GolfGTIforum.co.uk
Model specific boards => Golf mk5 => Topic started by: nadlad on 08 February 2012, 14:46
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Hi need a bit of info pls,
According to the stats theres not much difference between the gt sport 170 and 140?
Just wondering what your opions are on either the 140 and 170 ave noticed that from 08 onwards the majority of 140s have DPF aswell!
If you had the DPF removed on the 170 then surely its a better car in terms of performance?
Also anyone have any ideas of town driving and related MPG values in the 170?
Thinking of going for the 170 TDI instead!
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140 : Oil balance shaft fails leading to engine failure. Turbos are weak, block is weak, Headgaskets are known to go.
170: Piezo Injectors fail but are under warranty. DPF and related sensors are a pain in the ass.
Do yourself a favor and don't bother with the 2.0 PD TDI.
In my A4 170 I do around 45-50mpg combined mixed driving and thats with no DPF and a hybrid turbo.
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Seen as most MY2008 onwards either 140 or 170 are DPF's, i have budgeted for a dpf removal but just curious as to mpg figures between the two?
does the 170 achieve 55 mpg at a steady 70?
aslong as i get more than 28mpg local thats whats my pd150 does/did
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Are you wanting to tune it? If so 140 as its Bosch controlled ECU the 170 Siemens ECU is so limiting.
Not sure its that high, might be about 50mpg on a level surface at 70mph. I did 660miles to a full tank of motorway driving in the A4 not sure on the tank size though.
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Probably just remap it and that all in terms of engine mods.
Do u think the 140 non DPF would be a better i am not looking at audis as for the age and mileage they are way out of my price range
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Probably just remap it and that all in terms of engine mods.
Do u think the 140 non DPF would be a better i am not looking at audis as for the age and mileage they are way out of my price range
If it just a map then I would be inclined to buy the 170 and De-DPF it at Carbon. What's your budget?
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about 10K looking for an MY2008 though with less than 50K on the clock,
one thing ave noticed in my search is that you dont get a lot of extras actually its fairly basic inside aside from leathers!
Just worried about mileage my mates 140 does silly mileage usually around 55 cruising at 70 was thinkign the 170 woudl be same!
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about 10K looking for an MY2008 though with less than 50K on the clock,
one thing ave noticed in my search is that you dont get a lot of extras actually its fairly basic inside aside from leathers!
Just worried about mileage my mates 140 does silly mileage usually around 55 cruising at 70 was thinkign the 170 woudl be same!
Do remember the figures I have mentioned are that of something that nearly weighs 1450Kg so I assume the Golf weighs less ergo will do better MPG than.
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With your budget and the age of cars you are looking at, I'd save for a bit longer and get a Mk6.
I was in a similar position to you this time last year, looking at late model 170 GT Sports, but in the end decided to work a bit harder, save a bit longer and get the Mk6. You'll struggle to find a cheap GTD, but there are hundreds of 140 GT TDI's to choose from.
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Ad prefer the mk5 as I have about 3k of mods lo
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go for a 170 tdi brilliant car,i've ran one for over 2 years and never missed a beat.You will easily see 55mpg at 70
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I had MK5 GT 170 for just over 4 years. Had problems with the DPF getting blocked once at just over 3 years into ownership. Apart from that, I had 2 faulty central locking control modules - no other problems.
As far as MPG was concerned; used to see upper 40's on a decent run. Must say, I agree with dubber36; I'd go for a MK6. Really liked my MK5 but like my MK6 so much more.
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all the gt sports i see are pretty poverty spec no duel climate, no cruise all you get is leathers!!!
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Look at Audi A3 better spec and built.
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A3's remind me of rep cars
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Look at Audi A3 better spec and built.
^^^ This
A3
TDI
170
Remap
Job done
(http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y276/Rhyso/Audi%20A3/OY57UTM.gif)
Just don't expect 55mpg from one; standard or not. I average between 45 and 48mpg
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rhs: thought the 170s remapped to around 210 the feedback from others seems to be 55 if driven steady and 50 hard just dont get this mpg thing
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rhs: thought the 170s remapped to around 210.
