GolfGTIforum.co.uk
Model specific boards => Golf mk4 => Topic started by: Deano2711 on 04 June 2011, 13:45
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I have recently bought a 1.8 20v Non Turbo. Drove approx 50 miles to fetch it. Driving back I went about 10 miles with no problems, the temp guage was stuck at half way as it should. Pulled into services to get some fuel and as I came round the slip road towards the garage noticed steam coming from the header tank area. Temp guage was still stuck at halfway. Spent about an hour on the services letting the air out of the header tank pipe, topping up with water and massaging the pipes. Carried on driving back about 25 motorway miles and 12 miles of town driving with no issues whatsoever. About 3 miles from home the low coolant warning buzzer went off so I stopped straight away and refilled. Drove home and when I stopped the steam was back from the header tank overflow pipe. Forgot to say all this journey I had the heaters burning my face off !!!
Next day I disconnected the top hose from the rad and ran the hosepipe through for a good ten minutes then popped the hose back on and started the engine. No heaters but also no overheating and no steam. Ran the engine for a good 40 minutes and another couple of 30 minute sessions but no heating. Took it to work Friday afternoon about 4 miles each way with no problems whatsoever but still no heating.
So today I disconnected the bottom hose by the alt. Ran the hose through for a good ten minutes with the engine running and the heaters on full. Reconnected the hose and left it running. Now I have no movement above half way from the temp guage still and my heaters are now blowing hot through the outer two vents on the dash but the two middle ones are blowing cold (not stone cold but nowhere near where they should be). When the car is idling there is steam coming from the overflow pipe. The top and bottom hoses are a bit stiff still. When I stop the car you can hear some air in the system still but if I remove the header tank cap after the air has stopped coming out then the pipes will become squeezable again.
I originally thought of the thermostat but if the water is getting to the heaters then that cannot be it. Same with the water pump. I just think I have an air lock somewhere but has anyone got anything else they can add or tell me the best way to sort this. Any help greatly appreciated as I feel like taking a big hammer to the bloody thing !!!! lol
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is there water coming back into the header tank from the small top pipe?
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Yes Mate water is coming back ok. All seems to be as normal except for the pressure causing the steam. I have flushed the system twice now. Just been to fetch another header tank cap from the local scrappie and that's made no difference. Really annoying me now !!!!!!!
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Come on Guys really need some help with this one. I have now changed the thermostat and followed the how to guide on here. All went well until holding the revs at 2000rpm and waiting for the heater to start warming up. My expansion tank was getting lots of air coming back and was bubbling like a kettle. Eventually this died down and the cap went on. Heaters are working on the two sides but not the middle still. Within 2 minutes of the cap going on the top and bottom hose were solid.....is this normal as I have never checked to be honest ?? Will be taking it out for a little test drive very soon to see what happens but I am very close to smashing the bloody thing to pieces :angry: :angry:
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Forgot to mention that while I had the top and bottom hoses disconnected I have checked that the rad is not blocked with a hosepipe and checked that the water will pass from the one ond of the engine to the other easily. Will also get from the expansion tank to the engine block easily. The return pipe is clear and the water returns to the expansion tank as it should. Really at a loss now and pulling my hair out.
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thermostat? Water pump sounds good as you have water returning to the header tank
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thermostat? Water pump sounds good as you have water returning to the header tank
Water pump and head gasket seem fine, changed the expansion tank cap and thermostat, flushed the system three times now and contacted the twit who sold it me as a perfect runner !!!!!!!
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Not good then deano :sad:
I guess it could be airlocked but it should have cleared by now.
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Not good then deano :sad:
I guess it could be airlocked but it should have cleared by now.
Tell me about it Mate.....I have never encountered anything like this before !!!!! Got to be something really stupid somewhere....but where ??
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If the system is pressurising all the time and you're sure the system is bled, then its either a faulty cap or headgasket problem.
What you need is a pressure tester like i've got, not cheap though, about 90 quid, but it will bleed the system in seconds.
I assume the top point of the system on the mk4 is the header tank, so i assume you have run the car fast idle with the cap off for a good 5 minutes.
How are you sure the headgasket is ok?
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With the cap off I have run the car on tickover for 40 mins. Then flushed out again and did it with the thermostat fitting guide from the Maintenence section which involved keeping the car at 2000 rpm with the cap off. As for the headgasket there would be a sign somewhere. I drove the car 50 miles home with no overheating and have been driving it since. The oil and water are clean even after using the car. There is no smoking whatsoever and no loss of power, runs perfect. If it was the headgasket you would get a symptom somewhere.
