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General => General discussion => Topic started by: Sam on 25 August 2011, 19:08
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At the moment I am studying product design at loughborough University with two years left. Over the past few holidays I have been working as a blacksmith/metalworker/fabricator and I LOVE the job.
I have been thinking for a while now and spoken to my boss about quitting uni, getting an aprentiship as a fabricator and welder and eventually getting out onto the rigs (either land or sea). Im just not sure how easy it is to get into and weather quitting uni would be the right choice or I should see out the course.
Im 21 at the moment, so seeing out uni would push me to 23 where I COULD be 2 and a bit years into an aprenticip scheme with one of the big boys in oil. So.... any thoughts?
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if i were you, i'd just see out the Uni course :smiley: At least then you have options, and surely you could go and do the apprenticeship after university no?
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if i were you, i'd just see out the Uni course :smiley: At least then you have options, and surely you could go and do the apprenticeship after university no?
Yer but im wondering if its worth having a degree at 23 and then taking on the role of a 16 year old?
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You have to think what the chances are of you getting a decent job after uni, specially as the way jobs are going, it might be years after before you start earning good money, dont know how good money is on rigs but I presume pretty good as it's good danger money?
Could always start your own fabricating business as well. Surely you wouldn't be on 16 year old pay thought if you've work with him atm?
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Do what you enjoy :wink:
I done IT at college with the intentions of going to uni, but 2 years working on computers and I was sick of them.
Got my apprenticeship 5 years ago now doing mechanical fitting and love it. Do a variety of different jobs everyday and with overtime can earn a very good wage.
If you work hard and get your employer/assessor to give you different jobs you can complete a level 3 apprenticeship in 2 years most people finish in 3.
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You have to think what the chances are of you getting a decent job after uni, specially as the way jobs are going, it might be years after before you start earning good money, dont know how good money is on rigs but I presume pretty good as it's good danger money?
Could always start your own fabricating business as well. Surely you wouldn't be on 16 year old pay thought if you've work with him atm?
When I was in college it was £40 a week, 1st year on site £7.50, second £9, third £11. tradesman £12.90, advanced tradesman (2years after you finish your apprenticeship) £13.70.
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You have to think what the chances are of you getting a decent job after uni, specially as the way jobs are going, it might be years after before you start earning good money, dont know how good money is on rigs but I presume pretty good as it's good danger money?
Could always start your own fabricating business as well. Surely you wouldn't be on 16 year old pay thought if you've work with him atm?
Thats the point, I dont want to be a designer but the course offers me key skills eg. Engineering drawing module, CAD module and a degree. Just wondering if this will help me with were I want to go. And yes, rig money is good.... very very good.
Fabrication buissiness was going to be after rig work, earn my money, travel the world then settle down at aboot 40 and set up.
Do what you enjoy :wink:
I done IT at college with the intentions of going to uni, but 2 years working on computers and I was sick of them.
Got my apprenticeship 5 years ago now doing mechanical fitting and love it. Do a variety of different jobs everyday and with overtime can earn a very good wage.
If you work hard and get your employer/assessor to give you different jobs you can complete a level 3 apprenticeship in 2 years most people finish in 3.
Thats the difficulty, all the advice I have been given leads to 'if you ever find a job you love, its the job for you' which is the exact position I am in at the moment.
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Then do it. What's the uni degree worth if you're not going to put it to use?
You found a job you love, most people don't :afro:
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Then do it. What's the uni degree worth if you're not going to put it to use?
You found a job you love, most people don't :afro:
Im just wondering if having 'A degree' anyway will give me an advantage over others. If I am seen as pratical, creative and 'proven' academicly would doing my aprentiship and climbing the ladder be quicker/ simpler or more likely.
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depends on the company you work for.
My company it wouldn't matter what qualifications you got. If your good on the tools your move up.
If you want to be a manager then do some sort of management course at uni and go straight into it. Otherwise it could take a very long time
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depends on the company you work for.
My company it wouldn't matter what qualifications you got. If your good on the tools your move up.
If you want to be a manager then do some sort of management course at uni and go straight into it. Otherwise it could take a very long time
I dont want to be manager and sat in an office, I want to be on the job. Just wondering about advancing to say foreman or gangleader?