On optimistic dynos yes.
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rhs: thought the 170s remapped to around 210.
On optimistic dynos yes.
And also if you get rid of the DPF. Those claiming 210bhp are living in a fantasy world. That, and mine is tweaked to give more power at the top end
I drive mine fairly steady and the best I've seen from a tank is 49mpg........
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maybe the glfs are slightly better economicaly wise?
Rhyso: Did u remove your dpf or just gut the contents and remap it?
theres a dude on ukmkivs who removed dpf and remap and claims around 55-60 mpg lol
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maybe the glfs are slightly better economicaly wise?
Rhyso: Did u remove your dpf or just gut the contents and remap it?
theres a dude on ukmkivs who removed dpf and remap and claims around 55-60 mpg lol
Same engine so I can't see how.........
I still have the DPF in place :smiley: That's about on its limit; I could get a little bit more but I don't want to push the DPF into crapping itself
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So you still have the dpf ? Do u mean physically ie with the contents gutted or the proper dpf ? If the later why did u leave it on?
I think the audis are better build and although more common there a bit more pricy and smaller then the mk5
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So you still have the dpf ? Do u mean physically ie with the contents gutted or the proper dpf ? If the later why did u leave it on?
I think the audis are better build and although more common there a bit more pricy and smaller then the mk5
Physically in place as it left the factory. If it ain't broke, why fix it? That, and its an experiment to see how long it will last under remap conditions. Problem is I'm bored of the power.......
The A3 sportback is nigh on the same size; if anything its little bigger (body wise). They are built using the same chassis
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I like this thread!!!!
Im currently thinking on a re-maping my gttdi 170 mk5 my dilemma is do i do away with the dpf or not? i have heard so many issues regarding leaving the filter on. Some tunners will not re-map my car with it on. but i'm interested in seeing how long your pdf last before regen!!
Mpg at the mo standard is about 38/40 mpg and thats motorway driving at 60/70 mph which i can live with.
my local tunners in Glasgow offered me a revo remap and Miltek front pipe fitted for £800 then i would just need to get the error codes deleted when the dpf was removed(£50) so i think thats not a bad price?
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The DPF regens when it reaches certain criteria such as pre turbo exhaust temps and fill levels. What prevents the DPF from regenerating is normally a failure in one of the pressure sensors. When this happens the regen doesn't occur so the soot continues to build up in the filter. It will get to a stage where it can't be burned off and cleared
38/40mpg sounds very poor to me; even standard I was getting 45mpg on a trip.
Also don't forget to get your injectors replaced FOC; contact VW Customer services and get them done before they leave you stranded on the side of the road.....
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Mpg at the mo standard is about 38/40 mpg and thats motorway driving at 60/70 mph which i can live with.
Blimey!! :shocked: :shocked:
I get 34-36 doing 60/70 on a motorway and thats in a remapped 2.0T. Very poor MPG figures if you ask me.
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I suppose I was just guessing :undecided:
I know I'm going to fill my tank and actually find out what I get.
I do about 60miles a day motorway driving to and from work.
Yeah car is going in next week for injectors! Can you guys tell me if they just inspect them or change them
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I suppose I was just guessing :undecided:
I know I'm going to fill my tank and actually find out what I get.
I do about 60miles a day motorway driving to and from work.
Yeah car is going in next week for injectors! Can you guys tell me if they just inspect them or change them
I do 60 miles a day too and I get around 500+ miles to a tank; that's sat at 70mph for 90% of the journey
Should change them!! Mine were changed and I know a few with Golf's who have had them done recently too :smiley:
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I currently own a 140 TDi and am very pleased with it. It has great power even though it takes a while to build up.
GT TDi 140 :
50 MPG
£130 Road Tax
Insurance Group 28
0-60 : 9 secs
GT TDi 170 :
45 MPG
£165 Road Tax
Insurance Group 32
0-60 : 7.9 secs
As you can see the TDi 170 is more expensive to run in every way compared to the 140, but you do gain slightly more power. Having said that i've always felt that the 140 engine suits the aesthetics of the car much more than the 170 and is satisfyingly quick for a diesel on normal roads. If money is no object then of course you should choose the 170 every time.
