GolfGTIforum.co.uk
Model specific boards => Golf mk3 => Topic started by: dragongreengolfgti on 21 July 2011, 18:23
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Rigth basically when i bought my car i was told it had been chipped but i have no proof of this and i can't tell if it has been or not simply because i've never been in another 16v. Its quite fast as ive seen a few mk4 1.8 T off and generally surprises afew people.
Anyway all i'd like to know is how can i tell ? and also can i remap it if it has been or would i need to replace the chip for a standard one once ive found out then remap it ? If i tried to get it mapped anyway would they be able to tell rather than mess it up? cheers
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When mine was chipped and remapped they changed the chip and give me the original one so I could revert to standard if I wish.
So if you really want to know then open up the ECU and have a look at the chip to see if its standard.
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Cheers madman how can i identify if its a standard chip or not does it have a number or vw wrote on it cheers mate
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oh and if i disconnect the ecu to have a look is there a chance it will bugger anything up something along the lines of immobiliser etc silly question i know but on my old car i disconnected the battery and then the immobiliser stopped working although it was aftermarket same as on this one in the end i had to take the immobiliser out of the system altogether and now im scared to ever disconnect my battery again :laugh:
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Any decent ecu tuning company will be able to tell you if its non standard set up just by plugging into the diagnostics.
Even if it is chipped I can't see it pushing any much more than 160bhp peak maximum with a standard engine.
I own a chipped 16v myself and find it hard to believe that its quicker than a 1.8T though.
16v's don't really gain that much from chipping/ remapping alone and only really gain a smoother power curve and throttle response.
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oh and if i disconnect the ecu to have a look is there a chance it will bugger anything up something along the lines of immobiliser etc silly question i know but on my old car i disconnected the battery and then the immobiliser stopped working although it was aftermarket same as on this one in the end i had to take the immobiliser out of the system altogether and now im scared to ever disconnect my battery again :laugh:
If the battery is disconnected and left for at least 15mins or so you'll be fine to unbolt the ecu from the scuttle tray.
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Any decent ecu tuning company will be able to tell you if its non standard set up just by plugging into the diagnostics.
Even if it is chipped I can't see it pushing any much more than 160bhp peak maximum with a standard engine.
I own a chipped 16v myself and find it hard to believe that its quicker than a 1.8T though.16v's don't really gain that much from chipping/ remapping alone and only really gain a smoother power curve and throttle response.
Std 150 bhp turbo is not a quick car, My old 16v had the legs over a 1.8t in std form and my 8v snaps at the heals until some open straight road. 180 bhp version is clear daylight in front of 16v much to my annoyance
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To be fair a 16v will beat a standard 1.8T as they're 150hp and mk4 weight more than mk3. Remap on a 16v will gain 3-8hp depending on chip.
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To be fair a 16v will beat a standard 1.8T as they're 150hp and mk4 weight more than mk3. Remap on a 16v will gain 3-8hp depending on chip.
Spot on
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Any decent ecu tuning company will be able to tell you if its non standard set up just by plugging into the diagnostics.
Even if it is chipped I can't see it pushing any much more than 160bhp peak maximum with a standard engine.
I own a chipped 16v myself and find it hard to believe that its quicker than a 1.8T though.
16v's don't really gain that much from chipping/ remapping alone and only really gain a smoother power curve and throttle response.
Cheers i will go and see TRD man after work tomorrow see if he can help me :smiley: when i say seen off its abit over the top i have indeed had a play with my mates and someone else somewhere on a private run way and there was nothing in it at all infact i was slightly pulling and he even admits it which is rare. I have also kept with my mates 210bhp corsa vxr and this will sound silly i have surprised my (female) friend driving her 270bhp audi tt with many of witnesses. Dont get me wrong im not trying to boast here im just putting it in a way i can explain why i think it could be and how surprised i am with it amongst others. tbh i dont know what its had done and im looking to change a few things myself to gain more overall torque.
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Cheers madman how can i identify if its a standard chip or not does it have a number or vw wrote on it cheers mate
I have my standard chip infront of me so take a pic and I will tell you if its standard.
Just disconnect the battery and you will have no problems.
Mine gained 8bhp from the remap and I have before and after dynos to prove if need be.
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Cheers madman how can i identify if its a standard chip or not does it have a number or vw wrote on it cheers mate
I have my standard chip infront of me so take a pic and I will tell you if its standard.
Just disconnect the battery and you will have no problems.
Mine gained 8bhp from the remap and I have before and after dynos to prove if need be.