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YOU i have a degree in product desing dont you know
BOSS shut the f##k up and go and weld that pipe
the course sound like it has nothing to do with welding and fab but the design drawing and cad parts sound like they could be quite usefull but if you dont intend in getting into the design side of things and just want to make and weld things then the design and cad parts are not much use to you as you wont use them.
worst case you could go back to uni and study something else if you lose interest in the welding
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do what makes u happy sam :laugh:
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I dont want to be manager and sat in an office, I want to be on the job. Just wondering about advancing to say foreman or gangleader?
am a chargehand/gangleader on bigger jobs/shutdowns/when the foremans off and Ive been out my time for 20 months.
Problem Ive got is my company are site maintenance contractors at a large factory but we've only got 10 mechanical guys and 1 foreman so until he leaves nobody has a chance of moving up.
YOU i have a degree in product desing dont you know
BOSS shut the f##k up and go and weld that pipe
This is so true. :grin:
I hate it when a uni grad is working with the drawing office on a project and he is telling me how to do my job even though he's never picked up a spanner in his life.
They only tell me once though :lipsrsealed: :evil:
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I'd say being a foreman as such would have more to how much respect you have and how well you know the job, can handle pressure etc, can keep the job going etc. I'm basically a foreman running 3 sites atm.
You'd just say to your employer yer I done 2 years of cad at uni so I know what I'm doing, having a degree doesn't mean you can do what the degree says you can do, looking at half my mates I think do you actually know anything about what your doing, yet they will pass.
Steve pd, they seem like good wages! I work for my dad and didnt get that lol, well in 4 th year of plumbing atm, just bout to finish my apprenticeship. But was getting at because his boss knows he can do it, that he might start him off at a better wage.
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I'd say being a foreman as such would have more to how much respect you have and how well you know the job, can handle pressure etc, can keep the job going etc. I'm basically a foreman running 3 sites atm.
And thats how you move up quick.
Steve pd, they seem like good wages! I work for my dad and didnt get that lol, well in 4 th year of plumbing atm, just bout to finish my apprenticeship. But was getting at because his boss knows he can do it, that he might start him off at a better wage.
My company pay a good wage, welders can earn upto a £1 more an hour depending on what coding they got.
A pipefitter I went college with has been on £7.50 an hour with no overtime rates since he finished his apprenticeship 3 years ago and his boss wont pay him more.
But then some other fitters I went college with are earning 60k a year and was earning 40k as a apprentice. but they work 12 hours shifts 28 days on 2 days off
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you say your woried about being on a 16 year olds wage, when i started my aprenticship a lad who i was with was on 20 odd k a year in his first year.
it all depends what companie your with, equally i know people who are in the same stage of there aprenticship as me who are 2 or 3 years older than me who are on a grand or 2 less than me. age means nothing in aprenticships i also know someone whos on £100 (just over minimum wage for aprentice) and hes older than me.
personally ide stick out the degree. yeah saying you want to be a rigger or a welder or a mechy is all good, but when you come to 50 odd and you have no degree ect what you gonna do? or if you (god forbid) have a accident and can no longer do that and can only do work stuck behind a desk what you gonna do?
23 is not a old age to start an aprenticship i work with someone who started his aprenticship at 25. i also know someone whos 30 and is just starting aprenticships. chances are cause your older you wownt be on 16 year old wages, i know both of them are on pretty decent wages, the one whos 25 has just bought a house and a brand new car so cant be on a bad wage.
personally ide stick out the degree just so you have it, after all its something to put on your cv and it can be a back up. someone with a degree that is loosely tied to the subject is more appealing than someone with nothing.
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fcuk the degree, in these days they are two a penny, if you love your work you'll find going to work is a joy not a burden and you will find you will enjoy learning, and hence by the time you are late 20s will be an expert and have more opportunities and probably earn more than a graduate. :wink:
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If you pack in the degree, leave it at the end of an academic year and you could always go back to finish it couldnt you?
Do you have an idea of how you see your working carreer through life? i.e. do you want to get into a single trade/profession (or company) you can stick with and progress through, where a degree may be more useful, or be a bit more nomadic and varied where demonstrating experience with a degree of blagging ability can get you into good positions.
Experience in a role is always better than a qualification, but you may need to rely on the degree early on in a career prior to having much experience. After that initial stage the qualifications will generally pale into insignificance (unless you need it for levels of membership to a professinal institution, im thinking engineering here).