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Having said that i've always felt that the 140 engine suits the aesthetics of the car much more than the 170
Eh??? :huh: :huh:
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rhyso: Who did u get your remap done by
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rhyso: Who did u get your remap done by
Carbon
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Having said that i've always felt that the 140 engine suits the aesthetics of the car much more than the 170
Eh??? :huh: :huh:
Double Eh??? :huh: :huh:
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I have a 140 TDI and easily get 600+ miles from a tank. Often see 58+ MPG on my 22mile trip to work along A14 going 60-70 MPH as traffic allows. Pretty pleased with running costs really.
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Ok took my car for a blast today 300 miles round trip and great news 45mpg, and 170 is so much fun to drive on the west coast of Scotlands roads and to top it off a wee burn with a Audi tt fantastic day out. My mate prefers my 170 to his 140.
:laugh: :laugh:
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Just get a BMW, so much better. . . . . . :lipsrsealed:
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Having said that i've always felt that the 140 engine suits the aesthetics of the car much more than the 170
Eh??? :huh: :huh:
Double Eh??? :huh: :huh:
Haha, yeah sorry please forgive my somewhat biased comment! It's hard to explain. I've driven both the 140 and the 170, it might have been a bad 170 I tried but the 140 felt like more of an all round balanced car, smoother and makes more sense on paper when taking into account the running costs. Hence why I said if you have the money then of course go for the 170 everytime. After reading on here that 170 drivers are getting as low as high 30's to mid 40's on MPG then it starts to run into the same territory as the quick petrol equivalents.
So I guess what i'm saying is I can't afford a 170 TDi and am very jealous so i'll down play it to make me feel better! :laugh:
Just get a BMW, so much better. . . . . . :lipsrsealed:
I've driven a BMW 1 Series M Sport 118D which I guess would be the equivalent of the Golf 140 TDi, while it felt like an excellent car with much better equipment levels you can definitely feel the lower torque and increased bulkiness. Excellent brakes though and much quieter engine noise!
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and u also get the cheap tacky plastic sh!tty dash
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Just get a BMW, so much better. . . . . . :lipsrsealed:
I've driven a BMW 1 Series M Sport 118D which I guess would be the equivalent of the Golf 140 TDi, while it felt like an excellent car with much better equipment levels you can definitely feel the lower torque and increased bulkiness. Excellent brakes though and much quieter engine noise!
I agree the 118d has no torque kit but its very smooth and pulls well all the way to the redline.
The 120d on the other hand has much more low end torque and is much quicker but still gives the same mpg as the 118d.
Beemer diesels are soooo much more refined than bag diesels and the handling knocks socks off the golf/a3...
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I agree the 118d has no torque kit but its very smooth and pulls well all the way to the redline.
The 120d on the other hand has much more low end torque and is much quicker but still gives the same mpg as the 118d.
Beemer diesels are soooo much more refined than bag diesels and the handling knocks socks off the golf/a3...
Definitely. The 120D does have a lot to offer, with performance on par with the Golf 170 and very good running costs. Aux input, climate control, parking sensors and cruise control pretty much standard on the range I was very tempted myself when buying a Golf and in the end it was a decision between the two.
I'll also agree with nadlad above that the BMW's interior leaves something to be desired. Was quite disappointed with the quality of materials used for such a brand. Something the VW wins on.
