GolfGTIforum.co.uk
Model specific boards => Golf mk5 => Topic started by: acenumber1 on 12 September 2010, 13:07
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Hello all, What can i do to reduce the understeer im getting, ie, better tyres, or suspension,
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Learn to drive or get your geometry set-up.
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lol my drivings not that bad, explain more on the geomertry plz.
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Hello all, What can i do to reduce the understeer im getting, ie, better tyres, or suspension,
Slow down... :smiley:
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LOL I'm sorry but we don't buy these cars to drive like my grandad, I appreciate where your coming from but whats the point of remapping if I cant go round a bend at the speed remapping offers, my point of under steer is more in the wet, im not a kid that goes racing round the country lanes every night but i do like to feel the speed now and again.
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Tyres are the only thing keeping your car on the road. so that'd be my first port of call.
And i may be wrong (usually am), the WALK (whiteline anti lift kit) is ment to reduce this considerably.
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Start with some decent rubber, then if you want to dive further in to it an Anti lift kit, uprated ARBs, TT lower arms, and coilovers with adustable top mounts can be fitted to dial out unwanted understeer.
Try the tyres and walk first conti contact sport 3s are great and the antilift kit can be had for about £130, if your still not happy a set of adjustable antiroll bars will sort you out.
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I'd echo what the guys have said above, rubber is one of the most important things, then i would go with uprated anti-roll bars - this is also said to give more feedback through the steering wheel... gotta be worth a try!
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I'd echo what the guys have said above, rubber is one of the most important things, then i would go with uprated anti-roll bars - this is also said to give more feedback through the steering wheel... gotta be worth a try!
^^^This^^^^
Also with FWD the ARB should be stiffer than the rear to reduce understeer. However, increasing stiffness at the front can increase the possibility of snap oversteer from the back end. Just look at Stig when on the last corner of the MKV GTI's lap (search you tube) and then imagine having a car that is set up to possibly do that easier!!!!
Ultimately the best way of increasing cornering ability is to fit adjustable top mounts, so you can increase negative camber, which will give you better cornering ability, but will also make the car LESS stable at high speed (100mph+).
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:smiley: Thankyou all for your replies, I agree the tyre and the walk sound the best to start with, then the anti roll, cheers.
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Also with FWD the ARB should be stiffer than the rear to reduce understeer. However, increasing stiffness at the front can increase the possibility of snap oversteer from the back end. Just look at Stig when on the last corner of the MKV GTI's lap (search you tube) and then imagine having a car that is set up to possibly do that easier!!!!
Ultimately the best way of increasing cornering ability is to fit adjustable top mounts, so you can increase negative camber, which will give you better cornering ability, but will also make the car LESS stable at high speed (100mph+).
acenumber1 - Pay attention to this man - he's been there, done that and has done far far more than just bought the t-shirt (his MK5 GTI ED30 embarrassed a few Porkers at the ring a few times, sure he'll post the video link if you ask nicely!)
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Also with FWD the ARB should be stiffer than the rear to reduce understeer. However, increasing stiffness at the front can increase the possibility of snap oversteer from the back end. Just look at Stig when on the last corner of the MKV GTI's lap (search you tube) and then imagine having a car that is set up to possibly do that easier!!!!
Ultimately the best way of increasing cornering ability is to fit adjustable top mounts, so you can increase negative camber, which will give you better cornering ability, but will also make the car LESS stable at high speed (100mph+).
acenumber1 - Pay attention to this man - he's been there, done that and has done far far more than just bought the t-shirt (his MK5 GTI ED30 embarrassed a few Porkers at the ring a few times, sure he'll post the video link if you ask nicely!)
He may have been there, but hes giving incorrect information.
hes saying a softer rear arb reduces understeer. it doesnt, it increases it.
to reduce understeer / increase oversteer, you want a stiffer rear setup.
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What tyres have you got at the moment?
I dont think I've EVER seen a thread in the MK5 section about understeer ! :shocked:
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first off: good tyres. I like Eagle F1s, amazing in the wet. Better than Michelin PS2s, not sure how they compare with PS3s or the Contis
(my wife's Saab has the Contis and they're good but the F1s feel better - might be just as it's different cars).
second, try the anti-lift kit.
The stiffer the rear, the better the turn in will be - my hillclimb car is basically rock solid at the back (it's torsion bar but equating to 600lb/inch springing.....) and, despite being FWD, wants to oversteer quite a lot.....