Cheers mate i will probs get on this saturday now and see i'l PM you once i have taken a picture :smiley:
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A run on a rolling road will tell you a lot.
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A run on a rolling road will tell you a lot.
Yup you should come upto carbon chiptuning for the forum rr day in October, that will tell you for sure! :smiley:
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A run on a rolling road will tell you a lot.
Yup you should come upto carbon chiptuning for the forum rr day in October, that will tell you for sure! :smiley:
Im up for it so long as the cars still running then :laugh: should have it sorted by then also :smiley:
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Don't worry if it's not sorted...my passat wont be!
I'm going so I can plan a remap (and see how many ponies have bolted!!)
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Cheers madman how can i identify if its a standard chip or not does it have a number or vw wrote on it cheers mate
I have my standard chip infront of me so take a pic and I will tell you if its standard.
Just disconnect the battery and you will have no problems.
Mine gained 8bhp from the remap and I have before and after dynos to prove if need be.
Lucky You!
Mine gained 2bhp max!
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If the battery is disconnected and left for at least 15mins or so you'll be fine to unbolt the ecu from the scuttle tray.
I have done many back-to-back ECU comparisons between a stock ECU, Chipped ECU and plug & play Megasquirt ECU...and never once disconnected the battery when swapping between ECUs.
The Standard ECU is fine to be removed without disconnecting the battery.
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Mine is chipped, but with airbox mods, cold air feeds, stainless exhaust, pipercross filter and made 172hp on Stealths rolling road (known to be optimistic) and 162hp on the Garage Streamline rolling road (known to be fairly accurate) Both dynos gave a reading of 144lbs-ft of torque, so I would expect the real reading to be somewhere around mid 160s.
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not bad figures there really :smiley: Whats the trick to get the torque almost the same as the bhp? and also out of curiosity whos got the fastest/most bhp 16v'er on the forum N/A powered? cheers
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that would be ess three. running around 196bhp at the moment?
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Mine is chipped, but with airbox mods, cold air feeds, stainless exhaust, pipercross filter and made 172hp on Stealths rolling road (known to be optimistic) and 162hp on the Garage Streamline rolling road (known to be fairly accurate) Both dynos gave a reading of 144lbs-ft of torque, so I would expect the real reading to be somewhere around mid 160s.
Well mine has been on 3 rolling roads since remap and highest has been 154.5 and mine has all those mods plus a polished throttle body!
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Mine is chipped, but with airbox mods, cold air feeds, stainless exhaust, pipercross filter and made 172hp on Stealths rolling road (known to be optimistic) and 162hp on the Garage Streamline rolling road (known to be fairly accurate) Both dynos gave a reading of 144lbs-ft of torque, so I would expect the real reading to be somewhere around mid 160s.
Well mine has been on 3 rolling roads since remap and highest has been 154.5 and mine has all those mods plus a polished throttle body!
What sort of mileage are most of your cars, and is there a nice mileage which tends to be the breaking point for the 16v engine if you know what i mean :grin: Another thing i want to know is how strong is the 16v engine compared to the vr6 i know you can push somewhat 300 bhp on standard internals on the vr6's what could you expect from the 16v's? cheers
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Mine is chipped, but with airbox mods, cold air feeds, stainless exhaust, pipercross filter and made 172hp on Stealths rolling road (known to be optimistic) and 162hp on the Garage Streamline rolling road (known to be fairly accurate) Both dynos gave a reading of 144lbs-ft of torque, so I would expect the real reading to be somewhere around mid 160s.
Well mine has been on 3 rolling roads since remap and highest has been 154.5 and mine has all those mods plus a polished throttle body!
Not sure why yours is that low mate, I guess some engines are just running really well and are a better base for modding than others. At both dynos I ran on, it was commented that I had a very strong engine, with a very healthy, wide torque spread, this obviously helps with the hp figures. I can put up a RR print out if anyones interested? Mine has done 142/143k miles and feels as fresh as a daisy. My chip was already on there, so cant comment about its origins though, just glad I didnt pay out for an expensive remap!
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Mine is chipped, but with airbox mods, cold air feeds, stainless exhaust, pipercross filter and made 172hp on Stealths rolling road (known to be optimistic) and 162hp on the Garage Streamline rolling road (known to be fairly accurate) Both dynos gave a reading of 144lbs-ft of torque, so I would expect the real reading to be somewhere around mid 160s.
Well mine has been on 3 rolling roads since remap and highest has been 154.5 and mine has all those mods plus a polished throttle body!
What sort of mileage are most of your cars, and is there a nice mileage which tends to be the breaking point for the 16v engine if you know what i mean :grin: Another thing i want to know is how strong is the 16v engine compared to the vr6 i know you can push somewhat 300 bhp on standard internals on the vr6's what could you expect from the 16v's? cheers
I cant speak for VR6's, but I would be very hpeful, all things considered, of getting 200k miles plus out of my 16v - owing to condition and maintenance and nothing untoward happening of course!
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Mine was 151.7bhp standard so was nothing wrong with it.
The comments I have always had are that its a sweet engine and is well fuelled.
I just dont believe these high outputs.
Oh I did go on Storm's RR once and it gave 173.6! Which is why I have been sceptical ever since.
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Sounds alot like the chip or remap you had done wasnt much cop to me.
As I said, Stealth is known to be optimistic, which makes my 172 optimistic. On a recent Clubgti 16v shootout day at Garage Streamline (using Dyno dynamics - known to be probably the most accurate RR) my car made 162, as did another guys valver, most made mid 150s. There were alot of reference cars there (ie stock/standard cars, that had been well maintained, but were unmodified), which made or nearly made stock VW figures, then the modded cars, such as mine and a few others, showed the gains to be had from various mods. I wont say it is gospel, but I believe it to be as accurate as one can get when quoting car figures.
Check out the results from that day and come to your own conclusions:
http://www.clubgti.com/forum/showthread.php?t=228244&page=14 (http://www.clubgti.com/forum/showthread.php?t=228244&page=14)
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well looking at my dyno read out now it read 141 bhp at 110mph
thats when my engine was bog standard, crap oil, a massive hole in the exhaust and crap spark plugs (wanted to see it at a base)
now iv got upgraded sparkplugs, full service, full remus system and a carbon induction id expect about 160 ish :)
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Yes Dyno Dynamics are the best and my last 2 results have been on those systems.
The chip was done by Rtech and they have good rep and good results.
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well looking at my dyno read out now it read 141 bhp at 110mph
thats when my engine was bog standard, crap oil, a massive hole in the exhaust and crap spark plugs (wanted to see it at a base)
now iv got upgraded sparkplugs, full service, full remus system and a carbon induction id expect about 160 ish :)
I'd be surprised if a service, exhaust and induction kit will add 20bhp :grin:
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well service should have at least got me back to standard. and with a remus system and simota carbon induction then yep i recon so :)
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Mine ran 150bhp on the nose before the remap and 158bhp after with a small increase in torque.
That was running Jetex exhaust with de-cat, modded airbox with panel filter on my 40k mileage engine so I struggle to believe the claims of high 160s to 170s.
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Mine is chipped, but with airbox mods, cold air feeds, stainless exhaust, pipercross filter and made 172hp on Stealths rolling road (known to be optimistic) and 162hp on the Garage Streamline rolling road (known to be fairly accurate) Both dynos gave a reading of 144lbs-ft of torque, so I would expect the real reading to be somewhere around mid 160s.
Well mine has been on 3 rolling roads since remap and highest has been 154.5 and mine has all those mods plus a polished throttle body!
Len's graph from the Carbon RR day:
(http://i790.photobucket.com/albums/yy183/codling1234/P443WGC.jpg)
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You should get one of these chips: http://www.golfgtiforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=199054.0 25bhp extra. :grin:
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Plus another 5 bhp with this: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/STICKER-ADDS-5BHP-FUNNY-CAR-VAN-DECAL-MORE-COLOURS-/130493367366?pt=UK_SportingGoods_OtherSports&var=&hash=item641f051acc#ht_500wt_922
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Plus another 5 bhp with this: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/STICKER-ADDS-5BHP-FUNNY-CAR-VAN-DECAL-MORE-COLOURS-/130493367366?pt=UK_SportingGoods_OtherSports&var=&hash=item641f051acc#ht_500wt_922
paid for and arriving next week :cool: :lipsrsealed:
:grin:
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Plus another 5 bhp with this: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/STICKER-ADDS-5BHP-FUNNY-CAR-VAN-DECAL-MORE-COLOURS-/130493367366?pt=UK_SportingGoods_OtherSports&var=&hash=item641f051acc#ht_500wt_922
paid for and arriving next week :cool: :lipsrsealed:
:grin:
If you glue one on each wing do you thing you'll get 10? :grin:
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paid for and arriving next week :cool: :lipsrsealed:
If you glue one on each wing do you thing you'll get 10? :grin:
Hey if I get 6 and fit my maxpower filter...... I won't need a remap! :smug:
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With regards to Len's rolling road graph in comparison to one of my runs:
(http://img819.imageshack.us/img819/1509/imag0210r.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/819/imag0210r.jpg/)
Uploaded with ImageShack.us (http://imageshack.us)
I would comment on the fact that Len's valver seems to barely make over 135lbs-ft of torque and doesnt hold onto this for a decent amount of the rev range, tapering off to under 125lbs-ft before 6400rpm. Contrast this to mine and you can see it holds over 140lbs-ft of torque right from 3.5krpm upto 6krpm, only just dropping under Len's peak torque after 6.5krpm. Even as it hits the limiter of nearly 7krpm my car still makes 120lbs-ft of torque.