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140tdi is far more tunable with the bosch ECU, but then again i'm sure the guys tuning these will soon crack on and get some excellent power and drivability out of the 170tdi? but for now my 140 is at 210hp with an hybrid gt1756 CR Turbo, full EGR delete including the cooler and an RSTuning map, southbend SMF daily clutch kit and new head going on so expecting good things, come back from Scotland on Monday 330ml trip and averaged 49mpg :wink:
Darren
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140tdi is far more tunable with the bosch ECU, but then again i'm sure the guys tuning these will soon crack on and get some excellent power and drivability out of the 170tdi? but for now my 140 is at 210hp with an hybrid gt1756 CR Turbo, full EGR delete including the cooler and an RSTuning map, southbend SMF daily clutch kit and new head going on so expecting good things, come back from Scotland on Monday 330ml trip and averaged 49mpg :wink:
Darren
thought you were selling up soon? Howcome you need a new head
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140tdi is far more tunable with the bosch ECU, but then again i'm sure the guys tuning these will soon crack on and get some excellent power and drivability out of the 170tdi? but for now my 140 is at 210hp with an hybrid gt1756 CR Turbo, full EGR delete including the cooler and an RSTuning map, southbend SMF daily clutch kit and new head going on so expecting good things, come back from Scotland on Monday 330ml trip and averaged 49mpg :wink:
Darren
thought you were selling up soon? Howcome you need a new head
Yeh I was going to but couldn't bring myself to it, ended up buying the new clutch and head from Darkside Development,
Early cylinder heads are prone to go porous which mine has! so its getting a new one put on along with new seals, gaskets and bearings plus injector seals and maybe some Bosio uprated injectors?????
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140tdi is far more tunable with the bosch ECU, but then again i'm sure the guys tuning these will soon crack on and get some excellent power and drivability out of the 170tdi? but for now my 140 is at 210hp with an hybrid gt1756 CR Turbo, full EGR delete including the cooler and an RSTuning map, southbend SMF daily clutch kit and new head going on so expecting good things, come back from Scotland on Monday 330ml trip and averaged 49mpg :wink:
Darren
Your car sounds good mate!!
I'm thinking in remaping mine with custom code and a miltek Exhaust dpf removal pipe but don't know what the down side will be as i have heard a few stories about the 170s being temperamental.
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140tdi is far more tunable with the bosch ECU, but then again i'm sure the guys tuning these will soon crack on and get some excellent power and drivability out of the 170tdi? but for now my 140 is at 210hp with an hybrid gt1756 CR Turbo, full EGR delete including the cooler and an RSTuning map, southbend SMF daily clutch kit and new head going on so expecting good things, come back from Scotland on Monday 330ml trip and averaged 49mpg :wink:
Darren
Your car sounds good mate!!
I'm thinking in remaping mine with custom code and a miltek Exhaust dpf removal pipe but don't know what the down side will be as i have heard a few stories about the 170s being temperamental.
170's are only temperamental if they are fitted with a bunch of duff injectors. That and failing sensors on the DPF.
Contact VW and get them swapped out (injectors that is) FOC even if your car is out of warranty :wink:
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140tdi is far more tunable with the bosch ECU, but then again i'm sure the guys tuning these will soon crack on and get some excellent power and drivability out of the 170tdi? but for now my 140 is at 210hp with an hybrid gt1756 CR Turbo, full EGR delete including the cooler and an RSTuning map, southbend SMF daily clutch kit and new head going on so expecting good things, come back from Scotland on Monday 330ml trip and averaged 49mpg :wink:
Darren
Your car sounds good mate!!
I'm thinking in remaping mine with custom code and a miltek Exhaust dpf removal pipe but don't know what the down side will be as i have heard a few stories about the 170s being temperamental.
170's are only temperamental if they are fitted with a bunch of duff injectors. That and failing sensors on the DPF.
Contact VW and get them swapped out FOC even if your car is out of warranty :wink:
Thanks Rhyso you seem to be rite up to date with stuff, My car is going into Vw next week for Injectors and Exhaust is on order so things are looking good for my golf.
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Thanks Rhyso you seem to be rite up to date with stuff, My car is going into Vw next week for Injectors and Exhaust is on order so things are looking good for my golf.
It does help to know about the engines I remap :wink:
Whereabouts are you? I'd highly recommend Carbon if you want the full DPF delete :smiley: Or if you're in the South West then I can help :wink:
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It's a shame Rhyso,
I'm in Glasgow.I have just been trolling the net for information on remaps and upgrades.Scotland don't have much to offer and the name that keeps appearing for up grades etc won't go near the 170 mk5
The thing is I just won't let any one loose on my engine.
