might be worth investing in a mig welder and teach yourself to weld. Could save you £££

I did all the welding myself.
Good advice, you can get s/h migs quite cheap and its not difficult with practice and actually quite satisfying, i used to do a lot of welding on old rover sd1's and p6's and they were generally much worse that any mk3 is likely to be.
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: stainesy on 03 May 2012, 21:13
If your gonna Play with old dubs, it might be worth investing in a mig welder and teach yourself to weld. Could save you £££

I did all the welding myself.

iv played with old cars for years mate and always had bits done for me. that was before i got mate redundant though  :wink:
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: tshirt2k on 03 May 2012, 21:20
If your gonna Play with old dubs, it might be worth investing in a mig welder and teach yourself to weld. Could save you £££

I did all the welding myself.

iv played with old cars for years mate and always had bits done for me. that was before i got mate redundant though  :wink:

All the reason for doing it yourself then. Having low funds was why I taught myself. Plus I could probably take better care whilst doing the work.
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: stainesy on 03 May 2012, 21:48
If your gonna Play with old dubs, it might be worth investing in a mig welder and teach yourself to weld. Could save you £££

I did all the welding myself.

iv played with old cars for years mate and always had bits done for me. that was before i got mate redundant though  :wink:

All the reason for doing it yourself then. Having low funds was why I taught myself. Plus I could probably take better care whilst doing the work.

thats is very true. would love to be able to weld. its the setting the machine up propply that worries me. havnt got a clue about that
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: Dogbot on 03 May 2012, 22:06
Setting the machine up is tricky but it's just a case of feed speed for the wire an gas pressure, my dad taught me when I was 5, I forgot everything untill I picked up the gun again 2 years ago, try looking at a mig welding forum, lots of help to be had there as I appreciate not everyone has a coded welder to pass on the knowledge, I had me a lil Clarke pro 90 to start with an traded it in for a larger mig, when one came up on sale, just for reference I sold mine for £40, so the deals are out there to be had!! Best of luck, I will be replacing a lower rear quarter soon an will post up an take pictures as I go for you if it might help...
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: Gavv8 on 03 May 2012, 22:15
I had a clarke pro90, good little workhorse that was although a little jerky on the wire feed and it only went when i left it out in the rain by accident.
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: Dogbot on 03 May 2012, 22:18
I had a clarke pro90, good little workhorse that was although a little jerky on the wire feed and it only went when i left it out in the rain by accident.

I too ad that problem with the wire feed, I replaced the gun for a pro one. From a local welding suplies for about £20 an it was beautifully from then on
I only swapped mine because a 150amp larger machine came up brand new, that was also capable of welding ali an it was only £120.... New... Had to be done
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: VW BUSH on 03 May 2012, 22:20
I was a coded welder once upon a time, picked up a welder for the first time in years and blew a hole in the floor :grin:
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: Dogbot on 03 May 2012, 22:29
I was a coded welder once upon a time, picked up a welder for the first time in years and blew a hole in the floor :grin:


Haha it is very easily done!! Especially when the steel is quite thin really when you think that when they teach welding they use half in plates to start with pmsl
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: thai-wronghorse on 04 May 2012, 06:32
Tbf you don't really need to be able to 'weld' properly to carry repairs like this. As long as you've got the plant set low enough you can basically spot the entire seam and simply flat it back before giving it a skim of body filler.
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: Dogbot on 04 May 2012, 08:30
Tbf you don't really need to be able to 'weld' properly to carry repairs like this. As long as you've got the plant set low enough you can basically spot the entire seam and simply flat it back before giving it a skim of body filler.

This is a better way to do it really as it reduces the risk of warping the panels through the heat,
Top tip Thai...
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: Gti_Jamo on 04 May 2012, 11:06
Surely you would be better getting wheel arch repair panels as they come with that end of the sill and the bottom section of the arch. I got mine of ebay they were no more than £30 each posted if I remember correctly. Not really a big job sorting that out but you want to get it done sooner rather than later.

yeah i was thinking is that bit the sillm or the wheel arch?
the main problem i have is the cost of somebody welding it up as welding costs a fortune

They come with the complete wheel arch and about 6 inches of sill. I had done no welding since I was an apprentice bout 10 years ago but took it back up to do my mk3 project. Started off with an easy bit on the rear panel then its was all pretty simple from there on but like said its all in the settings of the welder.
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: stainesy on 04 May 2012, 11:10
you no what i think im defo gona give it ago. there is even a short college evening course down the road from me to learn how to weld. and seeing as iv been made redundant and there is no bloody work around here id probly get the course for free aswell. that is a bloody good idea actuly seeing as how much welders charge lol
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: tshirt2k on 05 May 2012, 00:32
you no what i think im defo gona give it ago. there is even a short college evening course down the road from me to learn how to weld. and seeing as iv been made redundant and there is no bloody work around here id probly get the course for free aswell. that is a bloody good idea actuly seeing as how much welders charge lol

Just buy a welder with gas and start practicing. You don't really need a course. Use the right setting and it should sound like sizzling bacon.  :wink: there are plenty of info on the mig welding website. I prefer to use an argon co2 mix as it stops the spatter a bit and gives a cleaner weld.

I started with a pro90 mig, lasted years and there's only a couple of setting to choose from on the amps.
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: stainesy on 05 May 2012, 07:37
problem im gona have is i will also need a petrol generator as there is no electric in my garage  :cry:
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: Gavv8 on 05 May 2012, 08:12
I would imagine you'll need a fairly beefy generator too, the only other way is acetylene which a different ball game.
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: stainesy on 05 May 2012, 09:02
Exactly you see my problem. My garage is 2 streets away from my house so I can not use electric tools so everything I do has to be by hand or battery powered. U remember when I put Eamonnism's coilovers on for him I had to walk back to my house a few time to keep charging the battery impact gun to try and get his front top mount nuts off as they didn't want to come off and took all the power from the impact gun. Pain in the ars not having electric.
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: Dogbot on 06 May 2012, 19:34
I have the same problem so i made friends with the person who lives behind my garage court, I gives her a tenner for an extension lead to be plugged in to her kitchen for a few hours over the weekend.... Maybe worth a try...
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: stainesy on 07 May 2012, 11:07
yeah im not really gona go knock on a random persons door an d ask to use there electric  :grin:
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: Dogbot on 07 May 2012, 14:37
Well...... I did... An now I have electric in my garage when I need it.  :cool:.. An she makes tea an brings it down with buiscwits.... She's a top neighbour...

If ya don't ask you'll never know pmsl... Wats the worst that can happen... You get told to sod off..

Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: stainesy on 07 May 2012, 18:59
Well...... I did... An now I have electric in my garage when I need it.  :cool:.. An she makes tea an brings it down with buiscwits.... She's a top neighbour...

If ya don't ask you'll never know pmsl... Wats the worst that can happen... You get told to sod off..



the area where i live you knock on strange doors at your own risk  :grin:
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: Dogbot on 07 May 2012, 19:02
Haha thats fair enough dude, to be fair she had popped down previously to complain about my diesel generator making a racket, so I thort why not ask but if it means endangering your life I wouldn't bother either
Title: Re: my sills after taking skirts off.
Post by: eamonnism on 07 May 2012, 19:53
Well...... I did... An now I have electric in my garage when I need it.  :cool:.. An she makes tea an brings it down with buiscwits.... She's a top neighbour...

If ya don't ask you'll never know pmsl... Wats the worst that can happen... You get told to sod off..



the area where i live you knock on strange doors at your own risk  :grin:



+1 (same area)  :grin: