GolfGTIforum.co.uk
Model specific boards => Golf mk4 => Topic started by: master_oogwai on 03 March 2010, 11:07
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Yesterday, I spent pretty much the whole day at R-Tech for a KO3s fitting and spec 2 map. At the end, I came away with a KO3s fitting and custom map.
The car made 209BHP and 240lbft torque.
Through the gears, the car pulled strong, no doubt about it, but on the graph, the power starts to tail off at 5500rpm and Chris said this should not happen. After speaking to Nick and was advised it could be either the N75j valve or the MAF (this has not been changed in the 2 years I have had the car as I have not had any problems with it).
The car seems to drive fine, but the low bhp figure is bugging me a little, as everyone who has had the same thing done are getting 230bhp+ lol
Mods:
Milltek Catback + 3" downpipe + sports cat
PiperX Panel Filter
Forge 007p
I am going to try a new MAF soon to see if this makes any difference, but was wondering if any has any other ideas what this could be? thanks.
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has the fuel filter been changed recently? what condition are your boost pipes in?
I made 230bhp and the only extra mods i have is a Forge TIP and Forge Actuator.
R-tech guys will have probably told you the reason why the power is down and i wouldnt doubt them mate. You can get a MAF on exchange from TPS for about £50.
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that is a very low figure indeed where did you get the turbo from?
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The car went in for a full service at R-Tech a month ago, but I am not sure if the fuel filter was one of the items they changed or not. If they did not change it, then I am not sure when the last time it was changed.
As for the boost pipes, looking at them today, they seemed ok. R-Tech did not advise me of any faulty pipes yesterday either. They also said the torque level of 240lbft is spot on for a KO3s, so I imagine their is nothing wrong with the boost. Chris said the car made 22 psi yesterday on the dyno.
The turbo was brand new from backdraft as recommended by Maxxeh on here.
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mmm, very odd as with it being a brand new unit would have expected around 220bhp at least. how many miles has the engine done?
Like the guys at R-Tech said you may have faulty N75 or MAF. 22 psi overboost is spot on for thier map as thats what mines peaking at.
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The engine has covered over 121000 miles already.
Any idea where the N75 valve is on the AGU? thanks.
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yes mate, it plugs into the Turbo intake pipe next to the 007p re-circ valve you have. It has to pipes running to it and has a plug on it.
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if its boosting to 22psi I wouldn't have thought it was the N75 valve at fault :undecided:
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(http://home.comcast.net/~hhong4/images/K04/k04-10.jpg)
(http://pictureposter.audiworld.com/12010/audin75.jpg)
From google image :)
All seems good then if youa re reaching all th figer you should be expecting aprat from the bhp :sad:
Its not something eles like you barkes sticking on when on the rollers or anothe part of you drive?
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Excellent, thanks guys for all the advice, it is mucho appreciated :smiley:
First port of call is a MAF swap and take it from there.
To be honest, I would like to go out in a 230bhp Ko3s motor and see what difference it would be compared to mine. The car is still pretty fast as it stands and Chris/Nick did confirm if I found the missing 20 odd brake, the torque level will not change anyway. Its just that I know I am missing the 20 odd brake, which is what is bugging me. I paid lots of money for the new Ko3s and I want my missing horses lol.
Thanks again guys :smiley:
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Sorry, one question.
I have never changed a MAF before and going by the guide on here, it looks pretty straightforward enough.
Question is, does the MAF only connect one way? you cannot fit it back to front, upside down or whatever lol.
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it is held in to the airbox by 2 screws, will only go one way mate
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got any graphs??
did Chris say if it was holding the boost or tailing off very quickly?
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I got a graph, but not sure which run it was, as they ran the car a lot of times to find the missing ower.
The graph shows the torque was pretty constant up until 5500rpm when the curve starts to dip and tail off like when i use to have a Ko3.
Thanks Hulmie.
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the peak power will be reached at around 5500rpm as its the same on most k03s setups that R-Tech have done. Mine hits peak at 5500rpm and then starts to tail off.
if its holding boost and fuelling right then the Torque curve will be nice and smooth and so will the bhp curve.
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I just had a look at devilz graph and my graph looks the same, apart from the curves on mine are really jagged throughout.
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I just had a look at devilz graph and my graph looks the same, apart from the curves on mine are really jagged throughout.