There is another garage that are offering a custom code remap and Miltek down pipe fitted for £800
but the remap is a generic one and if I understand it correctly I think it will be too much for my gear box
225 bhp. (allegedly) and the torque increase to around 300 +.I have been told any thing above 200 in my golf and things could start going wrong.
What's your thoughts ?
Where is your place!?
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Little bit far from me then; I'm in South Wales. I'm a mobile remapper for Carbon :smiley:
You got a manual or DSG box?
I've run mine for apporx 10,000 miles now (currently at 42K) and I've had no issues with the clutch / gearbox; as you can see from my graph I'm running some nice numbers :wink: That's a Carbon remap by the way :smiley:
(http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y276/Rhyso/Audi%20A3/OY57UTM.gif)
Plenty of people running 200bhp without issues :smiley: 225bhp seems like a big stretch mind :undecided:
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Little bit far from me then; I'm in South Wales. I'm a mobile remapper for Carbon :smiley:
You got a manual or DSG box?
I've run mine for apporx 10,000 miles now (currently at 42K) and I've had no issues with the clutch / gearbox; as you can see from my graph I'm running some nice numbers :wink: That's a Carbon remap by the way :smiley:
(http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y276/Rhyso/Audi%20A3/OY57UTM.gif)
Plenty of people running 200bhp without issues :smiley: 225bhp seems like a big stretch mind :undecided:
Yeah looking at those figures on the graph and scale it certainly looks good.I'm a manual G/box at the moment its a totally standard gt 170 with 50k on the clock, i have had it for about a yr and its a nice clean car.
I think 200bhp will be plenty for me as i'm not a thrasher lol but like the idea of a little bit more torque and better fuel eco.
So a remap and miltek exhaust should do the trick.
Its the remap that's the question Revo? or do i get a custom map ?
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How much is It for a remap on a 170 tdi
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Yeah looking at those figures on the graph and scale it certainly looks good.I'm a manual G/box at the moment its a totally standard gt 170 with 50k on the clock, i have had it for about a yr and its a nice clean car.
I think 200bhp will be plenty for me as i'm not a thrasher lol but like the idea of a little bit more torque and better fuel eco.
So a remap and miltek exhaust should do the trick.
Its the remap that's the question Revo? or do i get a custom map ?
I'd suggest trying out one if you can; think REVO offer you a trial version so you can have a play with it to see if you like it. Obviously if you were closer I'd recommend what I've got :grin: :grin:
How much is It for a remap on a 170 tdi
Depends who you go with :smiley: If you're in the South West area I can offer this for £200 :smiley:
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Well I'm near Cambridge how far are u from there
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Well I'm near Cambridge how far are u from there
Im in merthyr tydfil south wales
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About 200 odd miles from Cambridge..
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Hey Rhyso
Is my location to far for you to come?
Thanks
Steve
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Hey Rhyso
Is my location to far for you to come?
Thanks
Steve
Sent you a PM Steve :smiley:
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Gerard mercer at vw Audi in bothwell do the cc map and miltek,thinking of going there myself.
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spoke to carbon today there saying the 170 are too problamtic to remap so its no no thinking about this now the 140 would fo been a much better option
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spoke to carbon today there saying the 170 are too problamtic to remap so its no no thinking about this now the 140 would fo been a much better option
They are much more complex to remap thanks in large to the Siemens ECU and the DPF pipe :sad:
170 is still my weapon of choice though :evil: :cool:
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who else wud u recommed apart from carbon :undecided: mite go to r tech then!
The thing tempted me with the 140 is the fuel consumption it appears to be a lot better then the 170s however there are ppl who claim 55 plus in 170s too
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I got 45mpg from my 170 prior to DPF removal
I'm now getting 49mpg; I always think people getting over 50mpg from a 170 must constantly drive downhill :grin: :grin:
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whats the best year mk5 tdi to get ?