Another consideration before leaving higher education, how easy would it be to return to it? What support do you have now (parents/accomodation/finance) that you may struggle with in returning to a course in later years.
Good luck whatever you do!
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Both degree and trade will individually stand you in good stead.
But having them both will make you much better.
Stay the course and keep fabricating in the holidays. You're 21 FFS!
Put yourself in the postion of a HR manager. All those shiny degress but no work experience/practical knowledge.
Then your CV comes in. Whoa, shiny degree and three years welding/fabricating/general iron mongery skilz' much WIN.
It would even give you a fanststic grounding should you start your own business.
Its all about adding value to your CV. You'd be shoe in for small metal working design & fabrication business.
Jonathan.
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Go for it mate i work offshore allil say is to get on to rigs etc you just need experience... do the course or whatever get a job wleding for a year or 2 and apply to service companies... all il say is there are heaps of boys applying for the same jobs as i have heaps of welder/fabricator mates who struggle to find work offshore but work onshore but its not the same money....
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I quit my degree in the final year :laugh:, I didn't like the area it was heading into and realised I didn't have the talents that my fellow students had to make it in the multimedia design business.
However it wasn't until 2yrs later that I got the real job I wanted. I started this job as a trainee on £16k (all trainees got the same no matter if they had a degree or not). Within 4yrs I was on £24k basic (before overtime, etc).
I'm a sound engineer for a huge UK broadcaster.
My best friend also quit his IT degree course after 2yrs, because he'd been offered a job by the company he'd been doing a placement at. 10yrs later he's head of IT for the UK branch of an international company.
It all depends on what opportunities come your way and whether the benefit of not having thousands of pounds worth of debt is also a good idea.
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Both degree and trade will individually stand you in good stead.
But having them both will make you much better.
Stay the course and keep fabricating in the holidays. You're 21 FFS!
Put yourself in the postion of a HR manager. All those shiny degress but no work experience/practical knowledge.
Then your CV comes in. Whoa, shiny degree and three years welding/fabricating/general iron mongery skilz' much WIN.
It would even give you a fanststic grounding should you start your own business.
Its all about adding value to your CV. You'd be shoe in for small metal working design & fabrication business.
Jonathan.
Thanks for that mate, I think that's pretty much exactly what I have been waiting to hear. People with degrees will always tell you to either stick with it (lawers, doctors, engineers etc) or f**k it (psycholog, art, english) because they haven't done anything with there degree. People in a trade normally have never done a degree so will tell you how great it has all been and that uni is full of rioting student tossers.
I just cant seem to find anyone who has done a degree and then taken on a trade afterwards as its a rather odd move to take, with the normal reason been that there degree has somehow failed them and them been forced to 'take a step backwards'
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Forget about stigma and status.
With the exception of the professions, a degree should never be seen as "ticking that box to a better job."
NO!
A degree is there to increase ones knowledge and skills in something they're interested in.
You clearly love the creativity and hands on stuff that fabrication brings. Your degree will allow you to take those practical skills to another level.
Keep at it Sam.
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do what you want and what makes you happy! money isnt everything!
i left school, with a garenteed apprentaship!
needed 4 E's to get in to my collage! well i did that easy :laugh:
started on £125 a week, im on that a day 4 years later and the amount of over time i earn is :cool: and im still 20! iv got mates still at uni in 36k worth of debt and are not even garenteed a job at the end :lipsrsealed:
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Im 35 and started as an apprentice toolmaker at 17 and did a full craft training scheme with NVQ's C&G's covering sheet metal, welding, Machining, CAD, CNC machining etc etc
I now work in medical manufacturing bringing in Tech from all over the world (been to six countries this year), the stuff I get to see and play with is amazing.
dont get me wrong, just because i enjoy my work does not mean its a walk in the park but it does help when things are tough.
I am also qualified up to HNC with loads of industry specific stuff too, all paid for by my various employers.
It also helps with playing with cars :cool:
find what you like and are good at and stick to it, the respect and money will come :wink:
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Go for it mate i work offshore allil say is to get on to rigs etc you just need experience... do the course or whatever get a job wleding for a year or 2 and apply to service companies... all il say is there are heaps of boys applying for the same jobs as i have heaps of welder/fabricator mates who struggle to find work offshore but work onshore but its not the same money....