That's just the graph filtering on the dyno software, filter out the feedback too much and you get erroneous results :wink:
The fuelling was spot on so I wouldn't worry too much about changing the fuel filter. We had the turbo hitting 26psi at some points so it definitely isn't the new turbo at fault - although it might benefit from some actuator tweaking. It may be a timing issue, or it could be down to the maf. I think i'd need to spend a whole day on the car to really get to the bottom of it. Try the things we suggested and next time you're passing we'll stick it back on the rollers to see where we're at :afro:
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I just had a look at devilz graph and my graph looks the same, apart from the curves on mine are really jagged throughout.
That's just the graph filtering on the dyno software, filter out the feedback too much and you get erroneous results :wink:
The fuelling was spot on so I wouldn't worry too much about changing the fuel filter. We had the turbo hitting 26psi at some points so it definitely isn't the new turbo at fault - although it might benefit from some actuator tweaking. It may be a timing issue, or it could be down to the maf. I think i'd need to spend a whole day on the car to really get to the bottom of it. Try the things we suggested and next time you're passing we'll stick it back on the rollers to see where we're at :afro:
I thought 22psi was the most the car achieved that day, but 26 psi is good :grin:
Thanks for clearing up the graph query mate, much appreciated. Just looking at it on paper it seems a bit scary considering the graph before the map was pretty smooth. I will be looking into a new MAF very soon. Once I have that sorted out, I will contact you guys to arrange another dyno run.
Cheers topher :smiley:
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After reading other posts about faulty mafs, some people have suggested to unplug the maf to see if this makes any difference.
I left the car parked up at work, turn the ignition on with the maf plugged in and it idled normally, no stutter, revs are stable and no warning lights.
Unplugged the maf, turned ignition on and no change at all. All seems ok.
Is this a good or bad sign? Do I need to drive the car with the maf unplugged to make sure?
Sorry for all the silly questions, but if all the above is a sign of a non faulty maf, I will leave it for now.
Although, I have to admit that I have owned the car for almost two years and the maf never has been changed.
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You need to run the car with the MAF unplaugged, however it will be hard to notice any difference as your torque is 240 and you may only get gains of 0-10 lb/ft. the only way to really tell is to change the MAF and put it on the rollers again.
This said you may think that if no gains are made then youve wasted money.
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This said you may think that if no gains are made then youve wasted money.
This is what I am thinking.
But, from what you are saying, unless I try a new Maf, I will never know for sure. Guess I will try a new maf and pay R-tech another visit and take it from there. Thanks Hulmie.
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I got a new maf earlier and swapped it over. Turn the ignition on and it was idling fine, no dashboard lights, nowt. Ran the car through vagcom and a fault saying air mass flow signal low - intermittent. Cleared the codes down and ran vagcom three more times and no fault code came back.
Can I assume the fault appeared the first time was the ecu still trying to adapt to the new maf??
Took the car for a brief drive around the block and pickup seems better (maybe its late and it got colder, not sure lol) and maybe its just me, but the recirc valve seem to have got louder too.
Anyway, will take the car out again later tonight on some bigger roads to see if there are any differences
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I got a new maf earlier and swapped it over. Turn the ignition on and it was idling fine, no dashboard lights, nowt. Ran the car through vagcom and a fault saying air mass flow signal low - intermittent. Cleared the codes down and ran vagcom three more times and no fault code came back.
Can I assume the fault appeared the first time was the ecu still trying to adapt to the new maf??
Took the car for a brief drive around the block and pickup seems better (maybe its late and it got colder, not sure lol) and maybe its just me, but the recirc valve seem to have got louder too.
Anyway, will take the car out again later tonight on some bigger roads to see if there are any differences
The code will be there because you unplugged the MAF :wink:
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I got a new maf earlier and swapped it over. Turn the ignition on and it was idling fine, no dashboard lights, nowt. Ran the car through vagcom and a fault saying air mass flow signal low - intermittent. Cleared the codes down and ran vagcom three more times and no fault code came back.
Can I assume the fault appeared the first time was the ecu still trying to adapt to the new maf??
Took the car for a brief drive around the block and pickup seems better (maybe its late and it got colder, not sure lol) and maybe its just me, but the recirc valve seem to have got louder too.