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Don't get a 170!!!!
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Don't get a 170!!!!
why?
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Don't get a 170!!!!
why?
Get one and map it mate through Doc :cool:
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140, 170s are hard work - just dont
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Call me again tomorrow and I'll go through it all but in the vacuum.....
140 - normally no DPF and a Bosch ECU :wink:
170 - DPF and a bad one at that and a Siemens ECU :sick:
Or if you've bought it leave it alone :smiley:
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Since owning one I have formed an opinion on both the 140 and the 170 PD engines. Both have major problems ranging from a siezed block caused by an oil pump failing and giving no warnings, to cylinder block problems leading to a 2k repair bill.
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u were [robably just unlucky as i#ave not heard of the above problems am swaying towards a 140 now hoever most of the late 08 onwards are dpf aswell lol
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Get yourself on an Audi forum and see what problems the same engines are having :wink:
Yes you prob have not heard any problems regarding the mk5 140-170s as there isn't that many of them compared to the A3,A4, and A6s.
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Just chatted to a dealer and he was saying that all cars from 2007 have to to be fitted with a dpf to minimise emmisions is this correct?
every golf 140 from 08 and 57 onwards seems to have dpf fitted?
cheers
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No it's not mate.
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Since owning one I have formed an opinion on both the 140 and the 170 PD engines. Both have major problems ranging from a siezed block caused by an oil pump failing and giving no warnings, to cylinder block problems leading to a 2k repair bill.
Indeed but to fair the ecu in the 140 is a gem :wink:
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i would say 90% of the 2.0 TDIs that are brought to me with problems are the 170 models. Usually dpf problems or failed inlet manifold flap actuator valve. I've seen at least 6 of them this week alone, but only one 140 which just needed a temperature sensor.
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You lot are just unlucky...... :lipsrsealed:
A lot of dpf failures are people not drving the car properly once in a while and also ignoring the warning lights :rolleyes:
Yes they are a crap after thought but if you look after your car properly and put things right before they turn into a serious problem then its a great motor imo :smiley:
140's have choccy turbos :lipsrsealed:
Im not biased by the way :laugh: :laugh:
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you don't have a dpf anymore thats why :grin:
driven properly or not, they're all susceptible to the dreaded G450 implausible signal code!
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you don't have a dpf anymore thats why :grin:
driven properly or not, they're all susceptible to the dreaded G450 implausible signal code!
Didnt have a problem with it on either :tongue:
Its other people who now have a problem with mine; trying to keep up :evil:
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I ran my GT Sport 170 ps golf for 2 years and 80k miles, I had one dpf issue at 27k miles which was a pressure sensor and beyond that not a single problem.
I have a very heavy right foot, albeit most journeys I did were 50 miles or more I never had less than 50mpg average on the trip computer.
Driving the 170 really shows its performance advantage over the 140 at motorway speeds, acceleration is a fair bit stronger and would always show a 140 a clean pair of heels when required :evil:
Only reason I sold it instead of handing down to my wife was that I wasn't confident of anyone being able to remove the dpf and map accordingly to avoid issues with her short journeys. It would seem 12 months on things have moved quite fast and a number of different companies offer this conversion without any major issues.
Now drive a Leon FR with the new CR 170 ps engine and it's enjoyable to drive but doesn't feel quite as punchy as the old pd engine, much more linear power rather than having the low down torque spike.
I do miss my old MK5 :sad:
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I've ran my 170 for nearly 3 years the only problem was a cam sensor which got this week.I also ran it along with my mk5 gti & found the gt sport a better m way car down to the torque.
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Hi Guys!
My son bought a 170 gt sport five years ago it was an 04 reg with 21,000 miles , he emailed me last night to see how I was and said "By the way my car turned 100,000 miles today and still going great"
Now this car has only had regular oil changes and the odd fuel filter changed ,brakes relined and tyres and a headlamp bulb.
I service this car myself so it never goes to a dealer or other garage except for MOT'S,
So can't praise this car enough, he gets well over 50 to the gallon ,so 5 stars all round from us!