This is where I see the difference in the cars, it doesnt seem like they've tinkered much for a remap to make that torque hold on for that much longer.
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Nice curves :shocked:
Who mapped your car Dennis?
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This is mine with a modified airbox, pipercross panel filter, decat and exhaust.
(http://i254.photobucket.com/albums/hh115/kharekatoh/abfdyno.jpg)
The coil was on it's last legs though, in fact it packed up on the way home from JKM. I've since stuck the chip that rubjonny found a 6hp gain on the rr so it should be making in the low 160hp and torque should be a lot better too.
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If the battery is disconnected and left for at least 15mins or so you'll be fine to unbolt the ecu from the scuttle tray.
I have done many back-to-back ECU comparisons between a stock ECU, Chipped ECU and plug & play Megasquirt ECU...and never once disconnected the battery when swapping between ECUs.
The Standard ECU is fine to be removed without disconnecting the battery.
Ah ok fair enough, i was just under the impression you could possibly damage it with the battery connected still. I guess it's just a force of habit to disconnect it whenever i work on any of the electrical system.
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Ive also got the same chip and basic mods as khare so would expect very similar results.
My only complaint with this chip is that the engine does tend to pink occasionally if i don't use super unleaded. Would this be a timing issue, possibly the cambelt out by one tooth although i haven't got the usual 5k safe mode kicked in.
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I wouldn't know about that as I only ever use tesco 99, however I do know these chips are mapped to run on high octane. So that would explain it :smiley:
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Yeah the guy that sold it did say that although it would be fine on standard unleaded as well, just thought id check to see if anyone else had come across anything similar.
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Ive also got the same chip and basic mods as khare so would expect very similar results.
My only complaint with this chip is that the engine does tend to pink occasionally if i don't use super unleaded. Would this be a timing issue, possibly the cambelt out by one tooth although i haven't got the usual 5k safe mode kicked in.
Sounds like your chip is makeing your ignition timing advanced some would say aggresive timing, which is all ok but givin you pre ignition knock if you run the lower octane stuff,cambelt is probably spot on :smiley:
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Nice curves :shocked:
Who mapped your car Dennis?
I have no idea who mapped it unfortunately, it was in the car when I bought it, the torque and power curves are superb and the drive equally so.. I don't want to take it out incase the magic disappears! :wink:
However, I thank that person for doing a superb job! :cool:
I wouldn't know about that as I only ever use tesco 99, however I do know these chips are mapped to run on high octane. So that would explain it :smiley:
I don't know so much about high octane having any real effect on the output - the mk3 was made to run on standard fuel, not high octane, and I've noticed no real difference running it on the V power or BP ultimate. For the last year I've been running mine on standard Tescos fuel (for the club card points :nerd: ) and only real difference I can see is maybe 30miles extra per tank with the high octane stuff, the drive doesnt feel any different.
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The VR6 runs better on high octane fuel, the handbook says 98 RON gives more torque.
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mine definitely runs better on 99ron.
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There will be no difference on a standard vehicle ,high octane will let you run more advanced ignition with out pinking.
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There will be no difference on a standard vehicle ,high octane will let you run more advanced ignition with out pinking.
There is on a vr6 and that's actually in the vw handbook, not huge, but it is noticeable.
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There will be no difference on a standard vehicle ,high octane will let you run more advanced ignition with out pinking.
Makes a very noticable difference with my S3 lump.. its all ill put in it
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And when I use normal stuff I get less mpg and revs feel a bit lazier on the pickup.
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Right then ive got my car booked in for a rolling road in two weeks, i'm going to see what its pushing now with a nackered exhaust etc then put my other exhaust and do a few tweeks and see what i gain i will also know by then if infact it is chipped :smiley: i would just be happy if i got factory figures and very happy if its more time will tell :smiley: some good comments on here cheers peps :cool:
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And when I use normal stuff I get less mpg and revs feel a bit lazier on the pickup.
+1 on this