Anyway, will take the car out again later tonight on some bigger roads to see if there are any differences
The code will be there because you unplugged the MAF :wink:
Ah right, cool.
Thanks mate. This is all new to me and still learning :smiley:
It was the guide you put up for changing the maf I followed so thanks for that. If that was not there, I would have asked the dealers to replace it.
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I got a new maf earlier and swapped it over. Turn the ignition on and it was idling fine, no dashboard lights, nowt. Ran the car through vagcom and a fault saying air mass flow signal low - intermittent. Cleared the codes down and ran vagcom three more times and no fault code came back.
Can I assume the fault appeared the first time was the ecu still trying to adapt to the new maf??
Took the car for a brief drive around the block and pickup seems better (maybe its late and it got colder, not sure lol) and maybe its just me, but the recirc valve seem to have got louder too.
Anyway, will take the car out again later tonight on some bigger roads to see if there are any differences
The code will be there because you unplugged the MAF :wink:
Ah right, cool.
Thanks mate. This is all new to me and still learning :smiley:
It was the guide you put up for changing the maf I followed so thanks for that. If that was not there, I would have asked the dealers to replace it.
No probs :afro:
Keep us updated :wink:
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Sorry to bring up this old thread. I thought it would be better just to continue where I left off.
Anyway, I knew the fun would not last :sad:
Its probably me who is causing this issue, but I thought I would put this through the more brainy people on here and see if anyone can advise me?
I swapped out the maf on the 5th March and ran the car for two days to make sure everything was ok before I gave my original maf back to VW as an exchange unit. The car seemed fine, no power gains or losses that I can notice. However, the beginning of this week, I had noticed the car seemed to be, how can I put it? seemed to be 'bunged up'. Like when you have a cold, you have a blocked up nose and you have trouble breathing through it. This is how the car feels. Gears 1 and 2 you dont really notice it, but from 3-5 and you give it half,full throttle, the car slowly picks up speed, followed by a little turbo kick and picks up speed again. Before, you give it half or more throttle, the engine feels loose and it flies.
Stuck my head under the hood with a torch and cannot see any loose or split pipes. I am not 100% sure which pipes I should be checking, so I looked at all the ones around the airbox, tip and anyone other one connected to the turbo.
I checked the maf and the tip to make sure they are fitted correctly and the maf is snugly fitted inside of the tip. I did have an issue of putting the airbox back together and it popped open the other day, but I have sorted this out. The airbox is tightly shut now.
Ran the car through vagcom a couple of times, but no faults at all.
The other thing I have not changed yet is the n75 valve as advised by r-tech. Reason being someone said if the car is boosting at 23 psi, the n75 valve should be ok.
Surely, the maf would not have buggered on me already can it?
Would changing the n75 resolve this issue?
Any help would be great. I only want a working car :sad:
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have you adjusted the actuator? im in the same situation just fitted a brand new K03s and i feels really slow going VW tomorrow have another MAF fitted see if that the problem and going R-tech on sat to see if my actuator needs adjusting!
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have you adjusted the actuator? im in the same situation just fitted a brand new K03s and i feels really slow going VW tomorrow have another MAF fitted see if that the problem and going R-tech on sat to see if my actuator needs adjusting!
I am not sure if Nick had done this when he fitted the ko3s. Chris also did mention this in his post in this thread, so I think I my have to give them a bell to arrange another visit.
If you can let me know of your outcome, it would be much appreciated mate. I dont really fancy buying another maf from VW, as they dont come cheap and does not resolve the issue.
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my faulty N75 gave me too much boost so it is possible mate
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my faulty N75 gave me too much boost so it is possible mate
Cheers mate.
I wonder if this is a part i can pick up from GSF?
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have you adjusted the actuator? im in the same situation just fitted a brand new K03s and i feels really slow going VW tomorrow have another MAF fitted see if that the problem and going R-tech on sat to see if my actuator needs adjusting!
Did the new maf resolve the issue mate?
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had a new maf fitted and no joy but replaced my N75 valve and a little of the power is back can boost to 15psi but no happy think there is more issues regarding boost leaks and actuator issues!
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had a new maf fitted and no joy but replaced my N75 valve and a little of the power is back can boost to 15psi but no happy think there is more issues regarding boost leaks and actuator issues!
What did r-tech advise?