I believe that everything under the bonnet is working fine. I have checked the water flow from the expansion tank to the engine, from the one side of the engine to the other and from the top of the rad to the bottom. Everything is fine there but when I reconnect everything up and run the car to speed the pipes go hard. The steam has now stopped but I am worried the pipes are hard. Also when I stop the engine you can hear the air in the system. Seems to be located where the heater pipes meet the bulkhead and travels back along these pipes. At the moment the steam has stopped but I also have no heating in the car. I am starting to think that the heater is my problem somewhere. As said earlier I have changed the expansion tank cap and the thermostat. The strange thing is that even when the car is steaming from the expansion tank overflow the temp guage is still on the half way mark and does not go over this whatsoever. The engine is not hot when I check it either. Really is now just a pain in the arse and was wandering if anyone had ever seen anything like this because I sure haven't !!!!!!!
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possible crack in you head as air is getting into the system some how. i would do a pressure check on the engine mate.
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Any more news Dean :undecided:
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As for the headgasket there would be a sign somewhere.
Yes, the sign would be, airlocks (no heating is a classic airlock sign), stiff hoses, overheating and/or erratic temperature readings, steaming expansion tank.
If it was the headgasket you would get a symptom somewhere.
You are getting the symptoms.
Stiff hoses plus the other symptoms you describe, can only be headgasket.
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Well after a weekend of messing I now have the following......new expansion tank cap, new thermostat and engine flush. At the moment I have the engine warming upto half way on the temp guage which is great. I now have heating which is a little slow but nice and hot. No steaming from the expansion tank overflow. However I still have a rock hard top hose and cold bottom hose.
This leads me to believe that I have a blockage somewhere between the expansion tank and the thermostat. So I am dropping the car off to my Mate's garage lunchtime for him to have a look properly.
As for the headgasket, if the gasket was fooked then surely I would have at least one of the following....oil and water mixing (mine are clean and are after running the car for a few hours), smoke (mine has none even when I rev hard) or loss of power (mine has none). I am pretty sure head gasket is fine and as I get water returning to the expansion tank I believe the water pump is working fine. I am now banking on a blockage and my Mate to sort it for me.
Will update later when I know more.
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This leads me to believe that I have a blockage somewhere between the expansion tank and the thermostat.
No, it's the head gasket
As for the headgasket, if the gasket was fooked then surely I would have at least one of the following....oil and water mixing
No, as the gasket has split between coolant flow and cylinder, not oil flow and cylinder, hence rock hard hoses as the cylinder is pumping up the cooling system.
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Unfortunately i do have to agree with Ant on this.
Its very probable you have a head gasket leak, coolant hoses that go rock hard is a common symptom.
When i owned the vr years ago, i had a problem with the coolant system over-pressurising, the only symptoms i had was hard hoses and a bit of coolant coming out of expansion cap valve.
The gasket had failed between no.1 cylinder and a coolant passage.
Get the coolant system sniffed for exhaust gasses, it will tell you for sure, any garage should do this quite cheap.
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It's a bit naughty of the previous owner, very.
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Just to confirm Lads the head gasket is now being changed as everything has been tested and changed. Will update when I get the car back at the end of the week.
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Port and polish the head whilst it's off if the head's ok. Head off always opens up a few opportunities like that.
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Well the Golf is now back with a new head gasket, temp sender, thermostat, fan switch, water pump, timing belt and kit. All seems very well now except for an empty wallet !!!! :cry:
Here is the only pic I have of the car so far. I have Carbon Vinyl'd the front slats on the grille and put on the GTI badge. Before anyone says I know it's on the right hand side but I was a Mark 3 man for years and can't kick the habit !!! lol I have also Carbon Vinyl'd the centre console/dash which looks very nice. Better pics to follow soon.
(http://i680.photobucket.com/albums/vv163/Deano2711/DeanosGolf.jpg)
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Looks good mate! Ive been waiting to see the pics! Are you finding the 1.8 20v better than the 2.0 you used to have? Also, let me know when you wanna carbon my slats!! :grin: :grin: :cool:
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Looks good mate! Ive been waiting to see the pics! Are you finding the 1.8 20v better than the 2.0 you used to have? Also, let me know when you wanna carbon my slats!! :grin: :grin: :cool:
Loads better Buddy....the 2 ltr was painfully slow but I do like this one especially now I can drive the bloody thing !!!!!! :grin: :grin: Carbon Vinyl is really easy to use Mate but if you want to bring it up I can do it for you. Future plans are to lower it a bit and maybe some wheels when I get some money together. Just got to get over the bill for this lot of work first.
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Yeah, I bet the wallet is a little light now. At least its running and driving properly though :cool: I like it anyway, what wheels are you gonna go for when your cashflow has recovered? I put monty 2's on mine and it transformed the look!
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Not really sure yet guess I will see what turns up when I have the cash !!!!
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Looks good Deano and good result with sorting the problems out, expensive but worth it I guess.