Niice, I assume you live in aberdeen and do the north sea rigs. Im a long way off yet but wouldnt mind giving it a blast when the time comes.
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if you can finish your degree. if you leave you will never be able to go back EVER. look at the way prices are beinging hiked up!!!
having the degree shows you have the ability to learn a subject up to a standard which will always be recognised.
experience is good if you can get it.
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As Elvi says, really.
Doesn't matter if you don't use your degree, once you have it, you have it.
A degree done properly, by someone who's engaged in the course should teach you to think.
You won't learn that on an apprenticeship, you'll learn a trade instead. Straight down the lines, not creative. I think you'll realise you've made a huge mistake six months in, because you're more than that.
If you place any value in doing a 'product design' degree then you should continue with it. Is it BA or BSc?
Sorry, but 21 and only a year into your degree? Where'd you waste two years already?
Points made about accidents are very valid, too. Lose the physical ability and you've lost your income. Being trained to think means you should be able to adapt.
I have a very good friend who did the same sort of wrestling with a similar choice two years into his psychology degree, about five years ago. He finished his degree. He then worked through a couple of quirky mechanics jobs and now runs his own garage and loves it.
You've started and made a three year commitment. Shut up, man up and get on with it.
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^^^What he said :smiley:
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As Elvi says, really.
Doesn't matter if you don't use your degree, once you have it, you have it.
A degree done properly, by someone who's engaged in the course should teach you to think.
You won't learn that on an apprenticeship, you'll learn a trade instead. Straight down the lines, not creative. I think you'll realise you've made a huge mistake six months in, because you're more than that.
If you place any value in doing a 'product design' degree then you should continue with it. Is it BA or BSc?
Sorry, but 21 and only a year into your degree? Where'd you waste two years already?
Points made about accidents are very valid, too. Lose the physical ability and you've lost your income. Being trained to think means you should be able to adapt.
I have a very good friend who did the same sort of wrestling with a similar choice two years into his psychology degree, about five years ago. He finished his degree. He then worked through a couple of quirky mechanics jobs and now runs his own garage and loves it.
You've started and made a three year commitment. Shut up, man up and get on with it.
I 'waisted' two years doing an engineering degree for one year and then took a gap year to think about things where I did 3 months of fabrication (the job i do at the moment) and 7 months as an architectural assistant. Hated working in the office as a skivvy even though I was putting through minor drawings and planning appications, just got fat and bored - blew all my wages on beer and a golf. I then dissapeared to india for 2 months :smiley:
The degree I am doing is the top in the country, its always a tossup between brunell and loughborough. I fought off over 2000 aplicants to gain a place amongst 30 people. I was on the BSc course but changed to Ba this christmas, i really really struggled with the maths and a dyslexia test revealed that my maths is at a level that puts me in the bottom 20% in the country :embarassed: in terms of ability due to severe Dyscalcular.
I am all too aware of the accidents, my boss has one arm - he broke it in 36 places on the rigs and chose to have it amputated welding up a pipe that had been 'de-pressurised'.
Same as elvi DH, this is what I want to hear :smiley:
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Both degree and trade will individually stand you in good stead.
But having them both will make you much better.
Stay the course and keep fabricating in the holidays. You're 21 FFS!
Put yourself in the postion of a HR manager. All those shiny degress but no work experience/practical knowledge.
Then your CV comes in. Whoa, shiny degree and three years welding/fabricating/general iron mongery skilz' much WIN.
It would even give you a fanststic grounding should you start your own business.
Its all about adding value to your CV. You'd be shoe in for small metal working design & fabrication business.
Jonathan.
This. For the love of god this.
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Brilliant lads, thanks for all the help. I think I kinda new that quitting wasnt the best idea but wanted to make a change. Holiday fabrication and degree here I come :smiley:
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Go for it mate i work offshore allil say is to get on to rigs etc you just need experience... do the course or whatever get a job wleding for a year or 2 and apply to service companies... all il say is there are heaps of boys applying for the same jobs as i have heaps of welder/fabricator mates who struggle to find work offshore but work onshore but its not the same money....
Niice, I assume you live in aberdeen and do the north sea rigs. Im a long way off yet but wouldnt mind giving it a blast when the time comes.
Worldwide mate i go where they tell me! and its like any job has its ups and downs but you get to see the world lol but youl end up hating airports lol