Not just au fait with MK5 tuning so unsure if this is possible, but any kid of strut brace on the rear is a good idea.
Look at adjusting the front toe - minimise the toe-in as this will lead to a better/faster turn in. It'll make the car less stable in a straight line and will make it tramline more but, as ever, it's a compromise. Toe-out is maybe a little extreme on the GTi.
Maybe a little cheeky on a forum but I suspect your driving could do with a brush up too - not saying mine couldn't either, I think we can all benefit from good training. Bear in mind even current F1 drivers still get coaching.
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You see the thing on the end of your right leg? It pokes out a bit and has 5 little wiggly things on the end. Don't prod the right peddle so hard with this and your problems should be solved.
Nick
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If anything Mk5's are prone to oversteer under load. Before you do anything to the car, I'd get out on track with an instructor and learn about weight transfer.
Most road drivers in FWD cars are still heavy on the brakes coming in to a corner, pushing all the weight on to the loaded tyre causing understeer. It's important to stabilise the car and equalise the weight.
2 simple rules to follow: If you understeer in to the corner, you are too fast and broke to late. If you're understeering out of a corner, then you're on the throttle too early.
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He's got a point - it goes without saying that different cars need a different approach to driving and the way to tackle corners and it's probably fair to say that a remap on a GTI, increasing power by approx 20-25% (maybe more depending on stage of remap) will change the dynamics enough to require a different driving style (This is the subject where the guys who have done track work will confirm). I don't know what car you have come from but I could pretty much guarantee it requires a different approach to the GTI
I've found that by trying different approaches with my GTI, the "Slow-in, Fast-out" approach works best. Slightly slower into the corner, get on the power early to let the turbo fill it's lungs and it should rip you out of the corner! (as long as your in the right gear of course!)
This is different to my previous car (Fiat Panda 100HP) that had Eagle F1's as standard, first off: good tyres. I like Eagle F1s, amazing in the wet.
and (on that car i thought they were absolutely rubbish in the wet) you could just chuck it in, get it off balance and nail the throttle all the way through, it had that little power that any way you could maintain the momentum had to be done!
Try all of the above and find what works best for you, I don't think the guys above are criticising your driving as such, just trying to help you learn the car as getting used to a new car takes a little bit of time, especially if you've never experienced a turbo'd engines power delivery before!
If anything Mk5's are prone to oversteer under load. Before you do anything to the car, I'd get out on track with an instructor and learn about weight transfer.
Is this really true of a FWD car? I thought FWD cars would under-steer under load due to being dragged through the bend? I thought that over-steer would be caused by either trailbraking too fast to cause it to go off balance of again, lifting off the the throttle part way through the bend would again get the car off balance and cause the back to slide wide!
Correct me if im wrong!
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It is throttle induced, but happens without much warning. I quite liked it as it was a good way of pulling the nose in, in a quick corner
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Never realised how badly i drove until i drove round Silverstone under an instructor. ( i always thought i was the world's best too! :undecided: )
I'd deffinatley reccommend it bud.
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As above some professional instruction will be more beneficial than of any tyres / performance mods.
Also, why do you guys buy the WALK when you can just fit powerflex poly bushes in the OEM mounts (which AFAIK) are OEM that have been anodised gold?
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Thanks to you all for the different opinions, where is the nearest track with a good instructor, i live in lancashire. I do take on board the fact of having a lot more power and turbo than used to, so maybe start from the beginning wouldnt be such a bad idea.
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I did a really good driving course around the Stowe circuit in silverstone. It's done by Audi and they fly over zee Germans as instructors and they were very good. Learnt how to control understeer as part of the day (turning back the opposite way you want to go to regain traction). Plus I got to abuse an RS4, S5 and TT. I'm on my phone at the moment so can't post a link but give Google a go if your interested.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v92/twior/Photo-0014.jpg)
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I can recommend Don Palmer... http://www.donpalmer.co.uk/
One of the best in the UK for specialist training - in your car of theirs. He is quite pricey though!
Failing that, try http://www.driverdp.com/
I personally don't rate the manufacturers' own centres - they are fine for joe public.
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As above some professional instruction will be more beneficial than of any tyres / performance mods.
Also, why do you guys buy the WALK when you can just fit powerflex poly bushes in the OEM mounts (which AFAIK) are OEM that have been anodised gold?
The walk adds + 0.5 degrees of caster and antilift, completly differant from pressing bushers in the oem mounts.